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Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:25 PM Apr 2016

I have a feeling that President Obama loathes Bill and Hillary Clinton.

One, I LOVE my President and I'll never completely forgive Hillary and Bill Clinton for the things they said about Obama during the 2008 campaign. The Reverend Jeremiah Wright was started by Hillary. The Bill Ayres story was Hillary. The "was he born in America?" was Hillary. Everything that the Republicans still use today against Barack Obama was introduced by Hillary and Bill Clinton.

If you recall, Bill famously said to Ted Kennedy that, "Not too many years ago, Obama would have been getting our coffee." This caused Ted and the Kennedy family to announce their support for Barack Obama almost immediately. (From Game Change by John Heilemann and Mark Halperin.)

Bill also said in South Carolina that Obama's campaign was a "fairy-tale" with no chance of winning a general election.

Hillary took it to the wall and only withdrew when it was way past over in June. She endorsed Obama, but millions of her PUMA supporters did not. They marched their Obama hate right into the McCain campaign. Much of it was racist. I know some white Hillary supporters who said "It's not because he's black," but it was.

I believe that in order to get Hillary's endorsement he had to offer her VP or Secretary of State. He was too smart to pick her as Veep, so she got the job that already had been promised to John Kerry, Secretary of State.

Hillary was always problematic. Obama was allegedly pissed when he found out about the private email server in her home. And they disagreed vehemently over getting rid of Ghaddafy - which she plunged forward with nevertheless. I think her deal at SoS was for four years so she could get going on the Presidential race for 2016, and Kerry got the SoS job for the second term. However, when Obama was down in the ratings in 2012, I see Bill and Hillary offering the Big Speech and Endorsement at the convention in exchange for Obama's endorsement of Hillary in 2016. Ergo, Bill's big speech.

But, and I'm pretty darned good at body language, I believe that Barack and Michelle do NOT like the Clintons. I think they'd like nothing more than to see her go down. They just can't say so out loud.

I see the Clintons as triangulating sharks, and I wouldn't trust either of them as far as I could throw them. Alas, I'll vote for her if she's the nominee. I'm no shameful PUMA.

But I'm getting a tingling that Bernie is going to win. Bernie is actually going to win, because he's the ONLY candidate with a sound mind, a big heart, and a progressive spirit, the ONLY one.

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I have a feeling that President Obama loathes Bill and Hillary Clinton. (Original Post) Zen Democrat Apr 2016 OP
Jimmy Carter Might Feel the Same Way Too. n/t Herman4747 Apr 2016 #1
Oh, hell yeah. Jimmy Carter has been cross-wise with the Clintons since the 1990's. Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #7
there's a great pix in the oval office of all the living presidents roguevalley Apr 2016 #20
The best had the shortest run due to Reagan's corruption. Why do the corrupt win? snowy owl Apr 2016 #84
Delusional. Obama not only chose HRC for a major cabinet position, Hortensis Apr 2016 #85
That image. aidbo Apr 2016 #91
1 picture that is truly worth 10,000 words. Kip Humphrey Apr 2016 #105
I agree there's a lot in the history that might have caused such. elleng Apr 2016 #2
The problem with politics is you can loathe and support at the same time. JackRiddler Apr 2016 #99
Right, elleng Apr 2016 #104
I think he's taking her and the foundation out (but is doing it Chicago style). IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #3
LOL, now this is the most ridiculous conspiracy theory I've seen yet. Too funny. nt CalvinballPro Apr 2016 #8
I think you're exactly right CoffeeCat Apr 2016 #15
Whoa -- that last bit. senz Apr 2016 #61
No kidding...I had no idea about that last bit either... tex-wyo-dem Apr 2016 #78
Here's a link for you CC Mother Of Four Apr 2016 #80
I certainly hope so noiretextatique Apr 2016 #54
If he felt that way he would not have picked her to be sec of state JI7 Apr 2016 #4
keep your friends close and your enemies closer. he could roguevalley Apr 2016 #21
Yes. And remember, Obama was reading "Team of Rivals" at the time. Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #32
and there was an agreement, outlined in many articles amborin Apr 2016 #111
But, but, feelings are what's important, not facts! MoonRiver Apr 2016 #48
Um,you're relying on a quote from Ed Klein? geek tragedy Apr 2016 #5
I see "Clinton Cash" is a legit source here. robbedvoter Apr 2016 #11
They really should have kept the old rules about no wingnut sources geek tragedy Apr 2016 #14
Yup,when I heard that,my comment was, Wellstone ruled Apr 2016 #57
I have a feeling you've never met any of them, and your armchair psychoanalysis is bullshit. nt CalvinballPro Apr 2016 #6
Why don't you say how you really feel. NWCorona Apr 2016 #28
So, Obama hates Hillary Clinton but he loves DWS? brooklynite Apr 2016 #9
When it comes to foreign policy CoffeeCat Apr 2016 #17
Also, Blumenthal was representing individuals and companies with hopes for polly7 Apr 2016 #26
Yes, good point. Clinton and Blumenthal had many email exchanges about Libya CoffeeCat Apr 2016 #47
Very similar to Iraq noiretextatique Apr 2016 #55
As with Dick Cheney's energy company meetings, months before we invaded Iraq senz Apr 2016 #63
+1000 yeah...just ignore that noiretextatique Apr 2016 #70
You must think Obama's stupid ... Scuba Apr 2016 #94
All three worship at the altar of the Third Way yourpaljoey Apr 2016 #10
I have the feeling you're wrong. zappaman Apr 2016 #12
I would have to agree with you, zappaman! sheshe2 Apr 2016 #36
The Obamas may dislike the Clintons, but sadoldgirl Apr 2016 #13
Friendly correction...Bill said carrying our bags for us. Punkingal Apr 2016 #16
I remembered it as "carry our bags for us" too. But in Game Change it was quoted as "coffee". Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #31
... NurseJackie Apr 2016 #18
I have a feeling that what people say about opinions would be very correct in this instance. Arkansas Granny Apr 2016 #19
I have a feeling he loathes the candidate who wanted to have him primaried in '12 lunamagica Apr 2016 #22
Here is what Obama's donors think: GreatGazoo Apr 2016 #25
Huh/ we're talking about the POTUS here lunamagica Apr 2016 #30
He knows Clintons seek power and Bernie sought SS maintenance. senz Apr 2016 #64
This message was self-deleted by its author felix_numinous Apr 2016 #23
There has to be a lot of stuff in the dumps of Hillary's emails that has pissed off Obama BernieforPres2016 Apr 2016 #35
And Bill Clinton just called the last 8 years an "awful legacy" GreatGazoo Apr 2016 #24
If Obama even disliked Hillary, he could have already destroyed her campaign. BillZBubb Apr 2016 #27
I agree. I suspect Obama doesn't like and am sure he doesn't trust either of the Clintons... BernieforPres2016 Apr 2016 #39
So THAT'S why he awarded Bill the Presidential Medal pkdu Apr 2016 #29
Yes, loathing. I think Obama is down with Jimmy Carter on the Clinton loathing. Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #41
And the PMOF thing ? pkdu Apr 2016 #72
Tis possible! oldandhappy Apr 2016 #33
Bernie is the only candidate that gives a fuck about us madokie Apr 2016 #34
^This^ Art_from_Ark Apr 2016 #88
lol PeaceNikki Apr 2016 #37
twistin rbrnmw Apr 2016 #38
I still don't understand Obama not seeming to be upset over the agreement she violated while SOS. Skwmom Apr 2016 #40
I think he let Hillary be her own worst enemy. NWCorona Apr 2016 #42
Unless he had already promised to not stand in her way. He has stayed true and not endorsed anyone. Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #43
The Clinton hate runs deep on DU nowadays. LonePirate Apr 2016 #44
You got so much wrong in this post that I don't have the energy to go down the entire list. StevieM Apr 2016 #45
You're right about the fairy-tale comment being said in New Hampshire. This is what Bill said in SC: Zen Democrat Apr 2016 #46
Funny how you eliminated the very next sentence he spoke, when he said: StevieM Apr 2016 #62
I have had this feeling since 2008 and no show of forced friendliness has mitigated it. senz Apr 2016 #49
If so, then Obama is a hypocrite for giving HRC a cabinet position bigwillq Apr 2016 #50
Bullshit Alert!! Bullshit Alert!!! Lil Missy Apr 2016 #51
This is incredibly delusional. And I can tell you one thing, Hillary acted with more class and grace Metric System Apr 2016 #52
I think they all play the game to a certain point treestar Apr 2016 #53
Intersting... MrWendel Apr 2016 #56
Why? jack_krass Apr 2016 #69
I love him, too. senz Apr 2016 #74
Really? MrWendel Apr 2016 #75
Lies won't work, MrWendel. senz Apr 2016 #83
Recreating... MrWendel Apr 2016 #89
Nope, telling it straight. senz Apr 2016 #90
Every link... MrWendel Apr 2016 #98
Bernie supporters are many and varied; we do not speak, act, and react in concert. senz Apr 2016 #103
The vote count.. MrWendel Apr 2016 #108
You made a half-way interesting statement senz Apr 2016 #109
I think... MrWendel Apr 2016 #110
and we know this how? MFM008 Apr 2016 #58
I'm not sure of the top post. Jarqui Apr 2016 #59
Karl Rove and gang told a lot of stories, read some here on this thread, Thinkingabout Apr 2016 #60
Sounds like wishful thinking or projection HereSince1628 Apr 2016 #65
Pure speculation Bobbie Jo Apr 2016 #66
Great post. I agree. Barack_America Apr 2016 #67
I have no clue who likes who but one thing that has been nagging me... dragonfly301 Apr 2016 #68
I guess since you have a tingle there is no need ohheckyeah Apr 2016 #71
Millions of us female Sanders supporters here. senz Apr 2016 #82
It's not a feeling Aerows Apr 2016 #73
Then why is Obama supporting Wasserman Schultz, Hillary's lady in waiting? DamnYankeeInHouston Apr 2016 #76
I have a feeling that President Obama loathes Sanders. He's the one acting like Obama should Trust Buster Apr 2016 #77
yes, agree amborin Apr 2016 #79
You can verify this. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2016 #81
I have a feeling that you don't know what you're talking about. Beacool Apr 2016 #86
Funny thing... Zambero Apr 2016 #87
The Clinton campaign did use Bill Ayers against Obama in 2008. senz Apr 2016 #92
I can't read minds and don't take body language too seriously lovemydog Apr 2016 #93
my god bigtree Apr 2016 #95
There is a word for that: apophenia. FSogol Apr 2016 #96
I love new terms, so thanks for that. senz Apr 2016 #106
Perhaps, but he did give her a pretty high level job when he didn't have to. FSogol Apr 2016 #107
I agree with the first part of your analysis Hydra Apr 2016 #97
I have a feeling you are speculating on things that you can't actually prove. Tommy_Carcetti Apr 2016 #100
I don't know about loathing but I bet he's no fan. bjo59 Apr 2016 #101
kick kgnu_fan Apr 2016 #102

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
7. Oh, hell yeah. Jimmy Carter has been cross-wise with the Clintons since the 1990's.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:32 PM
Apr 2016

And if you ask me who is right and who is wrong, not knowing the specific issues at all, I pick Jimmy Carter. The man who said "I"ll never lie to you," never did and never has.

roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
20. there's a great pix in the oval office of all the living presidents
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:57 PM
Apr 2016

Obama, the bushes and Clinton are standing side-by-side and Carter is standing away from them by himself. He looks really uptight. It was a great, great picture. GO, JIMMY!

Oh and I agree 1 zillion percent with the OP. The Clintons are the neutron bomb that keeps exploding.

snowy owl

(2,145 posts)
84. The best had the shortest run due to Reagan's corruption. Why do the corrupt win?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 08:14 PM
Apr 2016

Haven't we learned anything about corruption in high places yet?

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
85. Delusional. Obama not only chose HRC for a major cabinet position,
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 08:19 PM
Apr 2016

but he coaxed and wooed her after she initially was going to turn him down. They also worked together to get Obama elected in the GE. She worked hard for him and the rest of the ticket. Of course.

Now, exuberant, chatty, ultimate-people-person Bill is not cool, restrained Obama's type.

 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
91. That image.
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 02:29 AM
Apr 2016

President Carter's thought bubble: 'I wish I was somewhere building houses for people.'
 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
3. I think he's taking her and the foundation out (but is doing it Chicago style).
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:29 PM
Apr 2016

It's a gut thing, plus getting Bernie to run - the only guy in Washington with no DNC blackmail?

It's a gut thing, but I think he's got his home team doing some serious house cleaning.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
15. I think you're exactly right
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:38 PM
Apr 2016

Last edited Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:09 PM - Edit history (2)

Glad to hear others saying this. Among my Bernie supporter friends, we see this as a very real possibility.

A simple Google search reveals articles that detail how Hillary and Obama were at odds on foreign policy.

As SOS, she has her personal email server walled off from Obama. She was corresponding with and sending classified email to Sid Blumenthal, a man who Obama rejected as one of Clinton's advisers--after Clinton requested that Blumenthal be in her team.

This is also interesting:

Executive Order 13526 and 18 U.S.C Sec. 793(f) of the federal code make it unlawful to send or store classified information on personal email.

President Obama issued this executive order on Dec 29, 2009.

JI7

(89,262 posts)
4. If he felt that way he would not have picked her to be sec of state
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:31 PM
Apr 2016

And he would have encouraged Biden to run and endorsed him in the primary.


roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
21. keep your friends close and your enemies closer. he could
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:58 PM
Apr 2016

watch her better this way and still she done him wrong.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
5. Um,you're relying on a quote from Ed Klein?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:32 PM
Apr 2016

Bill called Obama “incompetent” and “an amateur” who has no clue about how the world operates, according to an article in the Washington Post by Ed Klein, author of The Amateur: Barack Obama in the White House.


robbedvoter

(28,290 posts)
11. I see "Clinton Cash" is a legit source here.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:35 PM
Apr 2016

I remember times when there was a threshold of sources not acceptable here

brooklynite

(94,703 posts)
9. So, Obama hates Hillary Clinton but he loves DWS?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:33 PM
Apr 2016

Bottom line: Barack Obama is a mainstream Democrat; Hillary Clinton is a mainstream Democrat; DWS is a mainstream Democrat. They all get along well with each other, and what happened in an election 8 years ago has long been forgotten.

FWIW - I learned long ago not to assume that what -I- think about political candidates isn't always what everyone else thinks.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
17. When it comes to foreign policy
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:50 PM
Apr 2016

Obama and Hillary Clinton are like day and night when it comes to the most critical issue--foreign policy.

She's a neocon hawk, who chose Robert Kagan (the founder of the neocon movement) to be one of her advisers. When she was SOS, Clinton communicated extensively with Sid Blumenthall, a man who Obama rejected as one of Clinton's SOS advisers--after Hillary lobbied for him.

But she communicated with Blumenthal on a private server of which President Obama was unaware. That is telling beyond measure.

Dozens of articles about Obama and Hillary being at odds on foreign policy. When Obama said that his foreign-policy mantra would be "Don't do stupid shit", Hillary ran to The Atlantic and publicly criticized Obama for his words. She's an interventionist. Obama is more cautious and he's not a neocon toe sucker like Hillary.

These two are not as simpatico as many suggest.

My guess is that her 2008 "endorsement" and "enthusiastic campaigning" in 2008 was part of a deal. In return, Obama made Clinton part of his cabinet. That kind of deal is de rigueur in the national political scene. How she handled her stint as SOS--and that she had a private email server walled off from President Obama, speaks volumes.

polly7

(20,582 posts)
26. Also, Blumenthal was representing individuals and companies with hopes for
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:23 PM
Apr 2016

investment in post-Libya at the time. I doubt very, very much that Obama would have approved.

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
47. Yes, good point. Clinton and Blumenthal had many email exchanges about Libya
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:16 PM
Apr 2016

The emails that has a red star, is one that Clinton failed to turn over to the FBI.

Sid Blumenthal didn't have a security clearance. He was also working for and being paid by the Clinton Foundation.

Interesting that Hillary could conduct these sensitive conversations with Blumenthal, behind the President's back. Meanwhile, Clinton has been credited with selling action in Libya to Obama.

"We must save the Libyans from a horrible dictator, Mr President"; while advocating for the neocon "business-stimulation" plan with Blumenthal on a server that Obama knew nothing about.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
55. Very similar to Iraq
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:42 PM
Apr 2016

Before her vote was a mistake, she was gushing about business opportunities in Irag

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
63. As with Dick Cheney's energy company meetings, months before we invaded Iraq
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:13 PM
Apr 2016

with maps of Iraqi oil fields spread out across the table.

Hillary and Dick know how to plan ahead. Movers and shakers, those two.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
70. +1000 yeah...just ignore that
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:54 PM
Apr 2016

Ignore her blocking a wage increase for garment workers in Haiti, and her support for a rw coup in Honduras too!

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
10. All three worship at the altar of the Third Way
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:34 PM
Apr 2016

Obama is no doubt pissed about Hillary running
a play for play out of the office of the SOS,
but I believe in the end - when it comes to
Third Wayers - money trumps all. Obama knows
the Clintons are where his bread is buttered.

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
13. The Obamas may dislike the Clintons, but
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:36 PM
Apr 2016

who else would push through the TPP for
the POTUS, who considers that agreement
as a great achievement?

(Remember how he attacked EW about it?)

Punkingal

(9,522 posts)
16. Friendly correction...Bill said carrying our bags for us.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 03:39 PM
Apr 2016


I have often wondered if Obama likes them, really.

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
31. I remembered it as "carry our bags for us" too. But in Game Change it was quoted as "coffee".
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:37 PM
Apr 2016

Either way, it was a blunder for Clinton that drove Ted Kennedy away in disgust.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
64. He knows Clintons seek power and Bernie sought SS maintenance.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:23 PM
Apr 2016

Yuge difference.

One's a self-serving enemy and completely untrustworthy, the other is a patriot and entirely truthworthy.

Obama's no idiot.

Response to Zen Democrat (Original post)

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
35. There has to be a lot of stuff in the dumps of Hillary's emails that has pissed off Obama
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:41 PM
Apr 2016

Including all the correspondence with and advice from Sid Blumenthal, who Obama had banished from the White House because he was convinced Blumenthal had spread false rumors about him and his family during the primary campaign.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/10/hillary-clinton-sidney-blumenthal-emails-benghazi-hearings-215083

<"Did the president -- the same White House that said you can't handle him, and can't hire him -- did he know that he was advising you?" Gowdy asked, noting that Blumenthal appeared to have emailed Clinton more often about Benghazi and Libya than anyone else.

"He was not advising me," Clinton replied. "I have no reason to have ever mentioned that or know that the president knew that."

And despite ample evidence on the public record for months that Clinton repeatedly asked Blumenthal to keep sending her updates on Libya and other matters, she repeated previous assertions that his advice was unsolicited.

"I did not ask him to send me the information that he sent me," Clinton said.

"You wrote to him, 'Another keeper, thanks' and 'Please keep them coming....Greetings from Kabul and thanks for keeping this stuff coming,'" Gowdy shot back.

Clinton then shifted slightly, conceding that she urged Blumenthal to keep up the flow. "They started out unsolicited and, as I said, some were of interest," she said.>

There is another email in which a Clinton aide told her that George Soros said he regretted supporting Obama in 2008 and should have supported Hillary (because she was always accessible to him and Obama wasn't). I'm sure there are plenty of others.

GreatGazoo

(3,937 posts)
24. And Bill Clinton just called the last 8 years an "awful legacy"
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:20 PM
Apr 2016

Also you left out this wonderful episode of Obama / Clinton history...

Clinton aides claim Obama photo wasn't intended as a smear
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/feb/25/barackobama.hillaryclinton

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
27. If Obama even disliked Hillary, he could have already destroyed her campaign.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:28 PM
Apr 2016

I'm not buying it. He may not like her on a personal level, but politically he's at worst neutral on her. He's actually been helpful to her campaign at times.

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
39. I agree. I suspect Obama doesn't like and am sure he doesn't trust either of the Clintons...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:44 PM
Apr 2016

...but he's a Chicago politician who knows how to play hardball and if he wanted to blow up her campaign he would have done it by now.

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
41. Yes, loathing. I think Obama is down with Jimmy Carter on the Clinton loathing.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:46 PM
Apr 2016

They have a very tight circle and if you are "in" you must do their bidding and if you are out, well you are OUT forever. Ask Bill Richardson.

It's much like the way the Mafia has operated. There is an Omerta with the Clintons. And, I hate that.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
34. Bernie is the only candidate that gives a fuck about us
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:40 PM
Apr 2016

and the United States of America.
He's honest, He's sharp as a whip, he has a plan that will work.

Did I mention that he's honest as the day is long? Solid as a rock and as kind hearted as one will find anywhere. Good man, Bernie Sanders, Good Woman Jane Sanders.

Skwmom

(12,685 posts)
40. I still don't understand Obama not seeming to be upset over the agreement she violated while SOS.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:44 PM
Apr 2016

Most people would be a tad bit pissed off. But, he has been fully supportive, basically endorsing her.

NWCorona

(8,541 posts)
42. I think he let Hillary be her own worst enemy.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:47 PM
Apr 2016

Obama, per Valerie Jarrett, warned her multiple times.

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
43. Unless he had already promised to not stand in her way. He has stayed true and not endorsed anyone.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:49 PM
Apr 2016

Including Clinton. You know he wanted Joe. Deep down in his heart, he loves Joe.

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
44. The Clinton hate runs deep on DU nowadays.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:54 PM
Apr 2016

Even to the point where ridiculous suppositions are feted like a Super Bowl champion.

StevieM

(10,500 posts)
45. You got so much wrong in this post that I don't have the energy to go down the entire list.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:58 PM
Apr 2016

So I'll just discuss a few of them.

The birther story was not originated by the Clintons. It just wasn't.

Bill's fairy tale comment was in New Hampshire, not South Carolina, and it was a reference to Obama's record on the Iraq War. He was talking about the fact that in 2004 Obama said he didn't know how he would have voted and then as a Senator he voted to fund the war. Whether that was fair criticism or not, it had nothing to do with calling Obama a fairy tale candidate or discussing his prospects in the general election.

Hillary's withdrawal was early by historical standards. Obama finished the race hundreds of pledged delegates shy of what he needed the clinch the nomination. Every race that close in the past had always gone to the Convention. Every single one.

Obama never promised the SOS position to John Kerry or to Hillary Clinton. Like every president, he didn't pick his cabinet until the election was over.

It's insane to think that Hillary would have ever refused to endorse Barack in 2008. In fact, she endorsed him four days after the final vote when she announced that she was suspending her campaign.

Hillary didn't take part in the 2012 election, since she was the sitting Secretary of State. Bill did and there is no evidence of Obama having to bargain for his support, nor can I begin to imagine that Obama would ever be willing to do so.

Obama hasn't endorsed Hillary for 2016, although once we have a nominee it goes without saying that the president will support him or her.

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
46. You're right about the fairy-tale comment being said in New Hampshire. This is what Bill said in SC:
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:08 PM
Apr 2016

“Jesse Jackson won South Carolina in ’84 and ’88. Jackson ran a good campaign. And Obama ran a good campaign here.” — Jan. 26, 2008, to reporters in Columbia, S.C.

Trying to pigeonhole Obama as the "black candidate" didn't work. Trying to pigeonhole Sanders as the "socialist candidate" won't work either.

StevieM

(10,500 posts)
62. Funny how you eliminated the very next sentence he spoke, when he said:
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:00 PM
Apr 2016

"he's run a good campaign everywhere"

I disagree that Bill was trying to pigeonhole Obama as a black candidate. He was simply acknowledging Obama's advantage in SC, although I admit that he shouldn't have said it. But we all say things we shouldn't. That's not the same thing as coming up with a calculating, diabolical scheme.

I don't think Hillary has really talked that much about Sanders being a socialist. But I do think it is legitimate to bring that up and discuss whether it is something that people want or whether it will negatively affect the ticket in November, current poll numbers not withstanding.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
49. I have had this feeling since 2008 and no show of forced friendliness has mitigated it.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:32 PM
Apr 2016

I also sense deep Clinton-loathing in Michelle, Malia, and Sasha.

I get the impression that the ruthlessness and depravity of Bill and Hillary Clinton makes it difficult for others, even in the high-powered D.C. world, to deal with them. They seem to wheel and deal, always in pursuit of power, to an extent that cancels out whatever human qualities either of them might have developed.

She seems to blend best with high-powered holders of great wealth and with sycophants.

 

bigwillq

(72,790 posts)
50. If so, then Obama is a hypocrite for giving HRC a cabinet position
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:35 PM
Apr 2016

And don't tell me it's just politics. That's the problem. Politics.

If HRC wins in Nov, I hope she doesn't give Bernie a position in her White House, and vice versa.

Metric System

(6,048 posts)
52. This is incredibly delusional. And I can tell you one thing, Hillary acted with more class and grace
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:37 PM
Apr 2016

after conceding than Bernie will.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
53. I think they all play the game to a certain point
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:39 PM
Apr 2016

And they all know that's what they are doing and don't take anything personally. They are all lawyers and that tends to make a person understand you are just doing a job and it's not personal.

Obama doesn't seem the type of "loathe" anyone.

[IMG][/IMG]

 

jack_krass

(1,009 posts)
69. Why?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:50 PM
Apr 2016

FYI, It *is* possible to admire the president, and at the same time, despise the Clintons. I can personally attest to this.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
74. I love him, too.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 07:10 PM
Apr 2016

I've defended him from rightwingers since 2008 and worked my ass off for OFA from mid-2011 to Nov. 2012 to get him reelected.

Now please don't try to tie President Obama to Hillary Clinton. That's a terrible insult to Barack Obama. He is a far, far better person than Hillary Clinton.

MrWendel

(1,881 posts)
75. Really?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 07:18 PM
Apr 2016

So if I say NAFTA you won't go crazy and call him a failure of a president as Bernie supporters tend to do? And that It was wonderful of Bernie to try and primary him? Yeah. Obama love.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
83. Lies won't work, MrWendel.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 08:10 PM
Apr 2016

Like many Bernie supporters, I have a good feel for Obama's heart and understand what he has been up against.

Bernie did not try to primary Obama. Bernie never tried to run for president until last spring. Got that?

The casual conversation that fuels the ugly Clinton campaign lie was Bernie on the phone with a caller who was disturbed about Obama planning to cut SS benefits to people currently receiving them -- and Bernie thinking out loud of ways to get Obama's attention, one of those ways being somebody primarying him in 2012. Period.

So the liars took that innocuous little tidbit and ran with it. But it doesn't hold water.

Yes: I have always been an Obama supporter.

MrWendel

(1,881 posts)
89. Recreating...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:48 PM
Apr 2016

history I see. Your right, lies won't work. Unless you have a time machine, trying to change the record won't work either...

The 2012 Obama Campaign Took Bernie Sanders' Primary Threat Seriously
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/02/obama-campaign-took-bernie-sanders-primary-threat-seriously

I'm still waiting on your feelings on NAFTA. Does that make him less of a liberal or not?

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
90. Nope, telling it straight.
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 02:05 AM
Apr 2016

Your link is to a hit piece on Bernie Sanders featuring the "opinion" of David Plouffe who is in the bag for Hillary. It was full of shit. Bernie thought a primary challenge would bring the President around. Actually, progressive pressure worked: President Obama backed away from reducing Social Security benefits.

You keep asking about NAFTA. NAFTA was and is hell for working Americans, but NAFTA was Bill Clinton's work, not Obama's.

What do I think of President Obama's performance? I think he tried to do the best he could within a horribly compromised system -- compromised primarily by Reagan and Clinton. He accomplished some good things and his heart was in the right place. I think the 1% leans heavily on presidents, making it hard for them to function. And I think Barack Obama hoped he could bring people together. I honor him for trying.

MrWendel

(1,881 posts)
98. Every link...
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 01:37 PM
Apr 2016

including the New York Post is a piece of shit. Anything critical or challenging Bernie activates the hyper-sensitivity and hurt feelings in some of his supporters. Imagine an alternate universe where he actually has to face republicans.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
103. Bernie supporters are many and varied; we do not speak, act, and react in concert.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:41 PM
Apr 2016

More importantly and more to the point of your comment, Bernie Sanders is an entirely different person from most of his supporters. On a Venn diagram, we (Bernie and supporters) would overlap strongly in the area of values and world view, but we are widely divergent in life experiences and personality types. Unlike his supporters, Bernie is a very experienced politician with over a quarter of a century of experience in D.C. getting things done and being reelected every few years. He is not naive. He is not inexperienced. He has paid advisors who also know the ropes. He may not be as dirty as Hillary, but he knows all the types one encounters in D.C. and American politics.

Bernie will handle Republicans in his own way. His way may not be typical, but no one can deny that he has succeeded rather smashingly in coming out of obscurity nearly a year ago, with no corporate funding, no PAC money, no organization, to become a very serious, viable contender against Hillary Clinton. So he seems to know what he is doing.

As one of his supporters and a lifelong Democrat, I've encountered Republican insanity and bullshit forever, from Nixon through Reagan and the Bushes. I've spent the past eight years defending President Obama from their ignorant, racist, brainwashed attacks. Not all of his supporters are as devoted to President Obama as me, but many of them are, and all of us know about Republicans.

So I think Bernie and his supporters can deal with Republicans. Furthermore, I would expect the Democratic establishment to stand behind Bernie if he wins the nomination.

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
109. You made a half-way interesting statement
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 04:36 PM
Apr 2016

to which I replied rather fully.

Then you did what so many Hill supporters do: you ignored every interesting thing I said and resorted to what amounts to a school boy taunt: "So what? We're winning."

That is the point at which so many Hill supporters shrink down to near-invisibility and we determine that you're just not worth talking to.

Adios, MrWendel.

Jarqui

(10,130 posts)
59. I'm not sure of the top post.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:50 PM
Apr 2016

I'm positive I think the world of Obama.

My sense has been that Obama is supporting Hillary.

I don't know why he is and it kind of bothers me because I admire him so much.

I would also agree that the lying, deception, dirty tricks, overturning his rule on lobbyist money, the Clinton Foundation kickbacks, Sidney Blumenthal (and probably many more) are not things that he is happy about and some of those tainted "no drama Obama" administration - that otherwise didn't have a lot of scandal.

But maybe Obama feels Bernie is not a real Dem like many other Dems.

Again, I'm not sure.

As much as I like Obama, he cannot pick who I feel that I must support.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
60. Karl Rove and gang told a lot of stories, read some here on this thread,
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 05:58 PM
Apr 2016

Still have many running around still believing the birther crap and trying to blame that one on Hillary, those who still hold to the lie Obama is a Muslim and much more just plain crap. Does not make it true and to be plain honest all of these talking points do not change the fact Hillary served very well as SOS on the Obama administration, nominated Obama on the convention floor, both Hillary and Bill campaigned for Obama. Three truly dedicated Democrats who have worked for progressive ideas.

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
65. Sounds like wishful thinking or projection
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:26 PM
Apr 2016

maybe both.

I'm clueless about what Obama thinks about the Clintons

dragonfly301

(399 posts)
68. I have no clue who likes who but one thing that has been nagging me...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:34 PM
Apr 2016

why did Obama choose Comey to be FBI chief when Comey investigated the Clintons 20 years ago and had some not so complimentary things to say about Hillary.

ohheckyeah

(9,314 posts)
71. I guess since you have a tingle there is no need
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 06:56 PM
Apr 2016

to vote. I know male Sanders supporters who say it's not because she's a woman, but it is.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
73. It's not a feeling
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 07:05 PM
Apr 2016

It's a fact. Hillary ran the dirtiest, most racist campaign imaginable in the primary against President Obama.

 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
77. I have a feeling that President Obama loathes Sanders. He's the one acting like Obama should
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 07:30 PM
Apr 2016

have used a magic wand to get around Republican obstructionism. He's the one that want to rip his legacy, the ACA, apart.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,711 posts)
81. You can verify this.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 07:55 PM
Apr 2016
You can verify this.


I read 'True Believer' by David Axelrod and he wrote that Bill Clinton was the first person President Obama called to thank after he was re-elected in 2012


Because






This you do not have to verify:





But the other thing that I’ll always remember is the sheer strength, determination, endurance, stick-to-it-ness, never-give-up attitude that Hillary had during those primaries. I mean, we had as competitive and lengthy and expensive and tough primary fight as there has been in modern American politics, and she had to do everything that I had to do, except, like Ginger Rogers, backwards in heels. She had to wake up earlier than I did because she had to get her hair done. She had to, you know, handle all the expectations that were placed on her. She had a tougher job throughout that primary than I did and, you know, she was right there the entire time and, had things gone a little bit different in some states or if the sequence of primaries and caucuses been a little different, she could have easily won.

-Barack Obama

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/off-message-podcast-transcript-obama-218167#ixzz44uCcLVX8


Does he love her? How do I know. I can only judge his actions. I don't know him personally and I wouldn't presume to know what any other individual really thinks, even my closest friends.


Beacool

(30,250 posts)
86. I have a feeling that you don't know what you're talking about.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 08:35 PM
Apr 2016

For example, Bill Clinton's quote “Give me a break. This whole thing is the biggest fairy tale I’ve ever seen.” was aimed at Obama’s portrayal of Hillary as supporting Iraq war policies while he had been against the IWR (Obama was not in the Senate at the time).

"Bill Clinton, Jan. 8, 2008: It is wrong that Senator Obama got to go through 15 debates trumpeting his superior judgment and how he had been against the war in every year, enumerating the years, and never got asked one time, not once, well, how could you say that when you said in 2004 you didn’t know how you would have voted on the resolution, you said in 2004 there was no difference between you and George Bush on the war. And you took that speech you’re now running on off your website in 2004. And there’s no difference in your voting record and Hillary’s ever since. Give me a break. This whole thing is the biggest fairy tale I’ve ever seen."

Zambero

(8,965 posts)
87. Funny thing...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 08:38 PM
Apr 2016

For some reason, I do not recall that the 24/7 Rev. Wright / Bill Ayres echo chamber mantra put forth by the likes of Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly also included an endorsement by them of Hillary Clinton. Some revisionisms will actually stick when thrown against a wall. I'm not so sure about this one.

lovemydog

(11,833 posts)
93. I can't read minds and don't take body language too seriously
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 02:53 AM
Apr 2016

when people have worked closely together for four years.

I tend to prefer what the actual people say publicly. I take that over 'allegedly' and 'insiders say' types of stuff.

bigtree

(86,005 posts)
95. my god
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 08:15 AM
Apr 2016

...all these folks here banking on the notion that Barack Obama 'hates' the Clintons.

What a sad revolution.

FSogol

(45,521 posts)
96. There is a word for that: apophenia.
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 08:56 AM
Apr 2016

Your mind is making a pattern that is not supported by the evidence only because you want to believe the pattern. In prehistoric times you would have interpreted the rustling grass as a friend approaching only to have been eaten by a saber-tooth tiger.

Good luck with future pattern recognition!

 

senz

(11,945 posts)
106. I love new terms, so thanks for that.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:53 PM
Apr 2016
The human tendency to perceive meaningful patterns within random data
-- wikipedia

I like it; it's going to fun to explore. Can already see how this trait figures into art, literature, religion, and socially constructed reality.

However, it's possible that you are not perceiving the situation clearly. I said "possible." Only Obama himself can say what he thinks and feels, and we know he's not going to tell the vast American public, probably not even in an autobiography. Perhaps close associates might spill -- but we don't know when or where.

I will say this: everything I have seen in Obama's interactions with Hillary have appeared strained with forced joviality. They are adults; they're not going to bicker like children. But it does not have the relaxed body language one sees in people who have close, trusting relationships.

fwiw

FSogol

(45,521 posts)
107. Perhaps, but he did give her a pretty high level job when he didn't have to.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:57 PM
Apr 2016

While we cannot read his mind, he can view his actions better than a subjective reading of body language.
I doubt he has a problem with the Clintons.

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
97. I agree with the first part of your analysis
Tue Apr 5, 2016, 09:59 AM
Apr 2016

But President Obama has painted himself into a corner by siding with the establishment for a safer shot at his "legacy." His legacy now depends 100% on getting the Clintons into the WH again.

Tommy_Carcetti

(43,191 posts)
100. I have a feeling you are speculating on things that you can't actually prove.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:25 PM
Apr 2016

But by writing multiple paragraphs based on your mere conjecture, you want to come off as sounding confident in your baseless speculation.

bjo59

(1,166 posts)
101. I don't know about loathing but I bet he's no fan.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:28 PM
Apr 2016

Obama clearly gave H. Clinton the Secretary of State position in a deal (which are made all the time, obviously) but she couldn't have endeared herself to him by going against his wishes and paying Blumenthal a salary through the Clinton Foundation and using him as an advisor on the QT with the help of that computer in the basement.

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