interesting--regarding diets for cats with kidney failure

[ginnyinWI]

http://www.catnutrition.org/4/post/2013/08/lil-bite-of-the-day-protein-restriction-for-kidney-disease.html

"There are NO studies that demonstrate that restricting protein halts kidney deterioration in a cat. "

[Curmudgeoness]

1. Very interesting.

And it makes me feel better about the loss of my kitty who had renal disease. She would not eat the kidney formula cat food, so I just gave her what she would eat (after much experimenting with low protein diets).

It seems to me that the reason vets have come to the conclusion that restricting protein is beneficial is because of the increased protein in the urine with a kidney disease. Lower protein in the diet would equal less protein being processed. But it sounds like that doesn't really matter much.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

2. When Kidley was diagnosed with kidney disease, the vet gave me samples of low-protein foods

Kidley absolutely refused to eat any of them.

I decided, therefore, if he was going to have a short life, he may as well enjoy it, so I began feeding him high-quality, low-carb foods with real meat as an occasional snack.

He is still an old kitty and still deaf and not as active as he used to be, but his coat is all fluffy, and his health is holding steady.

[ginnyinWI]

3. I had the same experience

Tim would not eat the prescription food, so I did just feed him nice canned food that he enjoyed. He was eating up until the end when his heart gave out. He was eighteen.

So I went with my gut and it turns out that it was okay to do that.

[Ino]

4. Kidney prescription diet helped my cat

She ate like a horse, but was losing weight. Finally got her correctly diagnosed (another story!), and she was put on the prescription diet. She gained two pounds within a month, and lived two more years, to 18-1/2.

Maybe the food didn't halt the kidney deterioration, but it kept her weight up so she didn't just waste away.

I miss her so much

my Adrian

[JayhawkSD]

5. Molly is living with 20% kidney function

Poor thing. First she had a heartworm. Vet was all excited because she was the first cat she'd ever diagnosed with heartworm. Rare in cats, especially in San Diego which has few to no mosquitos. She wanted to do an untrasound to get a picture of the worm(s), but I said no. Molly didn't need the hassle.

Then she threw a massive blood clot which killed a huge part of one kidney. That led to chronic pancreatitis.

Then six months age she was diagnosed with lymphoma, so has been on chemotherapy. She's thriving, though. Playing, sleeping normally and not losing weight.

She gets eight medications, which we now have compounded into one capsule administered twice daily, along with one subq shot twice daily. Calicos are supposed to be cranky, but if she's in my lap when it's time for the pill and shot she just lays there and takes the medicine, then goes back to sleep in my lap.

Once in a while she decides to "run from her fate," but it gets kind of funny. She runs about eight feet and stops. Allows herself to be picked up and goes limp with a look of doom on her face. Drama queen.

[ginnyinWI]

6. what does Molly eat?

I've had a cranky calico and I know just what you mean. They are cranky but not all that assertive.

[JayhawkSD]

7. Well, therein lies a story

She was eating Enova Evo dry food, but that became unavailable. We finally found another dry food, low protien which the vet said was good for her kidney problem.

Then we started seeing this internist for the cancer problem. Nice lady, but I think she's a little bit nuts. She wants Molly on canned food because of the water content; claims cats are of desert origin 10,000 years ago and therefor don't drink enough water. Molly doesn't like canned food, so we buy every fucking flavor the pet store has and try them one by one. She likes one flavor, so we stock up on it, but she only likes it for one can and then decides she doesn't like it.

Then the vet says try feeding her in a different place, and the next thing I know there's a cat food dish in every room in the house. No, no, no; I had to put my foot down on that. The place stunk like a landfill. Told my wife we weren't doing that, we would just put the one dish a different place in the kitchen. It didn't help.

The people at the pet store know us. We go in and say hello and then ask, "So, what haven't we tried lately?"

So now we are giving her whatever canned food she'll eat along with some dried food made from rabbit, I think it is. Vet isn't concerned with protein, make sure she gets calories and water. I think she drinks plenty, she pees a ton, but the vet seems to think she is manufacturing all of thet pee that we are reporting out of... I don't know where she think it's coming from.

She wants Molly to gain weight, but Molly has been 8 lbs 6 oz for the past several years and is maintaining that weight, so I don't know what the problem is.

[ginnyinWI]

8. I agree about the canned food.

I'm of the same philosophy: dry food is low in moisture, has less nutrition that cats can really use, and is made interesting to cats mainly using a "slurry" of pureed animal parts sprayed on the surface of the kibble. Grains and plant proteins like soy or wheat gluten aren't as well metabolized. They do need animal protein, unlike people (I'm mostly vegan myself). Unlike people, cats use protein for energy rather than carbs.

But dry food is as addictive as potato chips for some cats. You can try sprinkling a little on the top of the canned food to get her started. Be persistent. Once she is used eating wet food that way, stick with that brand and sometimes leave the dry food off.

With my one dry food-loving cat, she knows she will never get it in the morning feed, but sometimes sits there looking at her evening dish until I put some "crunchies" on top. I use Natural Balance Reduced Calorie formula. She is a larger breed and gets just a coffee measure of dry per day and no more, along with 3/4 to 1 whole can of Friskies.

The other cat doesn't care for dry food and will only eat it if desperate. She prefers a treat of real chicken thigh meat. Chicken thighs are pretty cheap and I boil and freeze them for use as treats.

[JayhawkSD]

9. Well, I'm not sure about that

Most of the canned foods list vegetables, and the dry food says that it contains no grains or gluten. The vet wants us to have her eat some dry food because it is higher in calories, and the canned is very low in calories. Basically we're just giving her whatever she will eat.

[bettyellen]

13. there are powder additives you sprinkle on that can make it more appetizing, that work well.

[REP]

10. Low-pro isn't done for human kidney patients; makes less sense for obligate carnivores

Just had this discussion with my vet - she told me they no longer recommend low-pro for cats with CKD; it does the same thing to them as it does to humans: makes them frail and unable to tolerate treatment for ESRD.

Anecdotally, I was not put on low-pro when my CKD was at its worst; instead I was put on additional protein to make up for what I was losing through proteinuria (an extra 12 g/day). My function has stabilized and my proteinuria is in remission (knock wood it stays there).

[CountAllVotes]

11. my old fellow the late Flame died of kidney failure

and yes, they had me running around buying this very expensive dry food made by Science Diet. The first two ingredients were corn and brewer's yeast -- that seemed to supposedly be the secret as well as low fat, low protein and above all low phosphorus, low phosphorus ...

He didn't like it and wouldn't eat it.

He lived to be 12 years old.

I think this food push thing for the kidneys is a racket ... a money racket.

[glinda]

12. Better quality protein but low phos as possible and no dry. Add wet to wet food also.

Look into "binders" also.

[Warpy]

14. Renal failure in cats is very different from renal failure in humans

My own cat flatly refused to have anything to do with a renal diet and I told the vet that at the age of 18, she'd earned her right to kitty hospice rather than kitty heroics.

She's now pushing 21 and doing well enough on regular food and two blood pressure drugs. She's skin and bones even though she's eating enough. Her hydration is good without fluids and that's 90% of the battle. The renal gastritis gives her hiccups after she eats, funny to listen to and usually over within a couple of minutes.

I have no idea how much longer she'll hang on. Any illness will see her out because she's so skinny, she's got nothing left to fight it off.

I'm very lucky that she's such a good kitty, swallowing her Pill Pockets with a minimum of fuss and only token resistance.

However, it's good news about the renal diet food. I guess kitty knew best all along.