Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

think

(11,641 posts)
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 11:49 AM Feb 2016

FBI gathers clues in massive Goldman Sachs money scandal

When isn't Goldman Sachs involved with a scandal? This latest one involves close ties to high ranking members of the Malaysian Govt:


FBI gathers clues in massive Goldman Sachs money scandal

By John Aidan Byrne - February 20, 2016

Fallout from Goldman Sachs’ involvement with the controversial Malaysian state fund continued last week.

US law enforcement officials are gathering sensitive documents — and identifying potential witnesses — in the massive money scandal that has ensnared the bank and one of its regional chairmen in a global probe, an international investigator told The Post.

The bombshell case involves Tim Leissner, 45, Goldman’s chairman for Southeast Asia, who recently decamped to Los Angeles to take a personal leave.

He’s married to the glamorous businesswoman and former model Kimora Lee Simmons, ex-wife of hip-hop mogul Russell Simmons.

The fallout is widespread, and it affected both Goldman and Leissner badly because of their reputed close ties with high-ranking government officials in Malaysia....

Full article:
http://nypost.com/2016/02/20/fbi-gathers-clues-in-massive-goldman-sachs-money-scandal/


Some links to more background on this newest scandal:

http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/1mdb-scandal-goldmans-ex-se-asia-chairman-leissner-leaves-firm

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-02-24/goldman-s-ex-southeast-asia-chairman-tim-leissner-leaves-firm

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bff30cc0-dab8-11e5-98fd-06d75973fe09.html#axzz416HghVCU
87 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
FBI gathers clues in massive Goldman Sachs money scandal (Original Post) think Feb 2016 OP
GS is hoping their investment in Hillary pay off. Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2016 #1
Yep. think Feb 2016 #2
Wonder if the transcript shredders are overheating. n/t PonyUp Feb 2016 #3
Right? Transcripts, what transcripts ... nt TBF Feb 2016 #12
I'm sure the new versions are almost done being written. nt valerief Feb 2016 #27
NO KIDDING! nt nc4bo Feb 2016 #9
BINGO libtodeath Feb 2016 #15
+1 azmom Feb 2016 #62
another Bingo! Ferd Berfel Feb 2016 #63
They are pretty, pretty busy UglyGreed Feb 2016 #4
They need president Hillary to put the kibosh on investigations whatchamacallit Feb 2016 #5
Goldman people are so misunderstood. They need a friend in the White House. / FlatBaroque Feb 2016 #6
Made me laugh :D think Feb 2016 #7
That's cuz we both love Opus FlatBaroque Feb 2016 #8
Leissner and Goldman were buying political influence tk2kewl Feb 2016 #10
Maybe they should have told them to "cut it out" Kittycat Feb 2016 #52
K & R !!! WillyT Feb 2016 #11
where is the spin squad? nothing? roguevalley Feb 2016 #13
Oh, i'm sure they're busy trying to get this thread locked. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #28
K & R AzDar Feb 2016 #14
Hurry Hillary! Get in the White House and save your buddies! jillan Feb 2016 #16
And herself. This election is more about her than it is the USA. eom Purveyor Feb 2016 #26
Way back in 2008 some of us heard that GS was one auditor away from having the LiberalArkie Feb 2016 #17
Don't vote for people who take their money, there's an alternative and a very good one. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #18
+10 99th_Monkey Feb 2016 #19
A very good one indeed! There is a reason Glass Steagall existed and a new Glass Steagall is needed. think Feb 2016 #20
The pros and cons are clear as can be between the candidates for me. We still need to keep Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #30
Why is this in GD-P? MaggieD Feb 2016 #21
GS's sleazy behavior has a LOT to do with this election. Ask Sanders. nt 99th_Monkey Feb 2016 #23
Can you be more specific? MaggieD Feb 2016 #34
The criminal behavior of Goldman Sachs is on every voters' mind 99th_Monkey Feb 2016 #40
So what does that have to do with our presidential primary? MaggieD Feb 2016 #42
Monetary links between that org and a candidate for a position in the Executive Branch that AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #45
So that leaves out Bernie, too, right? MaggieD Feb 2016 #50
It didn't go in his pocket. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #54
Okay, so you would not have voted for FDR or JFK either - correct? MaggieD Feb 2016 #60
Did I ever say I wouldn't vote for Hillary? AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #68
Everything. Feigned obtuseness on this issue leaves me wondering .. 99th_Monkey Feb 2016 #53
That Goldwater thing is so silly MaggieD Feb 2016 #66
Progressive? AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #69
Absolutely - here you go MaggieD Feb 2016 #74
Are you using 'progressive' as in time proceeds in a progressive, linear fashion? AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #77
It has everything to do with the primary race..everything. n/t Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #24
How so? MaggieD Feb 2016 #32
It relates to the heart of corruption in politics, the dangers their actions have on the Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #38
So you're inferring that Clinton has done favors for GS? MaggieD Feb 2016 #39
I'm not inferring anything, I am stating that anyone who takes that kind of money Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #44
I don't care what Warren says about Clinton's bankrupcy vote MaggieD Feb 2016 #48
That's what primaries are about, people will connect the dots, some lead them to Clinton Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #84
And some candidates will use artful smears with nothing to back them up MaggieD Feb 2016 #85
The amount of money and that she took it is not in dispute. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #86
Still waiting on transcripts. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #46
Here's one - it's pretty great MaggieD Feb 2016 #49
Thank you for the link to the thing I already said I didn't care about. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #55
So you have evidence she says something different when paid? MaggieD Feb 2016 #57
And yet, she's keeping it a secret. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #59
I don't think she's keeping it a secret MaggieD Feb 2016 #64
Yeah, it's a real shame when the truth gets out. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #67
But we knew that about Romney before MaggieD Feb 2016 #70
Would you please stop abusing the word 'progressive'? AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #73
Her record is absolutely progressive MaggieD Feb 2016 #79
The 'summary' you pasted includes a bunch of shit her husband accomplished. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #81
Do progressives advocate against marriage equality? beam me up scottie Feb 2016 #83
Says the person with the Hillary avatar. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #29
What does this story have to do with Clinton? MaggieD Feb 2016 #31
Millions. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #35
Millions of what? MaggieD Feb 2016 #36
Millions of dollars. Half a million in donations to the foundation, 675k for 'speaking fees' AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #43
Do you have a problem with a woman being economically successful? MaggieD Feb 2016 #47
I don't love Robert Reich. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #51
So unfounded suspicion and innuendo is enough? MaggieD Feb 2016 #56
Unfounded? AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #58
I did see it... it's all unfounded innuendo too MaggieD Feb 2016 #65
Everyone's a partisan for someone. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #71
No, not all journalists are partisans MaggieD Feb 2016 #75
And you very deliberately misconstrue 'Progressive'. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #78
I guess it's in the eye of the beholder MaggieD Feb 2016 #80
It's funny you'd pick mass incarceration as a litmus test. AtheistCrusader Feb 2016 #82
^^^THIS^^^ beam me up scottie Feb 2016 #37
DUzy! (n/t) noamnety Feb 2016 #87
But hey, I'm sure it's "not your fault". <-- says Hillary n/t 99th_Monkey Feb 2016 #22
I would SO love to see Goldman Sachs... gregcrawford Feb 2016 #25
Fresh off the heels of screwing Greece LiberalLovinLug Feb 2016 #33
Fun Fact about Robert Reich MaggieD Feb 2016 #41
Fun for him I guess LiberalLovinLug Feb 2016 #72
+1. nt. polly7 Feb 2016 #61
God's work is done in mysterious ways. n/t PoliticAverse Feb 2016 #76
 

tk2kewl

(18,133 posts)
10. Leissner and Goldman were buying political influence
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 12:30 PM
Feb 2016
The Scandal That Ate Malaysia
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-21/malaysia-s-najib-razak-feels-heat-as-state-owned-1mdb-melts-down

In a country with no public campaign financing and few strictures on political donations, the alleged cash flows caused alarm. Before the 2013 election, on March 12, 1MDB Chairman Lodin Wok Kamaruddin and Khadem Al Qubaisi, then chairman of Abu Dhabi’s Aabar Investments, signed an agreement to form a joint venture. The following month, 1MDB announced it had raised $3 billion for its share of the partnership. “1MDB opted for a private placement to ensure the timely completion of this economic initiative,” the company said in a statement on April 15 of that year.

The timing was controversial. “1MDB may have been created with one of the key objectives being to raise a slush fund to finance Barisan Nasional’s election campaigns,” says MP Tony Pua, of the opposition Democratic Action Party. A statement from the prime minister’s office dismissed the allegations in the Wall Street Journal, saying they amounted to “political sabotage” at the hands of “certain individuals to undermine confidence in our economy, tarnish the government, and remove a democratically elected prime minister.” In a statement, 1MDB said it “has never provided any funds to the prime minister.”


But that could never happen here, right? right?

Kittycat

(10,493 posts)
52. Maybe they should have told them to "cut it out"
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:41 PM
Feb 2016

Before taking the money? That makes it all legit, right?

roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
13. where is the spin squad? nothing?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 02:04 PM
Feb 2016

sort of explains the confidence that banksters have when they say HRC is only saying what people want to hear and will do her best for them when she's crowned.

LiberalArkie

(15,719 posts)
17. Way back in 2008 some of us heard that GS was one auditor away from having the
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 02:19 PM
Feb 2016

doors padlocked. In 2007 GS bought Alltel for 27.5 Billion and was holding it for some some term money but the very next year sold it to Verizon for 28.1 Billion. Probably not enough to even cover the cost of selling it. The word was that they needed cash, a lot of cash right now cash. That was 2008.

 

think

(11,641 posts)
20. A very good one indeed! There is a reason Glass Steagall existed and a new Glass Steagall is needed.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 02:37 PM
Feb 2016

The too big to fail banks have broken enough laws and done enough damage. It's time to break them up and work to keep them from manipulating the laws they are already breaking.

When wealth inequality is at it's highest point since the great depression more of the same isn't going to cut it.

We need a president who isn't taking cash from the big banks. We need Bernie Sanders!


Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
30. The pros and cons are clear as can be between the candidates for me. We still need to keep
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:03 PM
Feb 2016

working hard on getting as many disaffected voters as possible...there are millions of them.
They believe their vote is meaningless, we must change that.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
34. Can you be more specific?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:08 PM
Feb 2016

Seems to be about something that occurred in Malaysia. Where is the connection to our presidential race?

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
40. The criminal behavior of Goldman Sachs is on every voters' mind
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:15 PM
Feb 2016

or at least should be if they're paying any attention at all.

That this particular instance of GS malfeasance happens to involve a foreign country
does not somehow magically exempt it from being fair game for voter scrutiny.

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
45. Monetary links between that org and a candidate for a position in the Executive Branch that
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:24 PM
Feb 2016

could influence investigations into, and sanctions for, said company with money.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
50. So that leaves out Bernie, too, right?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:36 PM
Feb 2016
http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/07/11/sanders-courts-marthas-vineyard-donors/

“Bernie is attracting throngs and has a wave going preaching against the one percent,” said the attendee, requesting anonymity to speak candidly. “So why would he take the weekend to spend in Martha’s Vineyard with wealthy people who are donating at least $37,000 and change to the DSCC?” (That is the minimum contribution to the Senate Democrats campaign arm in order to attend the event)."

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
54. It didn't go in his pocket.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:45 PM
Feb 2016

Here's a more fair article.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/05/politics/sanders-democratic-fundraisers/index.html

You must have spent a while looking for one that doesn't detail the money goes to the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, which sanders SOMETIMES receives some campaign funds back from, when appropriate, and a committee fund that benefits more than just him, personally.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
60. Okay, so you would not have voted for FDR or JFK either - correct?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:57 PM
Feb 2016

I'm trying to figure out if WHERE she made the money is important, or if WHO paid was important. Sorry, it's unclear to me.

FDR and JFK's money came from banks, real estate, and other similar industries. So is it electing rich people you object to, or how they made their money that you object to?

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
68. Did I ever say I wouldn't vote for Hillary?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:07 PM
Feb 2016

I don't believe I did. Did you want to have an honest discussion here, or are you just going to sit there and put words in my mouth?

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
53. Everything. Feigned obtuseness on this issue leaves me wondering ..
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:45 PM
Feb 2016

where have you been the past 9 months?

Top Federal Reserve Official Agrees With Bernie Sanders: Break Up the Banks
http://mic.com/articles/135601/top-federal-reserve-official-agrees-with-bernie-sanders-break-up-the-banks#.EHIqMiYMp

Bernie Sanders wants Wall Street execs jailed for 2008 financial crisis
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/oct/6/bernie-sanders-wants-wall-street-execs-jailed-2008/

In case this isn't clear enough for you, here are some visual aids:

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
66. That Goldwater thing is so silly
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:05 PM
Feb 2016

She was 16 years old. By the time she was old enough to vote she was working on progressive causes. You know, Bernie has a huge gap between the years of 25 and 41 where he does not appear to be doing much of anything.

We don't see that gap during Clinton's life. She has worked non-stop for progressive causes all her adult life.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
74. Absolutely - here you go
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:15 PM
Feb 2016

Here's a good summary:

1947 October 26 — Hillary Diane Rodham is born at Edgewater Hospital in Chicago, Illinois, to Dorothy and Hugh E. Rodham.

1962 — Attends Maine Township East High in Park Ridge, IL for three years.

1962 April 15 — Goes with church youth group to Chicago to hear Rev. Martin Luther King. Hillary’s minister, Don Jones, takes Hillary and others backstage where she meets Rev. King.

1964 — In the fall goes door-to-door for conservative presidential candidate Barry Goldwater.

1965 — Graduates from Maine South High School in Park Ridge, IL.

1965 — Attends Wellesley College, an all-female college outside of Boston, and majors in political science and psychology. Elected president of the campus Republican Club.

1968 — Hilary watches on television as the Democratic Convention in Chicago disintegrates into chaos when thousands of anti-war protesters are attacked with tear gas and billy clubs. Rev. Martin Luther King and Bobby Kennedy assassinated. Protests grow against Vietnam War.

1968 — Before returning to Wellesley in September, Hillary meets with radical activist and community organization Saul Alinsky.

1968 — Writes her senior thesis about Saul Alinsky: “There Is Only the Fight: An Analysis of the Alinsky Model.”

1969 May — Graduates from Wellesley College and becomes the first student to address the graduating class at commencement. Her criticism of the “official” speaker, Republican Senator Edward Brooke of Massachusetts, landed an excerpt of her speech and her picture in Life magazine.

1969 — Attends Yale Law School In New Haven, Connecticut.

1970 Spring — Moves into small house with fellow Yale University Law student Bill Clinton.

1970 Summer — Works at Children’s Defense Fund.

1971 Summer — Works on migrant problems for Sen. Walter Mondale subcommittee.

1972 — Works on Sen. George McGovern’s presidential campaign.

1973 May — Receives Juris Doctor degree from Yale Law School, where she served on the editorial board of the Yale Review of Law and Social Action. During her second year, she worked at the Yale Child Study Center.

1974 — Appointed to Staff of House Judiciary Committee during Watergate. Teaches at Univ. of Ark. Law School.

1975 October 11 — Hillary and Bill Clinton are married by Methodist minister Vic Nixon in a house Bill Clinton bought in Fayetteville, Arkansas.

1976 — Joins the Rose Law Firm. Bill Clinton elected Attorney General of Arkansas.

1977 — President Jimmy Carter appoints Hillary to the board of the Legal Services Corporation.

1978 — Appointed to board of the Legal Services Corp. Bill Clinton elected Governor of Arkansas.

1979 — Made full partner of the Rose Law Firm.

1980 February 27 — Daughter Chelsea Victoria born by caesarean at Baptist Medical Center in Little Rock.

1980 — Bill Clinton defeated in re-election bid.

1982 — Bill Clinton again elected Governor.

1983 — Bill Clinton appoints Hillary head of the Arkansas Education Standards Committee.

1991 October 3 — Bill Clinton announces he is running for president.

1992 January 26 — Hillary and Bill Clinton appear on “60 Minutes” to respond to Jennifer Flowers story.

1992 — While campaigning in Chicago she defends her work for Bill’s presidential campaign by saying, “I suppose I could have stayed home and baked cookies and had teas.”

1992 — Bill Clinton elected president with 43% of the vote.

1993 January 20 — Bill Clinton sworn in and Hillary becomes First Lady.

1993 January 25 — Bill Clinton names Hillary chair of health care task force.

1993 January — The Hillary Clinton Quarterly publishes its first issue. Hillary is the first First Lady to have her own national publication.

1994 April 22 — Holds “pretty in pink” press conference to refute charges that she was illegally involved in the “Whitewater” real estate deal.

1996 January 18 — It Takes a Village: And Other Lessons Our Children Teach Us is published.

2000 — Elected to the U.S. Senate from New York def. Rep. Rick Lazio by 55% to 43%.

2001-2009 — As New York senator sponsored 363 bills between Jan 22, 2001. and Jan 14, 2009 of which 324 did not make it out of committee; 11 were successfully enacted. Hillary co-sponsored 1,530 bills during the same time period.

2002 October 11 — Votes “Yes” on U.S. Senate Iraq War Resolution

2003 June 9 — Living History is published.

2006 November 7 — Re-elected to US Senate from New York.

2007 January 20 — Announces the formation of a presidential exploratory committee

2007 January 21 — Hillary makes it official and launches her campaign for the presidency.

2008 June 7 — Ends campaign for US President. Following the final primaries on June 3, 2008, Obama had gained enough delegates to become the presumptive nominee.

2009 January 29 — Nominated by Barack Obama to be the 67th U.S. Secretary of State.

2010 January 16 — US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton arrives in Haiti to help with disaster relief

2010 May 21 — Warns of Consequences for North Korea following sinking of South Korean warship — “We cannot allow this attack on South Korea to go unanswered by the international community.”

2010 July 31 — Daughter Chelsea marries Marc Mezvinsky.

2013 January 21 — Attends Barack Obama’s second Inauguration.

2013 January 23 – Testified before Senate Foreign Relations Committee about attack at Benghazi.

2013 February 1 — Last day as U.S. Secretary of State.


AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
77. Are you using 'progressive' as in time proceeds in a progressive, linear fashion?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:24 PM
Feb 2016

You're not making much sense there.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
38. It relates to the heart of corruption in politics, the dangers their actions have on the
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:12 PM
Feb 2016

economy and who is best placed to fight against them and guard the US.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
39. So you're inferring that Clinton has done favors for GS?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:14 PM
Feb 2016

What, specifically, has she done for them? I know Bernie was asked this in a debate and had no answer. Perhaps you do? Don't hold back.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
44. I'm not inferring anything, I am stating that anyone who takes that kind of money
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:22 PM
Feb 2016

risks the public not trusting them to be president. Therefore, the OP is pertinent to
the primary race for this forum discussion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/02/09/elizabeth-warrens-critique-of-hillary-clintons-2001-bankruptcy-vote/

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
48. I don't care what Warren says about Clinton's bankrupcy vote
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:31 PM
Feb 2016

I can make up my own mind. It seems pretty clear Clinton voted for it when it included protections for women and children, and did not vote for it when those were removed. I also remember her being very much against it when Bill was president. And he vetoed it, did he not?

I'm not politically naïve. I understand good old fashioned horse trading when it comes to legislation. Prior to the extremists taking over the GOP this was done every day in DC.

If this is all you have (from 2001, no less) I have to believe you have no examples of her doing any favors for GS. Am I right?

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
84. That's what primaries are about, people will connect the dots, some lead them to Clinton
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 05:43 PM
Feb 2016

others to Sanders. The best placed candidate to confront corruption is the one
who is not the recipient of said monies, imo.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
86. The amount of money and that she took it is not in dispute.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 05:52 PM
Feb 2016

Connecting the dots is not that hard and no one forced her to take it.

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
55. Thank you for the link to the thing I already said I didn't care about.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:46 PM
Feb 2016

That's not a paid speech at Goldman Sachs. Try again.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
57. So you have evidence she says something different when paid?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:55 PM
Feb 2016

Can you link to it?

I can't imagine why her speech would change based on whether she is paid or not. She was paid for a speech of hers that I attended and given that her speeches are typically in front of hundreds, if not a thousand people I think it's kind of doubtful that if she'd said anything as awful as you imagine it would be some sort of secret.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
64. I don't think she's keeping it a secret
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:01 PM
Feb 2016

I think she has seen how her haters edit and take things out of context to lie about her. They have been doing it for 30 years now.

It's a clever trick but unfortunately for Bernie supporters only the folks that hate her care about the transcripts. There is no good reason to put them out there.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/02/clinton-speeches-218969

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
70. But we knew that about Romney before
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:08 PM
Feb 2016

By contrast, Clinton has worked toward progressive causes her entire life. So there really isn't any grounds for these baseless accusations.

I ask again, based on your remarks I assume you would not have voted for FDR or JFK - is that correct?

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
73. Would you please stop abusing the word 'progressive'?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:13 PM
Feb 2016

The TPP is not 'progressive'.
"has never been for single-payer health insurance" -Hillary
In favor of the death penalty.

Let me know when I trip over something that agrees with the Progressive platform.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
79. Her record is absolutely progressive
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:33 PM
Feb 2016

I think one of the problems with her detractors may be that they aren't super informed. For instance, here is some info her haters appear not to understand about TPP:

- She did not write the trade bill as so many of you falsely claim. SoS don't write trade bills.

- We live in a global economy, whether you or Bernie or anyone else likes it. 1972 is not coming back.

- Her job as SoS was to influence the TPP bill to the extent possible to include things that would level the playing field (it is distinctly unlevel right now), such as the right of workers to organization, ending currency manipulation that gives Asian countries an unfair advantage on the cost of goods, protect IP of American companies, etc. You took those efforts of hers to mean she was in favor of the TPP no matter if these important items were included or not. But that is simply not so.

-She was very clear in book and in other appearances that she would be for the TPP if it ended up including what she thought were important criteria to level the playing; and that she would be against it if it did not. It did not meet her criteria and as she stated she would be (TWO YEARS AGO) she came out against it.

- She voted against the only major trade bill that came up for a vote when she was a senator. CAFTA.

She suffers a lot of smears based on people being misinformed, IMO.

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
81. The 'summary' you pasted includes a bunch of shit her husband accomplished.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 05:22 PM
Feb 2016

So we can skip a sizeable percentage right there. Which is probably good, because you won't want to talk about NAFTA anyway.

I never said Hillary wrote the TPP. Not in this thread, not in any thread. Getting tired of defending against these 'you people' ghosts. You want to discuss policy with me, talk to me, not other people's positions.

"- We live in a global economy, whether you or Bernie or anyone else likes it. 1972 is not coming back. "


I know. I work for a company that does business on every single continent on the planet, except Antarctica. (Though our products are consumed there and on the ISS.) I don't want 1972 back. That doesn't make the TPP some unavoidable unstoppable eventuality that Must Come To Pass(TM).

You took those efforts of hers to mean she was in favor of the TPP no matter if these important items were included or not.


No, I take her at face value and in her own words. (Which brings us full circle to wanting to see some transcripts we may have discussed)

- She voted against the only major trade bill that came up for a vote when she was a senator. CAFTA.


That's a lie. She voted yes on:

United States-Oman Free Trade Agreement (Bill S. 3569 ; vote number 2006-190 on Jun 29, 2006)
Free trade with Singapore (Bill S.1417/HR 2739 ; vote number 2003-318 on Jul 31, 2003)
US-Chile Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act (Bill S.1416/HR 2738 ; vote number 2003-319 on Jul 31, 2003)
Normalizing trade with Vietnam (Bill HJRES51 ; vote number 2001-291 on Oct 3, 2001)

And she voted in favor of those, while opposing expanding free trade via CAFTA to have ”a little time-out.“ on free trade agreements. Both sides of the mouth working overtime there.

And she supported MFN status with China.

"She suffers a lot of smears based on people being misinformed, IMO."

You make a lot of silly assumptions.

beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
83. Do progressives advocate against marriage equality?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 05:28 PM
Feb 2016

Hillary Clinton on Gay Marriage:



That's part of her record, she opposed it until 2013.

Not very progressive imo.
 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
36. Millions of what?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:12 PM
Feb 2016

Still not seeing the connection between donations to a charity from 5 years ago and some GS employee actions recently in Malaysia. Are we playing 92 degrees of separation again?

Is every charity GS donated to also evil?

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
43. Millions of dollars. Half a million in donations to the foundation, 675k for 'speaking fees'
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:19 PM
Feb 2016

I'm not talking about the Women's forum appearance.

You wish it was 92 degrees.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
47. Do you have a problem with a woman being economically successful?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:26 PM
Feb 2016

Men make paid speeches. Robert Reich, who you all seem to love, gets paid $100K per speech, and probably donates a hell of a lot less the charity.

But I've never heard you try to discredit him for that. Why do you try to discredit her for it?

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
51. I don't love Robert Reich.
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:39 PM
Feb 2016

I didn't say anything about the upwards of 125 million dollars in speaking fees the Clintons have raked in (some $30m in the last two years), I'm fine with her commercial success.

I'm concerned with some of the people paying, and why, and what she told them. Especially since Hillary has claimed to have 'scolded' the financial sector after the last major recession.

I want to know what she actually told them, when money changed hands. I want to get a feel for how much I can trust the future CinC to pursue investigations into GS's current and future misdeeds.


If money changed hands (it did) and the message was fluff (unknown, someone is apparently 'looking into' providing transcripts) that does not bode well for the hopeful Executive.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
56. So unfounded suspicion and innuendo is enough?
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:50 PM
Feb 2016

... to tar someone, smear someone without evidence? I assume then you would never have voted for FDR or JFK, correct?

"The Roosevelt family was New York based and involved in commerce, banking and insurance, shipbuilding and seafaring, urban real estate and landholding. Although a lawyer by training, James Roosevelt's interests were in business where he was a respected figure in the field of finance, transportation (railroads), and philanthropy."

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/general-article/kennedy-wealth/

Am I reading your correctly?

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
65. I did see it... it's all unfounded innuendo too
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:02 PM
Feb 2016

That is what David Corn specializes in. You realize he is a partisan Bernie supporter, right?

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
75. No, not all journalists are partisans
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:19 PM
Feb 2016

And yes, he's got nothing but innuendo in that article. And he very deliberately leaves out her legislative history that would discredit the unfounded innuendo he writes about.

 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
80. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:46 PM
Feb 2016

I don't find his gun votes, his immigration votes, his dumping nuke waste in poor Latino areas, his vote to deregulate credit swaps and derivatives, his vote for mass incarceration to be very progressive.

I don't have purity tests for candidates, but if I did he certainly would not pass it.

http://theweek.com/articles/603044/bernie-sanders-not-nearly-progressive-think

gregcrawford

(2,382 posts)
25. I would SO love to see Goldman Sachs...
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 02:41 PM
Feb 2016

... crushed and dismembered, drawn and quartered, burned at the stake, beheaded, and buried in six different toxic waste dumps just to make absolutely sure it is DEAD!

LiberalLovinLug

(14,174 posts)
33. Fresh off the heels of screwing Greece
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:07 PM
Feb 2016
How Goldman Sachs Helped Create the Greek Debt Crisis

The Greek debt crisis offers another illustration of Wall Street’s powers of persuasion and predation, although the Street is missing from most accounts.

The crisis was exacerbated years ago by a deal with Goldman Sachs, engineered by Goldman’s current CEO, Lloyd Blankfein. Blankfein and his Goldman team helped Greece hide the true extent of its debt, and in the process almost doubled it. And just as with the American subprime crisis, and the current plight of many American cities, Wall Street’s predatory lending played an important although little-recognized role.
 

MaggieD

(7,393 posts)
41. Fun Fact about Robert Reich
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 03:18 PM
Feb 2016

He gets paid $250K per year to teach one class at a public university. Wow, that must be some class, eh? And he gets paid $100K per speech. Are you sure you want to use him to make your point?

Did Greece borrow $2.8 billion from GS? Yes. Did GS force them to do that? No.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,174 posts)
72. Fun for him I guess
Wed Feb 24, 2016, 04:09 PM
Feb 2016

But I fail to see how much income someone gets or their teaching credentials has anything to do with any facts they have researched. And no, GS did not force them to borrow, they only promised a desperate nation to hide any new debt, knowing full well that it meant more payback eventually plus a larger commission.

Do you want other links than a writer for The Nation supporting that view?:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/greek-debt-crisis-how-goldman-sachs-helped-greece-to-mask-its-true-debt-a-676634.html

But in the Greek case the US bankers devised a special kind of swap with fictional exchange rates. That enabled Greece to receive a far higher sum than the actual euro market value of 10 billion dollars or yen. In that way Goldman Sachs secretly arranged additional credit of up to $1 billion for the Greeks.

.......

At some point Greece will have to pay up for its swap transactions, and that will impact its deficit. The bond maturities range between 10 and 15 years. Goldman Sachs charged a hefty commission for the deal and sold the swaps on to a Greek bank in 2005.


http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/14/business/global/14debt.html?pagewanted=all

Wall Street tactics akin to the ones that fostered subprime mortgages in America have worsened the financial crisis shaking Greece and undermining the euro by enabling European governments to hide their mounting debts.

As worries over Greece rattle world markets, records and interviews show that with Wall Street’s help, the nation engaged in a decade-long effort to skirt European debt limits. One deal created by Goldman Sachs helped obscure billions in debt from the budget overseers in Brussels.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/greek-debt-crisis-goldman-sachs-could-be-sued-for-helping-country-hide-debts-when-it-joined-euro-10381926.html

Goldman Sachs is said to have made as much as $500m from the transactions known as “swaps”. It denies that figure but declines to say what the correct one is.
........

The size and structure of the deal enabled the bank to charge a far bigger fee than is usual in swap transactions, and Goldman persuaded Greece not to test the transaction with competitors to ensure it was getting good value for money.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»FBI gathers clues in mass...