Do Hillary supporters PROUDLY STAND WITH BILL AND THE BULLHORN...

[JudyM]

Last edited Fri Mar 4, 2016, 08:53 AM - Edit history (1)

The big stink is not just about whether it was legal or not, although at best it skirted the line.

There is a more pervasive stink: this skirting and implicit disavowing of his caper being egregious demonstrates resoundingly the singleminded focus on Clintons doing what benefits Clintons.
Even at the cost of risking disenfranchising voters (if not outright intending to disenfranchise them).

It is ROVIAN. He's a master politician, so you can't excuse the action for simply being ill-conceived. We aren't fools enough to think he didn't intend the consequences.
Nor to think that this isn't the way they do business, in and out of the public eye.

It is becoming more and more transparent that ethics do not matter. The Emporer has no clothes. Hillary supporters, this is the character of the leader you support... It is not about helping people. It is about the cult of self.

>> On next day edit:

Sadly for our DU community, rather than eliciting discussion, the responses from apparent Clinton supporters were overwhelmingly:

Attempts to deny that there is law governing this
Attempts to deny or discredit the video evidence that he was within 150' or that he was soliciting/electioneering
Attempts to deny that anyone was actually impeded from casting their vote
Bald assertions of allegiance with no discussion of the issue
Personal disparagement of posters attempting to have dialogue
The typical vacuous snark from some
Another OP that plays off this one and again, instead of discussing the issue, simply says Bill did other good things.
I had only one exchange where the person was open to looking at what happened. That DUer has had experience working elections.

Could this be reflective of a general refusal -or inability - among Hillary supporters to even see the ethical lapses that some of us believe actually characterize her way of operating...

[NowSam]

1. The answer to that question will speak louder

than Bullhorn Bill.

[Faux pas]

2. Kickin'

[Thinkingabout]

3. Rove who has a super PAC running against Hillary. Yes Bill is a maste politican.

Do you stand with the politician the Rove PAC is helping?

[tk2kewl]

6. wtf are you talking about?

[Thinkingabout]

8. This one

http://politic365.com/2016/02/23/rove-super-pac-runs-hillary-justice-reform-ad-you-knew-was-coming/

[tk2kewl]

9. what does that have to do with Bill breaking election law?

and what does Rove's PAC have to with Sanders? The article even asks "Why Isn’t Sanders Running This?" Do you think Bernie is coordinating with Rove ?

[Thinkingabout]

11. Since Bill did not break any election laws what are you talking about?

[tk2kewl]

13. i don't think that has been determined yet

btw... interesting ad at your link:

[Thinkingabout]

20. Produce the proof, where is the link.

[tk2kewl]

23. The Secretary of State’s office is looking into the actions of former President Bill Clinton

BOSTON (CBS) – The Secretary of State’s office is looking into the actions of former President Bill Clinton, who was campaigning for his wife across Massachusetts on Super Tuesday.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2016/03/01/bill-clinton-campaigning-massachusetts-polls-super-tuesday/

Appears that it's those in charge of enforcing the law are still examining the case

[Thinkingabout]

28. No proof, he did not solicit anyone within 150 feet, we have to go by the law, not feelings

we will see where this will be going.

[tk2kewl]

29. i'm sure he was 150' 6" away

[Thinkingabout]

32. Do you understand the statue? It says solicit within 150 feet, does not restrict him from entering

the polling place, if he did not ask any voter to vote for Hillary within 150 feet of the polling place then there is not a violation. Just as the reporters was also inside of the voting place so can Bill Clinton.

[tk2kewl]

33. do you understand the intent of his actions?

give me a break. he's a freaking poster for the Hillary campaign just standing still. he used a bullhorn to thank Hillary supporters as did the Mayor. if it is found that he did not break the "letter" of the law, it is clear to all that he did not act in the spirit of the law.

[Thinkingabout]

38. You do not know his intent, you have an opinion, thanking her supporters is not asking

for their votes, SOLICIT, it is the key word, the key action. He can not be charged with the "spirit of the law", he can not be charged with someone thinks this is wrong. Bill Clinton has been familiar with voting precincts for a long time, he knows the rules, let's be fair, respond to the letter of the law.

[thucythucy]

65. So what?

When I go to vote (which I did on Tuesday) I expect to see signs, candidates, supporters, all standing just outside the 150 foot limit. I expect chanting, people handing out leaflets (as long as they're standing outside the limit).

Since when did this become a problem? I bet Bernie does this too, when he's running for Senate, when he ran for mayor or Congressman.

Really, this is all new to you?

I voted for Bernie, but I find nonsense like this is just ridiculous.

[AlbertCat]

82. find nonsense like this is just ridiculous.

I just voted for Sanders....and I don't find this nonsense or ridiculous.

Bill is the same as a "VOTE FOR HILLARY" sign. Sanders' wife could go to a polling place and not talk to anyone and it would simply not be the same effect. It doesn't matter if Bill technically broke the statute or nor.... his intent was clearly against it. He is not just any campaigner. It's like corporations not breaking the law technically ....but they still have HQs in the Caymans.... or they hire workers for 39.5 hours a week. We just love those kind of companies, don't we?

[thucythucy]

85. So you're saying we should bar Bill Clinton, but only Bill Clinton

from even standing outside a polling place, even if he's obeying all relevant laws?

That is to me one weird position to take. Not to mention, probably unconstitutional.

[AlbertCat]

93. So you're saying we should bar Bill Clinton, but only Bill Clinton

Oh please!

That has nothing to do with what I said. I didn't say bar anyone from anywhere.

If he had any decency, he'd have stayed away.


Unconstitutional..... you're a riot! Next time keep your silly straw men more modest.

[thucythucy]

111. Actually, it has everything to do with what you said.

You said, and I quote: "Bill is the same as a "VOTE FOR HILLARY" sign. Sanders' wife could go to a polling place and not talk to anyone and it would simply not be the same effect. It doesn't matter if Bill technically broke the statute or nor [sic].... "

So what's your point? That President Clinton shouldn't be allowed to campaign outside polling places, even if he's obeying the law?

You can't pass laws that restrict one person from doing something that another person is entitled to do, not without some sort of due process. That's what the 14th Amendment is all about. Bill Clinton, whether or not he's famous, whether or not he's a former president, has the same right to stand outside a polling place as Sander's wife or anyone else, as long as he's obeying the law.

But I get it, you're not advocating he be legally restricted. You think he should censor himself, so as not to... well, what? Support the candidate of his choice? Intimidate voters who would otherwise have voted for Sanders? "I was all set to vote for Sanders, but then Bill Clinton showed up and his powerful mojo just got me so overwhelmed I went and voted for Hillary instead."

"If he had any decency, he would have stayed away."

Ridiculous.

[Nitram]

113. Albert, your "sense of decency" doesn't seem to have anything to do with decency.

Any law-abiding citizen can do what Bill did, and there is nothing whatsoever wrong with it ethically, morally, or legally. Please stop whining.

[treestar]

142. posters like that are put for all kinds of candidates right past the limit

At the school I vote at, these signs are all at the entrance so as not to be too close for the local similar ordinance.

The intent of the law would be to let people vote in peace, which they were not stopped from doing by Bill and his bullhorn.

[Javaman]

76. Statute. not statue. there was a Seinfeld routine about just this. nt

[A Simple Game]

81. He was probably just there to vote. He has that right doesn't he?

Why would anyone think otherwise?

[panader0]

91. In four different places?

[A Simple Game]

100. He was probably just looking for the right one to vote in.

Give him a break, after all it's not like Massachusetts is his home state or anything. That and all those people trying to vote were likely getting in his way.

[JudyM]

105. You are kidding I assume. He can't vote in MA.

[beac]

108. No, he just brought a BULLHORN to

get around that pesky 150-foot limit.

His use of technology to skirt the law aside, you are aware that the Secy of State is also investigating whether he straight up violated the 150 rule as well, right?

[JudyM]

137. Lol, good point. And then he ignored the rule *and* used the bullhorn.

[pdsimdars]

110. I thought it was about campiagning

[MynameisBlarney]

124. Wow.

Just. Wow.

[questionseverything]

40. no he wasn't

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511385409#post43

google overhead view shows he was about 75ft away

if he would of been 150'6'' away it would of been tacky but not illegal

bill did this deliberately to prove he is above the law

[tk2kewl]

43. i was being sarcastic... i have little doubt that he broke the law...

and did so in a despicable self aggrandizing manner

[LanternWaste]

177. You should then lobby to have the limit moved another six inches

You should then lobby to have the limit moved another six inches. And, when someone gets up to. but does not exceed the new line, lobby again for another six inches. No doubt though, that the sordid desires of people who disagree with you politically will rush to move to but not exceed, that limit too.

And eventually, you'll allow us your own arbitrary limit (based on objective measurements, of course) that is in fact, ethically convenient.

[tk2kewl]

178. sarcasm... he was much closer

[brooklynite]

45. Already done -- no violation of Election law

Election officials in Massachusetts say no official complaints have been filed against former President Bill Clinton, who was spotted Tuesday shaking hands with those inside a Boston polling station.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/01/politics/bill-clinton-campaigning-polling-place-super-tuesday/

[SCantiGOP]

52. So, that ends this matter, right?

Not among the hard core who will criticize the Clintons for anything they think will damage her.
Playing right into the hands of Rove and company.

[brooklynite]

66. You apparently think there was a plan to win the election by interfering with ONE voting site?

If you need sustained anger to get up in the morning...

[Javaman]

80. and so that make's it just a-okay.

just one among many. what harm, right?

[JudyM]

107. He went to 4 locations, actually.

[Nitram]

116. What a bunch of Drama Queens you all are!

Throwing Karl Rove in at every opportunity, having a hissy fit that Bill Clinton is legally campaigning for his wife. Grow up.

[AlbertCat]

136. Bill Clinton is legally campaigning for his wife.

With the now usual lack of ethics....

Got it!

Clintons.... don't expect much!

[Nitram]

144. Albert, get a grip.

Repeating the usual tripe about the evil Clintons just won't cut it.

[yourpaljoey]

176. far out

[pdsimdars]

104. What???

I saw pictures of him inside the poll shaking hands with people who were signing in. That seems to be with 150 feet. to me. Unless 150 ft is different there

[Thinkingabout]

131. Do you understand soliciting? To solicit he has to ask them to vote for a candidate and

This is what has to be proven. He did not solicit within the 150 feet, there is not a violation.

[JudyM]

146. He certainly did. Watch the clip. Said he hopes they'll vote for her.

[Thinkingabout]

147. Where was he when this occurred?

[JudyM]

150. Just outside the building. The vid is posted in this clip and elsewhere. And there's an aerial

photo as well with the number of feet printed onto it. It's actually clear, sad to say. I used to really like the guy.

[Thinkingabout]

157. I would like to see the photo.

[JudyM]

158. I went looking for it to include for you in my post but couldn't find it in a quick search.

Basically shows a fairly small front yard/entrance area bounded by a street which is itself within the 150 feet. So if Bill had held the rally just across the street in the open field that's there, that wouldn't have been as bad in terms of crowding the entry.

I have to say, Thinkingabout, I really appreciate your dialogue on this. You are the sole apparent Hillary supporter (I'm assuming you are) in this thread who's even open to discussing it. However you come out on it, I just appreciate that you are *thinkingabout* it.

[Thinkingabout]

160. Thanks for the compliment, I have worked in precincts and know about the

Barrier, we are constantly looking for possible violations, every voter should have the opportunity to vote privately. A voter is not even allowed to have a family member in the booth, we have precinct workers available to assist the voter if needed.

[JudyM]

165. Here's the photo for you, plus a couple others that give clearer perspective.

Shows 150 feet from entrance from aerial.



And here's what it looks like up closer.



Now here's where he was standing when he was outside.



And finally, a clip from someone frustrated with the delay in getting in to vote. "I haven't seen one person be able to come in and vote in here..."

https://m.

I have also worked the polls in election protection for Dems as well as outside worker and precinct captain, so that is part of why I'm more tuned into the issue. I just think what it would've been like at one of the polls I've worked, you know? Chaos.

[Thinkingabout]

166. I understand he was thanking those who supported Hillary

And the interruption has been broad on this law but I understand this has been investigated and the same results was not arrived of "solicitation" occurred inside the barrier, he would have to ask them to vote for Hillary. As far as him being present at the polling station it is not a violation as many claim.

[JudyM]

167. He said he hopes they'll vote for Hillary.

[Babel_17]

172. If this is being argued as not campaigning ...

Another video, posted by WFHN, shows Mitchell speaking into a bull horn after Bill Clinton addressed the crowd for several minutes.

http://www.theamericanmirror.com/video-polling-location-closed-to-accommodate-bill-clinton-visit/

Mitchell proceeded to campaign for Hillary Clinton outside the polling location, telling the crowd she spent some of her “formative years just a few blocks from here.”

“Let’s do our part to get her over the hump now,” he said.

Clinton and Mitchell appeared to be in violation of a Massachusetts state law that bars electioneering within a certain distance of a polling location.

Via the National Association of Secretaries of State, Massachusetts law reads:

Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22)

The video appears to show the duo well within 150 feet of the building.

[Thinkingabout]

174. I viewed a video, there are also those chanting Bernie Bernie Bernie, if Bill has violated the

barrier rule also violated by the Sanders group, do you think they are interested in investigation further?

[BlueMTexpat]

15. +1! eom

[JudyM]

25. Actually responding to the O.P. would be better forum form than throwing up side distractions.

Rove is a total ass, we all agree. But his actions have no bearing on how the Clintons independently choose to act.

Unless you are conceding that they in fact take cues from his playbook.

[JDPriestly]

53. We stand against the Clintons and their bullhorn bullying.

I question whether Hillary won Massachusetts at all.

I do not trust either of the Clintons.

Feel the Bern!

[Nitram]

119. Oh, come on, Priestly! You can't blame the Clintons for immoral behavior every time...

...Bernie loses.

[stranger81]

130. Nope -- just every time they engage in immoral behavior.

Which, as it happens, is quite frequently.

[JDPriestly]

138. In Massachusetts, yes.

[Betty Karlson]

74. The opposition to Clinton is heterogene, not bipolar.

Your outdated views, as exposed by the adversarial presupposition underlying your argument, is typical of Clinton's worldview: stuck in the 20th century.

[catnhatnh]

79. He came to bait the Sanders supporters

and most of us will readily admit he is a master baiter.

[whatchamacallit]

4. Of course they do

Ethical consistency is for losers.

[corkhead]

5. Bankers apparently do:

[MelissaB]

10. Perfect!

But... be careful. Hillary supporters reported this pic in another thread. Evidently they are a bit sensitive.

[pdsimdars]

118. What!!! you think Hillary's supporters are sensitive?

I think I disagree with this, they are SUPER sensitive!

[Lizzie Poppet]

173. Not to progressive causes, they're not. (nm)

[Ivan Kaputski]

156. ^ this ^

[matt819]

7. The Clintons don't give a damn. Who knows what their supporters think?

The Clintons are about the Clintons.

If elected, she will make no change to the status quo. Too big to fail will become much too big to fail. Regime change will the first option on any military agenda. The rich will get richer. And you can bet the speaking fees will go through the roof. And the bankers will continue to be on speed dial.

[marions ghost]

16. Well it does makes sense to ask Clinton supporters what THEY think...

some might just be a bit appalled. Maybe not up to admitting it here tho.

Otherwise I agree with ya...same old, same old with Hillary.

[msanthrope]

12. Damn, The Big Dog gets people riled! nt

[me b zola]

19. Will you say the same thing when Trump turns polling places into circus' in the general?

And when voters are rightfully pissed, will you just dismiss it as how Trump "gets people riled"?

[msanthrope]

22. I was referring to the denziens of this board being riled. But as a voter protection

attorney for the Democratic Party...um, no. This kerfluffle reminds me of the Philly 14th Ward, and that nonsense. FYI....that was my ward in 2012.

[me b zola]

26. Well, okay then.

Expect to see lots of this and magnified in the general. Sure hope it doesn't turn into a "kerfluffle" on DU, that would just be "nonsense".

[msanthrope]

27. It is nonsense---and like I said, it reminds me of the 14th ward in Philly. nt

[newthinking]

121. Could you not agree that it was at least "poor form"?

[msanthrope]

134. I think it was a popular Democrat making a stop.

I have no idea why some people think that disparaging popular Democrats is going to get Bernie Sanders a single vote from the center. Guess what, he actually needs enough of the center in order to actually win.

[questionseverything]

34. so if w bush shows up in chicago with rep gov rauner @ a polling place and stops

voting for a couple hours in the general,that is fine with you?

heck maybe they fan out and do it all over the democratic precincts, is that ok?

because that is the precedent bill set

[msanthrope]

37. Well...was voting stopped? Is there a complainant who was blocked?

You actually need a complainant.

Bush wouldn't show up in Chicago.

[questionseverything]

48. there are complaints all over the net and at mass

google's overhead view shows he was @ about 75' of poling entrance

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511385409#post43

illinois has a repub gov and a rep senator that is up for re election,,,bush shutting down a few aa polling places for a few hours here and there could make a difference

because of the ss protection, all an x pres has to do is show up and it stops everything

[msanthrope]

49. Yeah---you actually have to have a complainant....someone who

makes a complaint as opposed to a tweet.

Let me know when that happens.

[Trajan]

41. So, you made a reference to 'the 12th precinct'

Apparently you saw something that was analogous to this - some apparent illegal behavior in Philadelphia ...

It obviously made an impact on you and your thinking ...

So, now we have to ask, 'If you saw behavior at a precinct in Philadelphia in 2012 that was questionable ... Why are you NOT condemning behavior that you already admitted was 'similar' to bad behavior that which you saw in Philadelphia?'

You still didn't refer to the question itself, except to use that analogy ...

Did you condemn the behavior in Philadelphia?

If so, why do you ignore it now?

Don't bother answering me, because I block all dishonest posters ....but it would be right and proper for others to question your sense of justice when you see similar behavior to that which you already object to, but refuse to object to it in this specific instance ...

Only because it's your favorite candidate in question? ..

Classic Tu Quoque .... Gone

[msanthrope]

44. 14th ward. Not "12th precinct." My suggestion is that you google it,

and when you've familiarized yourself with the O'Keefe/republican shenanigans there, you might wish to edit your post accusing me of "ignoring" something. Hell---I'll even spot you "New Black Panthers" for shits and giggles.

[questionseverything]

14. the thing that bugs me most is

bill could of followed the law....had his little campaign rally in the open grass (150 ft away from the polling entrance) and been tacky but ok

he did not have to stop traffic, or the line of voters but he did it to show he COULD with no backlash from the ptb

evidently election law in mass is like the pirate code,more of a suggestion than an actual rule

[marions ghost]

21. Exactly

it was NOT cool to do this, to block the entry and "treat" everybody to his celebrity presence while he campaigns for Hillary and himself. Lost a few voters--oops. He KNEW this.

Not buying. This was deliberate.

[JudyM]

148. The mayor, himself, was bullhorning the crowd to repeat a cheer that the is "Clinton country"...

[questionseverything]

155. yes i know

the rules,laws are only for us poor folks

the wealthy and well connected can literally do anything and get away with it

and bill went out of his way to show us that

[artislife]

17. Why was he even there?

He can't legally vote there.

He is a known campaigner for the h campaign, so what was he doing there?

The lack of response from team h is appalling.

They are for electioneering when it benefits them. What else will that campaign and its candidate do to further her agenda? When will it stop?

[xloadiex]

97. I believe he was there

as a distraction to other things going on in the state.

[demwing]

18. "Bullhorny Bill"

Ouch!

[Fairgo]

24. I second this question

Another revealing moment (see also, sex in the oval office between the most powerful man in the world and a powerless intern) when you understand the deep, disturbing nature of his psyche. Ignore it at your peril. Standing in the symbolic centre of our democracy and waving his bullhorn around in defiance of the law and all social decorum...daring you to do something about it? This is his modus operandi.

[haikugal]

31. Yeah, there is that...creepy guy. nt

[randys1]

30. Meanwhile, President Rubio gives the go ahead to House bill HR277B, titled

"Legal to discriminate against Gays Bill & deny Women healthcare"

coming to a town near you very soon

[sadoldgirl]

35. Typical deflection!

Just answer the OP's question.

[randys1]

36. Was the question if my candidate, Bernie Sanders loses the nomination, will I support Hillary

Clinton over any GOP?

As if your life depends on it, I will.

Your life, mine, etc.

[NCTraveler]

39. I proudly stand with Bill and the Bullhorn!!!! nt.

[k8conant]

46. I hope you will proudly fall with Bill and the Bullhorn nt

[NCTraveler]

47. Sure. I don't see him falling though. He is looking pretty good. nt.

[JudyM]

50. You don't think his actions were out of keeping with democratic values? Or you don't think

honoring these democratic values matters? Wondering why you are proud of what he did?

[nxylas]

51. I'm amused by the disconnect between your subject line and your sig line

Shouldn't the latter read "Pay attention and slavishly obey the Clintons #gawdblessyouyermajesties"?

[treestar]

139. lOL, yes it's getting down to

apparently the First Amendment does not apply to Bill or anyone who campaigns for anyone other than Bernie.

[Hoyt]

42. Don't know about proudly, but it didn't change the election results, so it isn't

a big deal other than to those desperate to find a way forward.

[JudyM]

54. So individual votes do not matter? Only the final result?

You do not believe what he did was inherently wrong?

[Hoyt]

61. I don't believe it changed one vote, not one.

If it did, it might have been potential Clinton votes who decided Bill looks rough, so they voted for Sanders.

[JudyM]

77. This is simply repetition, please respond to my question about your response.

[Hoyt]

83. Your obtuse question about "individual votes?" I did respond. No individual votes were changed. nt

[Kittycat]

98. So it's okay if we disenfranchise voters at a few polling stations?

Why not a few hundred, or a few thousand. Votes add up, or do we forget what happened in FL, purging voters from roles, the recent changes in TX under Voter ID (with more states coming online by November, and the continued gerrymandering of districts.

Every vote matters. I will fight for a Clinton voter to put their ballot in the box, just as much as my own candidate. Hell, I will fight for a republican to vote, because it's their right. This is yet again a strong value of the democratic party that I see being set aside because of the Clintons, and it's just not okay. Support your candidate, whatever, but have the courage to say - no, that's not okay. Because if you are okay with even one vote being disrupted, then you have to be okay with your vote being lost. And I don't know about you, but I'd be pretty damn pissed.

[Hoyt]

101. Who was disenfranchised? The Secretary of State says no one was disenfranchised.

Was someone so distracted that they meant to vote for Sanders, but hit the Clinton button instead?

[JudyM]

162. I guess only people who had to get back to work on a Tuesday afternoon were disenfranchised.

https://m.

[Hoyt]

171. Well, assuming that happened, it would likely include Clinton and Sanders voters.

Hence, no direct impact on results.

[marions ghost]

62. Only results matter....

yep--how we got there = meh.

[Dems to Win]

55. Such contempt and disdain Bill shows for me as an ordinary person and voter

I return the feelings.

Hell will freeze over before I vote to return this greedy, corrupt asshole to the White House in any capacity.

[amborin]

56. imagine if Bernie supporters did that; hell to pay

[NorthCarolina]

57. I'm sure Hillarys' supporters are all for whatever it takes.

eom

[NurseJackie]

58. You know... I've been thinking about this. And I just want to say ...

[JudyM]

64. Are you able to articulate a cogent, reasoned response?

[Beowulf]

87. That is what passes as a cogent, reasoned response -

laughing at voters being obstructed from voting. The arrogance and contempt in that laugh is sickening. It's their world, in case you forgot.

[tom_kelly]

89. She seems to communicate with these clips

We don't know how old she is. Maybe it is age appropriate for her.

[bvf]

95. Do you even have to ask?

This is a step up from the usual.

[AzDar]

109. To be fair... it's hard to defend the indefensible. But they try, don't they?

[UglyGreed]

117. Many feel it was

a wonderful stunt so who are we to complain......

[JudyM]

141. The mayor acting like a HS cheerleader coaxing the crowd to shout "this is Clinton country!"...

[treestar]

140. ...

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

[Gamecock Lefty]

59. Damn Straight I Do!!!

I stand proudly with both Hillary and Bill!!!

[LonePirate]

60. DU continues to sink further when people openly accuse a former Dem pres of disenfranchising voters

The act he is accused of is completely preposterous and such accusations should not be tolerated here.

[JudyM]

67. Accuse or excuse?

[LonePirate]

78. It's your OP so why are you asking me what you're saying?

[JudyM]

84. Ok, communication disconnect here. I believe this to be unethical, at the least. Look at this clip

and let me know if this seems to you like it is not interfering with the voting process. There was, as can plainly be seen, open land where he could have held a rally right across the street.

https://m.

[George II]

63. Yes. Despite the moaning and groaning, he did nothing wrong. Period.

[marions ghost]

71. "I did nothing wrong."

The mantra of every politician caught in the act.* * of whatever they should not be doing.

[George II]

92. Okay, then what did he do wrong?

[marions ghost]

120. Lots if you work in elections

Re boundaries--go here and look for "state laws on electioneering boundaries":

http://www.nass.org/reports/surveys-a-reports/

It can be argued that the ex-president should not be above the law. Also if it can be proven that he said, "pull the lever for Hillary"--that is blatantly illegal.

This should lead to investigation and trial--it is pretty much unprecedented I think.

But in America, where it's just a matter of what you can get away with, maybe there will be nobody interested in upholding the laws on this.

[brooklynite]

175. The Commonwealth Secretary determined that no violation occurred...

[marions ghost]

179. Not good enough for those who have

Worked in elections and can tell there were blatant violations. But this is how the law works in America. For the sake of fair elections I hope this cannot be shoved under the rug so easily.

[brooklynite]

180. If "blatant violations" occurred, where is Sen. Sanders' complaint?

[marions ghost]

182. How much good would that do?

--- the candidates usually stay out of election sleaze unless it will change the result.

[brooklynite]

183. About as much as his call for Gov. Snyder to resign...

I thought he was a man of principles, not political expediency.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

68. Bill with a bullhorn standing on the wreckage of her 9/11 claims.

[monicaangela]

69. Just view the threads

There you will find your answer and it doesn't bode well for what is considered to be a part of the electorate in this country.

[Raster]

70. Of course they do. WHATEVER it takes to get Hill to the finish line.

[Hiraeth]

72. HILLARY SUPPORTERS ARE PROUD TO STAND WITH BILL !!!

[dana_b]

73. The responses here are telling

I wonder how the Clinton folks would feel if, during the GE, Melania Trump came to a precinct with a bullhorn and started shouting out for her husband - I guess that would also be perfectly fine??

[Hoyt]

86. Wouldn't bother me, I don't think a Clinton supporter would change their vote because of

that. That's the whole point. Clinton shouldn't have done it, but it had no impact -- Sanders LOST and he would have LOST if Clinton stayed in NYC, accept it and move on to some other stupid conspiracy theory about how Sanders is being treated unfairly.

[dana_b]

94. "Clinton shouldn't have done it"

that's right - he shouldn't have. He was IN the polling place (see TYT's video) and so he broke the law. But hey - no harm, no foul, right??

"accept it and move on to some other stupid conspiracy theory"

lol... yeah, breaking laws and being held accountable is soooo stupid. Yawn....

[Hoyt]

96. It's inconsequential, Sanders would have lost anyway. They aren't going to change the

results, accept it and move on.

If he broke a law, it is no more consequential than jay walking. I'll bet my rear you couldn't get a jury to convict him, even if you selected only Sanders' conspiracy theorists. At least one of them would have some sense of perspective.

[Blue_In_AK]

103. Why Massachusetts,

where the polls showed a tight race, rather than Arkansas or Alabama? Whether or not Hillary would have won anyway, he was obviously there to influence the outcome of a close race.

[Hoyt]

112. Inconsequential. Maybe he had an upset stomach and didn't feel like flying south or west.

[artislife]

151. We may just accept and move on

Move on in mass out the party.

Accept that Democrats spend their time skating as close to the edge as possible in moral and ethical behavior and pass it off with a shrug and a cackle.

There really is very little daylight in behavior between the republicans and democrats in each passing day.

[Duppers]

145. Zactly!

[JudyM]

149. Lol! Trump could hold a casting call for a new show.

[erlewyne]

75. Beware of the Ides of March !!!!

I AM VOTING FOR BERNIE SANDERS !!!

I just cannot imagine Bill Clinton being so self-serving ...
On the other hand ... yeah, I guess I can.

[left-of-center2012]

90. YES! Whatever it takes to elect Hillary !

[merrily]

102. Sleaze City, both in Boston and New Bedford. But that's Bubba.

People who are defending this, even a little, have lost their way. Same with people who gloat over super delegates, which is an undemocratic institution anyway, after seeing all the stories of how much pressure was put on Democratic politicians to endorse/support Hillary. For that reason, I can only be incredibly sad for them.

[840high]

128. .^that

[bbgrunt]

106. K n R!!

[pdsimdars]

114. Another point people seem to miss

It's not just about the law of 150 ft and splitting hairs about that.
But Hillary has said that no one should have to wait more than 30 minutes to vote. The polls were blocked for HOURS because of Bill and his entourage and the chaos from that.

People want to vote and get back to work or their lives. You think Bill didn't know the chaos he'd cause? Please, don't be naive.

The fact that all the Hill-bots are all here making excuses and rationalizing the whole thing it all too typical.

Bill created chaos. Stop making excuses, it just shows you have no ability to be objective.
What people say keeps showing itself over and over, it's like a cult of personality, whatever the beloved one does is somehow right. You are all excusing this.

[renate]

129. yep, Bill knew exactly what would happen when he showed up

He's been living like this for more than 20 years.

Plus I don't think it's splitting hairs about 150 feet. He wasn't supposed to get that close (and there's no way he didn't know that) but he did because he wanted to and he knew he'd get away with it.

I don't dislike Hillary and don't blame her for Bill's attention-seeking behavior, so this is just about Bill. He irks me no end.

[artislife]

153. Right on! nt

[JudyM]

159. Good point. We need someone to tweet it for the next debate!

Her likely answer "I don't know why he did it, it's just what he offered to do."

[SoapBox]

115. Total K & R

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

122. Apparently, "work hard and play by the rules" (Bill clinton) doesn't apply to rich politicians.

[RBenjaminson]

123. Get Real

Whose vote was impeded? Was anyone interfered with? The photos showed no lines of voters. It shows happy poll workers.
You say that votes were disenfranchised. How were they disenfranchised? We have Ken Kobach and the Governors of NC, Indiana, Texas, etc, they are disenfranchisors of multitudes. Worry about them and not a former President (who appointed Ruth Bader Ginsberg) speaking in front of 4 polling places out of thousands, for a few minutes.
BTW, I am one of those people who you disdain; you know, one of those people who has worked in every election, local, state and national for 50 years. I bleed for the Democratic party.
It is traditional for public figures to visit the polls, greet the workers and leave after a few minutes.
Get a sense of perspective!

[JudyM]

132. I am honored to have your first post on your first day at DU be such an ignorant insult.

Do take a look at the video and reports before you wax all historical and holier-than-thou. The comparison addressed in the O.P. is not to those outside the party, but a question of ethics within the party itself. Pontificate about that if you wish. Hopefully you will do a better job of contributing civil and positive discourse in the future.

[olddots]

133. ln other words get you sence of perspective ?

[EndElectoral]

125. They don't really care about this

[Sunlei]

126. I think its cool Bill went, bullhorn and all, in Public. Something a republican would never

Something a RW, a republican would never in a million years do- put themselves in front of the general public, face to face. This could be his last election to promote, let him be himself and enjoy himself. warts and all.

I donated only to Sanders and I support him in primary because Mrs. Clinton will need Sanders support to win, for, The Beast Cometh soon.

[artislife]

154. I think you just made the case for republicans being more ethical at the polling station. nt

[Darb]

127. Shark Jump Alert!!!! BWAAA! BWAAA! BWAAA!

[Progressive dog]

135. I stand with Hillary

If Bernie supporters felt a violation of law took place, all they had to do was report it and let the authorities determine if a law was broken.
I'm trying to figure how disenfranchising voters in Boston would have helped Hillary. Hillary won in Boston.

[Nye Bevan]

143. Raises hand. Love the Big Dog with a bullhorn!

And I don't think Bill should be expected to memorize the campaigning laws of all 50 states. If he's only 100 feet away and MA law says 150 feet it's up to whoever's in charge to ask him to move.

[eridani]

161. And fuck disabled voters n/t

[Darb]

164. Aah, Geez. It never ends.

What a Titanic crock of shit.

[JudyM]

168. There was no way for disabled voters to get in... No place nearby to park... This is a crock to you?

[Darb]

169. No, not that part.

Your extensive reach. Is this Gumby?

[polly7]

163. He kind of makes my skin crawl, personally. So arrogant and entitled. nt.

[JudyM]

170. So... In other words, whatever he can get away with. These restrictions are all about the same,

and everyone who has gotten close to any polling places knows about them... Certainly holding a rally in the small yard right in front of a polling place, AND he'd have to be blind to not see he was creating a huge traffic jam, are counter to even the most liberal polling place rules. He's no idiot.

[artislife]

185. Why was he even there?

He cannot vote in that state?


I should give up. I have had my one Hillary supporter who thought it was a dick move on Bill's part. And that actually satisfies the bar I set.

[vintx]

181. I'm surprised people are brushing this off.

People were held up for hours.

This should be MUCH bigger news.

[JudyM]

184. Welcome to DU, vintx! I haven't seen reports of that, please share if you have em.