How would a person protect family heirlooms from spouse taking control inappropriately?

[Grasswire2]

The scenario.

She has gathered and protected family heirlooms (many with historical significance) as the WW2 generation passed on, with the intention of keeping things together, some eventually going to various family members, some to museum.

Her husband seems to think that he can be the party to make those decisions. He made a speech at family party last week telling one in the next generation that he could be the recipient of uncle's WW2POW papers and artifacts and WW2 collection of signed books.

She was blindsided by that.

I told her today that she needs to protect her intent somehow from him, especially if she dies first. I told her she needs to make an inventory of the items and make arrangements with local Army museum in advance with a letter of intent, for the WW2 stuff.

And that a letter of intent or SOMETHING must be in place.

Does anyone have advice in this type of situation?

He was a very smart man and a professional journalist and archivist. He's now pushing 90. No dementia, I think, but diminished in many ways. A kind of a bully in their long marriage. The family is afraid of angering him because he yells and he's kinda mean.

Any advice or thoughts? She COULD pay a lawyer a modest fee, but probably would rather not go that route.

[Skittles]

1. honestly, I would consult with a lawyer

it's the prudent thing to do

[dawg day]

2. she probably needs a lawyer

States have different rules about what is "marital property," but her family heirlooms probably aren't... but how she make that clear? The attorney would help secure that.

Short of that, she might need to move it to a secure location-- a bank safe deposit box-- and make a will that specifies where they are and where they are to be donated. She needs also to make someone other than the husband executor to make sure her wishes are followed.

Or she could just do it now= distribute the items where she wants them to go right now. The museum will probably have a development director who can help her do this.

Point is-- get the items out of his vicinity. As long as they are in the house, he can probably just grab them.

And then if he says anything, she can just ignore him.

[Grasswire2]

5. well, there's way tooo much stuff for a safe deposit box

An heirloom Connecticut valley grandfather clock. A very very very old windsor chair. Civil War items. An awful, awful lot of stuff.

There is a son who is the executor. But everybody tiptoes around the bully.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. Free legal advice from the internet is worth what you pay for it.

If this person can afford a lawyer she should hire one, especially since there seems to the potential for family discord. A will with an inventory of all the items might be all she needs, but she really should talk to a lawyer.

[Jirel]

4. Multiple methods, but consult a lawyer for fear state's specific legal details.

She could set up a trust, with the museum and other specific people as beneficiaries.

She can write it into her will, with specific bequests to the museum and certain people.

I get it that she would “rather not” pay a lawyer, but if it means anything to her, she should. If she’s not willing, she doesn’t care that much about what happens. Details matter.

[Grasswire2]

6. yeah.....

It would likely be very hard for her to spend any of that kind of money without him. I think everything financial is joint. A typical marriage from the 1960s.


I think what I am going to do (I am her much younger sister) is to talk with another family member, a cousin, who has resources and a familial interest in protecting the items. He is the namesake of the WW2 uncle. And I think I will do the legwork with the Army museum inquiring about their process.

If we could get him out of the house for a day, she and I could make an inventory of the heirlooms. Not likely to happen, though, his health is diminishing.

[mr_lebowski]

7. Maybe she could sit down with her old man and say

"I'd REALLY like us to work it out TOGETHER ... dear ... to whom (all these items) will go when we pass. Let's make a list! I mean, if YOU dear were to pass away first I wouldn't know what you wished me to do with them, and I'd hope you'd feel the same about my wishes if I go first, wouldn't you? And maybe we could start giving some away now? We don't NEED all this STUFF really, do we dear?"

Maybe encourage the son to be there as well, the executor one.

Then if he's a jackass about it, talk to a lawyer.

[Hela]

8. Documentation

Number One: I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV.

However, when it comes to family heirlooms, I also have some “uncooperative” family members. Here is what my mom and I are doing.

Make lists. Even if you only inventory part of the collection, it’s better than nothing. And you may be surprised how much you can get done while he’s napping or watching TV while you guys do some “baking” or “scrapbooking.”

Take pictures. You have a cell phone? Use it. Save the pics somewhere in the cloud like google pics. Print them on paper or at Walgreens. Have her write on the backs of pictures or underneath if they’re on paper, giving any historical info about where the item was acquired, what it means, and who it should go to. You can also number the pictures and then have her write, type or record a narrative at her convenience about each pic by number, giving some history about the item, along with who it should eventually go to.

You could also Videotape or digitally record her making her wishes known (hello, cellphone again), especially for bigger or more important parts of the collections. Upload to YouTube in a private account for future use.

Are these heirlooms all from her side of the family? Is there clear provenance; do other family members on her side know where things came from? I wouldn’t advertise widely about your plans, because you just never know who’s going to rat you out for Aunt Fanny’s silver, but if there is another relative who can corroborate origins, it might be valuable to get a notarized statement of the information you need and keep it on file. You can get anything notarized, usually at a village hall or township office. This includes her statements with pictures regarding her wishes.

Good luck! And remember, something is better than nothing. Start with the big rocks.

[Grasswire2]

9. yes, they are all from her (my) side of the family.

It is a large family; our grandparents had six children. All came west in 1924, driving in an open touring car from Connecticut to the west coast after 300 years of family history in CT. Most of us have seen a lot of the stuff growing up, at grandmother's home.
There is no question about whose items these are and where they came from. His family didn't save stuff.

Your suggestions are really good, and I thank you for them.

[Fla Dem]

10. I am assuming your grandmother is as elderly as her husband, your grandfather.

Why not just suggest she begin to honor her family by presenting the heirlooms now while she is still alive. That way she gets to see the appreciation of the receiver and she can be assured the heirlooms are going to the ones SHE wants them to go to. Why wait until after she is dead.

Same with any historical items she wants to have go to museums. Do it now while she can see the appreciation of those she is donating the items to. None of us know what lies ahead. Don't put off until tomorrow what you can do today, especially something she feels so emotional about.

If you have a good relationship with your grandmother and feel you can talk to her about this situation, that's what I'd do.

[Grasswire2]

11. grandparents long passed away. nt

[Fla Dem]

12. OK, guess I'm not understanding who it is that currently has possession of these items.

"our grandparents had six children. All came west in 1924, driving in an open touring car from Connecticut to the west coast after 300 years of family history in CT. Most of us have seen a lot of the stuff growing up, at grandmother's home."

I took from this comment it was your grandparents.

I now understand, hopefully correctly, it is your mother/aunt, sister or a cousin you are speaking about?

In any case my thought is the same. The family (those that give a hoot) need to come together in a united front and work with the Mother/Aunt Sister/Aunt to distribute the memorabilia before she passes on.

I know it's difficult, went through a similar situation in my family. But there it was more of a tug of war over who would get what.