2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumDan Savage Trolls Susan Sarandon Over Suggestion She’d Vote Trump Over Clinton (VIDEO)
Susan Sarandon, a vocal surrogate for Bernie Sanders, joined Chris Hayes on MSNBC last night, and suggested to Hayes that she might consider voting for Donald Trump over Hillary Clinton if the choice came down to that.
Said Sarandon:
I think a lot of people are sorry, I just cant bring myself to [vote Clinton] I dont know [what Ill do]. Im going to see what happens. Some people feel that Donald Trump will bring the revolution immediately. If he gets in, then things will really explode. Some people feel that. If you feel its pragmatic to shore up the status quo right now then youre not in touch with the status quo. The status quos not working.
Sarandons interview was followed by an interview with Dan Savage, who joined Hayes to talk about the anti-LGBT push by Republicans in the states to repeal rights protections and pass religious freedom bills.
But Savage started his segment with an unsolicited response to Sarandon:
Can I just say Im for Bernie, or Hillary, or both. Come November I plan to vote for the Democratic nominee whoever it is, because the lesser of two evils is less evil, and I dont think Donald will bring the revolution.
http://www.towleroad.com/2016/03/dan-savage-susan-sarandon/
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)I love Sarandon, and I really like Dan Savage for that matter. I'm slightly less familiar with him, but he always seems pretty brilliant. I understand the terror of having Republicans in power, and especially those bringing the hate like Donald. I think his response to Sarandon's perspective is a fairly reasonable, but surface level criticism of her point of view. If she, like I do, believes that the two party system is rigged, and that one of the reasons divisive rhetoric is so powerful, is that the two major parties never unite people with the common goal of actually claiming our basic human rights, by wresting consolidated wealth back away from people and industries that have come by it only vaguely legitimately, thus allowing for divide-and-conquer political rhetoric to define the political game, then I think this is a conversation worth having.
Would Donald be a harbinger of revolution? Well certainly not his kind of revolution, and we know Hillary won't be. Is it a risk me, or Sarandon are willing to take? For me, probably not, but the question is always, is the other choice worse.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)NWCorona
(8,541 posts)Not that she'll vote for Trump. She did say that it was a possibility that he'd win and I agree with that.
Regardless of the framing. A non vote for Hillary isn't a vote for Trump.
GeorgiaPeanuts
(2,353 posts)Not only are Hillarians so arrogant and smug regarding their own votes they seem to feel they are entitled to force others to vote as they please...
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)CalvinballPro
(1,019 posts)I can guess that she probably meant this in the spirit of letting Trump destroy America for 4 years to "teach America a lesson about why it needs Bernie's progressivism." Which is a selfish and asinine mentality to have, and sadly typical of the "Bernie or Bust" movement.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)It's not a "teach America a lesson" It's, change is gonna come. Good/Bernie bad/Trump and we are doing what we can to elect Bernie because we believe Hillary will lose.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Ain't going to be her things exploding though.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)I felt the laugh and smirk came from the framing by Chris.
That's just me tho.
It's also false to say that Susan or any other rich or depending on the poster, white people, won't feel the effects of a trump presidency. Trust me. He'll fuck up everything!
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)and he is, why the hell is she promoting the opposite of what he says? sloppy campaign, entitled bullshit. she will be the last of us to get hurt. she is already super wealthy, donald will protect people like her.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)I also don't see Bernie as feeling entitled at all. He's worked very hard to get where he at right now.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)"things will really explode" stuff as a good thing.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)What I don't agree with is the framing that Susan supports or might even vote for Trump.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)very different views than those Bernie has already expressed. Because she is (maybe was now) an official surrogate.
But the way she expressed them, with no hint of seriousness and a bit of glee, was fairly disturbing. Detached from the reality of that "explosion" she referred to. Not good.
iandhr
(6,852 posts)Because she is white and very rich she wouldn't likely suffer any consequences.
Bernie or Bust is the definition of white privilege because POC would fear for the safety if Trump is President.
jillan
(39,451 posts)But facts - what do they matter?
Mary Mac
(323 posts)Her time watching Fox and Bill O Reilly. I've only seen and watched Bull Durham.
What state is Savage from?
jillan
(39,451 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)It's a witch hunt for women who support Bernie, not Trump.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,327 posts)... people for political gain"
Know anyone else who "knifed" LGBT people for political gain?
RandySF
(58,823 posts)Who bailed on marriage equality in Vermont.
But DU is a fact free zone. You aren't allowed to post the truth about Bernie.
LostOne4Ever
(9,288 posts)iandhr
(6,852 posts)He didn't support marriage equality when he ran for the Senate.
LostOne4Ever
(9,288 posts)[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=#009999]In the 1970's he wrote a letter saying that all LAWS dealing with human sexual behavior should be abolished:
That kinda includes bans on gay marriage.
In the 1980's he risked his political career getting a gay pride day past in Burlington:
http://www.sevendaysvt.com/OffMessage/archives/2015/06/30/32-years-before-scotus-decision-sanders-backed-gay-pride-march
He spoke out in defense of gay soldiers!
http://www.vox.com/2015/9/9/9295867/bernie-sanders-gay-soldiers
He opposed DOMA again risking his political career taking a horribly unpopular position:
http://www.advocate.com/election/2015/10/25/bernie-sanders-doesnt-remember-domas-passage-same-way-hillary-clinton
He was a major supporter of civil unions (and gay marriage) in Vermont and argued against the SCotUS overturning Mass.'s same sex marriage ruling back when there was talk of passing an anti-Same sex marriage constitutional amendment!
He has always voted in favor of gay rights which is why he has a higher scorecard by both the Human Rights Campaign and the ACLU.
http://www.hrc.org/elected-officials/profile/senate/92#.Vvq8JvkrKUl
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2007/10/sen-clintons-aclu-score-takes-bit-dive-obamas-stays-about-same
http://www.ontheissues.org/Notebook/Note_06n-HRC.htm
This in comparison to Hillary who who supported DOMA, who was against SSM until 2013 and even in 2012 capitulated to an imagined attack from fox news on legal forms.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/jun/17/hillary-clinton/hillary-clinton-change-position-same-sex-marriage/
Now, don't get me wrong. I don't think Hillary was ever REALLY against SSM anymore than Obama was (who was for it in 1996, then against it later when he ran for president and then for it again), but that she was being a political opportunist and didn't care about the issue enough to risk her career over it.
Sanders on the other had, risked his political career time and time again for the LGBTQ community. Hillary can't say that.
Both supported civil unions. Both opposed the anti-SSM amendment, both claimed to support states rights when it protected SSM in mass, and then changed positions on states rights when the SCoTUS legalized it. That is what supporters do, by hook or crook whatever it takes to see love prevail.
But when it came to fighting for gay rights and marriage when it was unpopular, when it meant risking their careers, only one of the two can say they did that. Only one of the two can say they never ever publicly opposed gay marriage.
Sanders.
And this "attempted" Swiftboating of one of the politicians who truly did stand up for LGBTQ+ rights, who risked his career for the community repeatedly is outright sickening. Every single person who knowingly participates in it should be ashamed of themselves.
He risked his career for the LGBTQ community and this is how they treat him?[/font]
LostOne4Ever
(9,288 posts)Hassin Bin Sober
(26,327 posts)Legends303
(481 posts)suppose it liberal sites that says if Bernie is not he nominee, they are voting for Trump. Youtube and facebook comments in particular. I guess throwing a tantrum is part of the Sander's supporters vent and outrage if he is not the nominee come the convention.
one_voice
(20,043 posts)Can I just say Im for Bernie, or Hillary, or both. Come November I plan to vote for the Democratic nominee whoever it is, because the lesser of two evils is less evil,
I agree with both the candidates on issues. I disagree with both on things. I like things about both, I dislike things about both-on a personal level.
I think the republicans are pure evil. They scare the shit out of me.
I'm glad in GA the bill was squashed. Thanks in part (a lot) to Hollywood--special shout out to The Walking Dead peeps!!!
Get on the ball NC.
Jackie Wilson Said
(4,176 posts)Sunlei
(22,651 posts)Sanders may lose the primary, and I very much doubt he wouldn't back Mrs. Clinton.
It's Republicanoid behavior to wish for a split vote.