“She’s got an open wound, and part of our job is to pour salt in it.”

[ucrdem]

That's Glen Bolger, head of the Republican polling firm that conducted focus groups for Karl Rove's Super PAC last summer to help him fine-tune the memes you hear every day, including:

* She's untrustworthy (cue the email server music!)

* She's out of touch (cue "Dead broke"!)

* She's a tool of Wall Street (cue speaking fees from Goldman Sachs!)

and many more. And not just AmericanCrossroads:

Crossroads plans to use a kaleidoscopic approach for its anti-Clinton campaign. In order to target particular voters with tailored messages, the campaign will feature tools including television and radio spots, digital ads on mobile devices, and pre-roll, the commercials that play before videos online.

Crossroads is eager to establish itself as the leading attack dog against Mrs. Clinton, but it is a crowded field, especially as other super PACs are emerging as bigger players in the Republican money world.

All that money to beat one candidate. Lots more here: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/12/us/the-best-way-to-vilify-clinton-gop-spends-heavily-to-test-it.html

[Uncle Joe]

1. How many of those are self-inflicted wounds?

Thanks for the thread, ucrdem.

[JDPriestly]

32. Unfortunately you are right.

It think we would be just dumb to nominate Hillary. The Republicans have had years and years to prepare for a Hillary candidacy. They will grind her to mincemeat. Sad that Democrats don't understand strategy.

[Betty Karlson]

36. Thank goodness we have another candidate ready to bury the GOP in a landslide.

He's the one who cannot be pinned to any scandal - unless one blatantly lies about him like Debbie or Chelsea. And even then it doesn't stick to him at all.

I just don't get why the establishment is so hung up on the candidate with the weaknesses and flaws...

[hedda_foil]

83. Why is the establishment so hung up on Clinton? Because she won't rock their boat.

[Betty Karlson]

99. If the establishment is the only one to still HAVE a boat

and the rest of us are drowning, maybe we ought to look at building anew boat, and retiring the old one. And yes, that will rock - in a good way.

[daleanime]

2. They're not using the War Hawk angle?

Falling down on the job.

[Art_from_Ark]

45. It's kind of hard to use the War Hawk angle

when they're ALSO War Hawks

[1StrongBlackMan]

54. The gop doesn't have to ...

They just leak a hint into the media, and the left does the salt pouring.

[Armstead]

75. And the Clinton/Centrists don't do any salt pouring into Bernie and progressive liberalism?

If, by some chance, Sanders were to get the nomination, their Red baiting will only fuel the GOP's attacks against him. Cue the ad: "Sen. Sanders is even considered too far left by his own party. (Quotes by Claire, Sheheen and Clinton)"

And they also pouring salt into the argument for expanding health care coverage/ Cue the ad: "Senator Sanders says he wants to overturn your insurance coverage and impose socialized healthcare paid for by an increase in YOUR taxes: (Quotes by Clinton and her surrogates)"

[1StrongBlackMan]

87. So why don't BOTH sides stop? ...

Neither side can complain about what the supporters of the other is doing, while throwing their own shade.

[Armstead]

90. You're right...That's the nature of things

Kinda like what Mark Twain said about the weather.

[Skwmom]

3. You really expect people to buy this bullshit? n/t

[Iliyah]

4. Oligarch!

RW talking points.

[cherokeeprogressive]

5. Heat. Kitchen.

Yeah, I don't feel sorry. Should I?

[MeNMyVolt]

6. You'll find lots of agreement with that quote on DU.

[CoffeeCat]

7. This stunt only proves that Clinton is unelectable

Half of the Democratic party has a problem with Hillary's Wall Street and powerful banking interests. And it appears also that the Republican party does as well.

Half of the Democratic party doesn't trust Hillary. Apparently, the Republicans don't either.

When it comes down to a national election--just who in the hell would vote for her? A portion of the Democratic party? Certainly no Republicans. And she polls extremely low with Independents.

Regardless of how you feel or don't feel about Hillary Clinton--all of this demonstrates that Hillary Clinton has absolutely no clear path to the White House.

She's so unpopular, among so many disparate, but large political groups--that she's unelectable.

[Fawke Em]

77. The only positive about her running is that the Greens might finally break

15 percent support.

[PatrickforO]

8. You know, some guy had the temerity to post on here an

assertion that Bernie's campaign was actually being funded by 'a GOP Crossroads Super Pac.' I laughed my ass off. Seriously.

But it is true, and we'd better acknowledge it, that beyond our party, many independents and virtually ALL republicans genuinely dislike Secretary Clinton.

[ucrdem]

12. Do you have a link?

TIA

[PatrickforO]

14. Yeah, here you go...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1041460

Geez.

[tazkcmo]

27. Will you believe it

When/If you read it?

[restorefreedom]

9. why do hillary supporters keep quoting rw sources? nt

[ucrdem]

11. Source is the New York Times.

Did I leave this out?

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/12/us/the-best-way-to-vilify-clinton-gop-spends-heavily-to-test-it.html

[restorefreedom]

13. sorryi guess i didn't mean source per se

but the continued references to crossroad. that is roves group. why would anyone want to post anything from the twisted mind of that goblin?

we know theyare going to attack all the dems...its what they live for.

[ucrdem]

15. They aren't attacking all Dems. They're attacking Hillary.

So you learned something new. And that's the point of sharing information on a message board.

[restorefreedom]

17. i haven't heard flowering praise for bernie from that crowd

but ok. yes rove hates the clintons. no major news there. but why do we want to see it here? he is scum.

[ucrdem]

18. That's what I'm wondering: "why do we want to see it here?"

And we do see it, every day, if not every hour: Show us your speaking fees Hillary! show us your server emails! show us your Whitewater-Travelgate-Benghazi-medical record Clinton Cash Rose Law firm tax returns etc. Well, now we know where this strangely irresistible negatives messaging comes from:

One problem in developing negative messages about Mrs. Clinton, Republican strategists have found, is that she and her husband have survived so many controversies by dismissing them as partisan attacks. So the Republican organizations are seeking to develop lines of attack that resonate more deeply or raise unsettling questions about Mrs. Clinton’s character.

[restorefreedom]

19. the only thing on your list i am interested in

are the transcripts from her wall st speeches.

and as to a campaign using rw attacks, bernie is sticking to the issues. he doesn't collude with scum like rove and he doesn't have to to address the issues.

but you might want to fire off a quickie email to claire maccasklil about pounding the "bernie is a socialist" meme, complete with hammer and sickle. that is right out of rove's playbook. that slimy shit has no place in a dem primary and she should be ashamed of herself.

[JDPriestly]

33. Rove is no genius. These criticisms of Hillary are so obvious it isn't funny.

She is simply a weak candidate.

I have nothing to do with Rove. I don't watch the mainstream news or follow any right-wing blogs or sources, and all of these criticisms of Hillary are ones I have made.

They are obvious to anyone who is not so enamored of Hillary to be blinded to her glaring faults and problems as a candidate.

It's about Hillary.

Don't blame Hillary's failings on the right-wingers. They just point out the obvious in this case.

[restorefreedom]

53. agree. she can't win

and the harder they dig in, the more it becomes obvious that they have nothing to stand on issue wise. they just have a burning desire to be president/first woman/ whatever. for most of us, thst is simply not enough.

[Joe Turner]

20. Maybe the problem is that Hillary can't pass any kind of scrutiny

be it in the media or the republican opposition. That adds high risk to her presidential campaign. And Hillary lacks the Teflon that her husband had when facing negative attacks.

[ucrdem]

21. Teflon: "Clinton Most Admired Woman for Record 20th Time"

December 26, from Gallup:

PRINCETON, N.J. -- Americans again name Hillary Clinton and President Barack Obama the woman and man living anywhere in the world they admire most. Both win by wide margins over the next-closest finishers, Malala Yousafzai for women and Pope Francis and Donald Trump for men.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/187922/clinton-admired-woman-record-20th-time.aspx

So the Clintons can face down attacks, but facing down an army of freshly focused-grouped negative ads while launching a presidential campaign in Iowa is not going to leave her with much time to win the hearts and minds of independents. So do we really need to help the VWRC defeat her by spreading anti-Clinton memes here?

[tazkcmo]

28. She better find time

Or quit doing stupid shit to make some time. What stupid shit? All the shit you listed in one of your earlier posts. Shit she put herself in the position to be smeared with.

[JDPriestly]

35. So do we need to defend Hillary when her faults are so obvious?

You can't cover up the fact that Hillary is a weak candidate.

She really should not be running, she has so many problems. Scandals some not even true but very believable. She has changed her mind on so many issues. Her relationship to Wall Street at a time when the public out her miles from New York are really disgusted at Wall Street's flaunting of its wealth while others suffer and try to pay their debts.

Hillary just has these problems. Her fans try to ignore the reality that she is not a winner.

The only way she can win in 2016 is if the Republicans nominate a truly unacceptable candidate.

For some reason I do not understand, people seem to like Trump. I think he is, all of him, as phony as his toupee, but hey, somehow a lot of people like him. It's probably because he is not part of the establishment.

And that is part of Hillary's problem. At a time when the American people are angry at the establishment, she is very much a part of it, deeply entrenched in establishment thought.

Hillary is not a good candidate.

Sorry that so many establishment Democrats want to hold on to the hope that she will be good for the country. She won't be. If elected, she will at most serve a term. Maybe less. She may resign or be impeached. There are so many scandals trailing behind her that the law of averages suggests one of them will bring her down.

I am a woman. I really, really want a woman to be our president, but I am also realistic. And I don't think Hillary will make a good president and may not even be capable of being elected president. She has so many weak spots that it isn't funny.

[oberliner]

57. I notice you have an Elizabeth Warren banner prominently displayed

Who do you think she will endorse?

[hedda_foil]

86. We not only need to see it, we MUST see it.

It is beyond me why some Hillary supporters think if they hide from her very serious negatives that the Republicans and their super PACs will certainly use against her, nobody will notice. If she wins the nomination, we need to be prepared and ready for the specific mudslinging she'll face. If you want to have her back, for heaven's sake, don't ignore these issues. They will need a better riposte than "nyah, nyah, nyah, that's right wing spin."

[baldguy]

43. We all agree that Democratic candidates shouldn't be attacked with RW sources.

So I'll expect to see your criticism of all the Berniestas trotting out stuff from Lewinski, the Arkansas Project and Darrel Issa's latest conspiracy theories.

[restorefreedom]

56. i haven't talked about any of those things

i am sticking to the same issues bernie is.

i don't even know what the arkansas project is! it sounds like a major highway build, but whatever. and i could not possibly care less about monica. issa is a twerp.

we need to discuss the massive income and wealth inequality and how the candidates would deal withh it, preferably withOUT clintons surrogates tossing around references to hammers and sickles.

that is so unseemly and just showing their hand how desperate they are getting. it has no place in a proper debate. bernie is not communist and they all damn well know it.

[baldguy]

59. RW talking points attacking Clinton are favored topics for some Sanders supporters.

The fact that other Sanders supporters don't criticize them for it makes your protestations of innocence fall flat.

[restorefreedom]

69. other than right wing wackos,

i don't put myself in the business of judging people. people can say what they want and the unfactual stuff is easy to refute.

and speaking of rw attacks, let me ask you: how do you feel about claire maccaskills hammer and sickle comment?

[baldguy]

91. Claire McCaskill is among those "RW sources" you decry...

But Karl Rove, Richard Mellon Scaiffe & Darrel Issa aren't. Got it.

[restorefreedom]

92. i expect scum like rove to attack dems and play dirty.

not other dems to do it

[baldguy]

93. And yet Berniestas are bent on doing just that.

As the OP shows, nearly everything they've crafted their hated Hillary caricature on has no basis in reality, but originated from some RW think tank industriously producing propaganda against Democrats and the Democratic party for 30+ years. Sanders and his supporters took it up and ran with it.

The trouble that that it's a cancerous poison whose only purpose is to destroy progressivism, democracy and the Democratic Party.

[restorefreedom]

94. my disagreement

not hatred...comes from her own policies

iraq
tpp
iran
syria
libya
wall street
her opposition to medicare for all
her crappy "let the poor kids work for their college" plan
her lukewarm position on income and wealth inequality

this comes from HER stated positions

I don't go to rove for my material. i don't need to.

[restorefreedom]

98. did he force her to take those policy positions?

cuz if not, then i don't know what you are talking about

[baldguy]

10. And we see them repeated ad infinitum on DU

By people pretending they don't know they're Rove's puppets.

[Iliyah]

22. Yep

[riversedge]

40. Spot on

https://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video/CZXsWsIWAAApIn4.mp4

[reddread]

44. and those with their strings in David Brock's hands

The only person who could polish Turd Blossom's appearance.
David Brock is the scum at the bottom of the pit called American politics.
Hollering Rove will not cover that stink.

[baldguy]

46. That Clinton gets flak for winning over one of the people who mercilessly attacked her

Is beyond my comprehension. Especially when those criticizing her for gaining his support use those same attacks on her that he crafted.

[reddread]

48. winning him over

lets ask Anita Hill how she feels about that wretched filth.

[m-lekktor]

16. Poor Hillary. nt

[LeatherSofa]

23. Bolger and Rove have an ally in Bernie Sanders

You can see American Crossroads talking points being spewed over GDP by Sanders' faithful flock. The pity is knowing that a percentage of them will vote Republican in the general election regardless of who the Democratic nominee is.

[litlbilly]

24. What the fk are you talking about? Yikes

[Blue State Bandit]

68. I voted on your alert to leave it, but your lack of context is...

very telling. I know plenty of Republicans on the fence about Trump and Cruz. Many have told me straight up' "I'll vote for Bernie if he's nominated, but but I'll never vote for Hillary".

Hillary has a long track record of dabbling in the "politics of personal destruction", and "political expedience in the face of popular democratic support". Hillary has done, recently, what Rove and the Republicans have been unable to do for decades, fracture Planned Parenthood's support within the Democratic Party. If anybody is doing the Republican's work for them, it's Hillary.

So let's be clear. Republicans and Independents on the fence in the general are not part of some covert opp to beat the Democrats by hook or by crook. They just don't like/trust Hillary, and the thought of Bernie being President over Trump or Cruz is more palatable to them than Hillary over Trump/Cruz.

[SunSeeker]

25. Some Bernie supporters here repeat those memes regularly. nt

[tazkcmo]

29. Truth hurts.

The Clinton's have been talking out both sides of their mouths for 25 years, skirting the edges of ethical and legal behavior and now it's coming home to roost. It ain't just Bernie supporters, it's about the 65% of America that don't TRUST her.

[SunSeeker]

30. It's not "truth," it's propaganda.

Still, propaganda does have an effect. Especially when you are able to get lots of people to carry your water.

But Hillary has been dealing with right wing bullshit for decades and has survived.

[tazkcmo]

31. Bull shit.

All situations she or Bill put themselves in.

On edit: Her credibility has suffered greatly and does everyday. How low can it go?

[riversedge]

41. Hillary raises funds to help other Democrats down ticket. Talk about creibilty when Sanders

does the same.



Hillary for Iowa ‏@HillaryforIA Jan 21 Iowa City, IA

This crowd is doing more than believing—they're caucusing for Hillary on February 1! #HillYes #ImWithHer

[JDPriestly]

37. These points are so obvious that it isn't funny.

Hillary is a weak candidate.

Polls show that she is not trusted and facts show she is not trustworthy.

It's the people who are blinded by some sort of adoration of Hillary who can't see who she is and how unattractive she is to people who watch and listen to her. Her voice sounds like the voice of the wicked witch. Compare it to Nina Turner's voice or even Bernie Sanders -- the sincerity in Bernie's voice.

Hillary comes across as lacking real emotion, and that translates in the listener to the sense that Hillary is not only insincere but that she is, in her words and stances, calculating and therefore not to be trusted.

Rove is not doing anything to Hillary. Hillary is what she is, and what she is does this to her.

I am a Bernie fan. I watch mainstream news only if posted on DU. I have no cable TV. I mostly only read DU and the blogs and news media to which DU links.

I would say I am probably less likely to be affected by Republican or Rovian propaganda than just about anyone in America that keeps abreast of the news.

But Hillary's faults are so obvious, an objective viewer cannot miss them.

I am a woman and would love a woman president. At 72, I would like to see a woman in the White House soon because I would like to see a woman in the White House before I die. That's why the Warren 2016 in my signature line. But Hillary is not the right woman. I care more about my country than I do about seeing a woman in the White House.

I just cannot support Hillary. She is really not a good candidate. Her faults are very obvious and grating.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

26. She's made herself such an easy target.

Which, hopefully, will cost her the nomination.

[uponit7771]

34. Bernie Sanders himself is repeating some of those meme constantly

[DrDan]

47. as are many here

[Hekate]

38. I love this line: "The campaign will feature tools..."

[Ken Burch]

39. That's them. It's got nothing to do with our primary.

And it's time to get past the silly notion that HRC is the only Dem that can win.

[baldguy]

49. When Bernie himself uses talking points crafted by RW propagandists it does.

[beam me up scottie]

51. What talking points are those?

* She's untrustworthy (cue the email server music!)


* She's out of touch (cue "Dead broke"!)


* She's a tool of Wall Street (cue speaking fees from Goldman Sachs!)

He never said any of those things.

[baldguy]

52. Really?

Bernie Sanders Goes After Hillary Clinton’s Speaking Fees
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bernie-sanders-hillary-clintons-speaking-fees/story?id=36351691

Bernie Sanders: Hillary Clinton's money 'hustle' could isolate her from reality
http://www.businessinsider.com/bernie-sanders-pans-hillary-clinton-money-hustle-2015-5

Bernie Sanders Refuses To Say Hillary Clinton Is Honest and Trustworthy
http://thedailybanter.com/2015/08/bernie-sanders-refuses-to-say-hillary-clinton-is-honest-and-trustworthy/

Seems like he's following the RW playbook for attacking Clinton rather closely.

[beam me up scottie]

55. 1) Noting her speaking fees is not calling her a "tool of Wall Street".

2) Hillary is filthy rich, that's not a right wing talking point it's reality.

3) I'm laughing my ass off at your insistence that this exchange where Bernie REFUSED to attack Hillary for the trained monkey who was interviewing him is an accusation of dishonesty and untrustworthiness. In fact it's exactly the opposite:

KARL: Hey, we are out of time. I want a yes or no answer to one quick question. Hillary Clinton’s poll suggest a lot of people don’t see her as honest and trustworthy. Do you think Hillary Clinton is honest and trustworthy?

SANDERS: I have a lot of respect for Hillary Clinton. She is somebody I’ve known for 25 years. I’m not going to be engaging in personal attacks against her.

KARL: So you won’t say whether or not she’s honest.

SANDERS: I’m not going to be engaging in personal attacks against her. She and I disagree on many issues. The American people want a serious debate about serious issues, not personal attacks.

Try harder, Bernie hasn't attacked Hillary or used right wing talking points. He's discussing the issues and why he's different than his opponent.

[baldguy]

60. The fact is he's using RW talking points in his campaign.

And when questioned directly to specifically refute & repudiate those talking points, he declined to do so.

Bernie Sanders is not as pure as the driven snow as his supporters make him out to be.

[beam me up scottie]

62. Facts are not right wing talking points. What did he say that was false and/or inaccurate?

And again Bernie REFUSED to attack Hillary when prompted to do so twice by the interviewer.

You're buying into the spin used by the craptastically inept "journalists" at the Daily Banter. The msm wants to turn the Democratic primary into another sideshow and Bernie's not playing their game.

[senz]

81. They blatantly lie about him.

I appreciate your patience in wading through the crap and debunking it. You do it succinctly and well. I don't think I could stomach it, so thanks, bmus.

[baldguy]

95. And RW talking points are not facts.

Nearly everything Clinton's critics use to criticize her is based upon the RW spin created to try to defeat progressivism, democracy, Democrats and the Democratic Party over the last 30 yrs. You and the other Berniestas are the ones buying into it, not me.

[beam me up scottie]

97. What did Bernie say that isn't factual?

You seem to be confusing your own acceptance of msm spin with what Bernie's supporters think.

We're perfectly capable of distinguishing fact from right wing lies, we've been doing it for decades.

[RiverLover]

42. She's untrustworthy was found to be her biggest weak spot.

So many to choose from. Interesting article.

It really is a shame she's been chosen by the DNC to be our nominee. I'm glad we're actually having a race with the trustworthy one rising in the polls.

[hootinholler]

50. That's great they are gearing up for Hillary

What a waste of money for them!

None of that will stick to Bernie when he's nominated.

[Vinca]

58. This is nothing. Just wait if she's the nominee.

[aikoaiko]

61. The wounds are real and self-inflicted

Out of touch

Untrustworthy

Wall Street tool


These are her negatives. She has positive traits as well, but she will never be able to get past these as a politician.

[Warren DeMontague]

63. Just because right wingers say she's out of touch, doesnt make her NOT out of touch.

It certainly doesn't make her in touch .

Know who else thinks she's out of touch? Millennials, whose existence until recently her campaign was only dimly aware of.

[eridani]

64. Nice that Repukes have the utter gall to complain about Wall Street contacts n/t

[hedda_foil]

88. Of COURSE they have the gall. They swiftboated Kerry's military service while their guy went AWOL

[pengu]

65. I'm happy the republicans are underestimating Sanders just like Clinton

The phrase "be careful what you wish for" comes to mind.

[Depaysement]

66. So the point of this OP is . . .

. . . what exactly? That Republicans are trying to attack Hillary? She's the expected Democratic Party nominee, as her supporters never tire of telling us. Is it surprising that she is being attacked?

[Autumn]

67. What are we supposed to do here? Send her a sympathy card?

* She's untrustworthy (cue the email server music!)

* She's out of touch (cue "Dead broke"!)

* She's a tool of Wall Street (cue speaking fees from Goldman Sachs!)


those points are not fiction.

[last1standing]

70. Why would we nominate a candidate with "open wounds?"

That seems really, really foolish.

[ucrdem]

71. Call it "manufacturing dissent."

The take-away is that the reason the electorate distrusts Hillary Clinton (that's the open wound by the way) is that the VRWC has been cranking out high-end propaganda to bash her with for the last 25 years.

[last1standing]

72. But isn't the VWRC's greatest smear merchant working with her now?

Why would we want to support the kind of campaign that coordinates with the man who destroyed Anita Hill's reputation with quotes like "a little bit nutty and a little bit slutty." Isn't that just as bad as supporting the VWRC?

Or do you believe that lies, sexism, and racism are fine so long as it's your candidate doing it?

[ucrdem]

73. Navigate to AmericanCrossroads-dot-org to see who Rove is working with. nt

[last1standing]

74. Can't we navigate to hillaryclinton.com to see who David "nutty and slutty" Brock is working with?

Do you not care that NoHope Hillary is working with a man who destroyed a woman's reputation in order to get the guy who sexually molested and harassed her onto the Supreme Court so he could vote against women's interests?

[ucrdem]

76. Brock is not Rove.

In fact I'd never heard of Brock until last week. I imagine most here hadn't either though I don't expect them to admit it.

[last1standing]

78. Your admitted lack of knowledge does not give you insight into who "nutty and slutty" Brock is.

You should really read up on his body of work before making assertions that don't stand up.

[Fawke Em]

79. Beg to differ.

If you didn't know who Brock was, you've had your head in a hole in the ground.

Most here knew who he was before last week. This is a political board.

[ucrdem]

80. Brock's Clinton connection is voluntary and his 1993 Hill book appeared 2 years after the 1991

Clarence Thomas confirmation hearings. And he publicly retracted and apologized for it in 2001, per this June 2001 NYT article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/06/27/us/book-author-says-he-lied-his-attacks-anita-hill-bid-aid-justice-thomas.html

Until last week Brock wasn't a public figure as far as I'm aware. Maybe I'm not spending enough time perusing RW scandal sheets?

[beam me up scottie]

82. We've been discussing Brock here for months.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251632918

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251595545

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=629102

Until last week Brock wasn't a public figure as far as I'm aware. Maybe I'm not spending enough time perusing RW scandal sheets?

Is DU a RW scandal sheet?

[ucrdem]

84. I imagine you have. As to your question . . .

[beam me up scottie]

85. If you were unaware of his disgusting victim blaming well then...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1052555

[hedda_foil]

89. We've known who David Brock is at minimum since he founded Media Matters years ago.