32 Trillion In Tax Havens - Take It All - Pay Off Our National Debt

[scottie55]

If the "global elite" have to hide their money to avoid taxes, it should be confiscated, and used to pay off our national debt. If you are a drug dealer and get caught, they take your house. Why should this crime be any different?

"Exhaustive Study Finds Global Elite Hiding Up to $32 Trillion in Offshore Accounts"

http://www.democracynow.org/2012/7/31/exhaustive_study_finds_global_elite_hiding

I for one am tired of being taxed/screwed to death.

Should our children have to pay for the money these criminals stole?

Rec if you agree.

[scottie55]

1. If They Complain Lock Them Up

When we get caught stealing, or cheating on our taxes, we have to go to jail.

Why not these "people" too?

[liberalmike27]

35. Oh Don't Worry

I'm sure they'll make up the difference by adding another sales, gasoline, cigarette, alcohol, property, or Internet sales tax. Or maybe they'll add a higher fee, add a utility tax, or makes some more things illegal, so they can fine you, or perhaps raise the price of fines, already so high as to create incredible hardship, to the poorest among us.

But sure, why not keep allowing them to hide that vast wealth, or get away with their huge tax cuts, like in 2010, with the Obama tax cuts. Sweet deal, Obama, down from 55% to 35% taxes on wealth, upon death. Add that you raised the "cap" from $625,000 to 5.5 million per person.

And all you had to do was let Bush's tax bill expire. Republicans would have been flipping all over themselves to negotiate a new one, one where you could've determined the terms. Nope. You gave it all away.

[hopemountain]

65. or given a death sentence for selling cigarettes....

[whatthehey]

2. Well for a start it's neither all or most US citizens' money

Should we grab rubles from Russian oligarchs while we are at it?

[scottie55]

3. No, I Am Talking About Americans

Let the other countries get their money back from their thieves.

If they got to hide the money, it should be taken.

Sounds fair to this overtaxed working stiff.

[aggiesal]

8. "Our" portion wouldn't come close to $32 Trillion ...

I agree though, we should go after "Our" portion.

On top of all this, Mossack Fonseca is the 4th largest organization that does this.
There are 3 other larger organization that hide more than $32 trillion.

So that means that there is at least [font color=red]$128 Trillion[/font] of money hidden from taxes.

[Hoyt]

4. You do realize a whole lot of that money is not "American" money?

Plus, I expect a lot of it is not hard assets that would retain some value upon expropriation. And, I think it would precipitate global chaos that might result in a lot of pain for everyone who doesn't have offshore accounts, or even a local bank account.

Otherwise, I pretty much agree with what you are saying. And all countries should take steps to prevent offshoring to avoid taxes.

[OregonBlue]

6. Each nation should seize the assests of those citizens who are hiding their ill gotten gains.

If it was a petty crook, it would be taken. If it shakes up the world's economy, well so much the better given that the current systme is founded on graft and corruption by the politicos. Time for a world shake up if you ask me.

[Hoyt]

9. I hear what you are saying, but I suspect hundreds of millions of people would be without jobs in a

liquidity crisis many times worse than we saw with the housing bubble.

[scottie55]

14. Hoyt, I Think You Are Wrong

We take our 8 Trillion, and fix our problems at the same time putting people to work.

The filthy rich would have to live off their non hidden trillions.

Boo Hoo.

I don't think it would hurt them, and would make the economy better.

I for one would like to see in your face tax cheaters locked up, and their fortunes taken, or penalized 90%.

We are the ones paying interest on the money we had to borrow to make up for their fraud.

[Hoyt]

34. There wouldn't be $8 Trillion there, and I doubt you could legally take anything but

any taxes owed which is a lot less. It would be nowhere $8 Trillion. I saw a CBO, or some government agency study, that figured out how much taxes are owed on profits that domestic corporations have not brought back into the USA (the profits get taxed when eventually brought back). It's only $70 Billion. Nothing to sneeze at, but no answer to our problems.

The problem is, that $8 Trillion -- or whatever it really is after much evaporates when paper wealth is expropriated -- will be extracted from the world's economy. It's not just sitting in a vault in gold bars. In any event, that is much more than what precipitated the financial crisis of 2008.

It sounds simple, but it's not. And believe me, I don't have any money in an offshore account, not even much in an American account. And, I don't care if the take every corporation in America, except for one thing: Who is going to produce food, energy, run the sewer system, etc., because we have so many people nowadays that the small family farm, cess pool cleaners, and the coal wagon won't be enough.

[elljay]

56. I haven't had time to look it up

but we do have asset seizure laws. They are generally misused by police departments to seize the car of some random black guy who was caught with a joint, but they still exist. If our government has any cojones (which it doesn't) we'd charge violations of a statute with asset forfeiture penalties and let them whine. Instead, we'll do little, maybe a fine that is the equivalent of a speeding ticket to a billionaire.

[KPN]

24. You are probably right to a degree. But it would be

stupid frankly to not pursue accountability that is painful for American tax dodgers who used these mechanisms. When I say painful, I mean JAIL time -- and a significant amount of it, not to mention at least some recovery of past taxes owed and a penalty to go along with that.

If we don't take steps like these, all hell will break loose -- and then you'll see a real "liquidity" crisis.

[SomeGuyInEagan]

27. "Jobs will be lost"

Can't regulate polluters ... jobs will be lost.

Can't prosecute Wall Street ... jobs will be lost.

Can't break up banks ... jobs will be lost.

Can't properly enforce OSHA laws to protect workers ... jobs will be lost.

Can't ask businesses to pay taxes ... jobs will be lost.

Can't have anything nice ... jobs will be lost.

And so it goes.

[KPN]

33. Haha.

Ain't that the truth! Problem is, there are no more jobs to be lost. They've darn near hit the end of the road on that one don't you think?

[Hoyt]

36. I agree 100%. If they owe taxes, it should be collected immediately or throw the bums in jail.

[KPN]

37. How about both?

[Hoyt]

38. That's OK, although I'd just soon they keep making money (if legitimate) so we increase their taxes.

[JDPriestly]

48. That's the confusion in the OP. Is the OP about just taking all the money in those accounts

or just taking unpaid taxes?

It's not very clear really.

[brett_jv]

64. What's funny about the whole thing ... is that this is ALL just fucking digits inside computers ...

That 'others' think is 'real', therefore ... it's real.

Like to see what would happen if all these people showed up at the same time to collect their 'trillions' ... lol ...

[OregonBlue]

39. Sounds like the same old same old. When are we going to say enough is enough. There will always be

the "don't rock the boat" excuse and in the meantime, they just become more corrupt and steal more and more.

[rpannier]

55. Agree in part

Where I disagree is about the jobs, not because I know for sure either way and you may be right
But, that argument has been used for the last 4 decades on why we can't or shouldn't do anything about overt illegal behavior by persons or organizations, like banks, because it will costs jobs.
Even though we bleed jobs and a small group of people soak up the profits

The problem with taking it is (IMO) not all of it is illegally housed there
Just because someone has assets overseas does not mean they're doing something illegal (or immoral)
I have money in three countries (no tax havens) in Korea, Japan and the US because those are the places my work has me most of the time
If I had a business in the Philippines I'd likely deposit money there
That some people put money there for tax purposes and it is legal is not their fault.
When they put it there illegally, which David Cameron's father may have done and he may still be profiting from is another issue entirely and those things should be prosecuted

For the most part, people have always known they've done it. But it's the old, "I'm shocked I tell you! Shocked! Shocked that there's gambling and prostitution going on here!" response by some
We're also now stuck with the crank conspiracy theorists who have lept from the word work

*Rambling a bit I know*

[fierywoman]

53. seize and exile

Take back their money and exile them to Gitmo!

[Ferd Berfel]

44. THe Mid-east Oil wasn't ours either

But Hillary voted to grab that

Seriously - we need to take OUR portion back & toss the criminals in jail. Our portion will probably be the largest share anyway.

[Hoyt]

45. Actually in this case, it does not appear ours is the largest. And, by law, at best we'd be

entitled to any taxes owed. Apparently, a lot of folks with offshore accounts pay their taxes. They just like to diversify where their money resides.

Clinton did not vote to grab oil. And she didn't vote for what george war bush did in Iraq. She voted to give bush authority IF NEEDED. Of course, it was not needed. But laugh away.

[rhett o rick]

57. Your rationalization for Hillary's vote to give Bush authorization "if needed" is

pathetic. She knew full well as most of us with a brain did, that Bush was determined to invade and would be the decider as to when the "needed" part was decided. Clinton isn't an idiot, she knew what Bush would do. And if it was me and Bush betray my trust, I would have screamed to high heaven. She didn't because she knew what she was doing and she was rewarded by "speaking fees" from those she helped profit from the war. She will have to answer to her maker for her role in that mess. One million dead.

[Ferd Berfel]

67. Of course she did

Everyone paying any attention at the time KNEW Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11 and the invasion was about OIL

Remember.....?

[Hoyt]

68. Perhaps you can find a post you made at the time predicting what would happen if

the IF NEEDED resolution was passed. If you can't, perhaps someone else will show how prescient they were with a link. I get george war bush is a war criminal, but at the time lots of Congress people were forced into backing the Prez, even John Kerry.

Anyway, you ought to be able to dig up some posts at the time, from here or elsewhere.

[Ferd Berfel]

69. The Right and Wrong Questions About the Iraq War

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/05/the-right-and-wrong-questions-about-the-iraq-war/393497/


The Right and Wrong Questions About the Iraq War

These “knowing what we know now …” questions are driving me crazy. They should make you mad too.




• Anyone who was paying attention to military or political trends knew for certain by the end of 2001 that the administration and the military were gearing up to invade Iraq.

[Hoyt]

70. Again, maybe you have some proof of how you were aware of this and protested loudly.

I knew when Hans Blix cried and begged bush to give then a little more time. But the resolution had already been enacted to help weapons inspectors gain inspection access. That is what the resolution was intended to do, and it would have been a good move had bush not abused the intent of the resolution.

[SoLeftIAmRight]

61. spoken like a $hillary

...

[Scalded Nun]

5. Time to apply the 'grab and snatch' approach just reinforced by DOJ

Authorities can basically take all your money and possessions when they stop you.

This sounds like the same thing, except that more than likely the 'victim' is really a perpetraitor.

yes, I know is misspelled the word.

[SammyWinstonJack]

20. I like your misspelled word...it fits.

[chapdrum]

30. Like "perpetraitor" too.

Have over time suggested (to politicians, friends, etc.) that this be applied to, oh I don't know, public servants like Bush & his merry colleagues.

No takers so far.

[world wide wally]

7. I guess it's just pin money for a rainy day

And our kids are struggling to pay for school?
WTF is wrong with fucking Republicans? Were they born evil, stupid, or both?

[magical thyme]

19. what makes you think it's only republicans?

face it -- 1% scum exists in all the parties.

[KPN]

25. Yup.

I'm guessing we'll see at least some Third Wayers ensnared in this fiasco.

[abelenkpe]

10. Could use that money to properly fund schools

Restore "lost" pensions, social programs, fully fund social security and rebuild our infrastructure.

[scottie10]

13. Sounds good to me.

I'm for it.

[scottie55]

11. Imagine 32 Trillion Spent On Developing Alternative Energy

Climate change problem solved by the folks making money off making it worse.

Solar panels, windmills, and electric cars for all.

Paid for by stolen money.

[scottie55]

12. I Saw An Estimate 8 Trillion Was American Loot

That would make a dent in a lot of our problems.

Then the filthy rich could pay their fair share, and we could pay off our national debt.

Remember, when Bush took office, Clinton left him a balanced budget.

[deutsey]

15. But...austerity!

That's the only option we have, according to our lords and masters...

[SammyWinstonJack]

21. EAT YOUR PEAS, right Obama?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

16. How much has Trump hidden?

[allan01]

17. take the keys and lock them up, lock them up, lock them up , my fair lady o

[DrBulldog]

18. The German newspaper that is the equivalent of the American Wall Street Journal . . .

. . . - and, unlike the American paper, is still completely reputable - is reporting that the AMERICAN impact of this global scandal is coming out very soon . . . !

(From yesterday's Thom Hartmann report)

[2naSalit]

23. Yup...

that's the part I can hardly wait to see.

[TryLogic]

22. I wish !!

[MattP]

26. They need a real criminal penalty and seizure law just like drug dealers

They take peoples property and money and never give it back by just charging them with drug charges!

[nilesobek]

28. Change the color of money from green to red.

Then, when the green money is being exchanged, make it a requirement that the money exchanged has been properly taxed. Viola!

[felix_numinous]

29. We found our stolen loot

too bad we can't just print our our own $32 Trillion and start over, and bail ourselves out

[Skwmom]

31. Asset Forfeiture was the first thing that came to mind. n/t

[RoccoR5955]

32. Prosecute the bass turds!

Lock them up, and throw away the keys.

[colsohlibgal]

40. Agreed

Don't hold your breath waiting for Hillary to do or even try to do something about it.

[passiveporcupine]

41. Something should be done to the banks too.

It also finds that private banks are deeply involved in running offshore havens, with UBS, Credit Suisse and Goldman Sachs handling the most assets.

[nikto]

42. Financial/Korporate elites are a cancer on the world

Either surgery or chemo is needed.

[IronLionZion]

43. But, but, but...they're job creators!

They're creating lots of jobs with those offshore accounts! Just you wait. They're just waiting for the right time and then they will trickle down all over us!

[felix_numinous]

46. The benefactors have drawn up their own laws

and if their overseas political interference is any indication, they'd prefer America to be a banana republic.

[DamnYankeeInHouston]

47. Hoarders.

[maindawg]

49. RICO

This screams RICO. We are talking billionaire class here. Ruling class. We will learn if our laws matter at all. That's what this will be about.

[L. Coyote]

50. What role did this hoarding of capital offshore play in the 2008 Bush economic collapse?

One of the problems was there was no fluid capital. With so much hoarding offshore, how can there be any fluidity in our own economy?

[scottie55]

63. Bingo

[robbob]

51. Just heard Obama on the radio

He said that technically there is nothing illegal about what these people have done to hide their money. Also, that he is trying to change the tax code to prevent this kind of hiding of monies in off shore accounts.

So, technically it's not illegal, but I guess when you get to write the laws then technically nothing you do needs to be defined as "illegal".

So the best that we can hope for is to expose them and shame them in the court of public opinion, aka the MSM, but I wouldn't hold my breath on that happening...

[scottie55]

62. Just Like None Of The Wall Street Scum Did Anything Illegal Right Barack?

Don't make me puke.

Half the money is stolen, bribe money, or drug money I would guess.

Anything wrong with that?

If it was legal, why would they hide it.

I never knew my president was an idiot.

Don't alert me. Anyone saying anything this stupid is an idiot.

"Technically" hiding bribe money, stolen money, and payoffs, and drug money is "technically" legal?

Then why are all those dirt bags from Iceland, Argentina, and Chile (for starters) resigning?

F!

[glinda]

52. $15/hr, more green energy projects and jobs, more aid for elderly and sick, etc....

End homelessness. End hunger. Go to single Payer. So much to do.

[stuffmatters]

54. Offshoring is a crime against democracies. Seize it all, not just the taxes due.

The less taxes corps and the wealthy pay, the more countries & their citizens are financially strangled, inevitably creating govt instability and the rise of tyrants. It's not just economic treason, it's also an ideology that has an agenda.

[ish of the hammer]

58. finally. what a good idea!

[Snotcicles]

59. Nationalize those funds until they can prove their tax burden has been met. nt

[valerief]

60. But it's the global elite who buy the laws that allow them to offshore their hoards. nt

[cannabis_flower]

66. Of course,

quite a bit of it (maybe most of it) was from people evading taxes from other countries, not the US. I'm sure Germany, Russia, France, the UK, Guatemala, Peru and others would like to get their hands on their share.