Awed by the Heavens

[edhopper]

This is a color photo taken today from the surface of another planet.

[img][/img]

Anyone who think that atheist don't get the awe and majesty people feel from their religion or in Church. They don't understand how those of us who love science feel when we see something like this.

[cbayer]

1. Stunning.

Awe and majesty are certainly not just a religious experiences.

[edhopper]

4. Not in this forum

but I have seen it said that atheist don't get religion because they don't understand the religious experience, the epiphany of being "touched by the Lord" and such. Actually told that is evidence of the divine.
I have always countered that those exact feelings can be brought about things like science and art to many of us.
This is one such moment for me. And I have no doubt it is every bit as profound as an experience in a religious service.

[cbayer]

5. I've heard that as well.

It's the "you just don't know what you are missing (both figuratively and literally)" argument.

I live in a place where I am consistently in awe and it has nothing at all to do with religion.

[edhopper]

7. Glad you agree

I think those who feel that way and always need it to be about God and such limit themselves from some amazing experiences.

[marasinghe]

27. and drugs. ;) thanks for the OP & photo, dude. really cool.

[mike_c]

2. there is a video, I think one of the Sagan Series vids...

...that ends with a very brief time lapse sequence of a sunset. I once spent a large part of an afternoon watching that sunset over and over. It's the sun setting as seen from the surface of Mars, shot by one of the previous rovers. It moves me just thinking about it. We can watch the sun set on the surface of another planet. What an amazing thing.

[MineralMan]

3. Awe is not limited to the religious.

Not by any means. There is much to be in awe of. The more you understand about the world, the more in awe you become. My awe increases daily.

I am an atheist.

[MineralMan]

6. One afternoon when I lived in California,

My wife and I went out to a cliff overlooking the ocean to watch the sunset. We arrived not long before sunset and sat in the grass. As the sun got lower in the sky, I noticed a couple of things. Half a dozen ground squirrels and a doe and two fawns had joined us near the edge of that cliff, not far from where we sat. We all watched the sun drop below the horizon. Then, the deer left, the squirrels returned to their burrows and we went home.

Awe is not limited to humans, either.

[edhopper]

8. Watching sunsets on vacation

is one of our favorite pastimes.

[onager]

11. My favorite sunsets....

(But NOT my picture - shamelessly stolen.)

Sunset over Miami, but not the one you're probably thinking of - this is the Miami District of Alexandria, Egypt. For nearly 4 years, I lived just a few blocks up the street from where this picture was taken.

Never got tired of those sunsets.

Off to the left (west), you can just see the skyline of modern Alexandria. Where I'd go on weekends, walking with the Non-Woo Ghosts...

i.e., the memories of very real people who had lived in that city - Alexander The Great; all those murderous Ptolemies and especally the last one, Cleopatra VII; Julius Caesar, who nearly ended his career/life in Alexandria by drowning in a battle behind the Pharos Lighthouse; Marc Antony, who committed suicide not far from the Pharos; the murderous Xian thug Athanasius and his rival Arias, as in "Arian Heresy;" speaking of Xians, the violated and slaughtered Hypatia; and a little later, Napoleon Bonaparte, who met a baffling enemy in Alexandria - veiled Muslim women heaving rocks and insults at his soldiers.

To sort of stay on-topic with science - Alexandria is where Erastothenes not only proved the Earth was round, but calculated its circumference to within 50 miles, according to some experts. He did that with 2 sticks and some basic math...in the Third Century BCE.

[edhopper]

14. Thanks for retelling the story of Erastothenes

puts a big crimp in the whole "people thought the world was flat" myth.

[Fortinbras Armstrong]

16. Dante knew the world was round

Otherwise the last canto of the Inferno and the first canto of the Purgatorio in the Divine Comedy (written circa 1325) would make no sense. Dante and Virgil are climbing up from Hell, passing through the center of the earth, and arriving at Mount Purgatory, which is explicitly stated as being on the opposite side of the world from Jerusalem.

[Scootaloo]

9. And it's more powerful because it's REAL.

Reminds me of an interview with Richard Feynman, where he's talking about the electromagnetic spectrum, and how it's all around us, constantly

"And it's all REALLY THERE! That's what gets you. ... But you gotta stop and think about it … to really get the pleasure about the complexity; the inconceivable nature of nature."

[edhopper]

10. There is no atomic red

Red does not exist at an atomic level. It is the interaction of the atoms of a substance with the photons that reflect or emit from them with our eyes and brain that make red. (a bit simplistic, but you get my point)
Just as l see the feeling of awe as a reaction within ourselves. Not intrinsic to the stimuli.
I look at consciousness that way. It is not some outside force that takes up residency in our minds, it is the integration of a biology and processes that end up with our self awareness.
I find the question of where consciousness comes from, outside of neuroscience, to be pointless.

[Leontius]

25. A reaction within ourselves ?

By that do you mean electrical and chemical reactions to stimuli? Self awareness of what?

[edhopper]

26. Yes

as opposed to being filled by the Holy Spirit, as some believers would say.
Cartesian "we are" awareness. Or however you wish to define consciousness.

[Leontius]

28. So the sum total of "we are" is just reaction to stimuli, is that "self' in your opinion?

[edhopper]

29. Sorry

don't really want to get into THAT discussion.

[Leontius]

30. No problem

You just seemed to be saying two different things in your posts and I was just asking for clarity. It was as if you were saying all we are is what science says we are but then again we are something beyond what the science says. Both statement seem to contradict each other.

[edhopper]

32. Sorry for the confusing.

I am saying we are what science says we are. Of course science has not answered all the questions, but it can.

[humblebum]

12. For some reason you seem to think that believers are not just as awed by

the accomplishments and beauty of scientific endeavors, simply for the sake of the raw beauty and the scientific accomplishment itself, as you are.

I have little doubt that there is a Creator, but that does not diminish my appreciation and wonder of events like this. It would be very difficult for any human being regardless of their spiritual orientation to not be drawn to this.

I have always been disappointed that putting humans on Mars is taking so long and that more effort has not been put behind such a goal. There is so much to gain. Exploring space is far more constructive and the rewards are far greater than any gains of being constantly involved in wars.

[edhopper]

15. Read my post #4

and cbayer's reply. Never said all, but there are definitely many out there who feel this way.
And explicitly said not on this forum. So what are you protesting?

[humblebum]

18. That's all and well and I do agree with the essence of your post #4, however

that is not a totally accurate representation of why all believers believe as they do.

However, scientific discoveries can be enjoyed for their own sake by anyone regardless religious belief or lack of it.

[edhopper]

20. Where did I say

ALL believers? You are arguing against something I did not say.

[humblebum]

23. OK. Have a good day. nt

[Dorian Gray]

13. I think it's pretty awe inspiring

for anybody who sees it. It's amazing.

[Fortinbras Armstrong]

17. Probably the most awe-inspiring thing I have ever seen is the Green Flash

Sometimes, when the sun is setting on a flat horizon, such as a calm ocean, and the atmospheric conditions are exactly right, just after the sun sets, you can see a bright green flash. My wife and I were on a beach in Marin County, California with a group of people, watching the sun set over the Pacific, and we saw it. We all applauded it.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_flash for a write-up. There are a couple of videos on YouTube, but none of them really show it well.

I was awed by the photograph of the earth taken from the surface of the moon. And I am also awed by astronomical photographs such as

or



I am awed by other things as well. Right now, I am listening to the third movement of Mozart's Piano Concerto 22 In E Flat, K 482, which is true beauty.

[rrneck]

19. That image might be considered

an example of one of humanities most basic expressions of faith - a desire to see what's over the next hill.

[edhopper]

21. That sounds like the oposite of faith.

The quest for knowledge. To find new things and to find what is real.

[rrneck]

22. How about the quest for survival?

Last edited Wed Aug 8, 2012, 07:44 PM - Edit history (1)

Mobility has been a large part, and perhaps the most important part, of the success of our species. And you have to believe there's something over that hill that will ensure one's survival rather than endanger it.

[edhopper]

24. Hmmm?

Yes, a more interesting supposition.

[Odin2005]

31. "We began as wanderers, we are wanderers still" -Carl Sagan