2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumWhy the sleaze? I thought Hillary was a sure winner.
The despicable and misguided attempts to portray Jane Sanders as some kind of ally to racist Arizona sheriff Joe Arpaio, because she didn't sock him in the jaw when he ambushed her visit to the tent prison, do not look like the work of a campaign that has achieved victory. They do not look like the work of a campaign ready to bury the hatchet and move forward to the general election. They look like the work of a campaign that needs to achieve a large victory in Arizona, and will push any racial buttons necessary to do it.
I think the Clinton campaign knows a little secret that most of the world doesn't: Michigan wasn't a fluke. Ohio was the fluke. Spring break and the victory of Jon Kasich in Ohio drew down the turnout in two of Bernie Sanders' strongest constituencies: college students and independent voters. Bernie met or exceeded expectations in the other states that voted on March 15th.
GreatGazoo
(3,937 posts)it's all a game to some
Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)NCjack
(10,279 posts)Cowpunk
(719 posts)Before Bernie raised a stink about Henry Kissinger at the debate, Hillary and Bill had been bragging about the fact that Kissinger had praised her work at the State Department. Not to mention the Clintons' personal friendship with Kissinger and his wife.
NCjack
(10,279 posts)Punkingal
(9,522 posts)They do it because it is what they do for fun.
JonLeibowitz
(6,282 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)It's the kind of people they are.
One more reason to enjoy being a Bernie supporter!
MisterP
(23,730 posts)just wanting the vicarious glee of defeating their enemies (core Dems); then they'll go back to their manse or rookery and wonder why America's so rich and yet so poor
must be the fault of the left-right wing
a million worms does not a dragon make
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)to claw their way to the top.
Unfit for office.
Jenny_92808
(1,342 posts)MORE, then what you have posted here! Well Said!
GoneFishin
(5,217 posts)Phlem
(6,323 posts)They also
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They are on the same level as Republicans IMHO.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)How come her events are smaller than Bernies. If that's the case she should be blowing out every event she attends compared to Bernie.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)What matters is the actual vote. You might be filling auditoriums and stadiums, but you're apparently not filling voting booths.
Trenzalore
(2,331 posts)Obama at least made sure the people who showed up at his rallies, showed up to vote.
Land of Enchantment
(1,217 posts)What region of the US do you live in and are you willing to allow the most conservative region of the US determine who you will vote for in November? I am a progressive, you obviously are NOT.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)They're completely irrelevant to the general election.
I don't think it's particularly progressive to write off a predominately black Democratic constituency just because they don't live in Burlington. I actually think it's quite unsettling how the camp that trumpeted Sanders' civil rights record is so determined to disenfranchise southern African American votes.
And for what it's worth, I'm from Indiana. We went blue in 2008, and I just sent in my absentee ballot marked with Hillary Clinton for President, and a slew of fantastic Democratic candidates such as Baron Hill for Senate, John Gregg for Governor, and Angela Demaree for House District 5, because while some of you are committed to ignoring and devaluing them, even red states have very loyal and committed Democratic state parties.
I would really prefer the person running to be the de facto leader of our party to give a damn about Democrats outside of states where it's easy to be one.
Land of Enchantment
(1,217 posts)She kept herself cloistered behind closed doors while others who WERE fighting for civil rights were putting their lives on the line. I remember the freedom fighters in Alabama and Mississippi because I was there. I remember George Wallace standing on the steps of the University of Alabama refusing to admit black students. I grew up in Army bases all over the US and was mortified to moved to Bama to segregated schools when I was 11-12 year old. I grew up there and most of my family is still there. I left in 1973 and would never consider living there again. I think Ohio was the fluke and we will see what happens with the rest of the US. My point is not about the black constituency it about the Bible Belt, the repressed ideologies and the front end rigging of the primaries. What about CA, NY, PA, three of the largest states that have yet to vote? Are you saying our votes do not matter?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_States_of_America
On March 11, 1861, the Confederate Constitution of seven state signatoriesSouth Carolina, Mississippi, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, Louisiana, and Texas replaced the February 7 Provisional Confederate States Constitution with one stating in its preamble a desire for a "permanent federal government". Four additional slave-holding statesVirginia, Arkansas, Tennessee, and North Carolinadeclared their secession and joined the Confederacy following a call by U.S. President Abraham Lincoln for troops from each state to recapture Sumter and other lost federal properties in the South. Missouri and Kentucky were represented by partisan factions from those states, while the legitimate governments of those two states retained formal adherence to the Union. Also aligned with the Confederacy were two of the "Five Civilized Tribes" located in Indian Territory and a new, but uncontrolled, Confederate Territory of Arizona. Efforts by certain factions in Maryland to secede were halted by federal imposition of martial law, while Delaware, though of divided loyalty, did not attempt it. A Unionist government in western parts of Virginia organized the new state of West Virginia, which was admitted to the Union during the war on June 20, 1863.
Trenzalore
(2,331 posts)Really, they are going with Spring Break as a reason for Ohio?
Cowpunk
(719 posts)The endorsement of Clinton by Sherrod Brown was a big blow to Sanders. I think Hillary probably would have won Ohio without these other unusual factors, but the margin of victory would have been much narrower.
Trenzalore
(2,331 posts)R B Garr
(16,950 posts)all their fault. Hillary was nowhere around. They did this to themselves.
First Bernie left an interview in a huff, making the focus of the reporting about his intemperance and incompetence rather than getting his message out. That's also his fault since people are saturated with his "message" and want to hear about THEIR issues. Instead, Bernie made a spectacle of himself, so that's all people are talking about. How ridiculous to suggest that has anything to do with Hillary.
Jane Sanders got totally owned by Joe Arpaio. He took control of that situation and made a show for his Trump supporters just how he would manhandle the Sanders. She got snippy and was completely ineffective and overwhelmed.
Multiply their Arizona debacle by a gazillion times and that's how they will be completely owned, dominated and marginalized in a GE because that's politics and that's where this is obviously headed.
They will be crushed just like they were in Arizona. If anything, Hillary has been going light on Sanders because she is hamstrung because of his supporters and the party primary.
The Sanders' are not ready for primetime. That has nothing to do with Hillary.
Trenzalore
(2,331 posts)Running non-competitive races in Vermont and being liberal in the most liberal state in the country hasn't prepared Bernie Sanders for a General Election campaign. Who would have guessed?
panader0
(25,816 posts)We don't vote here until Tuesday. Geez....
R B Garr
(16,950 posts)In Arizona. Campaigning.
The rest of what I said was about the GENERAL Election That's in November. Aren't calendars great?
panader0
(25,816 posts)R B Garr
(16,950 posts)Yeah. WTF.
Jarqui
(10,123 posts)Gutiérrez was one of the latinos lying about Sanders record in Nevada
oasis
(49,381 posts)Sheriff Joe. She did miss a golden opportunity to read Joe A. the riot act, so Gutierrez is well within bounds for questioning her timid approach.
Jarqui
(10,123 posts)... Jane Sanders held an impromptu event of her own, verbally sparring with Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio ...
She went after him for racial profiling, the inhumane living conditions of prisoners in tents in a hot 130 degree Arizona sun and the 'too many people in jail issue' in that coverage
She then got this video media report (one of many)
She got this photo essay done by the top paper in the state
http://www.azcentral.com/media/cinematic/gallery/81779434/jane-sanders-visits-joe-arpaio-speaks-in-phoenix/
This report & video of Jane going after Arpaio on his support for Trump
http://www.salon.com/2016/03/15/jane_sanders_pays_a_visit_to_sheriff_joe_arpaios_controversial_tent_city/
And it results in national coverage like this:
CNN: Jane Sanders tours 'Tent City' jail with Sheriff Joe Arpaio
...
A 2011 Justice Department report found that Maricopa County "engages in a pattern or practice of unconstitutional policing" and "engages in racial profiling of Latinos; unlawfully stops, detains, and arrests Latinos; and unlawfully retaliates against individuals who complain about or criticize" the county's policies.
"What I saw and heard firsthand today by visiting with the families and seeing tent city was very disturbing," Sanders said in a statement released by the campaign. "Sheriff Arpaio did not even attempt to explain or excuse his inhumane treatment of people of color -- not that he could."
She continued, "That kind of attitude toward our fellow human beings is completely unacceptable, especially in elected officials and those who would seek public office. We all need to stand up and put an end to these egregious human rights abuses."
The jail, located in a remote area in Arizona, was established by Arpaio in 1993 to alleviate prison overcrowding and is known as Tent City because prisoners reside in tents, as opposed to jail cells, in an area known for intense heat.
"He admitted that the temperature in the tents were up to 130 degrees in the summer. He told me he took all meat out of the prisoner's meals," Sanders tweeted, adding that, "Today's visits made it clear that we need real immigration and justice reform to keep families safe."
Arpaio has been under fire by human rights activists for the conditions of the jail for years and a 1997 Amnesty International report found that incarceration methods in Maricopa County prisons, including Tent City, violate international standards of human rights, while security and environmental hazards make the tents "unsuitable for inmate housing."
Another mainstream News story on it by NBC
So the wife of a candidate takes the initiative to visit this inhumane "tent city" jail with a media crew following her. When Arpaio approaches her (obviously trying to do damage control), she calls him out for supporting Trump and his divisive policies, inhumane jail conditions, racial profiling police practices, too many people in jail, etc. And when she does that, she gets national media attention on these problems.
Cockroaches do not like bright lights.
And somehow, for the liar of Nevada, Gutierrez, this is not enough.
Contrary to the allegation of taking Arpaio to task, Jane Sanders challenged Arpaio in a controlled, rational and civilized manner ... as the wife of a candidate for president should. And got tons of free media coverage for her husbands campaign against these issues doing so.
If this issue was truly that important to Luis Gutierrez and not about scoring political points for Hillary so she can reward him with a nice position in her administration, why hasn't Gutierrez already told his wife to get off her ass, fly to Arizona, go to tent city and read Sheriff Joe the riot act ?
What has Gutierrez's wife done about it? ... Nothing.
Just a little run of the mill political hypocrisy.
John Poet
(2,510 posts)How many misogynists are supporting Hillary, anyway?
oasis
(49,381 posts)...Along with the insinuation here on DU that Bernie was embarrassed about the incident and that's why he wrapped up an interview rather brusquely.
still_one
(92,187 posts)digit loss for Sanders in a critical swing state.
Michigan, 49.8% went to Sanders, 48.3% went to Clinton.
As for your argument they were all on spring break, have you ever heard about absentee ballots? Unless it is a caucus, you can vote with an absentee ballot in a primary.
Just talking raw numbers of votes, Hillary has gotten more votes than ANYBODY running on either side
THAT IS NOT A FLUKE
As for your comment regarding Bernie in Arizonia, I agree, totally uncalled for, but that is politics and it is occurring on both sides
Trenzalore
(2,331 posts)If Spring Break is the reason they are citing. They couldn't get a few staffers to handle the absentee ballot situation for Spring Break?
still_one
(92,187 posts)UglyGreed
(7,661 posts)"Brock" tactics being used. Now we have thread after thread and they post photos of Jane to "prove" that Bernie and his wife are some sort of racists SMH!!!
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)I also think some of their fans see it as a feature rather than a bug, they get a vicarious thrill out of it.
anotherproletariat
(1,446 posts)That is exactly what happens when people start getting in the mud. We all need to reflect on this primary, and how we can do better in the future by focusing on our similarities while pointing out relevant differences in an objective, thoughtful way.
Garrett78
(10,721 posts)...that's pretty strong evidence for the idea that many who vote in open primaries are being disingenuous. Open primaries are ripe for manipulation/gamesmanship.
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)anotherproletariat
(1,446 posts)Gwhittey
(1,377 posts)All this stuff comes from her campaign . You going to tell me that Lewis lies about Sanders making up his Civil Rights record was not Hillary spin? He was endorsing her and standing right next to him. The Jane Sanders thing was a Hillary surrogate working closely with her campaign. This is same shit she did to Obama last time. Just last time some of her ratfucking did not work because she tried playing race card on group of white people to get their vote, this drove them to support Obama more. This time she learned and targeted the easier people to by her racists crap and turn this into a white vs black thing.
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)the will of the people, but Hillary is the desperate one?
Bernie needs to win every upcoming state by a blowout to have a shot at the nomination. The polling shows he'll lose several big states by a landslide. If the pressure is one anyone, it's him.
Gwhittey
(1,377 posts)Wait so now her camping is saying SD are the will of the people. Boy HRC camp sure are flip floppers