LGBT
Related: About this forumHIV Positive Criminals: Have Sex, Go to Jail
http://www.gay.net/positive-proud/2012/01/01/hiv-positive-criminals-have-sex-go-jailThis may be the defining HIV issue of our time, and it is a true test of our compassion and understanding of both HIV stigma and the law. Please read this closely.
Around the country, and without leadership or guidelines from the Federal government, individual states have taken it upon themselves to draft laws that "protect" people from those of us with HIV. Whether using bio-terrorism statutes or simple "assault with a deadly weapon," people with HIV who do not disclose their status to their sexual partners are risking arrest and prosecution.
You're already having a visceral response to this scenario, aren't you? You may have the vague feeling that anyone who doesn't disclose their HIV+ status to a partner probably deserves to be punished. Don't worry, you're not alone. Not only do most people support laws forbidding sex without disclosing an HIV+ status, but even a majority of gay men support such laws, and it is understandable, albeit a misinformed view, as to why.
Many of us know someone who was infected by a partner who didn't disclose their status, or even lied about it. I have friends who dated someone claiming to be negative, until they found a telltale prescription drug bottle and then discovered they had been infected. Worse yet are the news reports showing some big, scary black man who has been raping white women and infecting them with HIV. How could anyone argue against bringing these liars and malicious infectors to justice?
dkf
(37,305 posts)Wouldn't they constantly have to check? What is the response time for a test?
Does any drug keep any condition in an unquestionably secure status?
Or is it like the pill...dependent on the diligence of the woman and the efficacy of the drug?
Personally I feel disclosure is the only fair thing. Putting other peoples lives at risk shouldn't be a right.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)And more gay people and straight people who are promiscuous will get infected thinking 1) these measure make it safer to have bareback sexual intercourse; and 2) those who are positive but undiagnosed will not have access to treatment that improves their own health and also helps protect their sex partners.
But what do those whose profession is medicine know about health care?
xchrom
(108,903 posts)and as i remember the days when a person wouldn't DREAM of disclosure because it was dangerous for so many reasons to so.
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)I'm betting you only feel that way because it involves sex. Should he be forced to tell his coworkers he is HIV positive, too? What if he fell and hit his head at work, was knocked unconscious? They should know that he has tainted blood, right?
William769
(55,147 posts)Now theres a novel Idea.
Response to dkf (Reply #1)
William769 This message was self-deleted by its author.
beyurslf
(6,755 posts)I would be interested to know how many states have laws that state that simple non-disclosure is illegal, rather than a law regarding some form of disclosure.
Kurska
(5,739 posts)Last edited Tue Jan 3, 2012, 12:43 AM - Edit history (3)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1137608You can find my feelings there. I saw well articulated arguments for both sides. I'm still leaning towards criminalization of nondisclosure.
I can see the other side. I just think HIV isn't one of those things where we can just expect the person to "do the right thing" and tell their partner. I'm all for personal responsibility, but what about responsibility for our fellow man? I have all the sympathy in the world for people with HIV. I want them to have access to cheap drugs. I want them to be protected from irrational firings at work. I don't want them to feel like their life is over. But I just can't get my moral indignation going, because someone was punished because they concealed possible life changing and dangerous information from someone else so they could have sex.
Look, I understand that you can have nearly no viral load with well managed HIV and condoms drastically reduce the risk, maybe these should factor into the law. I know for a fact spitting on someone shouldn't at all fall under this definition. However, no matter how small the risk can be during sex, I just feel like that isn't their choice to make. If someone knowing that their partner has HIV and still wants to have sex, more power to them. But when a person doesn't tell another person, they are making the choice for them and I'm not cool with that.
marginlized
(357 posts)these laws will only be abused for all the wrong reasons.
Fearless
(18,421 posts)Both partners should bear responsibility to some degree. If a partner purposely lies about his/her HIV status, I think that is criminal, particularly if the other partner then contracts it. Criminal negligence. And criminally I think it should be treated as such.
If a partner doesn't know that he is HIV positive and he/she engages in unprotected sex and their partner contracts it, both should be considered negligent in that consensual sex is a two way street, both need to take precautions.
If both partners have protected sex and one is HIV positive and doesn't tell the other, and the other contracts it, he/she IMHO should be held as negligent. To a lesser degree perhaps than the unprotected sex contraction, but maybe not. What I see as negligent there is that the person is not being honest about the risk involved, not whether or not they have protected / unprotected sex. Both are being to some degree negligent if they are having unprotected sex and don't know for certain each person's status.
If they have protected or unprotected sex while not knowing their statuses and one gives HIV to the other, then I see both as equally negligent. The fact that one happens to be positive and the other happens to be negative isn't pertinent to the actions being or not being taken by both parties. At that place and time they are both condoning the same action.
I hope I didn't repeat myself, it's late... And then there's the final category...
People who willingly have unprotected sex with multiple partners of uncertain statuses. Honestly, people blow my mind sometimes. In 2012, in the United States, if you don't know what you could be getting yourself into, then you have my pity. I'm not saying by any means that most people won't be fine, but the chance that someone could kill themselves over an hour's worth of thrill, that really bothers me. It's one thing if you're proven clean. It's another if you're protected. But I'll never understand the thought process in that. Just one of my pet peeves I guess.
Kurska
(5,739 posts)And reflects my own thinking. I defiantly think the laws need reform, someone getting prosecuted for spitting on someone else is absolutely ludicrous, but I'm not ready to get rid of them all together. The idea that someone could lie about their status to have unprotected sex is something that I just can't stomach as a-o-kay under the law.
I think that line needs to be drawn by asking the question: "Did I take reasonable precautions to protect myself from any potential negative consequences?"
If yes, then I think that the person can't be held liable. If no, then I think they should be held liable. Of course, they could both be at fault, then I think that liabilities negate each other. And both could be in the right, and things still just happen, which really sucks but I don't think that either should be held responsible for something that they took reasonable steps to avoid.
The only fuzzy line left, IMHO, there is whether wearing a condom constitutes a "reasonable precaution". If yes, then a person that gets HIV from a broken (properly used) condom can't hold their partner liable regardless of if either party knew they were HIV positive. If no, they can.
Of course, if we could make getting tested regularly a socially necessary thing, much of this could be avoided.