Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 06:17 PM Aug 2012

4 Reasons Atheists Have to Fight for Their Rights

From Alternet:

"You atheists are just taking on the mantle of victimhood. There are laws protecting you -- especially the First Amendment. Therefore, you're not really discriminated against. And it's ridiculous for you to claim that you are."

Atheist activists get this one a lot. When we speak out about ways that anti-atheist bigotry plays out, we're told that we're not really oppressed. We're told that, because we have legal protection, because anti-atheist discrimination is illegal, therefore we don't really have any problems, and we're just trying to gain unearned sympathy and win the victim Olympics. (I'd love to hear Bob Costas do the commentary for that!) It's a classic Catch-22: If we speak out about oppression and point to examples of it, we're accused of "playing the victim card," and the oppression becomes invisible. And if we don't speak out about oppression ... then the oppression once again becomes invisible.

...

Not everyone is able to fight these fights. Not everyone is able to risk hateful ostracism and violent threats from their community. It's hard enough for a 16-year-old high school student like Jessica Ahlquist to face down this kind of venomous hostility. It's even harder when you're trying to hold down a job and support your family, and you literally can't afford to alienate your bosses and co-workers and customers. Yes, the law is mostly on our side, and atheists and church-state separation advocates generally win these lawsuits. (Although not always -- more on that in a tic.) But it doesn't do much good to have the law on your side if fighting a legal battle is going to destroy your life.

...

If you were mugged, nobody would tell you, "Quit whining -- there are laws against mugging, you have legal protection, you don't have anything to complain about." The fact that there are laws against mugging did not stop you from getting mugged. It is reasonable for you to say something about it, and to express distress that it happened. And if muggings are happening a lot in your town or your country, it is reasonable to ask your community to pay attention, and to do something about it.


Lots of very interesting specific examples are given in the article.
7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies

dimbear

(6,271 posts)
1. Thanks, Trotsky. Interesting summary. There's a brighter day ahead, when John Lennon's dream
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 06:33 PM
Aug 2012

is realized and mankind walks out into the sunshine.

Imagine.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
4. If you follow the link to the FFRF page listing their recent successes...
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 08:28 PM
Aug 2012

it gets to be depressing just HOW MUCH of this crap there is out there. And we're the nasty militant atheists for bringing it up. If only we let the Christians have their way. What's the harm? Hell, there are some on DU who insist this is indeed a Christian Nation.

Funny how all of them would change their tune if anyone else's religion was the majority.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
6. You got that right.
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 09:06 PM
Aug 2012

Strange how some people think it's silly for us to be worried about stuff like this.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
7. Even benign religious people should be deeply worried. This is what the Founders wanted to avoid.
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 09:20 PM
Aug 2012

These guys are re-writing history as we speak. At this rate with privatization and the forced confornmity of corporation psychology, such as shown by people working at Koch brothers' firms, this is more like the Middle Ages or before, than even the 1930's.

And anyone who has read the writings of Mussolini, knows that the zealotry he imposed was religious. While I reject the 'I'm so fucking smart because I'm into science and I'm an atheist, and anyone who disagrees with me is just stupid' routine some push, the history of religion, with the suppression of free thinking and cruelty under religion is unmatched. Not just the religions we are familiar with, either.

It gave the Europeans, they thought, the right to kill peacefuli natives here, was a cover-up for atrocity, all of that. How much better would our world and our environment be if not compressed into narrow trains of belief and thinking?

We can't afford the luxury of such a destructive, egotistical path anymore.

Period.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
3. Freedom of thinking is what they want to suppress. Thought crime = You must believe like I do!
Thu Aug 9, 2012, 07:52 PM
Aug 2012

Or else what, I ask? Will the world stop turning on its axis in the direction you believe it should, or the fact I'm not going to help your mental masturbation to make you happy mean that I am the enemy now? Get a grip, please, don't try to drag me into your fantasy world. I'd probably break all the china there.

That is an oppressive system, a complete denial of individuality. Too many jump to assumptions about what others think or feel, when they can never really know, or tell them what they should think and try to impose their own brand of bullshit.

People are alive, and life is about change. Anyone can change their minds, should never be forced to make false allegiance to what they do not believe. I think we had a good article in GD a while back about atheist chaplains in the service. They explained the ]terrible trespass on the minds of the non-believer to be dforced to pretend they believed things that they did not, they wanted them to live a lie to please others.

The chaplaining plan was to give atheists protection, as they needed support. In the death of Tillman in Afghanistan it was tossed in that he wasn't part of the club.



Pat Tillman, Christian Supremacism in the Military, and Atheists as Worm Food

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It came as a shock. Halfway through a day of testimony about the Army's mishandling of the death of Pat Tillman, Tillman's mother, Mary, shared her outrage at remarks from one Army investigator that Tillman's family found highly insulting.

MARY TILLMAN, MOTHER OF PAT TILLMAN: He said that we were -- we would never be satisfied, because we're not Christians, and we're just a pain in the a**, basically. He also said that it must make us feel terrible that Pat is worm dirt.


http://atheism.about.com/b/2007/04/26/using-the-military-to-promote-religion-christian-supremacism.htm

So, because he and his family exercised their human right to freedom of thought, they get no respect? Only if he'd agreed with the majority or the powerful, was his life worthwhile? Thought police?

Nobody gets to tell me what I do and do not believe, what is best for me in my time on this planet. Even if a person is forced to convert or make an outward show of compliance by their messed up society, they will find a way to express themselves, but it should never be this way anywhere.

Screw 'em. JMHO.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Religion»4 Reasons Atheists Have t...