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Aerows

(39,961 posts)
Sun Mar 4, 2012, 07:43 PM Mar 2012

Here are my thoughts

If I choose to follow Christianity, I am compelled to follow only the books of Christ in the New Testament.


Paul is clearly wrong and had done more detriment to the faith of Christianity than anyone - that is my belief. Let me back this up, before I get sent into the posting hell.

Paul is divisive. He despises women speaking in church, despises homosexuals, he despises marriage unless it is by the church. You have to understand that people couldn't get married easily except by common churches.


I could follow Christ. But I can't follow anything Paul wrote. Now which religion is this so I can be a Christian again. They don't hate women, homosexuals, or people of different racial or theological ideals. I want to follow Christianity that has nothing to do with Paul's misogyny and Paul, whom was not a follower of Christ, but a follower of his own ego, minimized.

Is there a religion that follows the four books of Christ, and not the rest of them? Paul destroyed Christianity in my opinion - note - it's my opinion, and I'm not inviting the desecration of them, just true discussion.

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Here are my thoughts (Original Post) Aerows Mar 2012 OP
I don't know how to answer your question xmas74 Mar 2012 #1
Paul was a first-century rabbinic Jew... regnaD kciN Mar 2012 #2
RE: Paul's authorship deutsey Nov 2012 #4
It's not obvious to me that my primary focus should be in the Gospel accounts of Jesus' ministry. Reno Master Jan 2013 #5
Hey - DryHump Nov 2012 #3

xmas74

(29,674 posts)
1. I don't know how to answer your question
Wed Mar 7, 2012, 09:52 PM
Mar 2012

but I'm sure there is something out there for you.

You just have to keep looking.

regnaD kciN

(26,044 posts)
2. Paul was a first-century rabbinic Jew...
Thu Mar 8, 2012, 06:29 AM
Mar 2012

...with all the baggage that world-view entails. Actually, he was rather progressive for someone coming from such a background. Of course, nowadays, he seems extremely reactionary, but so would the vast majority of people from that time or place, if they happened to write down their thoughts and we could read them today.

(And, by the way, your statement that "people couldn't get married easily except by common churches" is completely incorrect. Marriage, at the time, was a civil contract, although Christians could follow it up with a church blessing if they desired. It didn't become required to be married in a church ceremony until later in the medieval period, long after Christianity had become the official religion of the Roman empire and, later on, all of Europe. For what it's worth, the requirement for a church wedding in those days was for record-keeping and enforcement purposes, to prevent men from traveling from town to town and marrying a new wife in each town.)

Now, having said all this, what can I say about your notion of following "only the books of Christ?" I'd reply that, unless you're part of a fundamentalist group that believes in Biblical inerrancy (that everything in the Bible is literally true and equally authoritative), which practically no mainstream branch of Christianity except the Southern Baptists does, you are not part of a "religion of the book." The "Word of God" is Jesus, not the Bible -- the latter is merely words about the Word of God. Vitally important words for us to learn of the Triune God, but still words written by humans, any of whom, Paul or anyone else, may have their own blind spots and their own personal and cultural misunderstandings of what promptings God was sending to their hearts and minds. For that matter, although it should hardly be necessary to point this out, the "Bible" isn't a single book, but a whole library of sacred writings of different voices and forms that first the Jewish and then the Christian communities found to be of importance to their faith and life.

Given that Jesus, not the Bible, is the Word of God, it is obvious that the primary focus of Christians should be in the accounts of his words and actions found in the Gospels. Anything beyond that, whether it be the Epistles or the Hebrew Scriptures (commonly called the "Old Testament&quot is really best thought of an appendix to the Gospels. And even the Gospels need to be seen as human accounts about Jesus rather than a video recording of his life.

You can learn a lot about God (including Jesus) through the Bible, but it should not be your only means of contact; Bible study needs to be supplemented by prayer, further study in theology (which can often give you vital insights into the meanings of things found in Scripture), and the fellowship of sharing in an appropriate Christian community to really come into its own.

By the way, when I look at Paul's writings, I look beyond the limitations of his cultural viewpoint and see the positive things he did. Primarily, by insisting that gentiles could become Christians without first having to convert to Judaism, he paved the way for Christianity to be a global faith, rather than merely a sect claiming to be, in essence, "Judaism 2.0." And keep in mind that at least some of the more strident misogynistic statements found in his epistles appear to actually have been added by a later editor, instead of being Paul's own thoughts, while his own words of Galatians 3:28 -- "There is no longer Jew or Greek, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus." -- speak of an inclusivity that took the world centuries to live up to.

deutsey

(20,166 posts)
4. RE: Paul's authorship
Tue Nov 27, 2012, 02:28 PM
Nov 2012

Good point on Paul's writings. There are many scholars who also believe some of the epistles were not written by Paul at all, but by others after his death seeking to use his name to give their writings authority.

Reno Master

(51 posts)
5. It's not obvious to me that my primary focus should be in the Gospel accounts of Jesus' ministry.
Wed Jan 30, 2013, 01:35 AM
Jan 2013

Jesus, like Paul, was a first-century rabbinic Jew. Unlike Paul, whose ministry was to the Gentiles during the current Covenant of Grace (Romans 11:13, Acts 9:15), Jesus' was to first-century Jews living under the Law of Moses. Being a Gentile believer living under the same Covenant of Grace, it would appear that Paul is speaking to me more than Jesus is.

DryHump

(199 posts)
3. Hey -
Wed Nov 21, 2012, 10:14 PM
Nov 2012

-with or without Paul or the Bible or a church at all, if your intention is to know the Christ, you will be led to union with God. Period.

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