2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumDNC Vice Chair: Bernie Sanders "extremely disgraceful" for stating the obvious
https://twitter.com/donnabrazile/status/709582115843805186
Everyone knows independent candidates don't get media coverage or money and risk being a spoiler candidate.
Sanders has repeatedly said these are his reasons for running in the Democratic primary process. And Donna Brazile knows that. Her fake outrage makes it clear that she never was neutral, and the DNC is not neutral, that the DNC favors Hillary Clinton. Which we all knew anyway. It also shows how much the Democrats' political establishment resents the idea of a grass roots progressive challenge.
TheCowsCameHome
(40,168 posts)And stay there.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,692 posts)choie
(4,111 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)like her boss does?
For that matter - Does Clinton?
BreakfastClub
(765 posts)PotatoChip
(3,186 posts)He gave us hope. Now it's time for the change. Even if that change does not come in the form of a Sanders presidency, it will come eventually.
Win or lose, Bernie's revolution was never just about this election. It is much more than that. His candidacy alone has already succeeded in planting the seeds of change.
So the current establishment can go ahead and try to squash the hopes and dreams of and entire generation of young people. They may succeed this time, but demographics are not on their side going forward.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)and I extremely disappointed in him
I'd say that his insane push for TPP proves with out a doubt that he in fact DOES support much much worse.
BTW has he come out against the 300% club?
marew
(1,588 posts)Birds of a feather!
still_one
(92,190 posts)want to split the Democratic vote which a third party run would do.
I am not sure where this is coming from, but someone is trying to stir thing up
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Rules don't apply sometimes.
still_one
(92,190 posts)the beginning why he is running as a Democrat is so he doesn't split the ticket
I don't buy it, whether it comes from Donna Brazile or someone else.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)And why is it wrong to state an obvious fact that independent candidates don't get media coverage? Everyone knows that. It's just a fact.
still_one
(92,190 posts)the respective candidates more media coverage. That is a fact. All I am saying is that wasn't his main reason for running as a Democrat. That does not exclude secondary reasons. They are not mutually exclusive
Armstead
(47,803 posts)Somewhat more tactfully, but he said ONE OF the reasons he ran is because third party candidates are ignored by the media, and he wanted his message to be part if this election.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)I would suggest you start with the person that is the fucking Vice Chair of the DNC, since she is the one that opened her mouth and said it.
I am becoming more convinced by the day that everybody in DC and on Wall Street just WANTS to hand the presidency over to an insider, lunatic or not, as long as they are the insiders that know where the bodies are buried. That way everything is safe for them.
Hell, Trump better watch his back, too, and I want him no where near the White House.
marew
(1,588 posts)passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)as a negative for Bernie. She's not the first to say it.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)kristopher
(29,798 posts)They re-aired it and the Clinton-Matthews interview several times today (Sunday).
orpupilofnature57
(15,472 posts)Definition & Action, they are because the have the Political Society behind them, a society made up of MSM and the robbers they work for .
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)Tooooo bad.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)She made that comment on March 14.
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Reminds me of another political party.
polly7
(20,582 posts)Autumn
(45,082 posts)Her concern is certainly noted, and enjoyed.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)He could have done a Huge amount of damage outside. Donna Brazile's comment strikes me as a somewhat shocking low blow.
I thought DNC officials were supposed to be neutral.
Autumn
(45,082 posts)Schema Thing
(10,283 posts)aikoaiko
(34,170 posts)Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)And shove your phony outrage where the sun don't shine...
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Duppers
(28,120 posts)Why did Al Gore ever hire her?!
berni_mccoy
(23,018 posts)Wilms
(26,795 posts)Go away, Donna.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)God, I love the "no time out for hides" thing...
coyote
(1,561 posts)Nice one!
UglyGreed
(7,661 posts)in the beginning now they regret the miscalculation. It also shows how many people want true change. The cat is out of the bag and I hope this is the start of a new direction for us regular folks.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)mariawr
(348 posts)..as he continues all will get a chance to be counted.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)He needs to suspend his campaign, endorse Hillary, and campaign vigorously for her. The sooner the better. If he does that, then all the unpleasant things he's done are forgiven. All that matters now is beating Trump.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)to kiss your ass is good politics?
My God, I am glad you aren't the Vice Chair of the DNC, but if you keep that up, I'm sure you will be going up the ladder quickly!
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)is my favorite look this campaign season.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Do you now need the pizzazz of fake, put-out dismay to accessorize?
desmiller
(747 posts)You and your fellow "Hill-extremists" might get a kick out of giving Hillary's rump "lip-service," but it'll be a cold day in hell before Bernie even fall in line for Hillary. Using all that money that "we the people" have donated to him just to help Hillary win?!! Talking about stepping on land mines.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)The sooner the better. Bernie might have some fans who want to see Trump be president, but Bernie is smarter than that.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)to finish off your style.
Everyone knows when you are wearing ()D()R.
Autumn
(45,082 posts)Bernie doesn't need forgiveness.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)cares about the ordinary people he claims to care about.
frylock
(34,825 posts)DanTex
(20,709 posts)The sooner the better. The only question now is will Hillary be president, or will it be Trump/Cruz.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Autumn
(45,082 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)helping folks to become reintegrated into voting.
djean111
(14,255 posts)What a ridiculous demand. Or wishful thinking, perhaps.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)bobbobbins01
(1,681 posts)And if he doesn't win the nomination, he should run as an independent, because I'll be writing his name in anyway.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)All that's left for him to do now is to bring his supporters on board with Hillary.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Entirely.
His chances are certainly slimmer, but a vigorous contest and continued engagement of the millions of democrats in primary states that have not voted yet, will only benefit us.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)First, the media is already going to ignore the Dem primary, because everyone already knows it's over.
More important, the sooner he gets on board, the more time he has to rally his supporters in favor of Hillary. Given some of the vitriol that I've seen, I think that is going to require some effort, and the more time he has to do that, the better.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)He can do it at the convention.
Rather, now would be an excellent time for hillary and her strategists to examine how they can broaden her appeal, particularly with millennials.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)And, yes, Hillary should examine how she can broaden her appeal. I think campaigning alongside Bernie would help.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)We had a bitter, contested primary up to the wire in 08 and hillary's endorsement of obama made a lot difference, to most everyone except a few PUMAs.
And it didnt hurt our turnout in the GE.
I think the calls for bernie to drop out are premature and, frankly, counterproductive.
Hillary supporters should realize they likely have it in the bag, and as such exercise a bit of patience - particularly with the folks they will want to get on board before november.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)It's true, the PUMAs in 2008 mostly came around, so maybe the Bernie-or-Busters will come around the same way this year, even if Bernie holds out all the way to the convention. But I'm not sure about that. Frankly, I thought the PUMAs were a bunch of irrational whiners in '08, and I feel the same way about BoBers this time around, but I'm not sure that all irrational whiners will behave the same way when the chips are on the table.
And the other problem we face this year is -- let's face it -- Hillary is not the same caliber of politician as Obama. Obama was once in a generation, Hillary is not. We can't afford to take unnecessary risks.
I think a good time for Bernie to drop out might be after losing NY on April 19. He gets to win a bunch of states in the next couple weeks. Losing a big state is a credible reason for suspending a campaign. And it gives him a few months before the convention to mend fences.
JonLeibowitz
(6,282 posts)Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)Beowulf
(761 posts)long before Bernie decided to run. Hillary's campaign merely poured salt on them. This isn't 2008. These are superficial wounds or bruised feelings.
What Bernie decides to do will have no effect on what I choose to do. I will support Bernie as best I can unless he declares his campaign is over. At that point I will decide how best to advance the causes most important to me.
For me there are urgent problems facing this country. This election cycle is about discovering if there is enough flexibility in the systems of power to allow a popular movement to begin to address those problems. In other words could someone like Bernie Sanders earn a major party's nomination for president and win the general election. Right now, it's not looking good. Hillary is a nonstarter. She is from the very power structures that will resist any significant change. For the problems the 99% face are the very sources of the elites' power and wealth. A Hillary presidency only allows the elite to grow even more powerful.
So spare me the calls to get in line. I can see where that line goes and it is no where I want to be.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)Buns_of_Fire
(17,175 posts)Anyone who thinks Bernie has done "unpleasant things" hasn't been paying attention to Caligula-in-Waiting over there.
roody
(10,849 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)that if I just didn't give a fuck about the Democratic party and the constituents the Vice Chair purports to represent, I too, could be the DNC Vice Chair.
I guess I'll just have to give less a fuck about Democratic party members in the future, and then I'm on my way!
Seriously - a call for neutrality and to support the Democratic Party.
Two hours later, then the direct DNC Vice Chair tells us to kiss her ass.
Some tone-deaf shit is going on. I am a damn Democrat, but statements like this make me thing it isn't me that is the problem - the Democratic party is the problem.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Oh my.
By the way she said that comment on March 14, the day before that bunch of states voted.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I guess my disgrace-o-meter must be off.
Karma13612
(4,552 posts)important to you than the 99%.
Well, it is going to get pretty bad when people leave the Democratic party in droves, to support Bernie Sanders and other progressives.
Buh Bye!
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)1. Sanders didn't say anything
2. If he said something it was taken out of context
3. He had every right to say it and he is being honest
4. It is a conspiracy that this story is being leaked
5. In reality, Hillary said it.
6. If Hillary didn't say it, she said something similar.
7. It is just a hit peace by a Clinton supporter.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)stating an obvious fact that everyone in America knows is true.
Third party candidates don't get anywhere.
merrily
(45,251 posts)make it as hard as possible for third parties. Sorry, you can't have it every which way.
Besides, Brazile is not exactly objective about Third Way or the Clintons.
What really is extremely disgraceful? An officer of the DNC talking that way about someone running as a Dem.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)We see that theme repeated from the top of the DNC, to the big media, to bloggers, and all the way down here with members of DU.
Bernie supporters don't seem to do that as much. Tulsi Gabbard resigned because she wanted to take sides.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Pointless, because they weren't very good at pretending, but still fun to watch.
SusanCalvin
(6,592 posts)Impedimentus
(898 posts)I pay more attention the seeds the birds eat in the bird feeder than I do to Donna or Deb.
azretired
(31 posts)Wasn't she the genius who led Gore's campaign to defeat by Bush 2?
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)I wouldn't hit her with that. But her treatment toward Bernie Sanders is disgraceful.
AzDar
(14,023 posts)Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)riversedge
(70,218 posts)Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)What does Bernie have in mind after Hillary wins the nomination and is the democratic candidate for prez?
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)A certain amount of his voters are bound to defect though.
elljay
(1,178 posts)his support will be conditioned on Hillary's continuing her recent conversion to the more liberal side of the party.
Marr
(20,317 posts)a wonderful job of it.
The left has felt ignored by the party establishment for a long time-- and for good reason. But that establishment is stepping way outside the boundaries in this campaign. It's just too in-your-face, and there's going to be a cost.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Maybe they really don't need us.
Jenny_92808
(1,342 posts)Mainstream Media has met its maker
"The Eulogy
About your sudden passing, I've only just learned
You wore yourself thin, taking your last wrong turn.
Your act caught up to you as we all knew it would
I'd tell you I'm sorry if only I could.
So I write these last words, to put to rest
These things I never got off my chest.
I remember when we first met,
My life turned on your every breath,
But then my feelings started to change,
You talked about war as if it were a game.
Still some were fond of you--who don't question or argue.
And I secretly promised to never be like you.
It's sad, one does not leave a funeral the way that one enters,
The mind gets consumed with death, but this one quite differs.
I speak to you now because there are no other takers,
To proclaim that Mainstream Media has met it's maker."
Taken from RT News.
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)We wanted him to run; he did, as a Democrat. Like we wanted him to.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)kristopher
(29,798 posts)That isn't a primary - it's a presidential preference election.
They do have a primary, but it's later in the year and only for down ballot state races. The "primary" is open registration. The PPE is closed.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)excusing the hypocrisy of running in the Democratic party, after past comments about the party. Now, he is all this. Yes, to take and not give, then trash in disgusting.
marew
(1,588 posts)They know very well Hillary is a DINO! She may call herself a Democrat but that does not make her one. If I call myself a tree, does that make me a tree?
Remember Hillary's gratuitous self-pitying comment about being 'dead broke"! Turns out in 1999, they bought a five-bedroom home in Chappaqua, N.Y., for $1.7 million. In December 2000, just as they were leaving the White House, they bought a seven-bedroom house near Embassy Row in Washington, D.C. The price was $2.85 million. It was, is, and always will be about her. She knew very well of the millions and millions she and Bill could and did make in speeches and numerous other activities.
The "dead broke" comment, unbeknownst to her, gave us a look into her true character. She had no concept, no depth, of what that comment in just a few words revealed to us all about her and her core values.
But lets get beyond labels here. To vote for anyone simply because of what they call themselves is short-sighted and dangerous. What I look for is the person who shares my values and who has supported those same values consistently and over time.
Wasserman Schultz (she has been working ferociously to gut new rules intended to rein in predatory payday lending- a real Democrat herself?- hardly!) and Brazile know very well Hillary is a badly flawed candidate and this is exactly why they feel a compulsion to disparage Bernie. They have become part of the corporate elite which rarely plays fair with the American people.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Being 'fair' to populist rebellions isn't in their job description.
marew
(1,588 posts)Absolutely correct!
You win the "truthiness" award today!
demwing
(16,916 posts)so everyday, everything she does, is done with media coverage in mind?
We are sick of you Donna Brazile, you and every other belt way bullshit artist.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)He looked at everything....on running as indy or dem. there is no structure, and no media coverage. but they denied him anyway. so I will be the one to deny, next.
onecaliberal
(32,858 posts)Surely no one thinks they can win the election without those independents. There are MORE of them than democrats or republicans. Someone should tell her surrogates to shut the fuck up already. They alienate more people by the day, and if they think those folks are afraid of president trump than they are even dumber than I think they are.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Well, maybe, she'll start turning down photo ops....someday.
stone space
(6,498 posts)Debs did pretty good when he got a million votes campaigning from his prison cell (despite being unable to vote for himself due to felony disenfranchisement), but the Socialist Party USA (with which the Iowa Socialist Party was affiliated with back when I was a member) really didn't get much media, either, so we probably weren't the optimal choice for a candidate serious about winning.
Democrats get better media coverage than we ever did. Not Trump level media coverage, of course, but still much, much better media coverage than the SPUSA ever did.
I have no sore feelings over his decision, and I don't personally know anybody who does.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)His triangulation was efficient and effective, and very politically expedient, regardless of its sincerity.
Uncle Joe
(58,361 posts)Last edited Thu Mar 17, 2016, 04:02 PM - Edit history (1)
Bernie stated an obvious political fact of realty in modern day American politics, if you're not a member of the two major political parties, your exposure to the nation via debates and television is hugely limited, unless you're a billionaire along the lines of Perot.
People claim that Bernie's "pie in the sky" policy proposals aren't based in reality and yet when he candidly states his deliberations on how he decided to run using sound logic, you condemn him for it.
I have no doubt you would be giving him hell if Bernie ran as an Independent siphoning precious votes away from the Democratic Party instead of invigorating it and ensuring a Republican win in November.
Thanks for the thread, Cheese Sandwich.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)They are technically private organizations, but they have a de facto semi-governmental role as gatekeepers of the political process. In some cases their advantages are even written into law.
Bernie said it right, and he said it honestly. It's a choice an independent candidate has to make.
It's so dishonest for Party officials pretend like it's offensive to acknowledge these realities.
thank you.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)She would have preferred him to be dishonest and say hechad a conversion on the road to Damascus or something.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Democrats range from Zell Miller to Michael Bloomberg approximately. Bernie told the truth. Donna B.'s comment was totally uncalled for.
Samantha
(9,314 posts)Chuck Todd asked him why he chose to run as a Democrat and made a small joke, saying "You never would have had me on your show if I hadn't." He did also say he didn't have the money to self-finance, he wasn't a billionaire. I don't see anything disgraceful at all about his answer. He was just honest.
Sam