Is Thom Hartmann a racist?

[liberalnarb]

[SamKnause]

1. Interesting.

Thanks for posting.

[Rebkeh]

2. No, he's not racist

I'm pretty familiar with him, I've read some of his books and listen to his show. He's definitely not racist.

This process is messy, he's caught in between because he's one of the first white people with a decent sized platform on the turning towards change. In a sense, he's in the crossfire. The first people out the gate are the most vulnerable and these people are critical to the process. It's one of the reasons I like him, I honor his work and courage, as well as his willingness to share his stories. He's allowed himself to be open and that's a big deal. He apologizes when he messes up and backs the apology with action (this is key). He inspires courage from other white people as well as helps heal black pain by restoring trust. We need more Thoms before people like the homeless guy can have faith. There aren't enough exceptions to the rule to cut through the pain. Not yet. Sometimes conflict/confrontation, even a violent fight, will provide an outlet for the pain, Thom was the wrong guy to confront because he didn't return in violence, he returned in kindness. This is good.

The widespread homophobic fear is just as irrational as racist fear, but to many they are not to be equated. I see the venn diagram there but many don't see it that way. Fear crosses all identities, no one is exempt. But.... Black homophobia, from my limited knowledge of black masculinity, has a lot to do with the psychological impact of historically being denied access to male pride. Black men have historically been denied the ability to protect their families, to be good providers, etc. It's only recently black men finally are called men, it's why "boy" is such an insult from white people. So, with religious influence added to that, homophobia is slightly different.

But back to race..

Where I think some people get it confused is that while white heroes for racial justice deserve applause and credit for their allyship, extra points are too scarce to be given. They are needed elsewhere. I don't think he himself expects them, but feeling unappreciated is understandable, but not a priority. I think a lot of white allies, not Thom, may feel unappreciated by POC. They are not unappreciated, we just don't have time to focus on that. Sometimes you see this expressed in terms of wanting cookies. A reward expected when there are none to give.

I hope Thom keeps right on doing what he's doing.

[Depaysement]

3. Three incidents - two responses

1. Intent is everything.

2/3. Crazy, stupid and mean know no race.

He spent way too much time thinking about this.

[Rebkeh]

8. He does but it helps others

When people share their process, it empowers others.

I appreciate it, personally, but he is hard on himself.

[Rebkeh]

9. Intent is not everything though

Intent from a place of naivete can be 10x worse, also unintended consequences are often irreversible and end up hurting the people you are trying to support. It's not as simple as just "doing the right thing" when you cannot possibly fully understand what the "right" thing is. Sometimes too, the right thing is not the best thing.

Responses two and three are dead on though, crazy stupid and in pain... know no race.

[Buzz cook]

4. A little bit racist maybe.

But it seems more like he's poor bragging. Revealing something that might be considered bad but really isn't and then waiting for folks to reassure him that he's A OK.
Notice how later he says "I might be hyper sensitive to things like this", this being gay people having boiling dumped water on them. That's a classic example of passive aggressive bragging.

It sure takes Thom a long time to get to the point.
Look at what he said. I used the word "Buck" to describe a man, then was worried that it might be taken the wrong way. Then, I was spat on by a young black man, was originally angry then realized that the young man probably had been metaphorically spat on his whole life.
It took Thom almost nine minutes to get that out.

[liberalnarb]

5. He's no racist. This was an odd video.

He was beating himself up WAY too much

[Rebkeh]

6. I agree he's beating himself up too much

Not so odd though, he does that on his show a lot and not just for things like this, for pretty much everything.

[Rebkeh]

7. I can see that if you have just met him or watched him one or a few times

I've been listening to his show for a while now.

He's sincere. I believe it. His heart is correct and he struggles just like everybody else. That he does it publicly says a lot too.

[angstlessk]

10. I am much villified for posting in the AA forum

being a white woman married to a black man and voting for Bernie.. I did not go over well, to say the least.