So, my daughter's school has a Zero Tolerance policy for PDA's

[FirstLight]

My daughter is now in middle school, 6th-8th grades. She came home and informed me the other day that the school has a hands-down NO tolerance policy for PDA's...if you hold hands with someone in the hallways, a teacher can break you up and you WILL get detention. Never mind if you get caught hugging or *gasp* kissing!

Okay, I went to middle/high school in the 80s and I can say this was NOT an issue. We walked holding hands, arms around each other, and had the decency to keep our snogging to discreet areas behind the portables... but it was commonplace. Hell, it was a way of showing others you were 'with' someone, holding hands or sitting on the bleachers snuggling during lunch or games...

And I think I know why they started this ridiculous nazi oversight....it's because more kids are dating same gender people and they are afraid of the repercussions from parents and kids asking questions about gay relationships. I even told my daughter that's what I expect is their motivation for this ... It's crazy. Just because it makes the establishment uncomfortable, they outlaw affection for everyone. Seriously, isn't this the age where we are supposed to be exploring relationships? Why can't we open the conversation to include what healthy relationships are supposed to look like, for ALL genders?

I was posting here to get your take on this, but as I type I am getting fired up and think I may have to have a talk with the principal.

[BlueJazz]

1. You can tell the way my mind works. I thought you were talking about a Personal Data Assistant

Maybe the powers that be think if they let people hold hands, other will push the envelope.
Which they will.

??

[FirstLight]

5. well the inappropriate ones have always existed...

and boundaries being made are one thing, but all out denial of affection is wrong if you ask me. What if my daughter is hugging her friend because she is sad over a family issue or something? will they consider that to be off limits and take both girls into detention?

why does our society choose to make our children non-emotive little robots of political correctness? Honestly, I have seen these generations evolve and can say that the Millennials and this upcoming next wave are more accepting and androgynous than ever...they have no problem with gay or bi or straight...WE do.

[BlueJazz]

10. Oh...I agree with you and your points. It just seems that the people in charge are...

...so afraid of something...(OMG!...What...what were they doing and will I get fired!!!)...that they try to fix EVERYTHING that's truly not broken.

[FirstLight]

13. it's always either too much or too little.

I am sure there are parents who would have my head on a plate for asking these questions out loud or saying anything in front of their kids.

It amuses me actually the level of paranoia even among my own daughter's friend's mothers. I am honest with my girl, she knows more than her peers about how the world works, because I don't want he being unprepared by being too naieve...but that's just me. Because I know my own mom was so overprotective not only did it MAKE me want trouble, but when shit happened, I didn't see it coming and didn't know how to stop it.
My daughter knows that I think some of these mommy friends are nuts for being so heavy handed...it's gonna blow up in their faces one day. You can't be so militant with tweens and teens....you have to be there for them so when they explore they feel safe and can share what they felt and figure out what they want & don't want. That's how to grow little adults... but I am a hippie liberal freak, what do I know?


It's times like this I wish I could have been a guidance counselor for a high school - but they'd surely fire me right quick for talking like that!

[immoderate]

2. I think the students could have a lot of fun with this...

If all the students hold hands every day, that would call their bluff.

--imm

[FirstLight]

3. ooooh!

good idea!

[Democracyinkind]

4. I think your assessment about their motivation is spot on.

We all know that teh gay is contagious!!11!! Don't let them recruit the kids!!

[FirstLight]

7. thanks...

I wondered for a split second if it was to prevent 'sexual harassment' or protect girls from boys being aggressive or whatnot...and I am sure there may be a small factor of that too. But I know this generation of kids is way more open to flexibility in sexual orientation, and that scares a LOT of people, parents and administrators.

[Democracyinkind]

9. While it scares some...

It should give "us" cause for hope. This is one area where I actually see change happening. A nice thoght for a sunday. Thanks for that.

[FirstLight]

12. anecdotally...

I have two 'generations' of kids...my oldest graduated in 2010 and the younger ones are now 10&11, so they are about 10 yrs apart...

My oldest son has several friend from high school who are Bi and Gay, and nobody even bats an eye... the acceptance among peers is so natural I am so proud of them. One boy who had a terrible time in his teen years with his mom kicking him out of the house for weeks on end if he displayed his flamboyancy has gone on to college - and is now the co-president of the Gay/Straight Alliance club on campus. They have opened a safe haven center for teens who get kicked out of the house for being bi or gay. He has turned his own issue into something so awesomely proactive.

My younger two consider these older kids the friends of their brother as extensions of the family. They call them big brother or sister and love them just as much for who they are, no issues. When I shared the news article about the above center that this kid opened, they were so proud of him!

When I told my daughter my suspicions, (about the PDA rule) she got all pissed off and said "why should anyone care?" She gets it.

Now, mind you...I am a liberal hippie mama, and I have raised all my kids that way. Open minds and hearts. Love is what matters, not gender or status, but who treats you right.

thanks for letting me ramble...

[Democracyinkind]

16. That's really heartwarming.

Thank you for sharing. You sound like a great mom... no wonder your kids got it right!

[FirstLight]

17. ...

thanks

[Downwinder]

6. Can you still carry someones books for them?

[FirstLight]

8. I doubt it...

but this generation may not remember that move so well!

[Niceguy1]

11. I wouldn't jump to conclusions

Without finsing more out.

[FirstLight]

15. my daughter

has a really great teacher for social studies and I may approach her quietly for her take on it. I'd love to see an actual event put together with the local (women's shelter) Violence Free center that discusses healthy relationships no matter what the gender... telling them it is okay to have feelings rather than making them have to hide them. teaching kids to hide things from us is a dangerous slippery slope....

[Niceguy1]

22. banbing pdas

At school is ok, it remoges a lot of distractions.

[SheilaT]

14. I went to high school in the 1960's

and PDA hardly ever happened. I can't recall ever even seeing kids hold hands, even those we knew were established couples.

To me it's not a gender thing, but an appropriate behavior thing.

How much PDA is appropriate in a workplace?

[FirstLight]

18. well 1960 and 1985

are really different years culturally and socially too.

I don't think you can compare it to the workplace either.
Middle school and High school are HUGE Social development arenas for kids... it where they learn how the world works on SO many levels... teaching tolerance is so vital at that stage of the game.

[Warpy]

19. To tell the truth, adults were always uncomfortable about kids

who were discovering the opposite sex. It's why they tried to ban certain music and clothing and why they all had pickle faces between classes as couples in puppy love were all over each other as they strolled down the hall. It just all squicked them out.

Healthier attitudes toward same sex couples have now spilled into the schools and the pickle faces are totally freaked out about it. So they clamp down on everybody.

This is just not going to be enforceable. They're going to have to expel half the school.

[FirstLight]

20. ...

exactly...so true

[FirstLight]

21. I'm thinking I'l x-post this to GD

just to get some more feedback...

[Fearless]

23. Sounds like someone thinks sex is icky at that school.

Or worse that abstinence works. (Which of course it doesn't.)

[FirstLight]

24. oh lordy, you're probably right

even though they 'should be' too young to think about sex, the fact is they aren't. That is why I say it should be a teaching tool and conversation opener to discuss relationships and so forth...rather than shut down the whole concept for fear of something icky...

and then we wonder why our kids aren't clued in to watch for date-rape...or how to defend themselves from an abusive partner...or how to value their own personal space enough to maybe choose abstention for themselves, but not to force it on others.

Narrow minds...

[Amimnoch]

25. Is this a policy they recently put into place?

Back in the 70's/80's my Jr. High and High school both had a 0 tolerance on PDA policies. Heck, for my first year in 7th grade, during lunch break, and the bus pick up areas were segregated completely by sex. Females had their side of the playground, males had theirs. Females had their bus pickup area, males had theirs. In 8th grade, they finally relaxed it a little from parent demands, and the playground was integrated, but still teachers would watch the students like a hawk, and ANY personal contact was going to be met with a trip to the principals office and a paddling.

Personally, I think it's a ridiculous policy, but if it's at least applied equally, and isn't being used to target any specific group('s), then at least it isn't bigotry... Still, anything that makes interaction a "taboo" is only going to make teens want to break the taboo even more. As with my example up above, the segregation forced on us did nothing to prevent several of the 8th grade females in my school from taking an unplanned vacation and coming back with a baby in tow.

If you feel it's there specifically targeting us, there's probably something to it (there's a reason "huntches" turn out to be correct), but if that's a policy that's been around since the school opened or for more than a decade.. it's likely just an outdated policy that's never been overturned.

[FirstLight]

26. I believe it is new this year

I am planning on having a chat with the 'cool' social studies teacher and see what her take on it is. I agree the taboo thing makes it worse. There are all kinds of posters here that think it's wrong for a 11-14 yr old to be holding hands, etc... but to me it is part of their natural growing up. But having a discussion and creating boundaries is better than zero tolerance. I think that part is just crazy....and if it is because of the reasons i suspect, that's just straight up bullshit. (ya, and just try to get the school to admit it)