“Not Just a Family Feud” (ASA boycott)

[azurnoir]

Members of the American Studies Association have voted in favor of endorsing the academic boycott of Israel by a 2–1 margin, making it the second major U.S. scholarly association, after the Association for Asian American Studies, to do so.

Of the 1,252 votes cast, 66.1 percent of members endorsed the boycott, 30.5 percent rejected it, and 3.4 percent abstained. Slightly less than a third of the association’s 3,853 eligible voting members participated in the 10-day online referendum. The association’s elected National Council had previously endorsed the resolution, which was approved by the membership despite concerns by some that it is discriminatory in unfairly singling out Israel, and over and above opposition on the part of the American Association of University Professors to academic boycotts in general. The AAUP holds that academic boycotts violate principles of academic freedom and open exchange, while those in support of the ASA boycott argue that they are seeking to increase the academic freedom of Palestinians.

The resolution approved by a plurality of ASA members cites as a rationale the lack of “effective or substantive academic freedom for Palestinian students and scholars under conditions of Israeli occupation” and calls for the association to boycott Israeli higher education institutions, which are described as being “a party to Israeli state policies that violate human rights and negatively impact the working conditions of Palestinian scholars and students.”

................................

In its press release approving the resolution the ASA included statements from prominent scholars endorsing the boycott in light of their personal histories and areas of professional scholarship. Among the scholars who endorsed the resolution was Eric Cheyfitz, an American studies professor at Cornell University who wrote, “I am a Jew with a daughter and three grandchildren who are citizens of Israel. I am a scholar of American Indian and Indigenous studies, who has in published word and action opposed settler colonialism wherever it exists, including of course the Palestinian West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem. It is worth noting in this respect that just as the myth of American exceptionalism seeks to erase the genocide and ongoing settler colonialism of Indigenous peoples here in the United States so the myth of Israeli exceptionalism seeks to erase Israeli colonialism in Palestine and claim original rights to Palestinian lands.”

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/inside_higher_ed/2013/12/israel_academic_boycott_american_studies_association_joins_the_fight.html

[King_David]

1. r at Cornell University who wrote, “I am a Jew"

Ha ha ..

Classic :

http://www.jpost.com/International/Why-do-non-Jews-bashing-Israel-claim-to-be-Jewish

[azurnoir]

2. so your saying Eric Cheyfitz is lying? Not really Jewish?

no children and grandchildren living in Israel?

sort of a 'no true Scotsman' sort of thing no worries I almost expected it

[Scootaloo]

3. This is a continual problem with David

Well, Zionists in general, but he's expressed it a few times around here. There's this belief among Zionists that they are the supreme arbiters of who is or is not a Jew, and the sole consideration involved in this are adherence to Zionist agendas and philosophies. Argue against it? You're no longer a Jew, you're a self-hater, a kapo, a judenrat, or - as we see here - a poseur.

or it could just be like another poster here who just can't comprehend that Jews come in a panopoly of colors and cultures beyond north European Ashkenazim?

It's part of why they're so loud with calling other people antisemites. You know how Republicans, with their rampagingly destructive policies, are always going on about how their opponentsare the ones "destroying America"? Same thing here.

[King_David]

4. This is a continual problem with you,

You think you know better than us about ourselves and what's happening within our community ....

I do understand the Antizionists antiisrael anti Jewish State and anti in general , crowd , to be seen to have real live actual Jews on their side...

Here's an article for you to read:

http://www.jpost.com/International/Why-do-non-Jews-bashing-Israel-claim-to-be-Jewish

[Scootaloo]

6. You know what I think?

I think that some jackass claiming that Jews he disagrees with are not "real Jews" is an antisemitic fuck.

But you knew that already, 'cause we've had this discussion.

[King_David]

7. Are you speaking as one of our community?

You are affected?

The ADL has gravitas in such and makes pronouncements, like when they said Roger Waters was not antisemitic and then changed their opinion and said he was....

Think they would agree with you?

Or do you think the Jewish community can decide for ourselves what is or is not antisemitic , or do you think we should check with you 1st?

What are your credentials for deciding for us?

[Scootaloo]

8. So you don't think denying someone's Jewish identity is antisemitic?

Who entitled you with the power to make that call, David?

[King_David]

9. I do not think it is any of your business though,

Unless your really one of our community? But if not you definitely do not get a say...at all !!

[Scootaloo]

10. Who entitled you David? It's a simple question you should have an answer for

Who, in all the great wide world took your hand, and placed into it the power and authority to proclaim someone to not be Jewish? Surely you have a name from this person, must be a pretty important and well-known dude, if he can just excommunicate people from their ethnicity like that.

[King_David]

11. I never did anything of the sort,

But even if I did ----again it is none of your business.

I do not go around telling the Armenians what is and is not going on with their people and such....why? Because I am not obsessed with Armenians and again it would actually be none of my business.


Here is an article for you to read :


http://www.jpost.com/International/Why-do-non-Jews-bashing-Israel-claim-to-be-Jewish

[Scootaloo]

13. That's EXACTLY what you did

When you had a laugh at mr. Cheyfitz' saying "I am a jew," and posted your link. That you are mocking his statement and claim is pretty fucking obvious. You are denying his Jewishness.

Now can you perhaps back up that denial, David? Your article points at Edith Lutz, who's apparently as Jewish as Madonna is. Okay. Is mr. Cheyfitz a religious convert from last week? Is there some other reason you're insinuating he's not a Jew? If so, show us. If you can't, then might I ever so politely invite you to shut your fucking pie-hole?

Unfortunately your article also undermines itself by attacking a person's Jewishness simply because they also identify as Chicano. Not terribly surprising given the sources involved, I suppose, but denying someone's identity while attacking them for another part of their identity? That's just not cool.

And yes, David, it is my business. I'm not a big fan of dehumanization and that is exactly what you are engaged in when you make this effort to strip someone's identity on the basis that you disagree with them. And again it is something you've done in the past. All while proclaiming yourself to be the voice of the Jewish People, as you've done in this subthread.

[King_David]

15. Actually I will not 'shut (my)fucking pie-hole'

As I said it is none of your business...who do you think you are...?

Not since 1948 do Jews 'shut your fucking pie-hole' anymore....one of the great things Israel did for us is make us strong,proud and no longer silent...

We are not the weak Jews from the 1930`s no more....strong Jews....that's what we are since 1948....(I learnt this in my high school it was a 'Hasbara ' type life's lesson )

[Scootaloo]

17. As I said, it is my business

Nothing in the world gives you any right to point at someone and say "you're no longer a Jew." This is a point of human interest - no one is so entitled.

Spare me the sermon, David, it's not going to change the reality that you're a jackass who thinks he has the right to pronounce and strip Jewishness from people on basis of whether or not he likes what they have to say.

[King_David]

19. ' you're a jackass ' gee thanks and I am hurt.... lol

[Scootaloo]

24. Ah yes, Birthright

[Shaktimaan]

44. Except

It appears he never was a Jew. All the evidence points to him lying about being Jewish to leverage political points to benefit a cause he believed in. He may have decided he identified with some aspects of the Jewish culture. But it seems pretty clear that none of his parents, grandparents or living relatives are Jewish, nor was he raised to identify as a Jew nor did he participate in any landmark Jewish ceremonies or study them or anything.

He doesn't meet any of the most basic rules of what a Jew is. Why would you think he's Jewish? He already admitted to using it as a false identity out of convenience.

You must know that you don't become Jewish just because you decide that you are, right? There's nothing to strip away from him. He's just lying for political advantage.

[azurnoir]

48. ah I see yaccording to you one can not be completely secular and still be a Jew

because that's the only way your comment even begins to make sense of any kind

[Fantastic Anarchist]

60. I am a Jew and you do not speak for me.

[King_David]

16. Cheyfitz deserved to be mocked...

He was telling the world I am a Jew and I am part of these people..

Because it is so important for those bigots in the ASA that voted to Boycott Jewish Academia that they could say...'Hey we have a Jew with us'....and he gladly went along with it....

[Scootaloo]

18. And here you demonstrate an inability to differentiate between "Israel" and "Jewish"

The antisemitism just pours off of you like axe-stench from a dudebro.

[King_David]

20. We are forced not to differentiate ,

?w=477







And it was Eric Cheyfitz, an American studies professor at Cornell University who wrote, “I am a Jew''

Was he differentiating ?? LOL

[Scootaloo]

25. And it's you saying he's not

And claiming tp speak for all Jews
And demonstrating you're no better than the asshats in your pictures.

Would you like some pie?

[King_David]

26. I do speak for some Jew as part of an organization,

How about you ?

You seem to think you do....

[Scootaloo]

28. Do you now?

Are you posting on DU as a representative of that group? Is the organization aware of your posts here? Do they know you are claiming htye have granted you authority to de-Jew a person? I don't imagine many organizations would be happy with that sort of thing going on in their name, but hey, for all i know, the "organization" is made of you and the voices in your head, right?

[King_David]

30. I am 100% sure I would get 99 % support from mainstream Jewish Organizations

One of which I function as a spokesdude for....

How much Jewish organizational support would you hazard a guess there that there would be for your AntiZionist views ?? LOL LOL

[Scootaloo]

35. 99% support for your campaign to deny someone's Jewishness?

What organization are you part of, exactly, that you regard that as mainstream? The JDL?

And argument via smiley. Man, that takes me back to the days of arguing with right-wingers. How apropos.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

43. A "spokesdude"...? Really?

Define the duties of a "spokesdude" with a straight face.

[King_David]

32. I had enough of this boring exchange...

Bye Bye

[Jefferson23]

33. lol +1

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

39. So if one decides to issue a fatwa against a Jew, essentially excummunicating him/her,

it is none of our business?

What a closed-minded thing to write.

[azurnoir]

12. so what you refer to as "our community" gets to decide who's a 'real' Jew and who is not?

because that's the issue you avoided that and latched onto antisemitism rather quickly I might add, so continuing on your original judgment, which you double down on above, I must ask exactly what criteria does your community use, in deciding who's a 'real' Jew and who is not? DNA, or political beliefs, because your pronouncements here seem based in politics rather than physical reality

[King_David]

14. I never proclaimed a thing .. I just posted a link to an interesting article

Why do you think it is so important for the the Anti Israel crowd and BDS AntiSemitisc peeps and Jew hating Aparyheid and Nazi State labelers of the Jewish state, to have Jewish members of their clan ?

So important is it to these people that they often lie about one of their members being a Jew ... When clearly as you can see in that article I posted ... They are not Jewish....

Not always ... But it happens often enough.

I never said this dude wasn't Jewish ( go back and read my post) I was commenting on the phenomenon that is written about in this article :

http://www.jpost.com/International/Why-do-non-Jews-bashing-Israel-claim-to-be-Jewish

[azurnoir]

21. very first comment here

1. r at Cornell University who wrote, “I am a Jew"

Ha ha ..

Classic :

http://www.jpost.com/International/Why-do-non-Jews-bashing-Israel-claim-to-be-Jewish

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113454253#post1

and you've posted the JPost article 3 times now so exactly what is your point? Just sayin' is all doesn't quite wash

[King_David]

22. I explained,

I was commenting on the necessity of the bigoted ASA group who voted to proclaim to the world that YES WE HAVE JEWS AMONGST US....

As if it legitimizes their bigotry....

It is a common phenomenon, so much so ,that some people even claim to be Jewish when they are not as illustrated in the article I posted.

It actually was not relevant to my point weather this dude was Jewish or not, but it was important enough to that group that they had to highlight this....I could care less personally...

[azurnoir]

23. except that the 2 cases in your JPost article the proclomations on the non-Jewishness of the subjec

are the products of political bigotry IMO, one is a convert meaning I guess she's not of the blood or something so there for has no right to speak and the other considers himself a Chicano ahead of considering himself to be Jewish

from JPost

Schivone’s alleged use of a fake Jewish identity recalls the German case of Edith Lutz last year. Lutz, a former school teacher, claimed to have converted to Judaism, and proceeded to use her invented Jewish credentials to garner enormous attention in the German media to publicize her voyage to violate Israel’s blockade of Gaza. Lutz was a passenger aboard the Irene catamaran in 2010 during last year’s flotilla.

Many German newspapers, including the widely viewed television program ARD-Magazin Monitor, which featured a broadcast in which Lutz was named as a representative of “Jews from Germany,” devoted extensive coverage to Lutz. The dogged reporting of German Journalist Henryk M. Broder exposed Lutz as a fraud, prompting Broder to comment, “Edith Lutz is definitely a Jew, like a smoked pork chop is kosher.”

and from HuffPo more recently

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gabriel-schivone/

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

40. Crickets...

[Jefferson23]

5. From the alleged fake Jews:

Shame/ Eldad Kisch MD

The Palestinian territory is divided and separated by Israel into 3 regions: Gaza, the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Each year around 200,000 Palestinians patients and their family members apply for permits from the Israeli army to access hospitals outside their "region". Around 20% of the applications for permits are refused or denied, harming around 40,000 people each year. That is, one out of five patients misses their hospital appointments due to not receiving permits on time.

The patients that require permits are referred by the Palestinian Ministry of Health for treatment outside the Palestinian medical system, due to overall de-development in the Palestinian medical system. Moreover, the Palestinian Ministry of Health is financing all treatments of Palestinian patients in East Jerusalem and Israel and it is not a deed of charity on behalf of Israel. Nevertheless, Israel creates many difficulties in the coordination of transferring patients and the procedure of "back to back" is still relevant, as Dr. Kish describes in this article.

Shame/ Eldad Kisch MD

Today I was ashamed, as a physician and as an Israeli. I joined some friends from Machsomwatch as an onlooker at the checkpoint Qalandia, north of Jerusalem on the road to Ramallah. This is the busiest crossing of the Green Line, where during rush hour thousands of persons pass. The passages are narrow, the crush is indescribable, the soldiers are inert and unmoved behind their armored glass windows. In order to experience some of this feeling, outside the rush hour crowd, we went through this route. With strong misgivings I joined, fearing my associations with cattle slaughterhouses and worse. From afar we heard the siren of an ambulance approaching and one of the experienced Machsom-ladies said, come, this you must see. Mind you, I came as an interested onlooker to see how Palestinians are herded like cattle, not in any medical capacity. So this column will acquire an unplanned para-medical content.

http://www.phr.org.il/default.asp?PageID=190&ItemID=1838

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

41. Lots of silence.

Perhaps your post was excommunicated?

[Jefferson23]

42. could be.

[Shaktimaan]

45. Your example of Israeli inhumanity.

Is a story ending with them saving the life of someone from the group they've been at war with for the past 65 years? And the caption of his life being saved reads:

This is the inhuman face of the occupation. This situation must be addressed as soon as possible, and we should enlist all the help we can get.

Just admit already. If you used one standard you'd have to change your whole worldview.

[azurnoir]

47. well ya eventually the patient was allowed treatment

after an 'appropriate' delay

[Shaktimaan]

52. Meaning what?

Are you asserting the delay was BC of an intentional Israeli policy to deny effective healthcare to Palestinians?

That's quite an accusation.

[Jefferson23]

49. When you insert yourself in a thread, a conversation, it would help if you

understood what was being discussed. The OP I posted was not to give an example
of Israeli inhumanity.

[painesghost]

27. This boycott doesn't make much sense.

The Israeli academic community are probably more likely to support the policies that the two academic organizations support than the general Israeli public. I don't really see with this boycott will accomplish. One thing I don't like about this whole boycott is that it just singles out Israel. Why not Iran, China, Saudi Arabia, etc. It's not like the Palestinian Authority is a bastion of academic freedom either. Its not that Israel is entirely in the right, but why only single them out? I've noticed that most of the discussions in this group seem to be between one side that believes Israeli can do no wrong and another that Israel can do no right. There are plenty of things Israeli does that I disagree with, but it is hardly the worst actor in the world.

[azurnoir]

29. Why was South Africa "singled out" after all they weren't as bad as Iran, China, Saudi Arabia either

did you ask? did you question that one? the article itself explains why

[painesghost]

31. I wouldn't have boycotted the South African Universities either for the same reason.

The South African academics were potential allies. Instead of a blanket boycott I would prefer to signal out individual scholars.

[Shaktimaan]

50. One great reason...

SAs apartheid issue was a single, identifiable demon whose beneficiaries were an entirely helpless (or at least generally nonviolent) majority population. Key is that both sides wanted to be South African. It's was relatively simpler to solve.

Evident is the boycott's white toast approach to requirements for repatriation and an end to the boycott. "Stop the Israeli govt policies from hindering Arab studies. Ok... Like stop bombing them I guess! Sounds good.

But what if Israel gets bombed? Then Gaza can bomb TelAviv university with impunity. But an Israeli response would trigger the boycott. So all you've really done is give the weaker side a new weapon to employ against the very Jews who'd likely be more inclined to support their cause. But that's a simple one...

What about ALL those tricky issues necessary to granting the Palestinians full human rights. Like final borders and Jerusalem and right of return? What are the boycott's specific plan on those?

It's ok to not have a plan. It's not ok to punish only one side for failing to achieve a goal you have no advice yourself to offer towards achieving it.

There are far more sophisticated models to use for situations where there's a variance in power and control, yet neither side can win without the others consistent input.

[azurnoir]

51. you make it sound so very complicated

that's a real talent I'll grant you that however really it's not all that complicated at all, unfortunately your examples (bombing) were not mentioned in the reason to boycott nor does it carry much water, unless of course one is attempting to obfuscate an issue, but you wouldn't be doing that would you?

you are correct about one thing though boycotts are meant to give the weaker side a weapon one that does not involve guns or rockets or bombs and not quite as easy to brush aside either

[Shaktimaan]

53. Got no problem with a boycott.

Just one with clearly defined terms and expectations. The biggest problem here is that it makes demands of one side when this is a two side problem.

In the Montgomery bus boycott there was no opposing side that held veto power. South Africa was asked for something that it alone had the power to grant or dismiss.

But here? This requires two sides. I'd be more comfortable if we saw a boycott based on specific, defined objectives that were Israel's alone to achieve.

[azurnoir]

54. and in the case of Israel vs Palestine it is Israel alone that has the power

you can deny, spin, or obfuscate more but that is the simple truth

[Shaktimaan]

55. So

The Palestinians don't have any ability to prevent peace? They haven't stopped the implementation of Israeli policies in the past at all?

When Hamas fires rockets at sderot and Israel shuts down the borders and institutes a blockade in response, they aren't influencing the peace process? When Hamas ousted the PA from Gaza entirely and refused to honor all existing agreements they made, that had no impact on the situation?

[azurnoir]

56. OMG are you actually claiming that Israel only blockades Gaza after rocket fire?

the Israeli siege of Gaza is constant especially when it comes to air and sea blockades and exactly what existing agreements are you speaking of here?

Israel itself does not homor existing agreements such as the PA recognition of Israel's right to exist- now it has to be as a Jewish State and Israel's FM has shown us the intentions that are entailed in that declaration

as for the West Bank can Palestinians stop the building of settlements by Israel?

[Shaktimaan]

61. Excuse my late reply

And please let's stay on point. Yes the seige is constant. Sure Israel's violated agreements. That's not something I was implying. You said:

4. and in the case of Israel vs Palestine it is Israel alone that has the power

Now the seige may be constant but was it always? Go back to 2005. It is simple cause and effect. The closures and the seige are a direct result of Gaza's rockets. Ergo... The Palestinians clearly posses the power to disrupt peace. They have done so often.

The fact that Israel also has influence over the situation is a given. But if they solely held the power then why is Hamas in control of Gaza at all? Is it Israel's desire that got them elected and the PA thrown out of Gaza entirely?

[azurnoir]

62. of course Israel did not have Gaza under seige while Israeli settlers lived there

that seems a no brainer as of right now we have reports that Hamas is trying to contain the rocket fire (which is more than Israel does with it's settlers) it is Israel and Israel alone that has the power over the air and sea blockade of Gaza

[Shaktimaan]

63. Off point again.

Things we aren't discussing:

Did Jewish settlers oppress Arab Gazans?
Does Israel have air and sea dominance over Gaza militarily?
Does Gaza make consistent efforts to control rocket fire?
Does Israel ever arrest a settler no matter what crazy atrocity he commits?

Edit. Btw it's yes. Yes. No. Maybe.


We are discussing whether Palestinians posses any influence over the peace process at all. It's kind of a no brainier. Are you so committed to the cause that you see the Palestinians as nothing more but impotent placeholders? Unable to impact the course of events in any way?

Did the intifadas not impact the Accords implementation at all?

Did qassams have anything to do with cast lead?

Did Hamas' explosions in the 90s influence Israeli politics in any way?

-----

One more. If all mortars and rockets from Gaza ceased after 2005, would cast lead still have occurred IYO.

[Scootaloo]

34. What a strange argument

Might as well ask "why single them out?" with regards yo any subject of protest, then. Why single Russia out, they're hardly the worst anti-GLBT offender in the world. Why single Saudi Arabia out, they're not the most anti-woman place in the world. Why single out mcDonalds, they're not the worst capitalist vulture. Why single Bush out, he wasn't the worst president ever! et cetera.

Yep, other places do bad things too. This does not exonerate Israel, nor does Israel's wrongdoing exonerate theirs. Why boycott Israel? because it's worth boycotting, to the people who choose to do so. Just as these other worse palces - and a multitude of better places as well! - are subjects of protest, boycott, and even sanctions, themselves.

[painesghost]

36. Why not go after them all? That's what I was saying.

I'm against blanket academic boycott's because I'd rather target particular scholars and think that the flow of information actually is more likely to bring about change than to slow it. Economic sanctions are the things that regimes actually take notice of and are more likely to have an effect. The academic boycott didn't hurt SA as much as the economic one.

[azurnoir]

37. so your encouraging an economic boycott of Israel?

interesting argument

[painesghost]

38. no. I'd like a targeted academic boycott not a blanket one. n/t

[azurnoir]

46. Targeted how?

against institutions or individuals?

[painesghost]

57. The boycott itself was mainly against administrators not professors....

So I'd target the administrators of any institutions that were treating Palestinians unfairly. A limited boycott would make it easier to remove problem administrators and replace them with fair-minded people.

[azurnoir]

58. In a perfect world that might work but not in this one

the reaction would be exactly the same not to mention the administrators alone would not be the problem there has to be co-operation from underlings too

[painesghost]

59. I actually think this would be perfect

The proposed boycott targets mainly administrators. They have said it doesn't target individual scholars. Of course if say you are a history professor that has his/her administrators boycotted this will still cast a shadow over your work. It would behoove the scholars in that department to demand the administrators resignation. I believe in this way you could achieve a faculty that was more in-tuned with a nondiscriminatory policy. There really is no excuse for some of the anti-Palestinian policies of said universities. At the same time it should be adopted on a wider scale. Any university that is discriminatory should face the same repercussions.