Joe Paterno, 85, dies in State College

[maddezmom]

Joe Paterno has died at the age of 85 after experiencing serious complications from lung-cancer treatment.

The health of Paterno, who had fought the disease for two months, had grown progressively worse after he recently broke his pelvis in a fall at his home in State College, Pa.

The family announced his death Sunday shortly after 10 a.m. ET., The Associated Press reported.

Paterno died at State College's Mount Nittany Medical Center, where he had been undergoing treatment.

more:http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7489238/joe-paterno-ex-penn-state-nittany-lions-coach-dies-85-2-month-cancer-fight

[Doctor_J]

1. An enviable career and life completely ruined at the end

I had a great deal of respect for JoPa up until the last 6 months. His handling of the Sandusky ordeal, his failure to protect and rescue those kids, will completely define his career and life. What a tragedy

[DeathToTheOil]

3. He's not a Catholic Bishop

Yet he did better than many. (And I'm a Catholic, myself, for any professional alerters.)

[maddezmom]

5. What is a professional alerter?

[OhioChick]

12. "Professional Alerter?"

I wondered that, myself.

[maddezmom]

22. I'm thinking DTO means anyone that voted to hide his posts

take a look at the transparency page.

[OhioChick]

83. Now, that's one colorful page!

[Sinistrous]

8. I'm sure all the sanctimonious twits here are celebrating his passing,

Smugly assured that this good man is unworthy of respect because he did not conform to a set of standards that THEY invented out of whole cloth. Shame on these judgmental pismires who will never in their useless lives do a wisp of the good Joe Paterno did in his life. They, who do not and do not know what was said to him, they who do not know anything about the frames of reference within which Joe Paterno interpreted whatever he was told, they ASSUME that Paterno knew everything that they learned after reading multiple rumors of this and that.

I wish them well as they prance through their lives, self-assured of their own wonderfulness.

[wial]

11. yeah, rape of young boys is just fine

if it's in a good cause like American football, a sport that turns the brains of young men into jelly!

I know I'm a sanctimonious twit for pointing this out. Since of course there are far worse things, right? Right? (Well anyway)... And why take away people's fun activity for Saturday afternoons? It's not like we have anything better to do than watch people brutalize each other on TV, after all!

uck.

[Sinistrous]

17. Not the issue raised in my post, of course, but carry on...

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

80. ...but "sanctimonious twits" was.

The Shakespearean Dismissal

The bard still lives.

[Tansy_Gold]

18. Sanctimonious Twit checking in

Joe Paterno had many many occasions to do the right thing under the law (which was not invented out of whole cloth by santimonious twits) and under the generally accepted morality that child abuse is a bad thing that should be prevented if one has the means to do so. If he had been a "good man" who only did one bad thing in his life, he could be forgiven and returned to his former glory. But his "one bad thing" extended over a long period of time, harmed untold numbers of innocent people, and was excused with such pearls of compassion as "I didn't want to ruin anybody's Saturday."

If there's an afterlife and a judgment as Joe Paterno probably believed in, he will have to answer for his deeds and decisions. I'm not the great judge, but just another sanctimonious twit who thinks Joe Paterno was a hypocritical, power-hungry jerk. My condolences to his family, but no forgiveness from me.


Tansy Gold, ST

[Sinistrous]

20. He did the right thing. It was just not YOUR right thing.

Carry on.

[obamanut2012]

36. He did not do either the morally or ethically "right thing"

[Sinistrous]

37. I'm so glad to have your word on that.

[Tansy_Gold]

40. Just as we're so glad to have yours

Even though you apparently think your word is so much righter and so much more important than ours.

Carry on.

[Orrex]

41. So it would be ok to cover up decades of child rape...

As long as the person doing the covering up thought that it was ok according to his own sense of right and wrong?

Holy moley, what a world that would be!

[yardwork]

104. And "frame of reference." Don't forget the all-important frame of reference. /sarcasm

[msanthrope]

52. Right thing, like transferring his house to his wife for $1 to avoid civil liability?

Once JoePa learned of the grand jury, and civil liability he faced, he transferred his house to his wife.

For a buck.

PA is tenants by the entirety. Which means that at his death, the house would have transferred without probate.

There is no reason to do this--no viable estate planning reason to do this-- except to avoid a civil judgment you believe will invade your assets.

That type of civil judgment arises out of criminal, and criminally negligent behavior involving the sexual molestation of children....

[frylock]

84. he did the bare minimum as required by law..

great man, there.

[CoffeeCat]

124. That is a revolting attitude...

Joe Paterno knew that Sandusky was a pedophile. He followed the chain of command
and told his superiors that a young boy had been molested in the shower. Then Joe
Paterno sat on the sidelines in silence--knowing that nothing had been done.

Joe Paterno KNEW that Sandusky hadn't been held accountable for molesting a boy--and
that this meant that hundreds of others boys to which Sandusky had access--could become
victims.

And they did become victims.

Joe Paterno didn't do a goddamn fucking thing--knowing that an active, rampant pedophile
was not punished and was running a home for vulnerable, innocent children from troubled
homes.

You DARE to call that "the right thing"? If you think that is "right" then you are just as
sick as the child rapists and the child-rapist enablers.

It disgusts me that *anyone* would excuse such vile, obviously-inhumane actions.

[Posteritatis]

23. Well-said, fellow sanctimonious twit! (nt)

[bread_and_roses]

30. this sanctimonious twit seconds that (n/t)

[roody]

19. I don't follow football.

What good did he do in this world?

[Posteritatis]

24. There's a sad tendency to elevate "good for sports" above all other considerations. (nt)

[Sinistrous]

25. There was so much more. Look up the facts.

[roody]

27. Football does not interest me.

Can you write two sentences that state good things Paterno did?

[Sinistrous]

31. Perhaps you should indulge your evident interest in people and look up

facts about the man.

[roody]

33. I take that to mean "no."

[erpowers]

130. Donated Money To The School

I am not the biggest Joe Paterno fan; however, there is at least one thing and a few other things some other people will list as the good that Paterno has done. It has been reported by ESPN that Paterno gave about $4 million to Penn Stste. That is the one thing that I mentioned above. Now for the things other might say.

It seems that some people (at least one person from ESPN) give Joe Paterno at least some credit for the academic status of Penn State. The line of thinking goes; Joe Paterno's football teams did well so that allowed the school to make money and some of that money could be used to improve the academic side of the school.

Some other people will say that Paterno was a coach that tried to teach his players life lessons. Paterno was regarded as one of those coaches who promoted the idea that it was more than just about winning it was also about being a better person.

[beac]

151. I was going to post some of the many examples of how "JoePa"

did just the OPPOSITE of teaching his players to be "better" people, but BigD 95 already compiled a great list downthread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=32672

It's amazing that people still believe he was some kind of pillar of morality. He was a deeply flawed human being.

[MADem]

162. It will cost them five times that in public relations seed $ to repair the reputation of the school

and even at that, it'll never be right.

That place will be snarkily referred to as "Pedo State" for at least a generation by opposing teams.

Paterno should have paid attention to his own lessons, he'd have had an easier final year had he so done, and likely many children would have been spared abuse.

[Vanje]

163. Don't forget the lawsuits

Theres going to be damages.

[MADem]

164. They might get a few bucks if they melt down that noxious statue of the enabler on campus.

They can start up the "Compensatory Damages" account with that as a first deposit.

[Orrex]

28. Well, as far as we know, he didn't personally rape any children in the shower, so there's that.

[Sinistrous]

32. What an amazingly inappropriate, superficial excuse for a comment.

[Orrex]

38. But not at all inaccurate

I'll give the man his due... He was very generous in his support of education, not least his donations to PSU's libraries.

Lots of other people have been involved in seedy coverups without likewise engaging in such altruism, so I suppose I'll try to remember that stuff.

[Paladin]

42. Look Who's Talking...... (n/t)

[sylveste]

51. more than

you, i'm sure.

[obamanut2012]

69. I doubt it

Unless you have evidence Roody has used his influence, position, and money to enable and shield a child rapist.

[creeksneakers2]

105. He donated lots of money to the academic side of the school

and other causes. He set an example for the rest of college football by putting graduating players above winning. He kept the team off steroids, unlike at least one other coach.

Football has entertainment value. It rallies and binds the students. It teaches teamwork and discipline.

Joe set a great example for loyalty and dedication.

[Ruby the Liberal]

112. He set an example all right, but it was

that putting the football program as priority over all else is a fucked up state of being.

Sad too - there was so much more that people *could* have remembered him for.

The stress of the realization of his true 'legacy' (what, at the end of the day IS important to society) killed him, IMO, no matter what money was thrown at what building or other campus project.

[creeksneakers2]

113. You don't know his reasons for not reporting to the police

[Ruby the Liberal]

117. Seriously? Give me ONE good reason. Just ONE.

You can make it up, it doesn't even have to have basis in this case.

Just ONE fucking reason not to report pedophilia sexual abuse to the authorities.

I can't believe you even went there. Wow.

[creeksneakers2]

170. Perhaps he worried that since he only had second hand sketchy information

that he might report something that wasn't true.

[beac]

152. See:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=32672

for many examples of the BAD examples he set for his players and how he kept their many crimes from being punished.

[MADem]

165. "When girls got assaulted he would blame the girls?" What a charmer!

Completely without any shame or sense of propriety, apparently.

[creeksneakers2]

171. There aren't many specifics there and no supporting links

The part about the road rage is a different story than the link tells. Its not unusual for one driver to scold another. That's all the link says.

I don't believe that Joe got any of his players off from school disciplinary actions. I don't believe it because the head of the board was interviewed in the PBS radio station here and he confirmed that Joe did try to get leniency for his players, but it was never granted.

So I'd need more than that post before I'd believe it all.

[beac]

178. Links:

Paterno Fought Penn State Official Over Punishment of Players http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204443404577052073672561402.html

Ex-Penn State official saw Joe Paterno's dark side http://www.vancouversun.com/story_print.html?id=5750617&sponsor=

Joe Paterno’s Troubling Attitude Toward Sex Charges http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/11/12/joe-paterno-s-troubling-attitude-toward-sex-charges.html

SportsPenn State’s Rap Sheet Way Longer Than Sandusky Scandal http://blogs.phillymag.com/the_philly_post/2011/11/16/psu/

[obamanut2012]

34. I don't celebrate anyone's death

But neither do I praise a child rapist enabler.

I am quite shocked at his apologists on these Paterno threads.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

57. I am very very sad that he died. And, I can understand completely his explanation. He

is old school. Given his age, his life and worldview I can totally see how he would have no
idea what to do. No understanding of the situation. He told his bosses - the people who
ran the school. Who had the power.

This sick individual probably hastened Joe's death. His blood is on his hands.

[obamanut2012]

70. Why are you excusing Paterno and making HIM a victim?

Wow. Your post is really, really hard to grasp.

I also didn't know it was "old school" to use your name and influence to shield child rapists.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

98. I am not making him the victim. I am looking

at this 100% differently than the common "automatically judge and pounce on a person" without any regard for his circumstances and his 85 years of a leading a good and moral life. To automatically condemn this fine person is just a witch-hunt, IMHO. Sandusky is the criminal and the children are the victims. This response probably won't sway a soul....don't know why I am bothering...maybe just to speak up in memory of this great person.

[obamanut2012]

101. Your prior post certainly reads like that

[MADem]

166. Memory of this great person? Please. The only thing that was great about him was his FAILURES.

He was deeply flawed, and apparently wasn't just covering up abused children, but abused female students as well. He was judge, jury and executioner when it came to discipline for his players--and he acted like he was above the law--and got away with it.

You probably need to recalibrate your hero-worship. The man had feet of clay, and faulty morals. He didn't do his duty.

He was a great bullshitter, more likely.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

182. Think you might have prefaced all that with "IMHO". Agree to disagree, I'm100% opposite. Peace nt

[MADem]

183. There's nothing "humble" about that view. It's shared by anyone who thinks children should not be

molested, and molesters--and their enablers--are the pond scum of the earth. You're on the wrong side of this issue, from a moral perspective. IMO.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

187. How about IMSRV....Enabler? Sounds like the man rented Sandusky an

apartment and let him commit his disgusting crimes and let children suffer there. He told his bosses - the people who ran the school, hardly an act of an enabler.

Of course children should not be molested. That's a given. Where we diverge is whether or not we believe that Paterno fully understood the nature and magnitude of what had happened. He said he did not, and I believe him. I can fully picture someone
of his generation...totally consumed with football and his family...not knowing about such atrocities. He did what he thought he should do and passed the information on to those in charge.

I am not familiar enough to know when all the molestations occurred - but I know Sandusky wasn't even working for PS when Joe was told. It would have been better had Joe followed up and stopped any further attacks. But, he didn't, and I can read a million posts like yours and still never think less of this great man because I have empathy.

[MADem]

190. Well, I think he DID know. How could he not? He learns, from a subordinate he trusted,

(and he must have trusted the guy--he moved up in the organization, after all) that Sandusky is a child rapist.

He tells someone, his bosses at the school, but he doesn't bother to tell THE POLICE? Particularly after NOTHING happens to Sandusky? Please. And Sandusky--who was a coach emeritus since 1999 with an OFFICE in the school athletic complex, and therefore he had a continuous working relationship--even without an actual job or role-- with the head coach-- keeps showing up around campus, at the games, at the social events? And he doesn't wonder, WTF? The scenario of Paterno The Innocent defies credulity.

Are you telling me if his HOUSE was robbed, he'd tell the heads of the school first? And not involve the cops? And "let it go" if there was no effort to bring the perpetrators to justice? If McQueary told him that he was in the team locker room and saw a guy with a gun, would Paterno notify the school leadership? Or dial Nine One One?

A crime was committed, "JoPa" knew who did it, because a trusted subordinate told him who did it. He told the wrong people, and nothing was done. The criminal remained free. At that point, doncha think, he might have called the cops to be SURE that they had all the info they needed?

Or maybe, just maybe, he told the wrong people because he KNEW they would do the wrong thing, and cover up the mess? Maybe, just maybe, Saint JoPa didn't want any of that nasty "pervy" stuff besmirching "his" football program?

What you're doing is excusing the completely inexcusable. Paterno, through his deliberate and thoughtful INaction, covered up a violent crime, enabled a violent criminal, and is responsible for that criminal being allowed to continue to perpetrate his violent crimes against little children for a full decade after he KNEW. There's no vagueness, here. He did what he did, and more importantly, he DIDN'T do what he should have, and he owns that.

It's also a bit of a stretch (and insulting to the elderly, too) to suggest that "old people" (and he wasn't all that old when this shit went down, either--McQueary told him about that incident TEN YEARS ago, when he was in his mid-seventies) have a differing view of child molestation than people of other generations. That's as silly as saying they have a differing view of armed robbery. If anything, grandkids (all the fun and none of the poop) would make "old people" more lion-like when it comes to defense of the most innocent among us. Old people aren't stupid, even if they aren't as blunt and open in their conversations about such horrible things.

You can't use the geezer defense on the one hand, and ignore the fact that for the last ten years, since he was told Sandusky was a rapist, that he was able to coach football and use all or most of his marbles to so do. That bird just does not fly.

[creeksneakers2]

106. He didn't shield

Shieding would involve an affirmative act to make the truth less discoverable. Joe simply didn't do as much to stop it as he should have done. That's very different from "shielding."

[Ruby the Liberal]

109. With great power comes great responsibility. nt

[creeksneakers2]

114. So its OK to accuse him of something he didn't do?

[Ruby the Liberal]

118. With great power comes great responsibility. nt

[ElboRuum]

173. I wished I could say I was shocked at the grave dancing.

But I can't. At least not honestly.

A man is dead who meant a lot to a lot of people, and whether you agree with those people or not as to whether or not that meaning is warranted, a little respect isn't much of a luxury.

But this is DU, where the painful and often unkind deconstruction of a life can happen before the body is even cold.

Honestly, I was seriously considering taking the day off, because I knew I'd find a thread like this, a sick, depressing thread which just exposes how unnecessary class has become in our society.

[Ruby the Liberal]

175. How inconsiderate of us.

Please do share what it is about JoePa's legacy that we should be celebrating.

I get that it is sad that he never had the chance to clear his reputation, but that wasn't in the cards, so you have to play them as they are dealt.

He had chances in 1998 (before he fired Sandusky) and, at a minimum 2002 to show leadership on this and he punted.

So, overlooking all of that, and ignoring a meaningless w/l record (given that it was gained/maintained on the guise/priority of protecting 'the program' at all costs), what is left?

[ElboRuum]

176. Who said you should celebrate anything?

I don't recall saying anything about celebrating a legacy. Joe Paterno really isn't even the point here. The point is class. And grave dancing pretty much states that you don't have it. This thread is nothing more than a bunch of barbarous "people" doing the stomp all over a person whose body is barely cold.

Because someone does X, you get to take our society's general respect for at least the immediate dead and ignore it. That's DU for you.

And unless Joe Paterno was a genocidal maniac (and I just can't wait for someone to suggest that he is that on some order) I expect people who claim to be human adults with a modicum of class to keep from doing the undertaker-two-step over his burial plot in honor of that tradition. Failure to do that means that you have no class. I wish I could say that that's simply my opinion, but it isn't, society is pretty clear on this. Only people whose 'virtues' include a overdeveloped sense of vengeance could fail to see this.

This is the sad and depressing part. I'd prefer to think of DUers as classy on the large and whole, and I'm sure most are, but this... this thread really shakes my faith in this place.

[Patiod]

49. I never realized how many black-and-white thinkers there were here

I've been here for 7 years and 10,000 posts, and I just didn't expect this level of smug sanctimoniousness. Someone actually commented that it was "good" that he was dead, which I can't even see this board approving for Bush, Cheney, etc.

I saw Paterno speak about 5 years ago, and he seemed rambling and confused - maybe drunk, maybe getting a little senile. I thought back then that someone - the Board of Trustees, the President, someone -- should have pressured him to retire.

He was an old man who shouldn't have been coaching into his 80s. I think he probably knew there was something seriously wrong with Sandusky (even if he didn't know or want to know the details) and he forced him to retire. He should have followed through/followed up when he found out that Sandusky was still creeping around the university. And he didn't. And so he should have been fired, and he was.

But that rates a reaction of "good" to his death?

Wow.

[msanthrope]

50. The good man who transferred his house to his wife for a $1 after learning of the grand jury

and his civil liability???

Please. FYI--PA is tenants by the entirety--there is no possible estate planning reason to transfer said property unless you wish to avoid a judgment that arises out of criminal or criminally negligent actions.

His family, and him, made millions while he sat on the Board of Second Mile....and looked the other way.

[Vanje]

59. Really

Last edited Sun Jan 22, 2012, 06:32 PM - Edit history (1)

...."a set of standards that THEY invented out of whole cloth."
As opposed to a set of standards that fucking children is bad. Crazy shit! I guess I made that up. Maybe fucking children is okay, for some people. Apparently JoePa must have thought so.
He knew.
He could have stopped it.
But he did not stop it.

This "judgmental pismire" has a stake.
You probably would'nt like to know this, but I was fucked regularly, by a male authority figure, from the time I was 6, until I was 9 or 10 , old enough to physically fight back.
I tried to tell. Because the fucker was a big name in the community, it was more convenient to ignore a dumb little kid's claims. Who you gonna believe: An eagle Scout from a prominant family or an ugly graceless little girl? No fucking contest.
I was was ignored.

Is there a long term effect? Were damages incurred?
I dont know.
Its fifty years later. I dont have sex. with anyone. I've tried, but it does,nt really work for me.
Is this because I was abused? or because I'm incapable of giving and recieving physical affectioni by my own ugly nature?
Maybe its just the physical scar tissue, and not my fault at all.(Yea, penetrating a 6 year old cases physical problems, as well as the head shit.)
I will never know.

I WILL NEVER KNOW.

I blame the guy that did this the child that was me.
But I much more blame the people who knew, but ignored it because knowing was inconveinient for their social status.

I do judge Joe Paterno. I judge him harshly.

That is how I "prance through my (barren) life, self-assured of my own wonderfulness."

How very nice for you, Sinistrous , that you don't have to know this shit.

Carry on. But I would ask that you protect your children , and the children you know,better than JoPa did , and better than my people did for me.

[Vanje]

63. And Oh yes.

My abuser is out there, living in Portland Oregon, Very successful business man, a pillar of the community, an elder in his church, a major donor to Public Television. I see him on the Oregon Public Broadcasting fund-raise-a-thons. He is an important person. Like Joe Paterno.

He is NOT in any sex-offender registry.

Protect your children

[boppers]

90. The local (Portland) BSA got opened up to scrutiny only recently.

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/index.ssf/2010/04/portland_sex_abuse_verdict_lea.html

Over 30 years of documented sex abuse, endemic to the scouting culture. When you say "elder" in his church, that makes me think LDS, which is another place that has hid abusers for generations.... and yes, they tend to rise to positions of power, because they lack the moral sense that keeps so many others from being ruthless and sociopathic.

Thank you for sharing your story.

[Vanje]

94. The Portland Boy Scouts

I learned that they guy who abused ......(no. Lets call it what it is. ) The guy who fucked me when I was a little kid , had been abused (no. Fucked) by his Portland Scout master earlier, (about 1962-1964) when he had been a little kid.

For that reason, alone, I can almost cut my abuser some slack. But I have NO charity, None , for those who knew and allowed it to go on. ..like a freshly dead lamented and well loved football coach , may God have mercy on his dark soul.

[Zenlitened]

85. Wish I had words to describe...

... how much I admire you for your wisdom, your strength, and the powerful beauty you exhibit simply by your presence here.

[renate]

121. I wish the (few) people who would give the enablers of child abusers slack would read this

Your message is both heartbreaking because of your 6-year-old vulnerability and incredibly powerful because of the way you survived and the way you write. (P.S. You do not have an "ugly" nature--I'm no psychiatrist but I'd lay very heavy odds that your lack of interest in physical affection is pretty directly attributable to having been abused so horribly.) I cannot imagine having suffered the emotional and (oh the horror that few people talk about) physical scars and then seeing your abuser, happy and important, on TV, as well as having others tell you how you should feel about those who fail to even try to stop sexual abuse. I wish I could give you a million

[LanternWaste]

146. You then hold others to a higher standard you hold yourself...?

"Shame on these judgmental pismires who will never..."

Your posts appears to be guilty of the very same transgression you indict other for, the only difference being the targets of the judgements.

You then hold others to a higher standard you hold yourself...? Or (and I find this more likely) you're merely a fan of the late coach, and rationalize anything he did, and anything done to him, through that particular bias...

[lunatica]

2. I didn't know he was sick

Not that it matters. The scandal would have come out post mortem but he would have never had the chance to give his reasons for what he did. Or didn't do.

The karmic burden is equal whether you do evil or you don't at least try to stop evil. Acts of commission are equal to acts of omission.

[CrazyBob]

4. Fire all the trustees

They killed Joe. What a rotten bunch of... I can't think of anything nasty enough to describe them. They could have found a better way to let him step down. They should have done it sooner, when they first knew about the problems. But instead they waited as long as they could, and then threw him to the dogs when all the TV trucks showed up. What a nasty bunch of worthless people!

[Arugula Latte]

29. "They should have done it sooner"

Yeah, it's bad when people don't do things in a timely manner. Like protect children from rapists, for instance.

[obamanut2012]

35. I hope you forget the sarcasm smiley

If not, then WOW.

[Iggo]

48. Yeah. Poor Joe.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

60. amen. I went to college in PA and we worshipped Joe. He and Penn State were the

shining stars. This whole situation has been one of the saddest experiences in my
life.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

64. 46 seasons with the NLs and they fired him over the phone ! nt

[Vanje]

65. The poor bastard!

[obamanut2012]

68. Can't dredge up any sympathy for him about this

Nope, not a drop.

He wasn't a victim.

[Arugula Latte]

73. Gee, what a tragedy. My heart bleeds.

It's hard to think of anything worse than that...

[Laura PourMeADrink]

96. cynicism is so better aimed at the offender.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

97. cynicism is so better aimed at the offender.

[Arugula Latte]

120. Sympathy is so better aimed at the victims.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

136. assumes you only can give sympathy to one person/side. nt

[Critters2]

115. The children are the victims...and the only victims.

He deserved no consideration.

I've reported child molesters twice in my career. To DCFS. Didn't hesitate. Didn't worry about anyone's reputation.

This "great man" could have, should have done the same. I didn't find it that difficult.

[yardwork]

107. Actually, cancer killed Joe Paterno. And the child rapist probably shares some responsibility too.

[SoapBox]

6. I find it hard to muster sympathy...

I will always believe that he knew a lot...

[rocktivity]

13. I'm reserving my sympathy and condolances for the people he destroyed

both the children who suffered under his collusion and those who will pass up attending the university due to its damaged reputation.


rocktivity

[liberal N proud]

7. When he was fired, I told some of my friends that he wouldn't live 6 months

Question will always remain, was his death, excellerated by the stress of the Sandusky incident and being fired or would this have come regardless.

Would they have even found the cancer had he not been fired?

Too bad his legacy will be marred by Sandusky.

[Zoeisright]

9. Good.

[CANDO]

10. I was at his final game as coach.

The late October home game against Illinois. Due to a freak October snow storm, the stadium was probably about half to 2/3 full. It was only my 3rd ever Penn State game to attend. I just never would've guessed I had just saw the man's final game. RIP Joe Pa

[Vanje]

67. Fuck football

[Vanje]

95. No, Cando

I don't kiss anyone.

[TheCruces]

157. That seems like a bit of an over-the-top response

Sandusky is sick. JoePa should have done a lot more to protect those kids. I don't see how this affects an entire sport, though.

[Archae]

14. Paterno died in disgrace.

Not just the Sandusky scandal.

Paterno covered up an incident where his players invaded a party, creating havoc.
Paterno made sure no one spoke to investigators, saying any of his players who cooperated would be kicked off the team.

Paterno had a "Our football team can do no wrong" attitude, and that attitude exploded in the college's face.

[itsrobert]

15. I bet his supporter at Penn State

blame the media for causing undue stress.

[Posteritatis]

21. His supporters here are claiming just that too. (nt)

[obamanut2012]

71. I cannot believe some of the posts here

Not just excusing him, but making HIM the victim!

[MADem]

131. JoPa was an accessory after the fact. Plain and simple. He enabled a perpetrator and allowed him to

persist in his nefarious and shameful conduct. He could have acted. He didn't.

He wasn't a victim--he aided and abetted, even if that wasn't his immediate intent. He had to know that more harm to innocent youngsters would be the result of his inaction, too.

[durablend]

58. Nah, no doubt it's the VICTIMS that caused it

If they'd either shut up about being molested or hadn't let their "adolescent wiles" gone wild, JoePA would still be here today.

[Arugula Latte]

75. How dare those children allow the great JoePa's reputation be sullied!

Unthinking little cretins!

[Iggo]

140. Those little bastards are ignoring all the good JoePa did.

Stupid victims.

(Wait. This argument is starting to sound a bit familiar.)

[aikoaiko]

16. Could have been known as the greatest football coach who also helped stopped a child rapist.

Our legacies are our decisions.

[TBF]

26. Prayers for his family. nt

[cbdo2007]

43. I'm sure in a few years the child abuse stuff will be forgotten....but for now

it's really tough to feel very much sympathy for him or his family. Just shows you how such bad decisions can lead to your whole world to come crashing down.

[yardwork]

108. Forgotten by everybody except the children who were raped.

[Critters2]

116. Exactly. nt

[cbdo2007]

122. I doubt they'll spend too much time worrying about Paterno, he's dead.

That kind of thing always seems to fade away after someone dies and since he isn't the one who raped them....you're really grasping at straws thinking this will have any effect on his long term legacy.

[Ruby the Liberal]

123. Er, he was fired over the phone.

But keep on keeping on that history is going to treat him as a hero who did the right thing when it truly mattered (hint - which isn't football w/l records...)

[cbdo2007]

145. You don't follow many sports do you?

Heard of Kobe Bryant or Ben Rothlisberger?? Both rapists. Both crimes swept under the rug. There are others also...many others.

Check back in in 10 years and let me know if you still feel the same way.

[Ruby the Liberal]

149. No question.

Remember Latrell Spreewell? Michael Vick? Another WTF moment or two but about as on topic about Joe Paterno's legacy as the examples you cite, and you are right, the examples are endless.

Know what the difference was? Those guys all beat the shit out of women, raped (or so accused) women and tortured dogs, but their crimes were between them and their victim(s). Joe's crime was overlooking child rape for fear that he would either have to admit his former DC was a perv (which I get, given his age) or out of protection of the program at all costs, or both and for at least a decade.

The latter is the tarnish on his legacy that history won't let go.

[MADem]

167. Memories will linger. Opposing team coaches will fire up their players by exhorting them to

"crush those child molesters at Pedo State."

This shit is going to stick for a loooooong, long time. Future teams will be tarnished by "JoPa's" inactions, as well as Sandusky's actions.

The school is tarnished, too. Who in their right mind is going to spend Big Money to send their kid to "Pedo State?"

There are other schools that don't have an "ick" factor associated with them, and that don't cost as much, either.

[tawadi]

44. My thoughts

This man gave up his integrity for football. His excuse for not reporting the rape of a boy in the university's showers by employee who reported directly to him? He "wasn't equipped." What a lame excuse. He had a phone didn't he? What was he not equipped with? WHAT? A conscience? Integrity?

It doesn't matter how Penn State decides to "honor" Paterno. He will always be remembered as the coach who looked the other way when young boys were raped in the shower.

[Tansy_Gold]

47. You nailed it. Paterno "gave up his integrity for football." n/t

[MinervaX]

86. And just think those showers are still there in that locker room

And thousands of Penn State fans watch their beloved team sitting in bleachers on top of a lair that a child rapist used.

[Bohunk68]

45. Not sure where I stand on this

He is of about the age of the person who molested me as a youngster throughout the 50's. Yes, he was of a different era and back then, in the 50's, there was no one to turn to. A person of the cloth? Yeah, right. The cops? Yeah, right. They would've done nothing either. My mother? She turned a blind eye. Now, one can make excuses for Joe, but, by the 90's and oughts when this all occurred there were different parameters than in the 50's and 60's. He knew better and he surely knew what he should have done. Unless one wants to claim total ignorance of the changes in societal thinking. He said nothing because it was all about "his" team and "his" university and "his" career. The only reason that I am sorry that he died is that he died before judgement came in and he could atone for his sins. Those above who have excused his actions don't even list the good things that he has allegedly done other than give books to the library. Those persons need to search their own souls and figure out why they are saying ok to a child molester enabler.

[tawadi]

46. Very well said

And I am so sorry to hear what you endured and that your attacker was not brought to justice.

[renate]

134. omg, I cannot imagine

... being abused in the "Leave It to Beaver" era... admittedly I wasn't born yet but I can only guess that in those 1950s days of shiny happy people, abuse would have been even less believable than it was just ten or twenty years or forty years later, so that there would be an even greater disconnect between the way things were and the way things were supposed to be. You're a better person than I am, to say "Not sure where I stand on this"... if it were me I'd be damn sure of where I stand. I'm so sorry for what you went through and what you may have been going through ever since.

[Bohunk68]

144. Thanks for your kindness

Over the years, I have studied psychology in an effort to understand what happened. I've often wondered what happened to my step-father for him to have done what he did. He also molested my two sisters, his own daughters. I forgave him years ago, but have not forgotten. This was brought home to me within the past year when I portrayed the role of Bob Ewell in "To Kill a Mockingbird" at our local theater group. I portrayed my stepfather and stepped into his shoes. My directer, a woman, said that I made Ewell a human being. One evening, as the audience filed out giving us hugs, one lady came to me and said, "You were really creepy, I've never seen you play a role like this before." I've only been doing theater now for the last going on three years. But, I must say, that it took me some time to get that particular role out of my system. I had thought I was "over it" years ago, but the truth is that you never get over it. It still lingers there in the back of my mind, only semi-buried. I can still hear the tremor in his voice the first time he pulled out his dick. And, there were many times over the years. Meat Loaf's song, By the Dashboard Light has special meaning to me. As a stepchild, and not having had a father figure for my first 9 years, I craved the attention of a male and wanted only to be loved. The love I got was not what I should have had. Instead of support, I got a hard dick. And, yes, I took it, because that was what was offered. I was only a kid for crissake.

The Joepa lovers should think of this: That was a 9/10 year old who had an adult dick shoved up his nether regions. How would they, as an adult, like to have a baseball bat shoved up theirs. That lad needed someone to love and protect him. Those in authority, read, Joepa, did not. In fact, he continued the betrayal. I'd like to call him a selfish greedy bastard, but I don't know that for sure. He turned boys into men, some posters have said. How do they know that for sure? And, if they do, how do they know what men are?

This is not an easy case. It is indicative of our whole society and the dis-ease and disease of that society.

[Pachamama]

53. A Great Football Coach....

....who prioritized football & his legend over the rape of children....

You will not ever be forgotten JoePa and remembered for the very things you tried to avoid getting out.....

[Skittles]

54. my sympathy to his loved ones

as far as his inaction that destroyed his reputation and endangered so many young boys, I do believe it has served to educate the nation that such a serious dereliction of duty will not be tolerated

[ButterflyBlood]

55. Hey there's yet another one to go that I can't be bothered to care about

Following Kim Jong-il and Christopher Hitchens.

[Taverner]

56. Wow. Saved by the bell.

[Pachamama]

62. Yeah...too bad...he should have lived to testify & have to hear the testimony of the victims...

I am curious if his grand jury testimony and any taped depositions will be used at trial. My guess is yes....

If its damning against Sandusky, they will use JoePa's death to their advantage....if the testimony is incomplete & helps Sandusky, they will use JoePa's death to their advantage....

Either way, I wish he would have lived long enough to have to look at the raped victims in their eyes....

[obamanut2012]

72. I thought that, too

[Vanje]

61. Fuck Joe Paterno.

And Fuck Football.

[obamanut2012]

74. To whom are you speaking?

[Coyote_Bandit]

76. But grave dancing

is soooooooooo much fun.

[alcibiades_mystery]

77. The grave dancers on this thread and elsewhere are horrid people

Just fucking outrageous and despicable behavior.

[Vanje]

78. Well, It was ONLY pedophilia, afterall.

Its not like anybody IMPORTANT was being abused.
Nameless , unimportant mucky children from unimportant families.
Football is far more important. Joe Paterno knew that. And you prove it.

[ElboRuum]

174. Vanje...

Just because someone does something, no matter what it is, doesn't give you a license to be callous. I gather you seem to believe it does. You, in this case, are wrong.

You can rise above and be a class act, or you can be as barbarous as those you criticize. Your choice. One of those choices is worthy of respect, one merits the opposite. I'll leave it to you to decide which. I have confidence that you will know the difference and choose the barbarism anyway.

[obamanut2012]

177. Her life experiences give her that right

She is not being "barbarous."

You have no right to tell her she has no right to despise child rapists and their enablers. None.

[ElboRuum]

193. She's got as much right...

...as I do to tell her otherwise.

But while we're on the topic, where did I say she has no right to despise either of those things? I don't think I did, nor would I consider such a thing. I've never defended the man, and I won't. But you aren't judged by the standards you hold others to, you are judged by the ones you hold yourself to.

Telling someone to do something is quite definitely different than telling them your opinion and letting them decide how to proceed. But twist my words as you like, I can't stop you, I can but point it out.

Grave dancing is nauseating, crass, and classless. No excuse justifies it. Period. But if people don't feel that's a standard that people need to be held to, well so be it.

[Vanje]

186. Well, call me classless....and call me callous

for not joining in celebrating the life of a man who, for YEARS turned his back to obvious acts of pedophilia.

[ElboRuum]

194. I'm not calling you callous and classless

...because you aren't celebrating. I called you that because you're grave dancing. I can't be more clear than that.

[Zenlitened]

192. "License to be callous." Did you really just say that...

... without even a trace of irony?

And the bit about barbarism... that's a pretty astonishing bit of reality-inversion, too. Them being noted for their nuanced objectivity and all, and totally not the raping and invading and stuff.



What an absurd and unbelievable post. Fortunately, it's never too late to edit. What will your choice be?

[ElboRuum]

195. My choice?

Simple.

Stand by my words.

Righteous indignation is pretty ludicrous coming from grave dancers. What's absurd is people who think that somehow it's more of an acceptable act when it's performed in a group of like minded people. What's unbelievable is how you felt the need to assert for the right to behave like a classless jerk.

[Zenlitened]

196. "Classless." You keep using that term...

Seriously though, please make an effort to better understand what this discussion is about.

It's not about Paterno's death. It's about his life, and the decisions he made during it.

You rail about "grave dancing," yet seem to be just fine with enabling child abuse.

Why is that?

You go on and on about "class," even as you put down people who have shared painful truths about their lives.

Really?

Are these really the words you want to stand by?

[Faygo Kid]

79. +1

Nobody excuses his inaction, but it is just awful all over the Internet all the horrible ghoulish posts.

Sadly, some of it here is also triggered not just by the Sandusky scandal, but by the visceral hatred of sports that occasionally springs up on DU (see post #61).

Edited to say see post #78, as well. Head case.

[Zenlitened]

87. Wow. How utterly callous your edit is.

Indifferent, inexplicably indignant. Thoughtless and cruel.

The Paterno way, I suppose.

[yardwork]

111. I agree. Says a lot about Paterno supporters.

[Posteritatis]

88. I figure the visceral hatred of rapists' allies is a bigger factor here than hatred of sports. (nt)

[Zenlitened]

119. "Rapologists"?

Pretty astonishing, no matter what it's termed.

[Vanje]

89. Yeah, Well....

child sexual abuse will fuck with one's head. Too True!

"Edited to say see post #78, as well. Head case."

[QC]

148. Don't worry. The jury says it's OK to call people head cases now.

Ah, the New & Improved DU!

[Taverner]

82. Give it a rest

Paterno covered up for a child rapist. Spin it how you wish, that is exactly what "JoePa" did.

[obamanut2012]

91. No one is grave dancing

They are just appalled by this child rapist enabler not only being lauded, but being MADE INTO A VICTIM. It really is sickening.

[Coyote_Bandit]

93. Pain depends on point of view

During the continuing Sandusky investigation and prosecution there will be plenty of opportunity for fingerpointing by and at all parties. Including the dead ones. There simply is no compelling reason why the fingerpointing cannot wait for a few days - perhaps until the cold dead body is in the ground. Right now a family is grieving.

[obamanut2012]

100. Our posts are a reaction to the lauders and apologists

As I stated.

What does pain have to do with anything?

[Initech]

102. And the decades of abuse from Sandusky isn't?

I respect Paterno's career but Sandusky completely killed it. There's so much evidence against him that there's no way he can continue to hide or cover it up the way he has.

[yardwork]

110. As opposed to people who aid and abet child rapists. They're heroes.

I didn't read this thread intending to grave dance or say anything at all about Joe Paterno. But the callous, ignorant, self-centered defenses of his behavior here are something to see.

[Taverner]

81. I don't believe in god, souls or sin. I do believe in mercy.

I am not gravedancing - in fact I think he got let off easy

Like many said, I would have hoped he would have lived long enough to see the victims and hear their stories.

As for mercy, where was the "mercy" when these children were being raped? Did Sandusky show mercy? Did Joe Paterno when he knew full well about it?

[melissaf]

125. But did he know full well about it?

That's the question. In his last interview, he says he didn't. I don't know I believe him, but I personally don't know of any evidence that proves he's lying.

[Ruby the Liberal]

126. During which investigation

the one in 1998 that led to Sandusky's career ending "retirement", the McQueary eyewitness account in 2002 or potentially another?

Maybe he was waiting for a leprechaun to break through his roof, land in his living room and spell it all out for him.

He made his choice in life (to ignore and/or overlook that which could hurt his program, or force him to have to deal with sexual issues he prefer not to address) and how his legacy (in death) will memorialize that decision.

[melissaf]

127. "Potentially another"?

Not sure it's fair to be speculating as to how many reports of Sandusky's abuse Paterno chose not to investigate. He wasn't the chief of police. He wasn't God (football fans' opinions notwithstanding). He said he didn't know about 1998, and even McQueary claims he didn't go into graphic detail with Paterno.

Paterno still has a lot to answer for, but hypothetical reports of child sexual abuse shouldn't be one of them.

[Ruby the Liberal]

128. Wait, what?

Quoting:

[div class="excerpt" style="border: solid 1px #cccccc; border-radius:0.5385em; box-shadow: 3px 3px 3px #cccccc inset, 1px 1px 1px #cccccc;"]Paterno still has a lot to answer for, but hypothetical reports of child sexual abuse shouldn't be one of them.

There isn't an issue of an upcoming pedophilia case, and even moreso, that JoePa will somehow, in the future, address this continuing investigation?

Seriously?

[melissaf]

180. If there's another investigation,

I haven't heard about it. But then, I've mostly stayed away from the whole thing, so there may be new news I haven't heard of.

Also, I don't know that Paterno will "address" any investigations anymore, seeing as how he's dead and can't talk.

[cstanleytech]

99. Suggestion........regardless of your views please try and remain civil people. nt

[AngryOldDem]

103. LOL.

I agree with you, but this place never passes up a chance for a good grave dance.

As if all of us here are so damned perfect that we can pass mortal judgment on others.

Not saying Paterno was totally blameless, but there is no point now in the piling-on.

[MADem]

132. I don't think most of us here would tiptoe anywhere near the moral abyss that "JoPa" found himself

in.

Come on, it's pretty straightforward--do not molest children, and do not tolerate anyone who does such a thing. Protect the child first and foremost.

Simple rules, really. No nuance to be found in that sort of situation. And yeah, if there's any situation where "moral (or mortal) judgment" is called for, I'd say keeping little kids safe from predators is pretty high up on the darn list. It doesn't even require "perfection" to pull off, just a little bit of essential decency.

Spare the concern for "JoPa" too. He's dead--he can't feel the "piling on." Perhaps, though, his very live, very defensive cheerleaders will--and they really should feel it, because they plainly don't get that what he did was very, very wrong.

[RobinA]

141. Do "Most of Us Here"

have any actual experience in this area? Has someone who does, it's a moral abyss that we walk every day. With more "nuance" than can be understood (apparently) by those who wish to view life as as a situation where certitude EVER has a place.

I'd say I envy the black & white world many here seem to live in, how very easy to live with a clear cut set of imperatives for all situations, but I don't. I would hope that all would aspire to something a little more enlightened.

[obamanut2012]

142. I do not think most people come close to what Paterno did

Many of us in these threads are mandatory reporters, quite a few have reported abuse. I also bet many of us know people who have been raped as a child.

No, most of us don't walk any such kind of "moral abyss." And, some things are black and white, with no "nuance."

Just wow.

[RobinA]

153. You Are Right

about one thing. Just wow.

If you could report second hand reports of child abuse without seeing the moral abyss you are skirting, I fear for those around you. Having worked in child welfare, I know very few of my fellow workers who weren't keenly aware of the very human consequences of a mis-step in ANY direction. Child abuse is a hall of mirrors which you walk through in sand. Everybody involved gets tripped up now and then. And that's the people involved, educated in it and with experience. Mr. Paterno, football coach, was a babe in that woods.

[MADem]

161. No--the "babe in the woods" wasn't Paterno--it was that poor kid trapped underneath that Sandusky

cretin.

There's no excuse for Paterno's inaction. It's his legacy of greed and cowardice.

[MADem]

156. If anyone has to "ask" themselves what they might do when a trusted employee comes

to one with a tale about another employee fucking a small child in a team shower, then they have Big Issues.

It's a no-brainer. Yes, this IS a "black and white" matter, and you don't have to live in a black and white world to see that.

No amount of football money, team hoo-ha, yee-haw and alumni drunken pride is worth the abuse of a kid. Or ten. Or twenty. Or hundreds.

If you know it happened, and you don't speak up and stop it and bring the perpetrator to justice, you're no better than a damn pimp.

When the kettle whistles, you take it off the stove. You don't sit there hoping that the water will eventually evaporate and the kettle melt into nothingness.

The guy -- in his most important leadership test -- demonstrated an abject failure to lead.

[Vanje]

158. Are YOU fucking KIDDING me!?

Experience in this area?
I cant imagine what sort of experience would lead anyone to be quiet when he suspects that someone he knows is fucking little kids.
Yes. It is black and white. Fucking kids is NOT a gray area.
Not in my world.
Your world maybe scares me. A lot.

[obamanut2012]

160. My thought, too

[Critters2]

179. I've reported two child rapists in my career. No nuance, no grey area. I learned they were

Last edited Tue Jan 24, 2012, 12:53 PM - Edit history (1)

raping children, I called the authorities. Period. Easy peezy. Not happy with how slowly DCFs moved in one case, but I did my part. What "nuance" do you see in the decision to stop a child rapist?

[obamanut2012]

137. I've mever enabled a chid rapist or hurt a child

I'm also a mandatory reporter, like Paterno was, and unlike him, know I'm NOT supposed to help seep it under the rug.

So, compared to Paterno, yes, I am pretty darned perfect.

And, there is no "piling on," just disgust at how this man is being lauded and defended and made into a victim.

[RobinA]

139. Then You Know

that these situations are rarely black and white.

[obamanut2012]

143. That's how I know they are black and white

[RobinA]

155. Then I Question

how involved you really are.

[Vanje]

159. No!

In what conceivable instance is it acceptable for an old bastard to fuck boys in the locker room?
Give me ONE scenario. Convince me that allowing a guy who "rescues " underpriveledged children and fucks them in the shower is remotely acceptable.

[cstanleytech]

191. Other than my prior post I have largely stayed out of this thread because these types of threads

almost always devolve like has been going on here with accusations flying back and forth but I just wanted to poke my head in and point out that your missing one key part which is...............a conviction.
So far there hasnt been a conviction just accusations but hey feel free to keep attacking one another like the republican candidates have been doing at their debates as I am not going to stop you.

[MrMickeysMom]

129. Joe probably should have retired years back...

... when he could still make a decision.

Sad.

[Guy Montag]

133. This thread is interesting in how too seriously people take football.

I have sympathy for his family, but the fact is clear he let himself become too much a legend in his own mind.

He must have thought himself too valuable because he most certainly stayed too long at the job way past his prime.

He obviously thought himself too valuable to sully himself with the duty to deal with this child raping scoundrel, or was in too much of an age induced fog to pierce his own cognitive dissonance on the matter.

My condolences for his family, but a lesson people should also take away from this is people in general have a duty to help nudge people aside if they try to stay to long at a job that wears out a coach far younger than eighty five.

We all want to live forever, we all think of ourselves and irreplaceable, but the simple truth is we don't, and we are.

[yurbud]

172. people involved in athletics can get just about the worst tunnel vision

the only thing that comes close is Wall Street and lawyers.

[solarman350]

135. joe paterno-pedophile enabler

For what moral reason would ANYONE protect a pedophile? You do realize that this went on for something like thirty years don't you? Wonder how things would have turned out if paterno had lived long enough to be called as a witness (hostile or not) for this upcoming case against sandusky. I'm amazed that paterno is STILL being lionized by the Press (aka "CORPORATE MEDIA&quot despite the fact that he enabled sandusky to rape children for thirty years or so. Look at the folks building shrines to paterno there in Pennsylvania. What the fuck is that all about? It is unacceptable and inexcusable. Penn State needs a lifelong ban from collegiate sports competition....or at least a 30 yr ban.

[obamanut2012]

138. He's being given a state funeral

It's disgusting.

I also think the Penn program needs to be suspended, at least until after the trial(s). Who knows who all in the program was involved in some way??? The NCAA and the Commonwealth of PA are derelict in not demanding this.

[roody]

168. That is shocking!

[melissaf]

184. Penn STATE

NOT Penn. Penn = University of Pennsylvania.

Please, everyone out there talking about this: do not confuse the two!! One university has nothing to do with the other, and to act like there's no difference makes it seem like you don't really care about the issue.

[RobinA]

185. Judging By The Attitudes

of some of the posters on this thread, that is a distinction too fine for many to grasp.

[obamanut2012]

189. We know we are taking about Penn State and not the U of P

And, I'm sorry that you don't care for the "attitude" of despising the lauding of a freaking child rapist enabler.

[obamanut2012]

188. The University of Pennsylvanoa is in Philly

It is an Ivy League school. I know the difference between the two.

Who in the world is saying what you are accusing us of???

[BigD_95]

147. I hate to bash the dead but...

I have never been a fan of Joe Paterno in the world of sports.

Not sure if people know this that don't follow sports but ESPN did a whole special on PSU football team and all the arrest & trouble the players have been in over a course of like 10 years. ESPN did that on PSU because it was a crazy amount more then other Football colleges.

Yet Joe is consider some great icon.

I remember when around 5 football players broke into another person's house and beat the crap out of the kid. Joe Pa wouldn't let the school punish the kids. Instead he made them clean the football stadium.

He had local law in his back pocket and when kids got in trouble they went to him and he would handle it and keep it quiet.

The kid that got beat up by the players received death threats from other students if he pressed charges. This stuff went on all the time with his players. Most of the stuff was kept quiet because even after being assaulted if you spoke out the entire student body would turn on you if they felt it would cost them players & games. That's how bad it was.

Then Joe Pa himself when girls got assaulted would blame the girls. Women's groups used to speak out against him but nobody listen. Football was the only important thing. Against Fl St in a BCS game several years ago the head coach of Fl St sent his top defensive player a LB home before the game. He went back to a girls room late a night. The girl claimed she was assaulted. Joe Pa blamed the girl. Said that players shouldn't go back with girls at night because they trick the players and what should girls expect bringing a guy back in their room that late at night.

There is so many countless players getting away with crap on that team year after year.

By the way it wasn't that long ago Joe Pa himself ran down some lady in her car. I think actually ran her off the road and cussed her out for her driving. Yes Joe Pa with road rage.



http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/view/23871-paternos-road-rage-incident


I'm not saying everything he did was bad I just always felt his God like image he had was so fake. All the news that broke with what he did or didn't do just put the spot light on the real Joe Pa. Winning meant more then anything else. Even all those kids he could have helped.

[beac]

154. I too am amazed that Paterno has a such a great reputation.

Putting aside the whole Sandusky thing, there is PLENTY of other evidence that "JoePa" would look the other way and, worse, intervene to protect his players from the consequences of their bad, and often illegal, acts.

From 2002 to 2008, 46 Penn State football players have faced 163 criminal counts, according to an analysis by ESPN. http://blogs.phillymag.com/the_philly_post/2011/11/16/psu/

[kaitcat]

150. There are days when I wish I believed in hell.

This is one of them.

My sympathies to his family, but this pedophile-enabler got off easy.

[yurbud]

169. that guy laid a turd on his own obituary

[Tom Ripley]

181. I'm not celebrating his death, but then again, I never celebrated his life

Football means jackshit to me