Worst Statistic Ever

[ProfessorGAC]

So, i'm watching Ken Burns' Baseball.

And there's all that about Dimaggio's 56 game heating streak.

Well, while he did that he hit 56 singles, 5 triples, 16 doubles and 15 home runs.

While he was doing that, Williams hit 54 singles, 22 doubles, 5 triples and 19 home runs, in 10 fewer at bats.

So, over that 56 games, Williams had 2 0-fers. But, he had 6 more hits in 20 fewer at bats.

One hit a little under 400. The other one hit nearly 420.

If that streak was by a guy from the St Louis Cardinals or Browns, or the Tigers, or the Indians, or the White Sox or Cubs, nobody would give a shit.

This "record" is about the fact that he played with the Yankees and nothing but. During that streak, he wasn't even the best hitter in the game.

Same with Rose and his useless 44 game hitting streak, but even worse. There were 5 guys who hit better over Rose's streak.

Batting average (by definition) is the marker of consistency. Long hitting streaks are luck. They always have been and always will be.

[KamaAina]

1. Take a chill pill, dude. There was no ESPN back then.

Also, DiMag was robbed of a hit late in Game 57 by Cleveland's third baseman. There's no telling how far he could have taken it from there.

[ProfessorGAC]

2. What Does No ESPN Have To Do With It?

Happy New Year, by the way.

I'm saying the stat wouldn't be close to legendary if he wasn't a Yankee, and that it has no real value anyway. ESPN, in today's climate, would make a hitting streak even more overvalued.

[KamaAina]

5. ESPN is the home of East Coast bias

So you're telling me it existed before then?

[ProfessorGAC]

7. Yes! That's What I'm Saying!

NYC has always considered itself the center of the universe. You know that too!

[Auggie]

3. I look at streaks as individual achievements

They don't win games like stolen bases, BBs, RBIs and situational at-bats/productive outs (for which I believe no stat exists). Perhaps I'd call a hitting streak a worthless stat because you can't really tie them into victories.

It's expected the New York media is going to blow anything New York related out of proportion. I always thought that if Omar Vizquel played career shortstop for the Yankees he'd be a revered as Jeter.

[ProfessorGAC]

4. Thanks Auggie

Sort of my point. And, Happy New Year.

[Iggo]

6. He'd be revered INSTEAD of Jeter.

[wilt the stilt]

9. omar was a great fielder

his batting average was .265. get a grip.

[Auggie]

18. Jeter's may have been .265 with other teams too

[wilt the stilt]

24. what are you talking about

Vizquel was mediocre hitter. Jeter was a superb hitter. This is about as stupid of an argument i have ever heard.

[Auggie]

34. You're making a comparison that is not relevant to my comment

I said Vizquel would be as revered as Jeter had he played for the Yankees. I never said Vizquel had a better average.

Your "stupid" comment would have merit had the discussion been hitting.

[wilt the stilt]

37. Your comment said he might have hit .265 with other teams

How in any way is that relevant. It is a comment that had no relevancy at all. Your premise is that if Vizquel would have been glorified if he was in NYC. He wasn't and his lifetime average would never been glorified. He was a very mediocre hitter. great fielder. why even bring him up with an irrelevant premise. NYC is very tough on their players.

[Yavin4]

8. To get a hit in 56 games straight takes more than luck.

It's impressive and unlikely to be broken.

[wilt the stilt]

10. sorry professor

Joe D was a great player, way better fielder and a better clutch hitter. read Halberstam's book "Summer of 49'. My Dad was a terrific baseball player and played in service baseball during WW2 entertaining the troops. He had a great understanding of baseball. For a power hitter no one struck out less than Dimaggio. He only struck out 361 times in his career. An almost 1 to 1 ratio. For Williams he struck out 800 times to hit 521 homers. Williams was a mediocre fielder and a mediocre baserunner while Joe D excelled in both those facets.

[ProfessorGAC]

12. Never Said Otherwise

What does that have to do with a hitting streak being overvalued because a guy played for the Yankees?

[hughee99]

11. The worst statistic in baseball is fielding percentage.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/order/true

Of the top 20 players at 1b this year (for example) with the highest fielding percentage, only TWO of them finished with a DWAR (defensive wins over replacement) in the positive.

[ProfessorGAC]

13. I Buy That, Hughee

The problem with that stat is it doesn't measure range. Believe me, i saw Bowa playing for the Cubs. Sure handed and threw accurately, but he didn't get to balls my mom could have gotten to!

[wilt the stilt]

14. Lke I said my dad who was in NYC at the time and saw Joe play many times

He was an exceptional fielder. He said of Dimaggio."He was the most graceful fielder, got a great jump on the ball and caught everything in stride. Ask Willie Mays who said "I copied Joe D""

[ProfessorGAC]

15. Still Not Getting It

I never said DiMaggio wasn't a superb baseball player. I just think that getting fewer hits, fewer extra base hits, fewer RBI, a lower OPS over the exact same time period as another guy who failed to get a hit in 3(!) of those 56 games is evidence that the streak is an overrated statistic. Completely valueless, just like i agree with the poster above who said such about fielding percentage.

Not sure how you got that i didn't think Joe D was a great player. I'm talking about a specific set of 56 games.

Let me ask it this way. Pretend that over that same 56 games, Joe had 1 more hit in one game, then only had a 28 and 27 game hitting streaks separated by one game where he went o-fer. Would his performance been lesser? IMO, no. He still hit nearly 400, still got lots of RBI, still scored bunches of runs. Hence, the one game where he hit one single to keep the streak going was irrelevant.

And i still believe had he done the exact same thing with the St. Louis Browns, nobody would care about it today.

[wilt the stilt]

16. he was stopped for one game and

then went on another 15 game hitting streak. That was 72 out of 73 games. What it highlights is handling pressure. Dimaggio was a better pressure player than Williams and handling pressure is the most important part of sports.

My friend is part owner of a very important test taken by every NFL player at the combine. www.therightprofile.com or www.athletetypes.com
if the right profile doesn't come up then the website is being redone This is the test that Belechik used take Tom Brady and Polian used to take Manning. It measures the intangibles in an athlete. Things like how they handle pressure and how competitive they are. Andrew Luck and Russell Wilson scored very high. I took the test and scored pretty well.
The Kc Royals use it as does the Spurs. The teams that use it win at a better than 60% clip vs.people who on't use it win at 40% The height of meaningless statistics is Wade Boggs

you make the argument of meaningless statistics but you don't measure how one handles pressure and handling a hitting streak is handling pressure.

[ProfessorGAC]

17. Therein Lies Our Disagreement

I don't concur that the hitting streak is any more pressure than any other clutch situation. Since one guy, on a team (discounting their own batting averages) had a lower team average, and then got more extra base hits and more RBI over the same time frame, it's IMO, silly to say one guy handled pressure better than the other.

And, on that note, on the last day of the season when Williams was hitting .3996 he played the double header anyway and ended up at .406. That's not pressure?

[wilt the stilt]

22. No I don't think you get it.

you don't seem to understand pressure and handling pressure. Williams was never able to handle pressure. By dissing the 56 game accomplishment you are dissing a rare feat. Hitting streaks were always considered a great accomplishment in baseball history. Dimaggio dealt with it and Williams by and large sucked when it counted.
Take a look at Williams record in clutch situations. It is not very good. Now look at Dimaggio's and it was great.

Look at those websites I sent you. It is all about handling pressure. the true measure of a great player.

[ProfessorGAC]

33. I Did Look At Them

Lots of nothing. You don't know what you think you do. Not trying to be an ass with a pal, but you're the one not getting it. You're not even trying. At least i tried.

[wilt the stilt]

36. I just don't think you understand pressure

Hitting streaks have always had pressure. You give one example of William's hitting .406. Look at his record in important pennant determining games. It wasn't very good. You are most certainly dissing one of Dimaggio's key accomplishments.

[wilt the stilt]

23. bullshit

if you know baseball Wee Willie keeler was known for his hitting streak and was Pete Rose who was not in NYC. a 56 game hitting streak would always be recognized. You are showing your lack of knowledge of baseball history. That is like saying no one know 4191 because Cobb was in Detroit.

Furthermore, by the time Bowa was in Chicago he didn't have range but that could not be said when he was in Philly. Furthermore, there is an argument on what is more important. Making the play or having range. All through the sixties SS was a fielding position. You would sacrifice hitting for someone catching the ball. The SS is considered the best fielder on the team. The reality is you can bobble the ball at third and at second and still get the out. One bobble at short and the runner is safe. You get almost 2 and 1/2 times more plays than anyone else in the field. Bowa might have not had range but he never misplayed the ball.

[ProfessorGAC]

32. Wrong

I saw what i saw. All your stuff was based upon what your dad saw. i was watching too. You're just wrong Wilt.

[wilt the stilt]

35. I saw it also

you probably think aaron was better than Mays

[joeybee12]

19. Well, he might be the worst person to play the game

Probably not, but he really was a teabagging idiot.

[ProfessorGAC]

20. I'm With Ya Joey

As a person, not so much.

[joeybee12]

21. He would have gotten hammered in this day and age...

With media covering everything he said and did...you really had no clue what he was like when he was alive...the saturation of media didn't exist back then.

[wilt the stilt]

26. the saturation of media certainly did exist in NY.

We are talking about 7 newspapers and baseball was everything in sports. The NFL and NBA did not exist. If it wasn't such a big deal then why was it so important to break the color barrier in baseball. It shocked the nation. history boys read some history it will do you some good.

[joeybee12]

27. Compared to today? Seriously, you're comparing what's out there now

to 50 years ago?????

[wilt the stilt]

29. In NYC it was all baseball all the time

It was the only sport that existed. Do we see any movie reels of the NFL players who went to war Do we see any news when a "negro" played in the NFL. When Robinson broke the color barrier it was pretty unbelievable.

The media crush was unbelievable and remember there were 3 teams in NYC. Just look at the affect of breaking he color barrier had on the country. It was every bit as big as MLK and I argue it was bigger It was the defining moment in racial history in the U.S. Read some history.

[joeybee12]

30. There wasn't the intrusive media like there is now...

Noting every comment every bad word...they covered him as a baseball player, nothing else.

[wilt the stilt]

31. really breaking the color barrier

was noted everywhere and on every broadcast and every newspaper and every magazine. An entire race was moved by it and the entire nation was consumed by it. name a single event in sports or maybe in history of the nation that equaled breaking the color barrier.

[wilt the stilt]

25. i don't measure

a player by his political beliefs but by his accomplishments. Brady is probably pretty right wing. He is a great football player an in sports that is all that counts.

[joeybee12]

28. People are assuming that of Brady...

I doubt he's as right wing as the haters want you to believe, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's a Repuke.