How many gun deaths are acceptable?

[Bgno64]

Gil Smart at Smart Remarks:

Let's take the lesser of the two figures — the 11,400 gun deaths in a single year recorded by Slate.

Is that an acceptable figure?

If not, what is?

How much carnage is this society, this nation willing to tolerate, given that our propensity for guns ensures carnage? How many deaths are "too many"? Or is any number, however large, acceptable?

Is the right to own a gun so precious that it trumps any number of deaths?

And are we, as a society, required to accept all these deaths because attempting to do anything about them, to reduce these numbers, runs the risk of infringing upon the Second Amendment?

We don't often frame the gun debate this way, but we should. Because the reality is that with rights come responsibilities, but the responsibility inherent in gun ownership falls not just on the gun owners themselves — but on others, those whose lives are touched by gun violence.

[pipoman]

1. How many of the 11k

Would likely occur without guns? To pretend that the fantasy of a country without guns would eliminate 11k deaths annually is just that, a fantasy. ..imo

[truebluegreen]

2. Good idea. We should study that and find out.

Instead of opining about fantasies.

ETA: and as you know very well, there are WAY more gun deaths annually than 11K. What will happen to them?

[pipoman]

3. even less suicides would be eliminated in the

Absence of guns...Most gun control advocates have quit citing suicide stats as "gun violence"..

oh, and since guns rarely cause anyone to wish to kill anyone else, it is a fantasy. ..the absence of guns would have little effect on people's desire to kill others. ..

[truebluegreen]

4. Don't think I said a word about fewer suicides.

And arguing that guns don't make it easier to kill others or oneself--accidentally or on purpose--just makes you sound like a...rhymes with tool.

[pipoman]

10. You said something about the 11k number

The other number you were thinking of is the number including suicide.

[Major Nikon]

9. It isn't too hard to imagine

Gun homicide rates by country...

1  Hong Kong 0.00 (2004)
2  Japan 0.00 (2008)
3  South Korea 0.00 (2006)
...
10  United Kingdom 0.04 (2010)
...
22  Germany 0.20 (2010)
...
25  France 0.22 (2009)
...
53  Argentina 3.0 (2008)
54  Barbados 3.0 (2000)
55  Philippines 3.24 (2002)
56  Uruguay 3.43 (2009)
[div style="display:inline; background-color:#FFFF66;"]57

 United States [div style="display:inline; background-color:#FFFF66;"]3.60 (2011)
58  Costa Rica 4.6 (2006)
...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

...
3  Hong Kong 0.2
...
6  Japan 0.4
...
20  Germany 0.8
...
36  France 1.1
...
41  United Kingdom 1.2
76  South Korea 2.6 (includes attempted murder, actual deaths is 0.38)
...
105  United States 4.7

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

[Duckhunter935]

5. how many

deaths by vehicle or drunk driving are acceptable? Still happens even with all of the rules and regulations.

[truebluegreen]

7. "Still happens" at a much lower rate than it used to

because of increased enforcement and safer vehicles.

Do you seriously want to argue for doing nothing because nothing is 100% effective?

[rdharma]

6. Gun nuts would accept three times the current level of deaths caused by firearms.

In their minds, these firearms deaths are merely "unfortunate externalities" that they are more than willing to accept in order to pursue their gun hugging hobby.

[awoke_in_2003]

13. They would accept 300 times the deaths. nt

[valerief]

8. It's not the deaths. Gun owners don't care about that. It's the PRESTIGE of gun hoarding.

That trumps all.

And, of course, bought-and-paid-for elected officials could care less about gun control. It's blatantly clear by the lack of gun controls in effect now.

[rdharma]

11. The "bubbadized" version of midlife crisis compensation?

Instead of a Ferrari an ARee?

[TheKentuckian]

12. How few would mean there is no problem? I bet it is something like zero, right?

Who is going to put numbers on acceptable numbers of dead folks on everything they do? What happens when the number is exceeded?

It is a frame trap type question, no honest or "good" answer is available to the respondents.

[MrScorpio]

14. For the gun industry and their sycophants...

Never enough.

[Aristus]

15. AS MANY AS IT TAKES...'CAUSE...'CAUSE...'CAUSE FREEDOM, THAT'S WHY!