2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumPeople can get really pissed off when they feel like the truth has been withheld from them.
So if Clinton is the nominee expect a lot of pissed off Democrats and Independents in the fall.
People, unlike political operatives and those that feed our corrupt system (e.g., corporate media hacks) do not like to be put in the position of trying to defend what they consider indefensible.
The Democratic Establishment is making a HUGE error in assuming that regular Americans view things the way they do.
When those fact ads hit it is not going to be pretty....
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Buddyblazon
(3,014 posts)Skwmom.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)People keep asking how can Clinton supporters be okay with this or that. The answer is they won't be once they find out about this and that.
Autumn
(45,107 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Autumn
(45,107 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)We aren't going to get the GS speeches unless she decides to release them after the convention. I think it is a really good move by Clinton. Sanders wins by staying on message. He left message over a month ago and his surrogates abandoned message even longer ago. The GS thing is just a distraction that doesn't hurt her. It won't be the same as finding out why Sanders paid half of the percentage in taxes with respect to what he made than I did, why he makes three times more than me yet gives less to charity, and what all of these deductions are for. Going to be fun.
Autumn
(45,107 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)I would like to know how he pays less than half in taxes as a percentage compared to me. Or why he finds himself to be in such a position to give less to charity than me. I don't make close to what he does.
Autumn
(45,107 posts)Maybe you just need a new CPA or a different version of turbo tax. Here's a pat on the back for your charity donations.
Merryland
(1,134 posts)is absolute bs
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)I just won't vote for a Republican or a Republican-light candidate, nor will I vote for a candidate that supports capital punishment or thinks that abortion is something that can be negotiated. I'll vote for a true progressive. I just hope that the candidate that I can vote for has a D next to their name.
Cursive
(89 posts)I hope people don't sit it out.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Jackie Wilson Said
(4,176 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)We're no longer scared. We have nothing left to lose.
SCOTUS? Obama's already nominated a center-right guy in Garland. Looks like it's going to be a pro-corporate justice no matter who wins.
Abortion? Hillary's willing to put that on the table, so that's not a differentiater.
LGBT rights? That genie is out of the bottle and not going anywhere. Corporations don't care who we marry or if we have abortions and the heads of many of them will boycott states that do this shit, like we're seeing in North Carolina and Mississippi.
Until and unless the Democratic Party tackles income inequality, climate change, fracking, low pay, raising the Social Security tax cap instead of cutting or means-testing like Hillary wants to do and stop taking money from the elite, many of its former members may move to third parties. The fundamental reasons for voting for Democrats have gone.
Jackie Wilson Said
(4,176 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)In the field to dismiss it as a few uninformed idiots online. Here is the truth cupcake, from both sides. People are pissed, and they know the system is rigged.
Kennedy once spoke about revolution. You might want to go look up that quote. It increasingly applies. Things like the Panama Papers are just confirmation of the level of corruption and the beginnings of an American Kleptocracy. Sorry for the 1 dollar word there.
LexVegas
(6,067 posts)JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)That's how elections work.
And angry threats are not going to change that reality.
Merryland
(1,134 posts)but this primary season reeks of cheating and corruption - and not from Bernie. This is not an angry threat. It's inevitable.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)If you have actual evidence of election fraud or election theft ... bring it forward.
And I said ACTUAL EVIDENCE ... not anecdotes, not innuendo.
The reason Bernie is losing is because his supporters sat on their asses since Obama took office and did NOTHING to develop a slate of more progressive alternatives to Hillary during those years.
In fact, Bernie wasn't even the first choice of the perpetually disgruntled. The "movement" wanted Warren but she didn't want the job. So, in the end, Bernie stepped in and said "Ok, I guess I'll do it."
The angriest of Bernie's supporters (a small but loud minority of his supporters) spent the last 8 years complaining about Obama.
They should have been doing the hard work of developing candidates they'd consider acceptably progressive and getting those people exposure nationally.
That's how you win elections.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)change it.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)... I'm simply telling you that, much like the PUMA movement in 2008, its a useless, impotent rage, pushed by a small minority, that will not impact 2016's general election.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)and apples. It is not the same thing. And once again, Clinton is NO Obama who had did not have the Clinton piles of baggage.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)... the election was stolen ... and I'm not voting for the eventual nominee."
You can try to spin it however you want.
Avalux
(35,015 posts)The status quo is desperately trying to ignore and/or downplay the growing wave of people who are waking up. Hillary Inc. says that she'll worry about uniting the party later; her buddies think the same thing.
There is no later for her or them - we are not going back to sleep. The tsunami is coming.
haikugal
(6,476 posts)Old Codger
(4,205 posts)As it has been known for a while is no more, the schism is beyond repair given the "leadership" that exists today. If clinton gets the nomination there are going to be a large amount of them standing there with their mouths agape wondering what the hell hit them...there may very well be a third party candidate, I doubt that Bernie will do that but there may be some who will try to run him as a write in anyway.. The real problem is that may very well leave the house and senate in charge of choosing our next president..
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)will drag themselves to the polls and vote, and then go back to home, couch and TV until 2020.
Avalux
(35,015 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)... so that "the people" will wake up, and the revolution can finally start.
That's my bet.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)VulgarPoet
(2,872 posts)"They'll get in line".
When Hell freezes over, buddy. When Hell freezes over, cats and dogs rain out of the sky, and the Browns win the Super Bowl.
WhaTHellsgoingonhere
(5,252 posts)Democrats are saying, "Today, we want more of the same" 52%-48. Based on Bernie's movement, however, I think a floundering Clinton admin (she's doomed) will reverse those numbers within a year, and come 2020, she's in for a world of hurt.
pampango
(24,692 posts)If this person were to be handed the nomination by the party establishment (super-delegates) his or her supporters would have every right to be royally pissed.
The primary has two months to go. As a Bernie supporter I hope he wins a majority of the popular vote and pledged delegates before it is over. If he does and the party establishment hands the nomination to Hillary I will be royally pissed. If Hillary wins a majority of the popular vote and pledged delegates, I will be disappointed. I'm sure her supporters would be royally pissed if the establishment handed the nomination to Bernie.