Bernie Sanders Destroys Trump. Clinton Loses to Trump. Choose Wisely.

[Gregorian]

&feature=em-uploademail

[bucolic_frolic]

1. Our Democratic Party

is not without deployable assets for the fall campaign
whoever our nominee may be

No-brainer opportunities often have unanticipated complexities
and adversities

Scrutinies can be battle-worn, age-old, or newly formulated

Take your pick there are merits and demerits on both sides of the equation

And the opposition could still pull their nominee and install Jeb!.

We're going to be pilloried as socialist either way

[crim son]

2. I saw a post yesterday, responding to a Bernie or Bust type.

It was the usual, that a vote for Bernie is a waste and if we stay home rather than vote Clinton, the resultant Trump presidency is our fault. "It will be on you," is how the Clinton supporter put it. If it's true that Clinton cannot win against Trump, or has much less of a chance against him than does Bernie, who will it be "on" if she becomes the nominee?

[Betty Karlson]

7. Precisely: they want to have their cake and eat ours.

It may make sense, but it doesn't make party unity.

[lewebley3]

10. Sanders has been rejected by the base:and he was not even vetted

[Betty Karlson]

20. Nope: he was rejected by the elite.

But no matter how many times Clinton played dirty against him, he stood tall. In fact: he'd have a better chance against Trump than Clinton, even if Sanders was very mild on Clinton while Btrock threw everything and the kitchen sink at the Vermont senator. That is very telling.

[lewebley3]

24. Clinton didn't play dirty: she didn't neven run 1 negative ad: She won fair and square

[Betty Karlson]

27. The negative stuff was done by Brock. We all know who employed him. eom

[lewebley3]

32. No, Sander just lost: because people didn't want to vote for him: just the truth

[basselope]

56. fixed it for you.

No, Sanders just lost: because people weren't allowed to vote for him: just the truth

[lewebley3]

58. No one was stopped anyone from voting for Sanders : he was rejected

[basselope]

77. Oh, all the primaries were open? Didn't realize that.

[lewebley3]

87. Primaries are not to be open: they about the Dem's not anyone else. Sanders

is not a Dem. That is Sanders choice, so his loss was his fault.

If fact I don't' think Dem's should allow people access to the Dem's
party expensive ballot access until they a least have run and won
a Dem office.

Hillary would never bash the Dem party like Sanders has, she is
a loyal Dem party leader.

[basselope]

88. And that is EXACTLY my problem with HER

and why I am supporting him.

"Hillary would never bash the Dem party like Sanders has, she is a loyal Dem party leader. "

THIS is why I would never vote for her... because a REAL leader has the ability to tell even their most trusted friends when they believe they are wrong.

[lewebley3]

90. If you don't vote for her: Its the poor and the elderly that will suffer not Hillary

[basselope]

92. They are going to suffer just as much under Hillary.

What on earth do you think she is going to do for them??

[lewebley3]

94. No, under Clintons 7.4 million were pulled out of proverty: with Dem party help

[basselope]

95. Not exactly true...

We had a dot com boom, which pulled 7.4 million out of poverty.

Unfortunately, Bill Clinton loosened the banking regulations so much that those people were plunged right back into poverty after the bubble burst.

[lewebley3]

98. Exactly true: The bank probems were under Bush: Clinton left the us all in the Black

[basselope]

100. You don't understand action / consequence.

The reasoning you are trying to use here, is the same reasoning that blames the debt on Obama, despite the fact it was run up mostly by Reagan and bush.

Clinton greatly weakened the banking regulations and allowed for MASSIVE consolidation.

This was following through on what Nixon and Reagan had previously done... just taking it to the next level.

bush did nothing to fix the problem.

You also confuse "leaving us in the black" (which refers to the yearly budget) and the financial collapse, which are two different issues.

The financial collapse happened b/c of massive consolidation in the banking industry, along with loosening of regulations, which can be traced back through the Clinton presidency. IT allowed the dominoes to become TOO BIG, which meant when one fell.. the others would also fall.

Clinton benefited from a dot com boom, but failed miserably to reign in the potential consequences of that boom.

[840high]

101. Now that's funny.

[EdwardBernays]

102. party loyalty

is fucking stupid... Country first, then party.

So yeah +1

[Miles Archer]

78. And I am confident that you make that statement after having read this article.

Only Voter Suppression Can Stop Bernie Sanders

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tony-brasunas/only-voter-suppression-can-stop-bernie-sanders_b_9780128.html

04/26/2016 03:17 pm ET

Yes, the DNC has actively worked to rig this primary for Hillary Clinton, by minimizing and delaying the debates, by counting superdelegates as if they vote before July’s convention, and by surreptitiously funneling money to her campaign that was solicited for down-ticket candidates.

The emperor has no clothes, and I’m going to point it out.

But before I do, let’s acknowledge that by many measures Bernie has been winning for over a month now. He has won eight of the last 10 contests, even if we accept these deeply flawed New York results. He has been rapidly climbing in the national polls while Hillary Clinton has been declining; from double digits down, Bernie is now tied or ahead by as many as five points. From a historical perspective, his favorability ratings dwarf Hillary’s in a way that makes her chances of winning a national election highly unlikely and his chances highly likely. The polls also show Bernie is the more electable candidate in a race against any of the likely Republican nominees. Among independents  —  you know, the ones not allowed to vote in New York but who will determine the winner of the general election  —  Sanders is the clear winner. Sanders has maintained a double digit lead over Trump for months. Clinton now leads Trump by only three points — the margin of error  —  and is losing to the other Republican candidates.

Bernie is the one national candidate who people like the more they get to know him. As people learn more about Clinton, Trump, and Cruz, they like them less. As the country learns more about Bernie, they like him more. He’s still relatively unknown compared to Clinton and Trump, yet he already outpolls them. Looking at the current trends, one would predict that Bernie Sanders will be the most popular politician in the country come November, just as he is now.

[lewebley3]

91. This was written by a Sanders loser: Hillary had Florida and Michigan taken away from

her wins in 2008; She didn't bash the Dem party or the Chairman.

[bjobotts]

80. He wasn't "rejected". He started a political revolution. Not winning does not mean rejection

[bjobotts]

81. It's the Democratic Convention, not the Democratic Coronation.

[lewebley3]

85. He has not started a revolution: the majority has rejected him: The Dem's are leading

fight against the GOP not Sanders. He is not even supported
by people who work with him.

[basselope]

89. fixed it for you.

He has started a revolution: the minority has rejected him: The Democratic establishment is trying to keep the status quo... not Sanders. He is not even supported by the establishment..

[OwlinAZ]

49. The Clintons always play dirty

[bjobotts]

82. Clinton 'could' but Bernie 'would'.

[wisteria]

60. I am part of the base and I would reject him.

Sander's would be squashed by Trump. Polls showing otherwise this time of year are worthless. Frankly, I Think his temperament, his attitude and personality work against him as a President. I can't even imagine him as President or his wife as a role model First Lady.

[scottie55]

21. And I Am Going To Post Some Nonsense Right Now!

Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense, Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense.

See two can play at this game.

[Omaha Steve]

25. So rejected she hasn't wrapped up the nomination in June?

[lewebley3]

35. Hillary is diplomat: she only needs to win: she need to bring the country together

You didn't see Hillary bashing Sanders after she won. Sanders is
a poor loser.

[florida08]

31. love that metaphor

and it's exactly right

[AlbertCat]

22. "It will be on you," is how the Clinton supporter put it.

It is up to Clinton to inspire people to vote for her, not Trump.

Should she manage to squeak thru the GE, it will not be because a majority WANT her as president.

What a lousy hollow victory she might, perhaps, if she can manage it, pull off.

[lewebley3]

29. Hillary has inspired people to vote for her, she won: and every loyal Dem is now behind

her.

[AlbertCat]

41. she won:

She has not won.

It is not over.


Take your sophomoric and uninformed hero worship back to High School.


This declarative dismissal of many Dem voters is a main reason I may not hold my nose and vote this time. The fact that she has a real chance of losing the GE against a buffoon is pitiful. Should she manage to squeak through the GE, it won't be because a majority WANT her as president. Apparently her supporters think they don't need us.

[lewebley3]

68. It is: people are just being polite: however Sanders has been very ungracious loser

[wisteria]

64. Exactly.

I never even considered Sander's as a wise Presidential choice.

[lewebley3]

66. Sanders is 49 state loss like Mcgovern

[zebonaut]

3. Wasserman Schultz is thinking how can Hillary possibly lose to a Buffoon?

Trump is a master salesman bullshitter con artist dictator he will trounce Hillary Clinton. He already took out seven Republican presidential rivals One at a time

If you fail to nominate Bernie Sanders Donald Trump will win the presidency and occupy the oval office

[Zambero]

5. Once vetted, they would decimate Bernie

Hillary has been in their sights for 25+ years. They see her as the presumptive nominee, and there has not been a compelling reason to expend resources or media attention on taking Bernie down when HRC is the focus that matters. If per chance Bernie was to get the nomination, the onslaught would ensue. They would redefine Sanders as "Bolshevik Bernie" who will tax and spend the country into oblivion while allowing Hispanic and Muslim hordes to bring down America. This type of Lee Atwater meets McCarthyism campaign tactic has worked for the GOP in the past, and it is there at the ready to be used as needed. Negatives notwithstanding applied 24/7, Hillary has been tested on more than one occasion by this attack machine is still very much in the running. The broader audience for the general election is altogether different than the one that selected Trump as their party's nominee. And with repeated exposure, the snake oil that Trump is peddling is not likely to set well with the electorate as a whole. This includes libertarians and other disaffected Republicans who will erode Trump's potential base of support by casting ballots for 3rd and/or 4th party candidates.

[merrifield]

9. How has he not been vetted?

He's run in multiple races--you think his opponents wouldn't have brought up damning stuff before this? And if there's so much out there that would be seen as negative, you don't think Hillary would have her surrogates casually bring this up? If you think honeymooning at his town's sister city in the Soviet Union will bring him down, I'd think again. . .

[lewebley3]

30. He ran in state that 95% white and few issues and only 600,000 people total

[libdem4life]

52. What this means, after the DNCSPEAK, is that Brock has not yet

started to slime him big time.

[Zambero]

72. If he's running in multiple races

and those races happen to be Democratic primaries and/or caucuses, the Republican attack machine will not bother to bring up damning stuff UNLESS they perceive him to be the likely nominee. Which they don't. Their target is Hillary.

[lewebley3]

17. You are right :and the base of the Dem party has rejected Sanders

[OwlinAZ]

51. You are delusional or an unrepentant liar.

[bjobotts]

83. You need to go back to '08 campaign when Hillary went all the way to the convention just

like Bernie is and gave the committee a letter saying super delegates should vote for her and not Obama since she was more 'electable' against McCain. Would you say she was "rejected' or that she just lost because the super delegates disagreed with her. Right...so stop saying it about Bernie...stop with the self righteous condescending treatment of your fellow democrats just because they disagree with your choice of candidate.
You'll be surprised to hear Bernie never brought up emails or anything else about Hillary except her decision making but Trump won't. Then you'll see all the Hillary hate come booming out of his mouth and turn this election into who is hated most, Hillary or Trump. Bernie does not have all this baggage to be exploited which is why all the polls show him beating Trump by a much higher margin than Hillary.
Neither candidate has the delegates necessary to win the candidacy nor will they have when we go to the convention. Super delegates will decide this one at the convention and can switch to Bernie if they feel he is more electable...just like they did for Obama.

[lewebley3]

84. Hillary didn't bash the party or Obama: Sanders is out for himself

[scottie55]

19. Decimate A Candidate With Impeccable Record Of Standing Up For Regular Folks? Think Again

Bernie would decimate Trump, and help us take back the House, and Senate by actually listening to people instead of corporate scum for a change.

Sorry, too late.

[SmittynMo]

34. Amen n/t

[Zambero]

74. I would hope that to be true, if Bernie was the nominee

Defeating Trump that is. However, Bernie's impeccable ideological credentials also render him to be a prime target for the type of red-baiting smears that heave served the GOP well in the past. If anyone thinks the "Swiftboating" of John Kerry was bad, the number that would be done on Bernie would pale by comparison. So the notion that Bernie is politically road-tested and bulletproof based on the comparative GOP non-response to him up to this point is delusional. That would change big time on a dime if he was seen as a contender with a real chance to be nominated. For now, the prime target for them is Hillary.

[Zambero]

75. I would hope that was true if Bernie was the nominee

Defeating Trump that is. However, Bernie's impeccable ideological credentials also render him to be a prime target for the type of red-baiting smears that heave served the GOP well in the past. Representing the best interests of people instead of corporations would be ample reason for wanting to take him down. If anyone thinks the "Swiftboating" of John Kerry was bad, the number that would be done on Bernie would pale by comparison. So the notion that Bernie is politically road-tested and bulletproof based on the comparative GOP non-response to him up to this point is delusional. That would change big time on a dime if he was seen as a contender with a real chance to be nominated. For now, the prime target for them is Hillary.

[chervilant]

53. Really?

This stale chestnut of an argument has begun appearing more often, which suggests to me that Hi11ary and her remaining supporters are genuinely concerned about the burgeoning support for Senator Sanders. I can't wait to see him decisively win California.

#BernieOrBust

#NotMeUs

#DropOutHillary

[lewebley3]

12. You don't know anything about DWS accept you are blaming her for Sanders rejection

[bjobotts]

79. You mean like supporting deregulating the pay day loan industry or allowing lobbyists into

DNC party platform planning. Like her support for corporate dems in Fl primaries over progressive candidates. Seems it's you who doesn't know a thing about DWS. Keeping min debates due to Clinton's name recognition preventing voters from seeing or hearing Sanders on the national stage. She needs to resign from DNC since we have been losing elections since she has been chairwoman of the committee.

[lewebley3]

86. You don't anything about this issue: and you don't know DWS position on it

[Beowulf]

71. How can Hillary possibly lose to a buffoon?

Having DWS as party chair is a good start.

I wonder how many nurse's votes Hillary lost when DWS booted the head of their union off the platform committee. This is not the year you can shit on people and still expect their vote. People do have other places they can go, not to mention places they can choose not to go.

[jmowreader]

93. He took out seven people who were worse than he is

No Republican who's worth a fuck is going to run for a job that pays $400,000 a year unless he has ulterior motives. He or she will instead go to the corporate world and make millions. Which is how Trump (who definitely has ulterior motives - he would make a lot more money if he could get rid of all those pesky taxes and regulations) went up against such stellar souls as Ben Carson, Scott Walker, Mario Rubio and Ted Cruz.

Hillary has torn Trump several new assholes and she hasn't really gotten started yet.

[ancianita]

4. Not impressed with this rehash. The "jail time" comment about Hill is over-the-top cheap.

That shit doesn't happen to secretaries of state. So some of this is a bit silly.

Not putting you down for the post, either. It's just that, after listening to the whole thing I'm glad this late-to-the-party partisanship will be gone in a couple of weeks.

[George II]

6. Video and Multimedia Forum?

This is just 20 minutes of blather - Hillary Clinton has defeated Bernie Sanders and she'll defeat Donald Trump.

Sanders vs. Trump is only a hypothetical "match up", it will never happen.

[scottie55]

15. Hillary And The Entire Corrupt Party Who Doesn't Give A Damn About Us Defeated Bernie?

As long as they get paid, and earn corporate "support" for their campaigns, all is good right?

Some of us are done being screwed over.

Bernie, and Trump supporters.

Of course the head in the clouds folks don't understand.

Marie Antioinette didn't understand either.

[AlbertCat]

23. Hillary And The Entire Corrupt Party Who Doesn't Give A Damn About Us Defeated Bernie?

Yes, in Crony Capitalist Land, where both Clinton and Trump live, the ends justify the means.

Any of Hillary's strained narrow victories are hollow.

[wisteria]

67. Bernie is for Bernie.

He has been promising you fools gold.

[NorthCarolina]

8. The establishment already lost the Bush half of their kibuki theater presentation

of Election 2016, so I really think they will fight like hell to salvage the remaining Clinton half of their script.

[lewebley3]

13. Sanders is the establishment

[scottie55]

16. I See Your Posts Here

Everyone knows what is going on.....

[lewebley3]

18. Then they know I am loyal progressive supporting Hillary: which is the truth

[AlbertCat]

26. Then they know I am loyal progressive supporting Hillary

Good one!

[lewebley3]

39. Just the truth: like Sanders has been rejected is the truth

[scottie55]

11. She's A Girl - All That Matters To Too Many

Total bs.

[lewebley3]

14. No, she is Hillary Clinton and their no one as talented or successful as her

[AlbertCat]

33. no one as talented or successful as her

...as she


and this is ridiculous goo-goo worship. She has been handed every "triumph" ...1st Lady and SoS, and won a single Senate seat that quite frankly is not too hard for a Dem to win. In all these positions she was mediocre at best.

Next you'll be telling us she's the kind of guy you can sit down and have a beer with.

[lewebley3]

36. No, just the facts: Hillary is one of the most admired woman in the world:

She is not just any woman.

[AlbertCat]

42. Hillary is one of the most admired woman in the world:

prove it.

[jamese777]

76. Gallup Poll: Most Admired

No other individual ranked first more than 12 times (Dwight Eisenhower) except for Hillary Clinton who has been "most admired" in 20 years.

Most Admired Woman
1990: Margaret Thatcher
1991: Barbara Bush
1992: Barbara Bush
1993: Hillary Rodham Clinton
1994: Hillary Rodham Clinton
1995: Mother Teresa
1996: Mother Teresa
1997: Hillary Rodham Clinton
1998: Hillary Rodham Clinton
1999: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2000: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2001: Laura Bush
2002: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2003: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2004: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2005: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2006: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2007: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2008: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2009: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2010: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2011: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2012: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2013: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2014: Hillary Rodham Clinton
2015: Hillary Rodham Clinton
http://www.gallup.com/poll/1678/most-admired-man-woman.aspx

[SmittynMo]

37. OMG!!!

[libdem4life]

28. Riddle me this...Clinton Foundation...Worst Decision Ever

Anyone who thinks she's been "vetted" for 20 years...this is Republican Red Meat. True, they have failed in the past other than to make them look Shady and on the Brink of illegality, but they didn't have Trump with the Bully Pulpit and a stupendously horrid "mistake" of apparent self-enrichment.

Remember, from broke to fabulously wealthy in 20 some years? Those Hard Choices seemed to have magically brought..."unicorns and fairies" that paid quite well.


Trump has been vetted and doesn't care. In this political circus, He's the Carnival Barker and She's, well, not a Headliner.

[lewebley3]

38. Hillary is loyal progressive: Her party is standing behind her and the Dem party base

[ihaveaquestion]

40. Is this sarcasm?

If not, it's laughable anyway.

[libdem4life]

47. Unfortunately, no.

What may be starting to dawn on more thoughtful and attention-paying Democrats, is that the Establishment and the Base are no longer synonyms.

[lewebley3]

61. Just the truth: Sanders mostly receive outside votes from the young not the Dem party

base.

[AlbertCat]

44. the Dem party base

only part of the Dem party base.


Try to not reduce things to elementary school level. especially when pretending to present "facts".


But you've obviously been smoking too much Hillary and are too high to reason....

[lewebley3]

62. Sanders didnt' get votes from most loyal Dem's: The Base voted for Hillary

[OwlinAZ]

54. less than half the base stands behind Hillary.

You folks are not fooling anyone.

[lewebley3]

59. No, the loyal Dem have been voting for her all along: the base is with her

[Contrary1]

50. I would imagine that Trump has quite a bit left in reserve

to use against Hillary...being she and Bill are friends with him. Hard to say what conversations they may have shared over cocktails.

[libdem4life]

55. Yes, the analogy of Jonathon Livingston Seagull comes up

on a regular basis. This is not political. It is Class Warfare. The Elites/Establishment are in this together. They have to be because losing the Oligarchy would possibly empower the unwashed masses into getting rid of them...their power...their fantastic riches...their Giant Egos. They are reduced to Killing the Messenger now. They have nothing else to say...other than just keep us employed, y'all, OK?

Oh, right. That's what Bernie wanted. Oh, well. Further down the proverbial Rabbit Hole we go.

[florida08]

43. People unfortunately

Vote emotionally not factually. The email scandal is far from over. Her buddy McAuliffe is being investigated for 2013 campaign contributions. Her staffers are taking the fifth. She should never have had a private server with classified info going across. That was just arrogant and above the law attitude. She wants my vote she's going to have to earn it and as of this moment I see nothing that suggests she is devoted to anything but herself.

[Uncle Joe]

45. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Gregorian.

[oberliner]

46. H.A. Goodman rearing his face again

His articles and videos have been ridiculous and his predictions incorrect throughout the campaign.

[ihaveaquestion]

48. Who else will be voting against this Disgusting Thug (DT)?

My vote will be FOR Bernie Sanders if he is the nominee (never say die!) and will enthusiastically campaign for him as well.

Otherwise... my vote will be strictly ANTI-DT and I won't be voting or campaigning FOR anyone.

[bjvom]

57. Meaningless polls

The polling at this time is rather meaningless when it comes to the general election. The fact that Bernie Sanders has been mathematically eliminated from the race should be your primary consideration. Pragmatism is not a dirty word. You should be backing Secretary Clinton's bid for the simple reason that Bernie can't beat Trump because he will never face Trump. Period. The end.

[NurseJackie]

63. The decision has already been made. Hillary is our nominee.

All this hand-wringing and overwrought doom and gloom predictions will make no difference in the outcome.

[AlbertCat]

70. The decision has already been made.

Back in Feb? March?

The ends justify the means.

[NurseJackie]

73. I'm afraid I didn't mark the calendar, Albert.

But at this late date, it really doesn't matter much, does it?

[AzDar]

65. Ayup.

[LynneSin]

69. Really? You think polls matter right now. People said the same about Obama

Same time 4 years ago when it looked like Obama was going to win the primaries and that Hillary supporters were somehow going to split the party and the Democratic party was in a state of disarray.

Hillary came out at the convention with an enthusiastic endorsement of Obama and we all united to ensure the GOP didn't take over the White House.

I really do not see Sanders (if Hillary is the nominee) doing anything that could enable Donald Trump to win. In the end Sanders knows that Trump is dangerous for this country and he will probably endorse Hillary.

Polls mean squat now. After the conventions then I'll start to worry.

[MrMickeysMom]

96. I doubt many Clinton supporters got through that...

So very interesting to see the reactions on this Board this year.. It's not what they want to hear.

We cannot change some people. I know this personally and so do many here.

IF we want a future (let alone a Democrat in the WH), it is ludicrous to keep ignoring the Drumpf/Clinton outcome, because it ends badly for us.

That's not going to penetrate into the people who chant, "LA-LA-LA-Nah-Nah-Nah-I-Can't-HEAR-You"...

It may in time. Regardless, if you're paying attention, you want a good outcome for the future... even after you shed your mortal coil. You want it for the sake of the human race. The young people understand this. The disenfranchised who pay attention to their "in perpetuity" status know this. The people who read their history know this... and we aren't just talking about K-12 classroom American History.

[appalachiablue]

99. K & R. Thanks for the post.