2 arrested in beating of Clinton Twp. driver; police want others to surrender [Steve Utash]

[alp227]

Source: Detroit Free Press

Detroit police have arrested two teens in connection with the brutal beating of a tree trimmer from Clinton Township that has sparked outrage across the region.

The teens, ages 16 and 17, were arrested without incident early this morning in the area of the beating on Detroit’s east side, according to Detroit police spokesman Sgt. Michael Woody.

Woody said the teens, who are from Detroit, were part of the group that beat Steve Utash, 54, on Wednesday, after his pickup hit 10-year-old David Harris, and he stopped to check on the boy. Woody declined to discuss a motive for the attack.

Police have said the boy was struck after he stepped into the path of the pickup, which was westbound on Morang, and Utash was not at fault. As of early this afternoon, Utash was in a medically induced coma at St. John Hospital and Medical Center with multiple head injuries.

Read more: http://www.freep.com/article/20140405/NEWS01/304050049/2-teens-arrest-driver-s-beating

[7962]

1. This was terrible. Hope they get all of the scumbags who put this man into a coma. nt

[840high]

2. I hope this man recovers. The

group belongs in jail. A most vicious attack.

[lunasun]

3. Gas Stn video proves it was not even the drivers fault - sick

[jtuck004]

4. Sounds like it might fit their hate crime statute, maybe keept the little bastards in

a cage a while longer.

[1StrongBlackMan]

7. I read the article and most of the links connected to it ...

where do you get that this beating had anything to do with the race of the victim, rather than because he hit a young kid with his pick-up truck?

Or are we now joining the space where Black perpetrator/white victim must be a hate crime?

[LovingA2andMI]

11. The fight had DIRECTLY to do that this Person hit a kid with his truck

But the so called News Media in Detroit which hate the African-American populace of Detroit, will be sure to make this story out to be the next "White Man" being beaten by "Black People" melee.

Here's the situation, the media in Detroit hates Detroit unless and until they achieve a White Utopia with re-gentrification led by folks like Dan Glibert (buying up all the foreclosed, abandoned and otherwise unlivable housing), Roger Penske (who partly financing the re-gentrification plan while buying up business buildings left and right) and Mike Illitch (who got his land for the new Red Wings Stadium for a $1.00 without promising to hire ONE African-American Detroiter for the new stadium to be --- in a city with 20-25% unemployment).

Stories like the man who hit a kid with his truck --- who happened to be White--- helps the re-gentrification plan to move the undesirable "Blacks" out and "Whites" in their place. Also, remember -- the city "elected" (which is up for debate -- considering the write in ballots for said "White" mayoral candidate had similar handwriting) it's first "White" Mayor in 40 years.....

There a point behind this story and anyone who's watching what's happening to Detroit, knows it.

By the way, where is the same outrage on DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND for Pensioners who worked for the City -- with a promise of income for life after 30 to 40+ years of labor--- having the rug pulled out from under them by being FORCED to take anywhere from a 6-34% monthly income cut? Oh....it does not or barely exist. Interesting, indeed.

[1StrongBlackMan]

35. Apparently it's not just the media ...

too many comments on this "liberal/progressive" site have made the leap that the beating was racially motivated.

[7962]

84. There have been LOTS of comments about Detroit pensioners here; when the bankruptcy began.

There were several threads on it.

[mstinamotorcity2]

96. I feel you on a lot of what you are saying.

People who don't live here don't fucking know shit!!! The people who jumped that man were opportunist. It had nothing to do with RACE!! But everything to do with Ignorance. But this is happening in our Suburbs also. How about I give a few examples so we understand this is not about hate. Example #1 http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25195196/prosecutor-army-vet-beat-was-initial-aggressor
Example #2 http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/articles/8961/fox_2_mob_beats_to_death_man_at_west-side_gas_station#.U0SNMk1OXct

Did they tell you that there was a HERO who helped the man, well here she is http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25196717/the-pistol-toting-angel-of-mercy-that-saved-a-driver-from-an-angry-detroit-mob

It doesn't matter the ethnic background or culture. Its opportunity!!! There are some truly Great people in our city!! But if the media tells you something why don't you ask a Detroiter. We are under a National attack and all I have seen are Negative things so most people will think negative things about the city! Look I will be the first to admit we have some Major issues. But these issues are the same in most big cities. But when you are being led to the slaughterhouse of republican Privatization you need encouragement to try and stop this Agenda. Oh I know they say well that's Detroit. Full of Black folk who cares?? I do. I care because I know if they get Detroit this plan is coming to a city near you. The Republican Governor has a lock with these Emergency Financial Managers all over the State. And they are mostly in Diverse segments of the State and we all know what I mean by diverse. I feel empathy for our Retirees and our Children because they are the ones who will be hurt the most. They started an amnesty program for people to pay Parking tickets and minor traffic violations and civil infractions. EFM Kevin Orr, put a hold on that. They were only waiving City fees not tickets themselves. They were also giving a reduction on minor violations. But Orr said no!!!!!! Rotten POS. We not finished. As of next week they are going to turn off Residential water service 3000 customers at a time for late or overdue payments. This will be a weekly event!!!While Ford Field, Eastern Market, Comerica Park, State of Michigan office buildings, owe in the millions. Those entities get to dispute their bills. And are not required to have their service shut off!!!!

[Shemp Howard]

14. You're right.

What was the motive for the attack? Was the white victim just stopping to make a delivery or something, and then he was attacked because he was white? No. The driver was attacked because he struck a kid. The driver was not at fault. But he was attacked because he struck a kid.

Was the driver beaten harder because he was white? Maybe. Who knows? But to go down that road is to make every last multiple-race incident a hate crime.

There are plenty of hate crimes, by black instigators as well as by white instigators. But this isn't one of them.

[delta17]

16. This wasn't a hit and run.

It sounds like it was clearly an accident, and the driver stopped to check on the kid. I can understand people being upset, I have two children. That said, there ws no excuse to beat this guy into a coma. I don't know if this a hate crime or not, but these young men need to see some serious jail time.

[LovingA2andMI]

17. Are you "As Outraged" about pensioners soon being....

Forced to join the Homeless Population due to a severe cut in their monthly PROMISED pension revenue?

"Hundreds of Detroit retirees and supporters rallied this morning outside federal court downtown to protest cuts to pension benefits that they say will cripple people of modest means.

The protesters urged retirees to reject the city’s proposal to cut General Retirement System pension checks by up to 34% and the Police and Fire Retirement System pension checks by up to 14%. With a proposed end to cost of living adjustments, the retirees say the cuts are even more severe, coupled with dramatic cuts to health care benefits for retired and current city workers.

“They’ve taken our health care coverage from the retirees,” said Michael Smith, a retired city bus driver who lives in Redford Township. “Behind that, they want to take a third of my pension. Quite naturally it’s going to be awfully difficult for not just me but anybody to survive off one-third of your money being cut.”

He added that he hoped to send a message to Detroit emergency manager Kevyn Orr, Gov. Rick Snyder and others that the cuts will mean devastation for “real people. We’re not the banks. We’re just everyday people.”

Protesters carried signs saying “Stop the Legal Looting of Detroit” and “Bail out people, not banks.”

It was among the largest protests yet by pensioners — about 300 participants — and it came as Orr ramps up pressure on retiree groups and unions to accept the cuts or risk even steeper reductions.

Under a so-called grand bargain designed to shield the Detroit Institute of Arts and its assets, private foundations, the state of Michigan and the DIA itself have pledged $815 million that would be earmarked to reduce pension cuts. The deal would spin off the DIA from city ownership to a private nonprofit entity.

Orr has told retirees that the DIA-pension deal significantly reduces cuts to pensioners, and that if they don’t agree to accept the deal, pensioners could face even steeper reductions.

The protest also came a day after Orr’s bankruptcy team filed an amended bankruptcy restructuring plan that calls for a major overhaul of pension fund management, including appointing trustee boards to oversee each of the retirement funds.

Ed McNeil, a special assistant to the president of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Council 25, the city’s largest labor union, spoke out against the proposal that also would get rid of union appointees to pension fund boards, saying the state’s goal from the beginning was to take over the pension funds and gain control of its assets.

He said retirees and city workers are bearing the brunt of the cuts in bankruptcy, and they’re the ones who can least afford benefit reductions.

“Everybody just may as well move to the cemetery and just open up a coffin and lay down — that’s what they want you to do,” McNeil said. “But we’re not going to let that happen. We’re going to stand up. We’re going to continue to fight.”

http://www.freep.com/article/20140401/NEWS01/304010082/Detroit-pensioners-bankruptcy-protest

[delta17]

19. What does that have to do with this story?

I don't agree with pension funds being looted. I also don't agree with mob violence.

[LovingA2andMI]

21. EVERYTHING....about the undercurrent of anger and outrage....

About what's going on in Detroit. How to you know that these children don't live with a GRANDPARENT (quite common in the African-American community you know) who in turn just lost her or his health insurance starting April 1 (thanks to the Governor Rick Snyder -- who's white, and E.M. Kevyn Orr -- who's a Oreo at best), and now Grandma/Pa is worried about keeping a roof over their head with a 6-34% pension cut.

How do you know if these teens -- tried to find employment to help the Grandparent(s), but in a City with a 20-25% unemployment rate among it's African-American populace could not.

How would this make you feel knowing that all of this suffering was coming down due to a certain race (and those working for the needs and wants of that race -- I.E. E.M. Kevyn Orr) was the catalyst of said suffering.

Then these same teens see a Caucasian in a Truck on a Detroit street hit (even if it was a accident -- which it could have easily been) a young African-American child? What do you think after all of the above, they MIGHT do?

Was it right what happen, of course not. Should they face penalties, probably. Should it been LIFE in Prison, NO.

Meanwhile, what about the next teen in Detroit with a Grandparent worrying how to keep the lights on after soon losing 6-34% of their PROMISED monthly pension? Will you care about them or better yet, that entire family.

If you came you do, then get ready because this number will be in the THOUSANDS.

[delta17]

26. I truly sympathize with people who have had their life savings stolen.

I won't defend that one bit. That said, there is still right and wrong, and what these young men did was wrong, point blank. The rest of your post is just speculation. They can argue that at trial, I guess.

I hope the kid who was hit by the truck makes a full recovery. I hope the driver makes a full recovery. I hope the people who attacked him serve their time.

[LovingA2andMI]

58. And after the driver's full recovery....

I fully expect the full aspect of the law on hitting a pedestrian (i.e. -- the kid) to be served. In addition, I fully aspect for the family to sue the driver's insurance company for the child's injuries, irregardless to the alleged events that occurred after the driver hit a pedestrian (a kid).

Meanwhile, I expect a vigorous defense of the two young boys along proper investigation of what might have proceeded to the alleged beating of driver.

[philosslayer]

62. Thank you for your very reasoned response.

We know very little about what happened here. Who knows what the driver may have said to the young men who approached him. He very well may have provoked them. And why the presumption that he's not guilty? He hit a child with a truck hard enough to severely injure the child. Once the driver recovers (hoping he does), I hope he is also held to account for what he's done also.

[exboyfil]

64. So words can now be used to justify a violent assault

The video looks like the kid stepped out onto a rapidly moving two lane. The driver was going no faster or slower than the other cars on the two lane. The driver apparently immediately stopped (off screen so can't see it). Should he have used caution when seeing kids on the side of the road. I know I would have slowed. If it is a common occurrence on the road (children on the side of the road) perhaps I would use less caution over time.

One lesson to be drawn from this - Avoid driving in Detroit??? You can't leave the scene but you get put in the hospital if you stay.

The measure of whether it is a hate crime would be what would happen if the races were reversed? Assaults especially ones that lead to life threatening injuries and robberies should carry enough of a penalty that the discussion is meaningless anyway.

If the driver had been tanked and mowed down the kid on the side of the road. I could see an extrajudicial beat down as a mitigating, but in this case???

[LovingA2andMI]

67. You're welcome...

[FrodosPet]

70. So the fact that it was the child's fault is irrelevant?

"Meanwhile, I expect a vigorous defense of the two young boys along proper investigation of what might have proceeded to the alleged beating of driver."

Me too! Followed by conviction and imprisonment for a long time.

Whether it was racially motivated, or just a bunch of violent assholes going after an easy target doesn't matter. The state of Detroit's economics does not matter.

What matters is a group of people mob beat and nearly killed a man. That must be severely discouraged.

[Ash_F]

71. The driver clearly was not at fault, from the video

The kid suddenly ran out into the street, not at an intersection. You can see him taking a sprinting stance(his friend too), just before attempting to rush across the street. His friend had second thoughts, at the last moment, and stopped. He went for it anyway, and didn't make it.

Video here: http://www.freep.com/article/20140402/NEWS01/304020159/Mob-beats-driver-who-accidentally-hit-boy-with-pickup-in-Detroit


I get your point about underlying racial tension in the city, but let's not jump to conclusions about what happened before seeing the first bit of evidence.

[penultimate]

75. If what you said was their motivation, then it was hate crime...

Last edited Mon Apr 7, 2014, 02:36 PM - Edit history (1)

They also made it much harder for themselves to get jobs in the future, because it's difficult for convicted violent to find employment. And for that they have no one but themselves to blame. I for one would be very reluctant to hire someone who showed the inability control their anger and frustrations, and decided taking it out on an innocent person was the best course of action. And that's even assuming everything you're speculating is correct. These kids may have just been assholes, and asshole don't get any sympathy.

Do you believe they should receive the same penalty that a similar white on black, white on white, black on black, whatever on whatever would get?

[Shemp Howard]

20. Way, way off topic.

Look, I'm a strong believer in unions. I'm a proud union member myself. And I believe that a city should keep its promises to its workers. You're correct about all that.

But that has next to nothing to do with a beating on a street, other than both are outrages.

If I were you, I'd consider starting a new post. The material you've presented is worth the read. But IMHO it doesn't belong here. No offense meant.

[LovingA2andMI]

24. If someone can ALLUDE ---

These kids where ROUGE YOUTH out for just beating a Caucasian Man on the streets for no reasons other than his race and he hit a young kid, then the rest of what's REALLY going on in Detroit is equally on point and ON-TOPIC.

[delta17]

28. I never said it was racial.

I said it was a gross overreaction to an accident.

These guys saw the accident. If the driver was at fault, they could have made statements and he might have lost his license or worse. Instead, now they are probably going to go to jail. How does that help the 11 year old kid again? The next driver who gets into an accident in that neighborhood will high tail it out of there.

[LovingA2andMI]

29. Avoidance and defection is a wonderful concept....

But it does not work in this case. All the FACTORS facing Detroit has to be examined to determine what could be the root-cause of these young boys anger. A five minute reading of an "article" cannot do it, at all.

Meanwhile, continue your "outrage" as I work at informing Detroiters of the situations of re-gentrification going on around them and how best to handle these subjects without anger.

[delta17]

31. Avoiding and deflecting?

Like saying that these kids weren't responsible for putting this guy in a coma?

Lots of people have anger, for many different reasons. That doesn't excuse violence.

[seveneyes]

32. root-cause of these young boys anger

I'm sure the family of the innocent man these idiots tried to kill are not concerned with any unrelated issues these violent punks may have with their "anger." Anyone who can't prevent themselves from harming innocents needs to be locked away from society. Hopefully they will have plenty of time to deal with any "anger issues" while spending decades safely isolated from peaceful civilization.

[1StrongBlackMan]

36. No one is arguing ...

that these young men shouldn't be held to account. Just resisting the racial motive behind the beating.

[LovingA2andMI]

57. 1StrongBlackMan.....

It will never matter to many of "these folks" on high moral ground at the moment. The faux "outage" is based on the color of these young boys skin and the lack of melanin in the skin of the truck driver who hit a young kid with his truck.

Think of "Black Wall Street" 2014. If many had their way with these two young African-American boys....the situation would end just like that. Ironically, it took years to determine the fake "outrage" that started the fires in Tulsa, OK was based off a lie. Meanwhile, the People harmed never were made whole.

"Black Wall Street, the name fittingly given to one of the most affluent all-Black communities in America, was bombed from the air and burned to the ground by mobs of envious Whites. In a period spanning fewer than 12 hours, a once thriving Black business district in northern Tulsa lay smoldering – a model community destroyed and a major African-American economic movement resoundingly defused."

http://sfbayview.com/2011/what-happened-to-black-wall-street-on-june-1-1921/

On a statistical basis it's African-American on Caucasian crime -- the perpetrator is threw in prison for life or worse, face the death penalty. In reverse, if the victim has a name like Trayvon Martin or Jordan Davis, justice is rarely if ever served.

The faux "outrage" is a symbol of why America has not been or will ever be the, "Land of the Free, Home of the Brave"....regardless of political party affiliation.

[penultimate]

76. Ughh...yuck!

What a divisive and presumptuous thing to say. Stop assuming what people are thinking or "really mean". Nearly everyone on this site is for social justice and fixing the fucked up shit that minorities have to put up with in this country. It's offensive that you make everyone here out to be racist hatemongers who don't understand simply because a lot do not agree that these men should have their violent actions excused and justified. Brutally attacking an innocent person because you may be angry about a situation or another group of people is wrong no matter who is attacking and who is being attacked.

As you're trying to frame it (by putting words in the attackers mouths) it would be classified as a hate crime. However, assuming you're wrong, then there is little suggest it's a hate crime and not just a bunch of assholes.

[GOPee]

93. Remove the color, motive, or any the other limited unknown facts in this article.

This is a tragic event, where it appears there was such bad judgment, as to raise it to a horrendous outcome. I hope the man and boy recover without lifelong effects, and that those that are the perpetrators get the legal justice, they deserve.

[AverageJoe90]

65. "But this isn't one of them." I don't think there's much to support that, either.

It does remain possible, but so far, nothing's come out that conclusively indicates it, though.

[seveneyes]

18. maybe keep the violent assaulting criminals locked up a while longer?

How about taking a stand against people trying to kill innocents by locking them up for a minimum of 30 years? These criminals are obviously not able to be in society without great risk to innocents. Maybe give them 20 years if they finger the other violent criminals involved in the torture and beating of this innocent man.

[alp227]

46. Sorry, an interracial crime is not per se a hate crime.

The burden of proof to prove a crime is a hate crime is high enough that one cannot assume that one who commits a crime against a person of another ethnicity is inherently committing a hate crime.

[jtuck004]

50. It wasn't "one", it was a mob, no different from the torch-carrying-bomb-thowing racist thugs

we have and have had for a long time. I'm sure there are a million excuses. But if a dozen white guys did this same thing many would be screaming and calling them KKK. Except for Fox News of course.

There are probably dozens of incidents there where black folk hit someone with their car, just like in any other big city. I did a little searching, and can't find one, not one, where the crowd of angry young black men descended - on a black person - and beat them senseless, compounding the tragedy of the kid getting hit by leaving a family probably facing bankruptcy, and perhaps the permanent disability or death of their father, breadwinner, this person who was doing nothing more than working in their neighborhood, for nothing more than satisfying their egos.

But it's different when it's a white driver. That's a hate crime. I'm not suggesting they be charged because of an assumption, but the crime ought to be investigated as such. To not do so would be just as wrong, just as racist, as if black folk can't be held to the same standards as other people, that they don't have the same a abilities as everyone else. That's along the lines of what Jason Richwine argues, and he's a scumbag of the lowest order.

[alp227]

52. umm...nice concern trolling around conjecture.

"I'm not suggesting they be charged because of an assumption, but the crime ought to be investigated as such. To not do so would be just as wrong, just as racist, as if black folk can't be held to the same standards as other people, that they don't have the same a abilities as everyone else. That's along the lines of what Jason Richwine argues, and he's a scumbag of the lowest order."

Err...what concrete evidence other than the facts (truck driver hits a child, angry mob converges) can suggest this was a hate crime? Conjecture isn't gonna convince me, sorry.

And the Southern Poverty Law Center http://www.splcenter.org/ has plenty of articles exposing the black equivalents of the KKK i.e. New Black Panthers and Nation of Islam. No one's denying that black Americans can commit hate crimes. It's just that the right wing media likes to dilute the meaning of "hate crime" (remember, the religious right opposed the Matthew Shepherd act) by characterizing things like the Knockout Game as "BLACK ON WHITE HATE CRIMES" as a way to render the term meaningless.

[jtuck004]

53. I don't care about convincing you. I, frankly, other than this annoyance, don't

even think about you. Nor do I give a flying fuck about right wing media. Neither one of you.

This wasn't a game. It was out of control thugs on a street corner who beat up a person of a different color than everyone in the crowd for doing nothing but checking on the welfare of a kid who ran out, illegally, on film, in front of his pickup, while he was just coming home from doing some work.

That's enough to investigate. All that other stuff is just chat.

[840high]

85. You expressed how I see it.

[mstinamotorcity2]

97. Not enough for a hate crime!!!

It wasn't that. It was Ignorance!!!!! He was not the first. It just happened to be him that hit the child. It could have been anyone. to incite racial provocation in this instance is all wrong. But if I know you, you will say I am lying too. The media is playing to hate because it works for them in our image!!! And you have shown a great example of what the wrong perceptions do to the thought process when you already have a mental picture in your head. Its there because it has had 350 years to settle in.

[jtuck004]

101. You don't know the first thing about what I think, that's obvious.

Whether you are lying is something only you would know - it's all opinion, so why would you? But I really, really don't care.

When Richard Pryor came out of doing some stuff in prison, he pointed out that "I am GLAD some of those motherfuckers are in there"

And I will be glad when these motherfuckers are in a cage.

Whether it IS a hate crime will be determined by the investigators, but there is more than enough to start. And they have, regardless of your hyperbole and characterizations.

But that has not much to do with a kid who ran out into traffic that had the right of way, for which they should look at charging the parents with neglect, and a group of little thugs who beat a working person nearly to death for nothing but caring about the welfare of a kid, it doesn't do shit for the likely medical bankruptcy they will be facing, and it doesn't have anything to do with this guy who is in a coma they have not been able to bring him out of successfully because he starts fighting.

As if he was being beaten to death by thugs on a street corner. It may be all that he ever remembers.

But perhaps the air is a might thin, up there on your high horse. Why don't you crusade off in another direction, maybe you can find some oxygen. I have big people work to do.

I won't be able to read your reply. Since you know so much, I bet you can figure out why.

[jtuck004]

102. and...

...
" Suddenly, some of the 30 people who surrounded the scene pounced on the driver.
A 54-year-old man was in critical condition after he was beaten by a group of people that attacked him when he checked on an 11-year-old boy that he hit with his truck. WXYZ A 54-year-old man was in critical condition after he was beaten by a group of people that attacked him when he checked on an 11-year-old boy that he hit with his truck.

“I think it lasted about one minute and then they let him go,” one witness, who did not give his name, told the news station.

“And then they jumped back on him again and they did it about three times, and finally someone was trying to help the guy that got beat up ... It was sad because I knew the guy was getting out of his car to try and see what damage he did.”
...

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/detroit-man-brutally-beaten-stopping-check-boy-hit-truck-article-1.1744464#ixzz2yMpWiOHm

The witness was right, it was sad. Guy should be able to get out of his car and attend to a victim without becoming one.

But this is about my limit, (in that I mean I ain't gonna spend no more time on justifying why I think they need to go to jail and be investigated for a hate crime. Already did). Because this is one tragedy among millions that shouldn't be happening. There were a lot of failures that led to this one, but we need to think about safety, and a mob beating someone into a coma is very likely just the next victim.

It's never gonna stop, though, until we address the causes. And we aren't gonna do that by cutting food stamps.

[mstinamotorcity2]

103. Yea real truth

is too hard to conceive for some individuals.

[Boomerproud]

5. I hope the victim recovers and the perpetrators are brought to justice.

It's the only outcome that will heal this crime.

[TomClash]

6. Isn't this a possible hate crime?

The driver did everything right. Why was he attacked? It would seem race may have been a motive in the attack.

[1StrongBlackMan]

8. Did everything right? ....

Why was he attacked ... probably because a 10 year old kid was hit by the truck.

[sarcasmo]

9. You are saying it's OK to for a group of teens to attack a man because a kid

ran into a street and was hit by a car?
A group of kids who were black hanging out at a gas station. They beat a white man nearly to death because a kid ran out into the road and was hit by a car. There is no way to defend this attack.

[1StrongBlackMan]

10. No ...

I am not defending the crime (and yes, the beating is/was a crime).

I am explaining why the guy was beaten ... crowds have never been accused of acting rationally, especially when children are injured by someone perceived as "outsiders."

And what does the race of the victim or the perpetrators have to do with this?

[Yo_Mama]

12. Maybe because he was perceived as an "outsider"?

if he had been running away from the accident that's one thing, but when a person stops and is attempting to help the victim, the beating makes no sense, nor does the robbery. Most think there is another element to it.

A very sad story.

[sarcasmo]

13. If you have been following the Detroit News coverage of this story

race is the central focus. Fact, group of black teens beat a white driver who tried to do the right thing. There is no denying the fact.

[LovingA2andMI]

59. Yes, because the Detroit News is the beckon of all things race neutral.....

And would never let RACE be a catalysis of "baiting" a certain story. No, not ever....but, oh wait...

"Updated: Friday, 10:15 p.m. -- Nolan Finley responded by saying: "I'm not going to dignify that idiocy with a response. My description of Mr. Barrow was 100 percent accurate based on his inappropriate performance Tuesday night."

*********

Suffice to say, Detroit News Editorial Page Editor Nolan Finley and mayoral candidate Tom Barrow won't be going for beers any time soon.

FInley, who appeared on Fox2's "Let it Rip" show on Thursday night, said of Barrow: "He's a a buffoon, he's a jerk, he's a convicted felon." He also said he was a perennial loser in the mayoral races in Detroit, and Tuesday would mark his fourth failed attempt to get that job.

Barrow, not one to turn the other cheek, fired off a press release Friday saying Finley's remarks were "bigoted and racially charged."

http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/articles/5886/nolan_finley_calls_barrow_a_buffoon_barrow_calls_remarks_racially_charged

No, never, ever, ever.....

[mstinamotorcity2]

98. Nolan is a racist!!

He on flashpoint every Sunday!! He sits on Republican side of table. He is against all things that help people!! He is for EFM's. He is not for Minimum wage. He is the worst of the worst. He rolls up to Mackinaw Island and kisses the rings of top republicans. Then comes back and sit at the table and tell us why we should be with Republicans. He is one of the Major reasons we are going through some of the shit we are now. He has always Catered to the Suburbs and Oakland County is his perfect society because L. Brooks Patterson is cool with him. He is not liked by a lot of Detroiters.

[Igel]

22. That's the essence of a hate crime.

Us versus them. Insiders versus outsiders.

It can be religion.

It can be gender.

It can be race.

Heck, it can be political affiliation. It can be what soccer team you support. It can be ethnicity--Poles against Italians, the reigning ethnic boundary at the high school I attended.

But what matters isn't so matter what's done, but the insider/outsider status of the "bad guy."

Flip it around--people often like to play that particular game here. What if the driver had been black and stopped after hitting that particular kid? Would that particular mob have beaten him into a coma?

What if the kid had been white? Would the "mob"--which happened to be black--have beaten the driver?

Yet another way: What if the mob had been white, the driver white, and the kid black? Nobody would have seen a story, I'm guessing.

And the final way: "White mob beats black man into coma after he stops to help after hitting a white kid with his car." A lot of people would be rushing to make that into a hate crime.

Absolutes don't matter here. "Definitely" and "maybe not" are close enough to being the same. No sneaking through a 5-10% margin of error to say that 0% is close enough to 90% to be equivalent. "Not everybody" would rush to judgment is much closer to "everybody would" than it is to "nobody would."

Because again, the entire "insider/outsider," us versus them, mentality would come into play--where the news is too often a good-versus-bad morality-play, an on-going comment to the ever-central topic of our own individual daily lives.

[wolfie001]

38. Concern troll alert!

callin' you out "lars"

[Tarnation6]

48. What is a "concern troll"?

[uppityperson]

51. A concern troll is someone who signs up to disrupt with false or overly concerns. A sock is someone

who signs up with a second account typically to support the position of their primary account. A zombie is someone who has been banned signing up again, rising from the dead.

I hope this helps.

[Tarnation6]

54. Why is that guy a "concern troll"?

He just asked a question. Some other people answered it. I thought the answers were informative.

[uppityperson]

55. I did not say he was. I was answering your question.

[Tarnation6]

60. Ok. I just thought you might know. Newbie question.

[aurelio17]

61. Some questions are better left unasked.

[delta17]

39. Yeah, they have.

I don't know the exact cases but I know it has happened.

[Lars28]

40. I'd like to know of an example.

That's all.

[delta17]

41. Here.

Wisconsin vs. Mitchell.

https://www.wicourts.gov/courts/supreme/docs/famouscases20.pdf

[uppityperson]

42. And a fast search...

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7045725

http://newsone.com/871585/report-claims-20-of-hate-crimes-are-comitted-by-african-americans/

WASHINGTON – The number of hate crime incidents and victims declined in 2009 compared with the previous year, the FBI reported Monday.
Of more than 6,000 hate crime offenders, over six in 10 were white while nearly two in 10 were black.
Nearly half of the crime incidents in 2009 were motivated by racial bias, nearly 20 percent by religious bias and over 18 percent by sexual orientation bias.

[MicaelS]

73. Because if the races were reversed this would be the lead story everywhere.

"White mob beats black driver into a coma." There would already be dozens of threads about it on DU.

[1StrongBlackMan]

74. Thank you for continuing a narrative ...

I'm so glad DU is such a liberal space.

[840high]

23. Not the driver's

fault. Kid ran out into street. Keep trying to justify this horrible attack.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

27. While I see nothing wrong with the body of youe comment

Why do you put a question mark after 'Did everything right'?

Are you suggesting that the driver actually did something wrong? Video footage seems to suggest the child stepped out into traffic in front of him, which would suggest the driver was not at fault. What do you feel the driver 'did wrong'?

[1StrongBlackMan]

33. I was writing from the pov of those that committed the crime ...

young kid got hit ... he was driving ... ergo, he did something wrong.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

37. Ah, that makes more sense. nt

[rollin74]

45. Mr. Utash was not at fault for the accident

he stopped afterward like he is supposed to

he did nothing wrong

I'm sorry but there was NO justification for anyone to attack him. That behavior was senseless and criminal.

No excuses

[TomClash]

56. After the accident

Obviously.

Do you think that a guy who accidentally hits a child with his car, and then gets out to help the child, should be beaten so badly that he may be brain damaged?

[Lars28]

15. Anyone who thinks this wasn't about race is mistaken.

A black driver would not have been beaten nearly to death.

[840high]

25. Not only beaten

but robbed. Did the robbery help the kid?

[1StrongBlackMan]

34. and you know this because ...? eom.

[alp227]

47. This story is sure bringing out cranks.

People will shamelessly register here and make DU no different from every other online sewer screaming "BLACK ON WHITE CRIME BLACK ON WHITE CRIME".

[1StrongBlackMan]

49. But this is a "liberal" site ...

They keep telling me!

[AverageJoe90]

66. Not helping, dude. nt

[1StrongBlackMan]

68. Not try to help, Dude. ...

Call me silly; but I just have a problem with so called liberals/progressives leaping to racial motives just because the victim is white and the perpetrators are Black.

[aurelio17]

72. Cranks?

In other words, they are insane?

[Stuart G]

43. This statement I believe is true, "A black driver would not have been beaten nearly to death."

This story is truly ugly, mean and disgusting. Still, if this one statement is true....

"A black driver would not have been beaten nearly to death."....

Then it is indeed a racist attack.
Perhaps, when they interview the attackers, more truth will come out.
But, I do believe this..,

"A black driver would not have been beaten nearly to death."...no matter what...

given these circumstances, that it was clearly an accident....., and the driver stopped


That is the central issue in this discussion.
....that is all....

[Tarnation6]

44. Exactly.

If the driver had been black, the people in the neighborhood would certainly have confronted him, but they would not have beaten and robbed him. Because he was white, all the racial tensions surfaced and exploded.

[Sternbar]

63. You nailed that one.

[KinMd]

69. If a black driver had been beaten by a white mob..

under the same circumstances, would anyone believe race wouldn't be a factor?

[alp227]

81. When we've got cultural demonization of black Americans,

whether the more subtle microaggressions, or the louder bigotry i.e. "BLACK ON WHITE CRIME BLACK MOB VIOLENCE" hype by right wing media like Rush Limbaugh or Fox News or WorldNetDaily and other online sewer tanks, then the answer is no, for a very justifiable reason.

Maybe the WorldNetDaily et al would have a point if there's real evidence of systematic anti-white racism among the African-American community. For now such hate is so limited to kooks like the Nation of Islam that WorldNut types have to resort to conjecture and sensationalism to make their case.

[penultimate]

77. How can we say that with any certainty?

I'd think there would have to be some sort of evidence that there were racial motivations. Were they saying racial epithets? Do they have any past history of being part of racist groups? Isn't that usually how hate crimes are determined? Has anyone ever been convicted of a hate crime just because the races were different?

[mstinamotorcity2]

99. I don't think it was about race!!!

And yes a black driver would have been beaten too. These were Ignorant people. Almost like your perception. Lived here too long. Him being white is just because of his skin. The area the child was hit in has white people living in the Area!!!! And a Hmong population in that area also. Not Race!! Did anyone notice the bus stop nearby?? Its a high school right around the corner!!! They were mostly teens. They say it was one guy who was older but they haven't caught him yet.

[rollin74]

78. so far one teen has been charged with assault with intent to murder

punishable by up to life in prison

http://www.freep.com/article/20140407/NEWS01/304070099/Driver-beaten-suspect-charged

[The Green Manalishi]

79. ANYTIME a mob of one race beats up a person of a different race

it should be called, and persecuted, as a hate crime. No exceptions.

[alp227]

80. fallacy. an interracial crime is not inherently a hate crime.

Hate crimes are generally interracial, not the other way around. Don't affirm the consequent

[The Green Manalishi]

83. Good point.

And you are correct.

Perhaps.

Show me some interracial crimes involving a group of people of one race attacking a person of another race that you don't consider to be hate crimes, though. I can't recall any.

[Sternbar]

86. WELL, WELL, WELL.

Look what just surfaced:

The Feds have arrested 4 and are looking into hate crimes charges.

"With four suspects now in custody, police and prosecutors are “widening the scope” of their investigation into last week’s beating of a 54-year-old white motorist to include the possibility that the mob assault was a hate crime, Detroit Police Chief James Craig said Monday."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10147745h

All you people who said it wasn't a hate crime may have to eat your words.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

91. Good. Let the Feds investigate "hate crime"

I'm not sure what constitutes a "hate crime" vs "street justice" vs "just some kids caught up in mob behavior".

The severity of the beating, the robbery, maybe these are factors, as well as race.

I'm sure there are plenty of words to eat, not many will go hungry on this issue.

[rollin74]

92. there was no robbery

The police chief said a robbery did not occur.

That wasn't the motive

[alp227]

95. The 4-post troll is gone now.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=313583&sub=trans

[mstinamotorcity2]

100. Chief Craig is

Kevin Orr and Governor Snyder's pick for our chief of police. Not ours!!!! He is giving a false perception of the crime. And my words are mine have no problem taking them back or apologizing!!! I am just saying there are other things at play here. Why do you think this story is getting so much attention??? Because it can draw controversy. Divide and conquer. Which is what I see in this post!!!

[bitchkitty]

87. I cannot believe some of the posts

on this thread. I stopped reading halfway through. Some people should examine their inner selves. I question what they're doing on a Democratic message board.

[alp227]

88. it's sad even established DUers find themselves agreeing with right wing trolls

look at the low post count, recently registered users posting snide remarks here. i was expecting a lot of "message auto removed" but oh well.

[countryjake]

94. The MIR team has been busy on this thread, not all get "message auto removed"...

some are just PPRed. Check profiles on some of the most glaring ones and they are now gone.