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Inuca

(8,945 posts)
Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:18 PM Jul 2014

What, no comments here about all the Kerry attacks?

Sickening. As is the whole horrid mess in Gaza. Makes me sick to the stomach, very close to literally. I spent 2 years in Israel in the late 70s, in Jerusalem to be precise. Magnificent place. I left for many reasons, one of them being that, as a Jew, I felt that it's close to impossible to live there and keep even a semblance of impartiality. But even at that time, I was seeing too much ugliness around me.

A few days ago, I read this http://www.newsweek.com/2014/08/01/my-jewish-mother-my-palestinian-father-and-family-torn-apart-260422.html. What stuck with me is this paragraph

This conflict defies rational argument and bypasses understanding. Here are people so blinded by pain that they cannot recognise suffering in anyone else. Jews and Palestinians have spent so many years beating each other and being beaten that they have become nothing more than a bruise and a stick. Victimhood has become a national religion. The right to “self-defence” is a holy creed for both sides. And the impossible search for justice, the redemption of all the wrongs of history, has become a blind alley to salvation.


And in the middle of all this, Kerry tried to bring some semblance of rationality. And what he gets is things like this http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/diplomania/.premium-1.607332. The link is behind a paywall, but I was able to read the whole thing (more than once) on my iPad without paying, so I guess for some illogical reason the mobile version is free.

Or closer to home and more recent http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/david-ignatius-john-kerrys-big-blunder-in-seeking-an-israel-gaza-cease-fire/2014/07/28/ab3fbfd2-1686-11e4-9349-84d4a85be981_story.html. I generally respect Igantius, but this I do not understand.

Kerry’s error has been to put so much emphasis on achieving a quick halt to the bloodshed that he has solidified the role of Hamas, the intractable, unpopular Islamist group that leads Gaza, along with the two hard-line Islamist nations that are its key supporters, Qatar and Turkey. In the process, he has undercut not simply the Israelis but also the Egyptians and the Fatah movement that runs the Palestinian Authority, all of which want to see an end to Hamas rule in Gaza.


Who was he supposed to use as intermediaries if not entities that may be able to exert some influence over Hamas? Not to mention that today I read that a Turkish representative is in Israel for cease-fire related talks.

The next paragraph from Ignatius makes more sense and maybe indeed Kerry should have done this. I have no way of knowing, obviously; all I know is that he did meet and speak with Abbas.

A wiser course, which Kerry rejected in his hunt for a quick diplomatic solution, would have been to negotiate the cease-fire through the Palestinian Authority, as part of its future role as the government of Gaza. Hamas agreed last April to bring the authority back to Gaza as part of a unity agreement with Fatah that was brokered by Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.


Rant over for now.
14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
What, no comments here about all the Kerry attacks? (Original Post) Inuca Jul 2014 OP
"Victimhood has become a national religion", that was a kick to the nuts of the victim screaming Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #1
The attacks are disgusting and... YvonneCa Jul 2014 #2
I agree. I have been defending him when I can. wisteria Jul 2014 #4
I am really bothered by the claims that Kerry created the world mess. wisteria Jul 2014 #5
I am bothered by that... YvonneCa Jul 2014 #6
Of course he can mylye2222 Jul 2014 #8
"Anyone who suggests... YvonneCa Jul 2014 #7
what hurts the most from this ugly attacks mylye2222 Jul 2014 #3
So President Obama defended ... YvonneCa Aug 2014 #9
Good, both the President and SOS Kerry know that Israel is being short sighted wisteria Aug 2014 #10
It was really great to see, although... YvonneCa Aug 2014 #11
The Attacks On DU Of SOS John Kerry Are Complete Bullshit... Corey_Baker08 Aug 2014 #12
ditto n/t MBS Aug 2014 #13
Same here... YvonneCa Aug 2014 #14

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
1. "Victimhood has become a national religion", that was a kick to the nuts of the victim screaming
Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:36 PM
Jul 2014

Israeli media that also has its fair share of religiously motivated but disguised religious extremists that push hate and fear just like Fox and the Wingnuts of America.

YvonneCa

(10,117 posts)
2. The attacks are disgusting and...
Tue Jul 29, 2014, 11:22 PM
Jul 2014

...unwarranted. I think he is purposely shaking things up. All the usual negotiating strategies have been tried by others and they failed.
I also think some are not aware of his relentlessness and ability to persist in pursuit of a goal. I think it is true that the window is closing to create a lasting peace, but...at least to me...it seems that the involved parties are in denial and very myopic.
To change that does require taking some risk and shaking things up. JMHO.

 

wisteria

(19,581 posts)
4. I agree. I have been defending him when I can.
Wed Jul 30, 2014, 05:20 PM
Jul 2014

But, I believe the Israeli media knew exactly what they were doing, when they decided to distort the draft, and make sure they described him and the draft in all the terms that Republicans like to hear, knowing that it is an election year. Obviously, Israel does not like to be told what to do. I believe they should defend themselves, but at what cost and to what extremes? Yes, Kerry shook things up. Anyone who suggests change, shakes things up. I consider Kerry a visionary, he knows what lies ahead, and he is trying to prevent it from happening.

 

wisteria

(19,581 posts)
5. I am really bothered by the claims that Kerry created the world mess.
Wed Jul 30, 2014, 05:24 PM
Jul 2014

Him and Obama did this all by themselves. Where there calls for Condi Rice to resign after it was obvious she lied about the mushroom cloud.

YvonneCa

(10,117 posts)
6. I am bothered by that...
Thu Jul 31, 2014, 12:11 PM
Jul 2014

...too, wisteria. But I know he can handle flagrant distortion of his actions well. Heaven knows he has had plenty experience with his efforts being distorted by media and others.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
8. Of course he can
Thu Jul 31, 2014, 03:59 PM
Jul 2014

He might certainly been hurt by this crap but we all know he will handle it in the most professional way

YvonneCa

(10,117 posts)
7. "Anyone who suggests...
Thu Jul 31, 2014, 12:23 PM
Jul 2014

...a change shakes things up." You are so right about that.

I think JK and the Obama Administration are fighting for BIG change on the world stage...against big oil/old energy policy, for sustainable, pro clean energy policy that recognizes the threats posed by climate change. It is a policy to untangle the US from ME conflicts and still have the compassion to help find peace there. It is a win win win... It's why I voted for them even though I have differences over education policy.

I think they are trying to be pro business enough to keep the US in a leadership position going forward. I support that even as I disagree with corporations as persons.
But this effort on JKs part has an opposition. The administration is making big-time enemies.
I worry about that.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
3. what hurts the most from this ugly attacks
Wed Jul 30, 2014, 03:11 AM
Jul 2014

Is that basically the trash JK for having shown compassion and concern to Gazaians.Thats beyond hatred.

YvonneCa

(10,117 posts)
9. So President Obama defended ...
Fri Aug 1, 2014, 11:43 PM
Aug 2014

...JK twice (at least) during his press conference today. Definitely worth watching on CSpan if you missed it live...

 

wisteria

(19,581 posts)
10. Good, both the President and SOS Kerry know that Israel is being short sighted
Sat Aug 2, 2014, 01:40 PM
Aug 2014

and ultimately going in the wrong direction.

YvonneCa

(10,117 posts)
11. It was really great to see, although...
Sat Aug 2, 2014, 02:20 PM
Aug 2014

...I really haven't doubted that President Obama and JK are on the same page where foreign policy is concerned.

Corey_Baker08

(2,157 posts)
12. The Attacks On DU Of SOS John Kerry Are Complete Bullshit...
Sat Aug 30, 2014, 01:44 AM
Aug 2014

reminds me of the Kerry haters, the Deaniacs, The Clarkites, etc from the 2004 Democratic primary, he has done an exceptional job as SOS and I still view him as one of the leaders of the Democratic Party!

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