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friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
Thu Mar 7, 2013, 07:55 PM Mar 2013

Bill suggests anger management classes for those purchasing ammo

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/bill-suggests-anger-management-classes-those-purch/nWkbQ/


Bill suggests anger management classes for those purchasing ammo

The bill was filed less than a week ago and it would require anyone buying ammunition to take a two-hour anger management course.

Sen. Audrey Gibson of Jacksonville wrote the bill.

"You have to use your driver's license to purchase cold medications these days, but there is no mechanism for using a driver's license or no database on how much ammunition is out there."


Another video here:

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/video/default.aspx?bctid=2208032304001

The phrase "transvaginal ultrasound" come to anybody elses mind?

Different bugbear, same mindset...

125 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Bill suggests anger management classes for those purchasing ammo (Original Post) friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 OP
I'm calm now ... holdencaufield Mar 2013 #1
Yeah, I felt that way about Sudafed. aquart Mar 2013 #51
"Hobby." You keep using that word. ThatPoetGuy Mar 2013 #78
The chances of this bill passing in Florida are less than the chance that I will win ... spin Mar 2013 #2
Oh, no doubt. I was simply amused to see an alleged 'progressive' attempt to employ... friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #3
CONTROL......they want to control you, not ammo or guns. ileus Mar 2013 #4
Nope. They want to keep people safe. ThatPoetGuy Mar 2013 #79
Rigid Dogma av8r1998 Mar 2013 #103
here is an interview with Sen Gibson on the subject gejohnston Mar 2013 #5
Hell, you seen those damned prices???!!! Eleanors38 Mar 2013 #6
Authoritarians are so cute when they get all Big Brotherish. nt Common Sense Party Mar 2013 #7
They're cute when they're small holdencaufield Mar 2013 #8
Oh how about anger management required before voting too. beevul Mar 2013 #9
Her level of ignorance is amazing. GreenStormCloud Mar 2013 #10
Point of fact...Most Mass murderers do NOT have a criminal record. VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #52
two different things gejohnston Mar 2013 #55
Most children who shoot themselves or other children VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #60
those make up at most 50 gejohnston Mar 2013 #61
It's not a herring VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #63
you think only 50 children die a year from gunshot wounds in this country???? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #64
Over 10 times wrong! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #65
if child is defined as under 12 gejohnston Mar 2013 #67
baloney and we do NOT define children as under 12.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #71
I can handle the math...can you? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #72
but I will defer to your constraint.....lets play another round shall we? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #73
and more... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #76
why get it from Huff Po gejohnston Mar 2013 #77
Welcome to DU! ThatPoetGuy Mar 2013 #80
So now saying that we need better gun control is an extremist position? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #81
Nope! I meant the opposite. ThatPoetGuy Mar 2013 #82
I simply said that 13 year olds are gejohnston Mar 2013 #83
Uh huh. ThatPoetGuy Mar 2013 #84
for example? gejohnston Mar 2013 #85
Oh Okay...thanks for the clarification! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #86
I don't think forcing a woman to be vaginally penetrated for a medical procedure ZombieHorde Mar 2013 #11
Anger management should be required before buying golf clubs. Remmah2 Mar 2013 #12
Are you equating Golf Clubs with AR15's? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #53
I'm saying gun control advocates can't count to four. Remmah2 Mar 2013 #58
We already HAVE Gun control VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #59
does anyone want one? gejohnston Mar 2013 #62
YOU BET they DO! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #66
I first learned such things are legal at the post office gejohnston Mar 2013 #68
Okay.....it is illegal to own a sawwed off shotgun! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #69
in fact my ex got 5 yrs probation for possessing said fire arm! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #70
state or federal law? gejohnston Mar 2013 #75
and STILL that equates to regulation does it not?? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #87
I never said we didn't gejohnston Mar 2013 #88
Gun control advocates DO know that we do VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #89
many seem not to, gejohnston Mar 2013 #90
One guy does not a trend make VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #91
she was pretty typical gejohnston Mar 2013 #92
Not so typical....those on the left are generally better read than many of those I know on the right VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #93
on most things, I'm most likely way to the left of you gejohnston Mar 2013 #94
Yeah unless the gun dealer is robbed...then he can destroy the records right???/ VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #95
nope gejohnston Mar 2013 #97
Not to the ATF.....and there is so indefinite registry federally VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #99
never said it was gejohnston Mar 2013 #102
we have had federal gun control since gejohnston Mar 2013 #74
And obviously that needs to be updated huh? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #96
that was the first one gejohnston Mar 2013 #98
There are No Guarantees... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #100
no gejohnston Mar 2013 #101
"How is a Sig Sauer different than a Ruger?" VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #104
huh? gejohnston Mar 2013 #105
pro-RKBA "logic": sitting in a classroom for two hours = an invasive probe inserted in a woman's apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #13
You lot are no different from the fetus fetishists in thinking your particular infringement... friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #16
You go right on doubling down on that offensive and frankly sexist comparison between a woman having apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #17
I've been pointing out the similarities between gun Prohibitionists and abortion foes for years: friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #18
There are no "similarities" between an invasive procedure in a woman's body and some clownish apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #19
"Bobo who likes to play with popguns". Gotta get your culture war on, eh? friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #21
Whatever any of that collage of non-responsive gibberish means. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #22
It means: You don't get to decide what is progressive, and what isn't. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #25
No, it doesn't: it's just a meaningless jumble of words, typed in order to deflect and obfuscate apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #29
Similar to your slanderous, idiotic .sig in that sense, then. Lizzie Poppet Mar 2013 #43
Aaaahhhhh...Someone haz an ongoing sadz about my sigz. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #46
As usual, you're dead wrong. Lizzie Poppet Mar 2013 #49
LOL! apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #50
I'd like to know if they find passing a driving test to be an equivalent invasive procedure VanillaRhapsody Mar 2013 #54
Tell you what: why don't you put your money where you keyboard is and post an OP in GD apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #24
Why don't *you* repost it in GD and complain about it? friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #27
And Bingo! There it is: all we're gonna get now is excuses as to why you're NOT going to post apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #30
Gun threads don't play well in GD- you are are always free to alert and play jury roulette. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #36
"Gun threads don't play well in GD" - Translation: "I'm unwilling to stand behind my convictions apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #40
And check this out, class: of the three links he provides "proving" he's been engaging in offensive, apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #20
I ridicule those that try to evade Lawrence v. Texas and Olmstead v. L. C., as well friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #23
This message was self-deleted by its author apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #26
Get back with me when you're willing to stand behind your convictions and post an OP in GD apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #32
And all *your* blather is meaningless unless you alert and/or claim a TOS violation. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #37
Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #39
You'll just have to get used to your demands being ignored. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #44
Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #48
Why not anger mgmt classes to get your driver's license? guardian Mar 2013 #14
Ammo is getting scarce. Jenoch Mar 2013 #15
*shrug* Okay. Deep13 Mar 2013 #28
she couldn't defend her own idea or explain how it would work gejohnston Mar 2013 #31
Seriously? Every fucking time you buy it? tularetom Mar 2013 #33
in an interview she blew badly gejohnston Mar 2013 #34
Haahaaahaaaa... *Bookmarking for Future Reference* apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #35
Good. Put it right next to the "Zimmerman will walk thanks to SYG laws" friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #38
And you're a pro-George Zimmerman poster to boot! Why am I *NOT* surprised? apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #41
Kindly prove your claim with citations. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #45
There's still time to edit your #38 above. Or at least initiate a walk-back. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #47
No need to; I need only repost something about Zimmerman that I posted in January, friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #56
Uh-huh. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #57
I'm still pissed to hell & back about ammo prices!! Did you do dat? Eleanors38 Mar 2013 #106
What irritates me is the irrational panic. I was waiting to be helped to get some premium 20 gauge apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #107
When you have calls for bans, ammunition limits, ammunition taxes, Eleanors38 Mar 2013 #108
And as such a reaction is *irrational* - i.e., NOTHING I have proposed or advocated for apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #109
Yours is a hateful culture war, in which you have concocted an enemy Eleanors38 Mar 2013 #110
Wrong - my "war" is the age-old progressive, liberal struggle for enlightenment, civilization, and apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #111
Same ol' denigration, same ol' longwindedness-s-s-z-z-z Eleanors38 Mar 2013 #118
Same "ol' truth and facts; same "ol' Gungeoneers fleeing the scene like vampires from a garlic grove apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #120
And according to many that post here............... oneshooter Mar 2013 #121
And here we have the Pamela Geller branch of gun control advocacy in purest ray serene friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #112
What you actually "have" is a genuine progressive talking truth to a gaggle of pro-NRA shills & apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #113
Same backbeat as Pam G., just a different subject- "All *those* people are alike, and I'm merely... friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #114
What you actually "have" is a genuine progressive talking truth to a gaggle of pro-NRA shills & apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #115
Hey, and BTW: have you worked up the gumption to actually stand behind your convictions PUBLICLY apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #116
Why? This was a thread about gun politics, and still is. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #117
So, the answer is "NO" - you have not yet worked up the courage of your convictions apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #119
I understand where you're coming from- you are upset because you fear defeat... friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #122
So the answer is *still* "NO": you haven't yet worked up the courage of your convictions to post apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #123
Still resorting to the same old "pro-NRA" untruths, eh? friendly_iconoclast Mar 2013 #124
Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions. apocalypsehow Mar 2013 #125
Sounds like it's intended solely to make a right/liberty more expensive, inconvenient, petronius Mar 2013 #42
 

holdencaufield

(2,927 posts)
1. I'm calm now ...
Thu Mar 7, 2013, 07:57 PM
Mar 2013

... but make me sign up for a course just to participate in my chosen hobby and I WILL need anger management.

spin

(17,493 posts)
2. The chances of this bill passing in Florida are less than the chance that I will win ...
Thu Mar 7, 2013, 08:01 PM
Mar 2013

the Florida Lotto tonight.

In order for me to have any chance I would have to walk across the street and buy a lotto ticket. At this moment I have no plans to do so.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
3. Oh, no doubt. I was simply amused to see an alleged 'progressive' attempt to employ...
Thu Mar 7, 2013, 08:03 PM
Mar 2013

..the techniques of the fetus fetishists.

ThatPoetGuy

(1,747 posts)
79. Nope. They want to keep people safe.
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:31 PM
Mar 2013

Rigid dogma makes it hard for you to understand that our lives are more important than your toys.

 

av8r1998

(265 posts)
103. Rigid Dogma
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 10:26 AM
Mar 2013

Makes it hard or you to understand that requiring "Anger Management" classes for ammo purchasers will not keep anyone safer.

GreenStormCloud

(12,072 posts)
10. Her level of ignorance is amazing.
Fri Mar 8, 2013, 09:23 AM
Mar 2013

Most murderers already have criminal records for violence. Does she think that such people will go to anger management classes?

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
55. two different things
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:38 AM
Mar 2013

GSC said most murderers, not mass murderers.
Mass murderers are relatively rare, they just get the media attention. Why do they get the media attention? Because it is not common.
Dog bites man isn't news. Man bites dog is news.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
64. you think only 50 children die a year from gunshot wounds in this country????
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 01:30 PM
Mar 2013

You are woefully mistaken!

Children in the U.S. are 14 TIMES as likely to die from gunshot wounds as any other country in the industrialized world!

Since you are pulling numbers out of that place the sun doesn't shine....you might want to try reading up on the subject.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
65. Over 10 times wrong!
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 01:33 PM
Mar 2013

Canada is concerned because in the latest reported year, 153 Canadian children were killed by guns while France had only 109 children killed. In Japan, the number was zero.

The United States had 5,285 childhood gun deaths that same year, the Center for Disease Control reports.

http://www.journal-news.net/page/content.detail/id/557291/Thousands-of-children-are-killed---.html

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
67. if child is defined as under 12
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 01:54 PM
Mar 2013

and you implied by accident, that is less than 50. If that is a real number, about half of all murders and about one quarter of gun suicides, then you get in different issues. Brady and VPC sometimes define child as under 24. I doubt Statistics Canada plays that same game and I don't think the French do either. Canada and France does not have the population that we do.
You have to make sure the definitions are the same.
It is always better to use the primary source. You are quoting what someone else said what the CDC reports without context.
Since France has a higher suicide rate than we do, and Canada has a slightly lower rate, I'm curious to see the rope death rates for each country.
France, Canada, and Japan does not have the same problem with wealth inequality or gangs that we do. While private gun ownership in Japan is almost non existent, private gun ownership in Canada and France is much higher than you think.


 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
71. baloney and we do NOT define children as under 12....
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:18 PM
Mar 2013

can a 12 yr old get married or join the military?

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
73. but I will defer to your constraint.....lets play another round shall we?
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:22 PM
Mar 2013

Between 2006 and 2010, 561 children age 12 and under were killed by firearms, according to the FBI's most recent Uniform Crime Reports. The numbers each year are consistent: 120 in 2006; 115 in 2007; 116 in 2008, 114 in 2009 and 96 in 2010. The FBI's count does not include gun-related child deaths that authorities have ruled accidental.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/24/guns-children_n_2359661.html

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
76. and more...
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:24 PM
Mar 2013

"In 2009, among 16 participating states in the National Violent Death Reporting System, over 86% of all firearm deaths of children 11 or younger took place in or around a home," Lowy says in an e-mail to USA TODAY.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/12/17/gun-control-children-newtown-school-schooting/1775469/

ThatPoetGuy

(1,747 posts)
80. Welcome to DU!
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:42 PM
Mar 2013

Please don't let the extremists drive you away. We need good people to counterbalance them.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
81. So now saying that we need better gun control is an extremist position?
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 03:06 PM
Mar 2013

apparently not as MOST Americans agree with that!

ThatPoetGuy

(1,747 posts)
82. Nope! I meant the opposite.
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 03:11 PM
Mar 2013

There was nothing sarcastic in my welcome. I'm glad to have another sensible voice penetrate the yawping.

We need better gun control is a moderate opinion, and a welcome one.

The OP belittled rape by comparing anger management classes to transvaginal ultrasounds. That's an extremist position.

The person you're arguing with -- well, he just said things about thirteen-year-olds that I won't even respond to. That's an extremist position.

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
83. I simply said that 13 year olds are
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 03:20 PM
Mar 2013

adolescents, not children as it is usually defined. Some states define child as under 14. A minor is under 18. VR seemed to be confusing child with minor, two different things.

ThatPoetGuy

(1,747 posts)
84. Uh huh.
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 03:28 PM
Mar 2013

I'm sorry, but you're free to edit what you wrote. As you wrote it, it's disgusting. You seem to understand that what you said isn't ok, which makes you think you meant something different. I certainly hope so.

ZombieHorde

(29,047 posts)
11. I don't think forcing a woman to be vaginally penetrated for a medical procedure
Fri Mar 8, 2013, 11:43 AM
Mar 2013

even comes close to forcing people to take a two hour class to purchase ammo.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
59. We already HAVE Gun control
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 12:34 AM
Mar 2013

do you know anyone who owns a surface to air missile?

See its gun nuts who cannot do mathmatics!

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
68. I first learned such things are legal at the post office
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:13 PM
Mar 2013

when I was eight years old. No one bought them, sold them, and most didn't know they were legal until the IRS (before the ATF was created) announced that you could pick up the registration forms at the local post office to register them and any previously unregistered NFA firearms (a short amnesty period after the Gun Control Act was passed).
IIRC, some people in my town misread the newspaper and brought their deer rifles to register them at the PO.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
75. state or federal law?
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 02:24 PM
Mar 2013

If we are talking federal, it would have been legal if he had the registration and tax stamp.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
87. and STILL that equates to regulation does it not??
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 05:21 PM
Mar 2013

either way my point still stands regardless...we ALREADY regulate guns!

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
88. I never said we didn't
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 05:30 PM
Mar 2013

It is usually the gun control advocates who claim we don't.
If your ex left any other unregistered NFA items laying around, please contact the nearest ATF office for them to come and get it from your home.
That said, that same shotgun would probably not have to be registered under Canadian law, only requiring the owner to have a Unrestricted PAL. I do think NFA needs to be reformed. A single shot rifle or shotgun with, for example, a 15 inch barrel shouldn't be regulated the same as a machine gun. That doesn't strike me as "common sense" gun control.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
89. Gun control advocates DO know that we do
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 06:09 PM
Mar 2013

It's mainly the "guns free for all crowd" that DOESN'T understand that....the fact that we ALREADY regulate and control...means we CAN expand upon that regulation and control.

They even had gun control issues when they wrote the constitution so.....it's far from anything new!

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
90. many seem not to,
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 06:14 PM
Mar 2013

or at least grasp the provisions of those laws. We had one a few years ago that actually thought the Gun Control Act regulated Wal Mart differently from Dicks Sporting Goods from a mom and pop gun store.

but I doubt the social good of expanding that control. There are limits to that expansion. Very few actually know the provisions of the various gun control laws.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
91. One guy does not a trend make
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 07:19 PM
Mar 2013

Yeah even those that support an all out free for all fail to grasp for sure!

Lets see...Children in this country are 14 TIMES as likely to be killed by guns...and YOU cannot see the "social good" in expanding those limits?????

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
92. she was pretty typical
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 07:28 PM
Mar 2013

you are the one that is rare. I prefer to deal with the root causes of those deaths esp when it comes to suicides and murders. If the suicides by gun simply become suicides by rope, nothing is gained. IIRC, the source the article cited was from the Brady Center which is kind of like someone on "my side" citing the NRA.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
93. Not so typical....those on the left are generally better read than many of those I know on the right
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 08:42 PM
Mar 2013

I am not so rare either when most Americans agree with my position....we DO need to strengthen gun control.

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
94. on most things, I'm most likely way to the left of you
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 08:57 PM
Mar 2013

and the President. I'm closer to Bernie Sanders. Gun politics are more regional or urban vs rural more than left vs right.
Out of the people I know, the "well read" folks are fairly evenly split.
The last poll I saw the specific questions, it pretty much supported the status quo (for example, one of the questions was should dealers be required to keep records of who purchases guns. Most people answered "yes", and has been federal law since 1938 and strengthened in 1968)

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
97. nope
Tue Mar 12, 2013, 12:10 AM
Mar 2013

If a dealer were to do that, he would lose his FFL and go to prison. The Gun Control Act says that they must report thefts and losses. Each manufacturer and importer keeps records of what is shipped, by individual serial numbers, to each wholesaler, and each wholesaler does the same to each dealer. These records must be kept indefinably. If the dealer goes out of business for any reason, those records are turned over to the ATF. Also, robbing a gun store, like banks, is a federal crime and has federal jurisdiction.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
99. Not to the ATF.....and there is so indefinite registry federally
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 02:50 AM
Mar 2013

As of July 2004, approved purchaser information is no longer kept for ninety days but is instead destroyed within twenty-four hours of the official NICS response to the dealer.13 As a result, ATF inspectors are no longer able to compare the information on file with the dealer to the information the dealer submitted to NICS. The Department of Justice Inspector General noted that the shortened retention time makes it much easier for corrupt firearm dealers to avoid detection.14 Federal law also specifically prohibits using NICS to create any system of registration of firearms or firearm owners.15

The FBI maintains indefinitely the records of prospective purchasers whose applications are denied.16
Sales Records: FFLs are required to maintain records of the acquisition and sale of firearms indefinitely.17 The dealer must record, “in bound form,” the purchase or other acquisition of a firearm not later than the close of the next business day following the purchase or acquisition.18 The dealer must similarly record the sale or other disposition of a firearm not later than seven days following the date of such transaction and retain Form 4473, the Firearms Transaction Record.19 When a firearms business is discontinued, these records are delivered to the successor or, if none exists, to the Attorney General.20

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
102. never said it was
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 09:04 AM
Mar 2013
As of July 2004, approved purchaser information is no longer kept for ninety days but is instead destroyed within twenty-four hours of the official NICS response to the dealer.13 As a result, ATF inspectors are no longer able to compare the information on file with the dealer to the information the dealer submitted to NICS. The Department of Justice Inspector General noted that the shortened retention time makes it much easier for corrupt firearm dealers to avoid detection.14 Federal law also specifically prohibits using NICS to create any system of registration of firearms or firearm owners.15
Not really true either. NICS is ran by the FBI. Each NICS transaction has a control number and the dealer writes the control number on the 4473. I doubt inspectors would take the time go through each transaction unless local police wanted to know about a specific person or firearm.

The FBI maintains indefinitely the records of prospective purchasers whose applications are denied.16
Sales Records: FFLs are required to maintain records of the acquisition and sale of firearms indefinitely.17 The dealer must record, “in bound form,” the purchase or other acquisition of a firearm not later than the close of the next business day following the purchase or acquisition.18 The dealer must similarly record the sale or other disposition of a firearm not later than seven days following the date of such transaction and retain Form 4473, the Firearms Transaction Record.19 When a firearms business is discontinued, these records are delivered to the successor or, if none exists, to the Attorney General.20
prior to that it was the Secretary of the Treasury because ATF moved from Treasury to Justice that year.
I never said there was a federal registry, and I certainly don't advocate one.
 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
96. And obviously that needs to be updated huh?
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 11:54 PM
Mar 2013

Since we agree that we have it....it means that it can be upgraded to reflect the times.

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
98. that was the first one
Tue Mar 12, 2013, 12:24 AM
Mar 2013

It was called the "Miller Act" aka "Mailing of Pistols Act" Since then
National Firearms Act of 1934
Federal Firearms Act of 1938
Gun Control Act of 1968
The Brady Bill that created NICS+

Your post tells me that you actually don't know what current gun laws are. Every gun owner I know are very well versed in the laws that affect them.

The truth is, even Joe Biden admits that gun laws do not curb crimes. There are few if any independent criminologists that seriously believe that gun bans affect crime rates simply because you are talking about two different populations. That could be that is why no gun control advocate can put together an argument that isn't full of logical fallacies and propaganda misinformation.

What gun laws are saying is that it is the hunter or target shooter's fault when two drug dealers or gangsters shoot it out. In short, the farmer in Montana is being scapegoated for some city's problem. That has a lot to do with the very understandable push back.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
100. There are No Guarantees...
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 02:54 AM
Mar 2013

and what you said about Joe Biden is incorrect and points out how wrong headed your position is...the actual quote is:
"Joe Biden: Gun Laws Won't 'Guarantee' End To Mass Shootings"

No one expects ANYTHING to prevent All crimes...BUT it sure seems in Australia that curbing guns curbed mass shootings didn't it?

By the way....we ALREADY have gun controls...we are advocating for MORE of them...and stricter enforcement of them as well.

Nobody is suggesting you cannot hunt for game. But you do not need a Sig Sauer to do that do you??



gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
101. no
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 08:55 AM
Mar 2013
and what you said about Joe Biden is incorrect and points out how wrong headed your position is...the actual quote is:
"Joe Biden: Gun Laws Won't 'Guarantee' End To Mass Shootings"
Actually no since a misremembered quote as proof of "wrong headedness" is grasping at straws.

No one expects ANYTHING to prevent All crimes...BUT it sure seems in Australia that curbing guns curbed mass shootings didn't it?
Here they combined a propaganda technique call "stacking the deck" and a the logical fallacy "post hoc ergo propter hoc". Card stacking because the lack of mass shootings before the 1980s. while there was one in 1976, the the rash of them in the 1980s started with seven killed in a battle between two biker gangs in 1984. Did the gun laws change that started them? Each state had its own laws and basically stricter than ours (although Tasmania's machine gun restrictions were laxer than NFA). To say that the law curbed or ended the spree shootings is post hoc ergo propter hoc.

By the way....we ALREADY have gun controls...we are advocating for MORE of them...and stricter enforcement of them as well.

Nobody is suggesting you cannot hunt for game. But you do not need a Sig Sauer to do that do you??
How is a Sig Sauer different than a Ruger? It is simply the name of the manufacturer. There is no dept of needs, so that's not a valid point.

By the way....we ALREADY have gun controls...we are advocating for MORE of them...and stricter enforcement of them as well.
I have always known that, while I am for stricter enforcement of current laws, I am apposed to more of them.
 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
104. "How is a Sig Sauer different than a Ruger?"
Wed Mar 13, 2013, 07:10 PM
Mar 2013

How is a Benz different than a Volvo?

talk about Ad Hominem!

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
13. pro-RKBA "logic": sitting in a classroom for two hours = an invasive probe inserted in a woman's
Fri Mar 8, 2013, 04:03 PM
Mar 2013

body in order for her to receive medical care she needs.

That has got to be one of the most offensive analogies I've ever seen posted down here, and given the pro-NRA right-wing tenor of the joint that's saying something.


Sig line nails it again:

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
16. You lot are no different from the fetus fetishists in thinking your particular infringement...
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 02:39 AM
Mar 2013

...of others' rights are 'reasonable' and 'common sense'. You disagree only on the subject of that infringement.

Like I said in the OP: different bugbear, same mindset...

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
17. You go right on doubling down on that offensive and frankly sexist comparison between a woman having
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 06:49 PM
Mar 2013

her body invaded in order to receive the medical care she needs and sitting in a classroom for two hours listening to someone talk about anger management so they can keep feeding bullets into their precious little popgun: that won't fly for long on a progressive discussion board, sport. But you keep at it.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
18. I've been pointing out the similarities between gun Prohibitionists and abortion foes for years:
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 07:36 PM
Mar 2013
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x478232

The Brady Campaign is using the techniques of the anti-abortion crowd


http://www.democraticunderground.com/117235299

Two peas in a pod: Abortion restrictionists and gun control advocates


http://www.democraticunderground.com/117235299#post25


26. 'True believers' of all sorts are more alike than different-not that they'll ever admit it...

It's hardly a new or original observation- it is the underlying thesis of Eric Hoffer's The True Believer: Thoughts On The Nature Of Mass Movements

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Believer

...The book analyzes and attempts to explain the motives of the various types of personalities that give rise to mass movements; why and how mass movements start, progress and end; and the similarities between them, whether religious, political, radical or reactionary. As examples, the book often refers to Communism, Fascism, National Socialism, Christianity, Protestantism, and Islam. Hoffer believes that mass movements are interchangeable, that adherents will often flip from one movement to another, and that the motivations for mass movements are interchangeable; that religious, nationalist and social movements, whether radical or reactionary, tend to attract the same type of followers, behave in the same way and use the same tactics, even when their stated goals or values differed.


If you don't being called on the similarities, quit acting like them. As long as you lot keep aping them,
I'll keep pointing it out.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
19. There are no "similarities" between an invasive procedure in a woman's body and some clownish
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:08 PM
Mar 2013

Bobo who likes to play with popguns being made to sit in a class for two hours to listen to someone talk about anger management. It's an offensive, sexist analogy, and the fact that you've got away with it for so long on DU - largely by flying under the radar down here in the Gungeon where such right-wing bilge is openly tolerated - doesn't make it any less offensive or sexist.

But you keep right on with it: such things tend to come around full circle in the end, as your pals "Jody" and "rDigital" could no doubt tell you.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
21. "Bobo who likes to play with popguns". Gotta get your culture war on, eh?
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:26 PM
Mar 2013

"right-wing bilge"? Oh yeah, I forgot that one of articles of faith amongst the gun Prohibitionists is that
"anyone who disagrees with us is a winger".

Tell ya what- Just for shits and giggles, why don't you dig up some non-gun related "right-wing bilge"
that I've posted?

While you're doing that, I'll be learning Linear B...

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
22. Whatever any of that collage of non-responsive gibberish means.
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:31 PM
Mar 2013


"While you're doing that, I'll be learning Linear B..."

Laughable stuff.
 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
25. It means: You don't get to decide what is progressive, and what isn't.
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:39 PM
Mar 2013

You're hardly the first self-appointed zampolit to blow in here, and undoubtedly you won't be the last.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
29. No, it doesn't: it's just a meaningless jumble of words, typed in order to deflect and obfuscate
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:43 PM
Mar 2013

Last edited Sat Mar 9, 2013, 10:47 PM - Edit history (3)

from your phony, offensive, and sexist comparison of an invasive, unnecessary procedure in a woman's body with the requirements that some "RKBA enthusiast" somewhere is going to have to sit in a two hour anger management class so he can continue to stockpile his parent's basement with crates of military-grade ammunition.

This act of yours is played out all over DU, and fools about no one.



Edit X 3: clarity & typo.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
43. Similar to your slanderous, idiotic .sig in that sense, then.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:00 AM
Mar 2013

Just with a different purpose: the post you referred to wasn't intended to troll for conflict.

You're not fooling anyone, either, sweetcheeks.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
49. As usual, you're dead wrong.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:09 AM
Mar 2013

You confuse "sad" with "utter contempt." Understand now? Good. Always happy to help. Feel free to hit me up for assistance with big words and challenging concepts too.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
54. I'd like to know if they find passing a driving test to be an equivalent invasive procedure
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:33 AM
Mar 2013

this Vaginal American wants to know!

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
24. Tell you what: why don't you put your money where you keyboard is and post an OP in GD
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:38 PM
Mar 2013

stating that you think an unnecessary invasive procedure in a woman's body is the exact same thing as requiring some trigger-happy Gump to sit in a class for two hours of anger management because he likes to stockpile ammunition for his PRD?

In other words, why don't you try that phony, sexist analogy between anti-choicers in the abortion debate and folks who believe that sensible gun legislation and regulation needs to come to America out up in General Discussion? Or in the feminists group?

Well, we know why, don't we?



Wait for it...wait for it...

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
27. Why don't *you* repost it in GD and complain about it?
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:43 PM
Mar 2013

I realize the management took away Meta and spoiled some of your fun, but you could give it a try.

Tell the world that "the rights apocalypsehow deem important are more important than others".

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
30. And Bingo! There it is: all we're gonna get now is excuses as to why you're NOT going to post
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:45 PM
Mar 2013

that offensive, sexist analogy up in GD or the feminists forum, just as I predicted above.

In other words, you don't have the courage of your convictions, knowing full well how such an OP would be received by the vast majority of DU.

Quod erat demonstrandum


apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
40. "Gun threads don't play well in GD" - Translation: "I'm unwilling to stand behind my convictions
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 12:50 AM
Mar 2013
publicly on DU in the larger forums."

Curious, that. But uniquely your credibility problem, not mine. Which why this thread is *Bookmarked* for future reference.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
20. And check this out, class: of the three links he provides "proving" he's been engaging in offensive,
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:16 PM
Mar 2013

sexist analogies "for years" - something he's obviously proud of - two are to the same thread and the other one is to a DU2 OP he authored in 2011. Further, all were posted in the Gungeon, not up in GD or any of the other big forums where the replier knows such offensive, sexist analogies and comparisons - invading a woman's body with an unnecessary invasive procedure in order to receive medical care she needs is the exact same thing as an anger management class for folks who like to stockpile ammunition - would receive a rather chillier reception than they do down here in this NRA-smitten joint.



Contemptible stuff.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
23. I ridicule those that try to evade Lawrence v. Texas and Olmstead v. L. C., as well
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:37 PM
Mar 2013

Funny thing, I'm sure that the homophobes and ableists think their principled stances are the
right and proper ones, too...

Response to friendly_iconoclast (Reply #23)

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
32. Get back with me when you're willing to stand behind your convictions and post an OP in GD
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:56 PM
Mar 2013

or the feminists group making the offensive analogy that says an invasive procedure compelled unnecessarily on a woman's body in order to get the medical care she needs is the exact same thing as some Bobo with a popgun being made to sit in a two hour anger management class because he wants to stockpile ammo in his parent's basement.

Until then, all the rest of this jazz is just meaningless huff n' puff.

Go ahead: Stand. Behind. Your. Stated. Convictions.


 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
37. And all *your* blather is meaningless unless you alert and/or claim a TOS violation.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 12:41 AM
Mar 2013

Feel free to do so- I've endured worse from better...

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
39. Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 12:47 AM
Mar 2013

Such episodes of shrinking from standing up for one's supposed beliefs as you have conceded to here hurts your credibility, not mine.

But, then, you are well aware that the vast majority of DU'ers don't care for NRA talking points and gun lobby "blather" in which you are well versed - as you are quite aware.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
44. You'll just have to get used to your demands being ignored.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:03 AM
Mar 2013

I also don't blame you for not going the alert route; it seems juries aren't exactly your friends:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=458790

You might want to reduce the bile just a bit...

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
48. Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions.
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:08 AM
Mar 2013

Such episodes of shrinking from standing up for one's supposed beliefs as you have conceded to here hurts your credibility, not mine.

But, then, you are well aware that the vast majority of DU'ers don't care for NRA talking points and gun lobby "blather" in which you are well versed - as you are quite aware.

Sorry: attempting to change the subject by posting some non-responsive silliness simply isn't gonna work.

 

guardian

(2,282 posts)
14. Why not anger mgmt classes to get your driver's license?
Fri Mar 8, 2013, 06:40 PM
Mar 2013

There are certainly more instances of 'road rage' than 'gun rage'. Or even better lets require anger management classes for gang members. I can see it now. Members of the Aryan Brotherhood, Mexican Mafia, Crips, and MS-13 sitting in a circle, holding hands, and doing destressing breathing exercises. Once they have their course completion certificate they can get their gang tats.


I nominate Sen. Audrey Gibson of Jacksonville for moron of the year award.

 

Jenoch

(7,720 posts)
15. Ammo is getting scarce.
Fri Mar 8, 2013, 06:44 PM
Mar 2013

This morning I lucked out and was able to buy several cases of ammo. On the way home I stopped at the gas station where a drop-dead gorgeous blonde was filling up her car at the next pump.

She looked at the ammo in the back of my SUV and said in a very sexy voice, "I'm a big believer in barter, big boy". "Would you be interested in trading sex for ammo?"

I thought a few seconds and asked, "what kinda ammo ya got?"
 

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)
31. she couldn't defend her own idea or explain how it would work
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 08:54 PM
Mar 2013

She couldn't handle Buckethead and Otto.
http://www.thebucketheadshow.com/player/?mid=22952921&station=TBHS-IP&program_id=buckethead.xml&program_name=podcast

That tells me that it wasn't really well thought out and not worth seriously discussing, let alone have a flame war over.

tularetom

(23,664 posts)
33. Seriously? Every fucking time you buy it?
Sat Mar 9, 2013, 09:21 PM
Mar 2013

That's the dumbest thing I've seen all day.

And totally impractical for that matter. There aren't enough anger management instructors in the world to accomplish it.

When do I actually need anger management? When I read that some moran dumb enough to come up with an idea like this actually got elected to office.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
56. No need to; I need only repost something about Zimmerman that I posted in January,
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 01:48 AM
Mar 2013

as it applies just as much to you as it did to the person to whom I responded:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=104730

You're both culture warriors- him 'protecting' the cul-de-sac against those sketchy brown people, you
'protecting' society from those sketchy gun nuts...


For that matter, so does a response further down that thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=104733

Don't flatter yourself- your sort has been seen before:




apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
107. What irritates me is the irrational panic. I was waiting to be helped to get some premium 20 gauge
Fri Mar 15, 2013, 03:11 PM
Mar 2013

shells when a guy ambles up to the counter and says "got anything in today?" or words to that effect. The counter guy tells him they'd just unloaded a case of .223 and the guy says "I'll take it all." This lead to an argument by another guy ahead of me in line that said he'd like a shot (no pun intended) at some of that caliber of ammo, and he was there first.

They sorted it out but when I got up there I asked the employee helping me about it, and he said the first guy comes in every single day and asks if they got anything "in," and will usually buy all of it if it is either (1) handgun ammunition, (2) ammunition in calibers that loads "assault weapons," i.e., .223, .308, 7.62, etc, or (3) .22 ammo. On that third the management of the joint had had to limit him because he'd literally buy every single brick of the stuff if they'd let him and no other customers would then be able to get any. But they didn't want to limit him on the other stuff because he'd been a customer there for decades (this is a mom 'n pop gun store, not a chain or Wal Mart).

And then he proceeded to tell me they didn't have the shells I was looking for, #3 buckshot, totally sold out. Never in my life have I been told a place was out of shotgun shells. Unreal.

In any event, my question is two-fold: #1. Where are all these gumps getting the money to literally buy gun shops out of ammo? That stuff isn't cheap, and the rank n' file of the "RKBA enthusiast" movement are usually poorly-educated folks with marginal employment potential/skills, the folks profiled in Thomas Frank's "What's the Matter with Kansas?" and #2. what in the world do these panic-buyers of ammunition think is going to happen in the future? The government's going to shut down Federal, Winchester, Hornady, and the like? Or nationalize them and turn them to military/LEO production only?

The irony is, this panic-buying by our "RKBA enthusiasts" - besides being idiotic and irrational - is only hurting genuine law-abiding gun owners who can't get varmint hunting or .22 plinking rounds, or even 20 gauge shotgun shells, for crying out loud, because they're in the grip of right-wing paranoia. It irritates the hell out of the rest of us legitimate gun owners who own them and use them, but haven't made a fetish out of a piece of metal and polymer like the NRA talking points brigade mentioned in my sig line have. What gives?

 

Eleanors38

(18,318 posts)
108. When you have calls for bans, ammunition limits, ammunition taxes,
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 12:46 PM
Mar 2013

Putting people on the, NICS turndown list because of certain mental problems (BBC had a story just this a.m.), anger management requirements, insurance requirements, and many others, both in legislative circles and right here, some folks might actually get the notion that bans and restrictions are forthcoming, esp. when these measures are given the pistscript: "and that's just a start."

You may have missed it, but I think a lot of those huge lines at gun shows was pushback. Big-time pushback. That and the rather sizeable demonstrations around the nation. I don't know what the stereotyped income level is for tens of millions of gun-owners is, but many are voting with their wallets, something politicians duly note. Further, I believe we will see a jump in gun-owner numbers, both real & %, that any survey will not be able to "model" away, although that is not a great concern with me.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
109. And as such a reaction is *irrational* - i.e., NOTHING I have proposed or advocated for
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 03:25 PM
Mar 2013

or suggested as sensible gun legislation, policy, or codes would affect hunters, sports shooters, or even the guy who likes to wander through the woods plinking around at any small game that moves or any stray soup can that doesn't all that much - you simply prove my point: the group of "enthusiasts" such legislation would affect are probably most in need of having their dubious little hobby more closely monitored and regulated by public policy.

The group my proposals would affect would be those who like to strut about town with a pistol perched in their pants; those who like to fantasize they're free-lance Special Ops agents and thus feel the (bogus) need to own/stockpile military-grade weaponry like the AR-15 all the while yearning and dreaming of a Red Dawn-style scenario unfolding around them; the stalker or abusive spouse or SO; the white supremacists longing for a return to the days of Jim Crow; the alienated loners with buried rage against a society they perceive as having done them "wrong" by not giving them the public attention they think is their due; that loner's philosophical twin, the Angry White Male suburbanite who wakes up every day determined to do everything he can to keep "them" out of his neighborhoods and the children of "them" out of his kid's schools (aka George Zimmerman); the homophobic religious right crowd that is praying for an apocalypse so they can go on shooting sprees against "sinners" and "degenerates" and everyone else who doesn't fit their fanatical definition of the holy and godly; and the seriously mentally ill who need help, not more firepower.**

That group is what makes up the bulk of our "RKBA enthusiasts," and it is their lobbying for almost non-existent and extremely weak gun laws in the United States coupled with mass support of the NRA that has directly led to such horrors as occurred at Sandy Hook, to Gabby Giffords, at Aurora, I could go on and on and on and on with the all-too-long list of massacres and shootings that have long plagued this country.

It is not "Big-time pushback": it is irrational, paranoid nuttery plain and simple to hoard ammunition, stockpile weapons, and flock to gun shows like groupies to a rock concert.

So in the end, your reply above only confirms the need for a nationwide law modeled on New York's SAFE Act, or just an out-and-out adoption of the Canadian/Australian/Western European model of gun regulation.

I know, I know: you're going to take a good chunk of your next reply to squawk about how "it's never gonna happen!!!!11" But oddly enough, for a group supposedly so confident that no progressive/liberal legislation on guns is going to pass, our "pro gun progressives"* sure do spend a good deal of time on this Democratic discussion board gnashing their teeth over even the possibilities of it. Which is very telling.

In any event, I answered in good faith a question you posed, and, like so many of your pals are wont to do, you merely used it as a platform to further pimp for NRA propaganda. It's good to be reminded that about all we got down here is one-note wonders among our "RKBA enthusiasts." And the tune sung is uniformly the one whistled by Wayne LaPierre and the rest of the right-wing gun lobby.


*( ; "Sic"; & etc. )

**(That's quite a crowd our "RKBA enthusiasts" roam around in the same ideological playpen with, ain't it my folks? See sig line.)

 

Eleanors38

(18,318 posts)
110. Yours is a hateful culture war, in which you have concocted an enemy
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 10:34 PM
Mar 2013

you despise and hate. I'll let stand your characterizations without comment; in fact, I invite the widest reading of your comments.

While your views are confirmation of your animosities and useful to an extent, could you in the future please condense your writing? Thanx.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
111. Wrong - my "war" is the age-old progressive, liberal struggle for enlightenment, civilization, and
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:01 PM
Mar 2013

what Martin Luther King Jr. called the "arc of history" that "bends toward justice," while yours is the agenda of the NRA, the gun lobby, and the reactionary right-wing.

My "war" is the war of the Freedom Marchers who helped liberate the Jim Crow South, and stood for equality; your "war" is the war of Richard Nixon's "southern strategy," re-packaged and re-cloaked in the phony, hateful NRA garb of "RKBA" and "pro gun" when what it really is is the same old racist blather based on fear of "the other."

My "war" is the war of JFK's New Frontier and LBJ's Great Society, always expanding rights and working to improve the "general welfare" of all of America's citizens; your "war" is George Wallace's "standing in the schoolhouse door," and Lester Maddox's handing out ax handles for "self defense" and "RKBA" against African Americans who wanted to patronize his restaurant (Maddox used the same bogus rhetoric of the modern NRA in his rants: no surprise there! )

But most of all, my "war" is the war of tens of millions of genuine progressives and liberals who share my mainstream beliefs on the need for sensible gun legislation and policy, the same majority that put President Obama in the White House TWICE, much to the anger and hatred of your NRA pals; your "war" is conducted in the same voice and with the same talking points as Wayne LaPierre, George Zimmerman, Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, Sarah Palin, and all the other gun lobby, pro-NRA shills & sycophants.

And here's the real kicker, sport: my side is winning; yours is losing. America is turning Blue. Better get used to it.

"could you in the future please condense your writing? Thanx"

If your attention span is that short and/or your reading abilities that strained by a thoughtful reply on DU, perhaps you should find another online diversion to amuse and entertain you. This one seems to be too much heavy lifting for the 'ole brain cells you got kicking around up there.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
120. Same "ol' truth and facts; same "ol' Gungeoneers fleeing the scene like vampires from a garlic grove
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 12:30 AM
Mar 2013

when they encounter said truth and facts. And extremely limited attention span problems to boot. Funny stuff, as always.

See 'yah.

oneshooter

(8,614 posts)
121. And according to many that post here...............
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 10:22 AM
Mar 2013

You are also a law abiding responsible gun owner, till you're not.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
112. And here we have the Pamela Geller branch of gun control advocacy in purest ray serene
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:07 PM
Mar 2013

Rabid culture war, spittle-flecked hate with only a tenuous relation to reality, and attempts at collective
guilt-tripping- you lot have learned well from your role model Pam and her merry band of bigots:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022504439

The strong-stomached can see on video the equivalent of what you've been reading here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022504439#post15

Like our pet bigots here, Pam doesn't suffer dissent well at all:

http://www.salon.com/2013/03/16/pam_geller_shouts_down_orly_taitz_at_cpac_panel/

Glad to see that the Teabaggers are also beset by self-appointed zampolits. Just like ours, they can't abide
any disagreement...

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
113. What you actually "have" is a genuine progressive talking truth to a gaggle of pro-NRA shills &
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:19 PM
Mar 2013

sycophants: that's what drives the rage, the defensiveness, the rank false analogies, the personal attacks, the dishonest debating tactics & techniques, the endless logical fallacies, and the sputtering regurgitation of Wayne LaPierre rants and NRA propaganda.

The vast majority of DU'ers agree with my position on sensible gun legislation, not yours; the vast majority of Democrats agree with the vast majority of DU'ers position regarding same; and the majority of Americans as a whole agree with us, not you, and not the tiny coterie of "pro gun progressives"* who routinely spew NRA talking points all over this discussion board.

The future is with our side, not yours: America is turning Blue. Better get used to it.


*( )

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
114. Same backbeat as Pam G., just a different subject- "All *those* people are alike, and I'm merely...
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:28 PM
Mar 2013

...trying to help the Real Americans, who agree with meee..."

And if you think I'm down with the NRA- well, you're either too lazy to search my posts or resistant
to factual information that doesn't jibe with your schtick.

Which is it?

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
115. What you actually "have" is a genuine progressive talking truth to a gaggle of pro-NRA shills &
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:34 PM
Mar 2013

sycophants: that's what drives the rage, the defensiveness, the rank false analogies, the personal attacks, the dishonest debating tactics & techniques, the endless logical fallacies, and the sputtering regurgitation of Wayne LaPierre rants and NRA propaganda.

The vast majority of DU'ers agree with my position on sensible gun legislation, not yours; the vast majority of Democrats agree with the vast majority of DU'ers position regarding same; and the majority of Americans as a whole agree with us, not you, and not the tiny coterie of "pro gun progressives"* who routinely spew NRA talking points all over this discussion board.

The future is with our side, not yours: America is turning Blue. Better get used to it.


*( )

Since the replier obvious didn't read it the first go round: another crack at it. I'm generous like that.

Read slower, friendly! Or better, friendly! Or both!

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
116. Hey, and BTW: have you worked up the gumption to actually stand behind your convictions PUBLICLY
Sat Mar 16, 2013, 11:41 PM
Mar 2013

on DU, yet?

Get back with me when you're willing to stand behind your convictions and post an OP in GD

or the feminists group making the offensive analogy that says an invasive procedure compelled unnecessarily on a woman's body in order to get the medical care she needs is the exact same thing as some Bobo with a popgun being made to sit in a two hour anger management class because he wants to stockpile ammo in his parent's basement.

Until then, all the rest of this jazz is just meaningless huff n' puff.

Go ahead: Stand. Behind. Your. Stated. Convictions.


Link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172113546#post32

How about it?

Or is it a matter of...

Inquiring minds want to know!

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
117. Why? This was a thread about gun politics, and still is.
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 12:18 AM
Mar 2013

Double-dog daring me to post where you'd like me to is rather middle school.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
119. So, the answer is "NO" - you have not yet worked up the courage of your convictions
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 12:26 AM
Mar 2013

to a sufficient level to post a pro-NRA talking point in General Discussion or the Feminists forum equating a male gun owner sitting in a two hour anger management class with a woman being vaginally probed against her will in order to get the health care she needs.

Scarcely surprised, as you already know the (justified) anger such a ridiculous analogy would stir in the actual progressive and liberal parts of DU, as opposed to this right-wing pro-NRA talking points pit you and your pro-NRA pals have going on down here.

Looks like I was correct above: you're

Laughable stuff.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
122. I understand where you're coming from- you are upset because you fear defeat...
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 03:22 PM
Mar 2013

despite all the shouting, waving and insults.


Think about it for a minute- you lot now have your own patch at DU, where you can discuss to your little hearts' content
without hearing a dissenting word:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1262

(which sees much less traffic than GC&RKBA does, despite the claimed popularity of your views)

So why bother to come here to root out heresy....err, 'counter NRA talking points', if us low types
are headed for the dustheap of history as you claim?

Because for all the brave talk, you lot know deep inside things aren't going your way

The Federal assault weapon ban isn't going to happen. NO state that now allows its citizens to
carry concealed weapons is going to rescind that- even the deepest blue ones- and the one remaining
that doesn't allow it will be doing so this year.

I'd much rather be on the proper (and winning) side of history than have the good opinion of people like you.

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
123. So the answer is *still* "NO": you haven't yet worked up the courage of your convictions to post
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 04:02 PM
Mar 2013

a pro-NRA talking point in General Discussion or the Feminists forum equating a male gun owner sitting in a two hour anger management class with a woman being vaginally probed against her will in order to get the health care she needs.

As that phony, offensive claim (that you have posted down here in the Gungeon repeatedly) would be seen as the sexist, misogynistic, pro-gun lobby crap it is and likely be hidden, you have not yet worked up the bravado to stand behind your own stated convictions. That's all I or anyone else examining the matter "sees," and you well know it.






Textbook stuff.

 

friendly_iconoclast

(15,333 posts)
124. Still resorting to the same old "pro-NRA" untruths, eh?
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 05:05 PM
Mar 2013
http://www.democraticunderground.com/126268

Leahy sponsors bill to outlaw straw purchasing and gun trafficking


http://www.democraticunderground.com/126268#post10

Good. I'd like to see this become law


Just keep playing that tune- those that like hearing it will continue to like it

apocalypsehow

(12,751 posts)
125. Hey, it doesn't bother me that you are unwilling to stand behind your own stated convictions.
Sun Mar 17, 2013, 05:24 PM
Mar 2013

But nice ploy at continuing to try to change the subject and evade the issue of your unwillingness to post your offensive pro-NRA talking points regarding this matter up in GD or over in the Feminists forum.

petronius

(26,608 posts)
42. Sounds like it's intended solely to make a right/liberty more expensive, inconvenient,
Sun Mar 10, 2013, 12:56 AM
Mar 2013

difficult, and/or time consuming - with no redeeming societal or personal benefit. I'll always oppose that sort of transparent obstructionism and interference...

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