Why go to a rally, then not vote?

[ghostsinthemachine]

I am not getting that. the rallies weren't anything special. The one I went to (Sacramento Cal Expo, Bonnie Field) was hard to be at (security was especially harsh) and it seemed to me that you really had to want to be there. Not much in the way of music, no fireworks, just Bernie and a two second Danny Glover appearance, yet there were 20K people there. There were countless people registering people to vote at the event and they were doing a very brisk business. The crowd hardly skewed young, seemed a nice cross section of people, with young kids, pre-teens, as well as senior citizens (myself) and all kinds of people.

But now they say that those people, "the young people" that support Bernie at the rallies didn't vote? I don't get it. Going to the event is far more hassle than voting, especially if absentee voting, where you don't even have to turn off the video games to vote.

[reformist2]

1. They *did* vote. It's just that their votes aren't being counted. No biggie.

Just your run-of-the-mill election fraud that is becoming commonplace. Most people choose to ignore it, because we really don't know what to do about it.

[redstateblues]

29. I doubt that they voted. The youth vote is historically unreliable.

[still_one]

32. You keep spewing these falsehoods, even though multiple people have shown why your accusations

are all wet:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2171619

[scscholar]

52. This. Our votes don't count!

Here in Washington state we vote by mail, and since my county added a voting tracker, my vote hasn't counted a single time. So many votes are just thrown away.

[Lord Magus]

63. Bullshit. Their votes have been counted. It's just that rally-goers are a minority of voters. -nt-

[gollygee]

2. No I don't think that's it

It isn't that the people at the rallies didn't vote. It's that the vast majority of Hillary voters didn't bother going to any rallies.

[Jennylynn]

3. It's BS...as in bull shit not Bernie sanders. They voted.

The're trying to cover up the 'shenanigans'.

[brewens]

36. It would probably be more like the young people that went to the rallies also voted.

That just wasn't enough to make the youth vote overall very impressive. Most kids didn't go to the rallies either.

The rallies were impressive and Bernie's support is impressive. Given his late start, the media blackout, underhanded tactics by DWS and the DNC, Bernie and his supporters have done very well, so far.

[Jennylynn]

61. Indeed

[tonyt53]

4. A rally is more like a party. Voting takes responsibility.

[Hortensis]

27. Exactly! Rallies are group activities, voting is solitary.

[uponit7771]

5. Because it seems the focus was to establish what people think and not do something about it

... like vote and register people and drive them to the poles.

[Skink]

6. If we could vote by smartphone problem solved

We would rather voting be as difficult as possible.

[TwilightZone]

12. How exactly do you plan on safeguarding that?

There are already roughly a zillion accusations of voter fraud. If you allowed people to vote by smartphone, how are you going to ensure that the person voting is the person registered?

[Skink]

14. Same way the banks do it

[TwilightZone]

15. Banks get hacked all the time.

[Skink]

18. And ballots get lost or tossed

[TwilightZone]

21. Not 40 million at a time.

[Skink]

24. That would put an end to online banking

So it doesn't happen

[TwilightZone]

26. So, you have never heard of Target, I guess.

Intentional ignorance is not a compelling argument. At least try not to be so obvious about it.

[tonyt53]

28. When you live and die by your smartphone and Facebook, you expect it in all aspects of life.

[Whimsey]

13. That is the saddest thing I have ever read.

I have been voting for over 40 years. I have done it as my civic duty and never expected it to require no effort.

Your attitude is why Bernie lost. It was not worth your time to vote for him!

[Skink]

16. I voted early for Bernie. In the progressive state of Texas

Other states made it difficult

[NCTraveler]

17. I agree it needs to be easier.

But it is currently as easy if not easier than going to a rally.

[Gomez163]

30. Vote by selfie.

[HassleCat]

7. Depends on the state.

Well, much of that kind of talk is just BS, pure and simple, more conventional wisdom about why we must not challenge the decision of our party leaders. But some states have closed primaries, and very strict registration requirements, so it's not easy to vote in the primary.

[Eric J in MN]

8. The AP called the election over the night before CA voted.

Regarding earlier states, people who went to the rallies generally voted, but the number of voters is much bigger than rally attendance.

[tonyt53]

9. If that prevents someone from supporting the candidate of their choice, that is sad.

And no, Bernie had big rallies in IL, OH, and NY and got hammered. Hillary had a much better campaign plan.

[Eric J in MN]

23. NY has a freeze on joining the Democratic party

...of a year plus 25 days before the general election.

In the 1970s, 4 Supreme Court Justices including Thurgood Marshall thought that was unconstitutional, but 5 conservative Justices thought it was constitutional.



Illinois was close. HRC won by two points.

[tonyt53]

34. NY published it and it was in the papers and news. People ignored it. Voting takes responsibility.

NY, as well as most states, want a candidate to receive the votes of those that actually support them, not votes from people that want to tear them down. IL makes no difference if it was 2%. Bernie dropped a boatload of cash and guaranteed a win, same as in OH, and the same as in NY.

[JoePhilly]

37. So hillary voters knew she was going to win, and stayed home.

[Eric J in MN]

45. Yes, but Clinton was leading with absentee ballots.

HRC is more popular with older voters, and older voters are more likely to vote absentee.

[Hekate]

50. I toddled on over to the polling place, where I drew a Democratic ballot and voted for Hillary...

Hubby waffled about changing his registration from Green to Dem and finally decided to let it ride, and leave the Presidential slot blank, so as not to cancel out my vote, as he put it. Oh, and he uses mail-in ballots.

He was very glad she won, and led the toast when the results came in. Bernie kind of lost him along the way, and by the time Hillary gave her speech in San Diego, hubby was all in for Hillary.

So make of it what you will. "Older voters" does not mean senile -- maybe we just have more experience.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

10. Going to a rally with your friends is fun...Voting is a solemn and solitary activity...

I suspect that is why Bernie excelled at the caucuses. They are events where you can go with your friends and have fun.

[mythology]

11. There are several possibilities

First, maybe they didn't like what they heard, or didn't like it enough to turn out. Yes it's easier in states that have absentee voting, but you still have to make the effort to request it and then send it back. It's got multiple points of failure in that sense. Even for something as simple as returning a Netflix dvd will often take me a couple of days between forgetting to take it with me to work, or forgetting to drop it off on the way in or leaving too late to get it in that day's mail. And that's something I do far more often than voting.

And that's before considering the impact of voting rules in each state. Did somebody need to register as a member of the party, or just to vote? Did they request the correct ballot like in California? Did they actually register on time? Did they think they were registered but it turns out that they weren't?

Secondly, maybe they did vote, but didn't do enough outreach to their friends/family etc. Sanders certainly had bigger rallies than Clinton, but rally size alone isn't necessarily predictive of vote share. The Clinton campaign wasn't trying to have huge rallies as that's clearly not her strong suit as a candidate so comparing rally size when the campaign strategy wasn't the same for both campaigns.

Third, I remember hearing I believe the NPR Politics podcast that the Clinton campaign had what they considered a better follow up approach from campaign to voters to get affirmative commitment and schedule for prospective voters. The Clinton campaign would take voter information about how they intended to vote and then follow up which would help with the issues in my first point.

[panader0]

19. Five more days!

Why do you HRC people keep this up? Aren't you happy yet?
Keep it up. You and your ilk are driving voters away from Hill.

[redstateblues]

31. BSS are still in attack mode.

[Orangepeel]

20. 20,000 people per rally. How many rallies in CA? 20?

That's 400,000 votes. Bernie got a million and a half.

There were a lot of people at the rallies, but not enough to win, even if they all did vote (and there were some kids and some non-citizens)

[reformist2]

40. For every person who attends a rally, there are 10 more that will vote for a candidate.

It's absurd to think every Bernie voter could attend one of his rallies. And it's absurd to think that even though Hillary cannot fill a gymnasium, that she has some sort of "silent majority" out there ready to roll out on election day, like stealth ninjas.

[KK9]

49. Right and Wrong

You are right that not every Bernie supporter attended a rally, I know six Bernie supporters in my life and only one went to a rally. I do believe they voted, however, I know my grown sons did.

On the other hand, there certainly ARE many "stealth ninjas" for Hillary. I'm one and there are two others in my household, and I know many others. You couldn't pay me to go to a political rally.

I think the demographics are key...older voters (I'm one, mid-50s) don't have a lot of time to go to rallies, even if they wanted to. I I have a full-time job, a child still at home, an elderly mother living with me and property and animals to care for. I have time to vote, and always do, but never for a rally. I don't like crowds anyway, so I wouldn't go even if I had nothing else to do. I think many people my age are just done with big, noisy, crowded social scenes that were fun in our 20s.

[DrDan]

22. rally - skip voting - create conspiracies/whine/toss chairs - threaten to skip GE - demand respect

Bernie must be so proud

[msongs]

25. hillary did not get even one vote. bernie got them all and they were stolen. nt

[reformist2]

43. This is actually not too far from the truth.

[Hekate]

51. June 16. Tick tock.

[Lord Magus]

65. The sad thing is you actually believe that.

[qdouble]

33. Rallys are social events and theater. Not much different than going to hang out with your friends.

It's something to do. Voting and actually being politically involved beyond that is boring and meaningless to a lot of those folks.

[still_one]

35. Who said they didn't vote. They voted, it is just that there were more Hillary supporters

some may not like the fact that Hillary has a lot of support. Those who won't accept that will just have to deal with it:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2171619

[anotherproletariat]

38. Actually, they may have done more good by attending the rally then by voting.

Because of the large turnout at Bernie's early rallies, he got the attention of the media, which in turn gave him the exposure he needed to recruit more supporters. However, even if everyone of the people of his rallies had voted, he still would not have won.

[appalachiablue]

39. Sit on your assets, mail in your ballot. Easy, peasy.

[NorthCarolina]

41. You know, they didn't "follow the rules". Many apparently

thought you could just register and then show up and vote, being that this is the worlds shining example of representative Democracy and free elections and all, but WAIT...not so fast bucko. Maybe you checked the "I" box when you only thought you were checking the "D" box, those things are tricky you know. No? Well perhaps you only dreamed you registered because, surprise, you don't seem to be on our list. Hate that you had to stand in line for 16 hours though so let me get you a provisional ballot you can use. Hey, we got any more provisional ballots? I need some over here; ran out again.

[jillan]

42. How do you know they didn't? Why is this assumption that is not based on facts repeated

over and over and over and over by her supporters?

[MineralMan]

44. 20k people,sounds like a lot, but it's not really.

Most places with that kind of turnout have large voting populations, and 20,000 doesn't represent a large percentage. Also, people drive a long way to go to those events, some even from neighboring states.

Probably a high percentage of them did vote, but so did far more who went to no rallies at all. It's a mistake to draw conclusions from such events. Enthusiasm is important, but population matters more.

[bjo59]

46. Kinda like "why go to the voting booth if the vote has already been decided," right?

[pnwmom]

47. Some went to multiple rallies but could only vote once; some went with their friends

as a social activity, even though they weren't registered to vote (and didn't bother later); some went out of curiosity; some weren't old enough to vote. (Those young kids and preteens you mentioned, as well as middle schoolers and high school students -- they all took up space in the rallies.)

Lots of reasons.

[justiceischeap]

48. I love this idea that rally size indicates vote amounts

For every 20k at the rally, I'd guess 5k aren't old enough to vote or aren't eligible to vote in some form or another (felony convictions for example). Also, as already pointed out, the reason why "youngsters" get such a bad "rap" is because they are notoriously fickle when it comes to actually voting. They'll get behind a candidate and idolize them like a rock star but that doesn't mean much if they don't make it to the polls.

The other thing people seem to discount is the fact that since Hillary didn't have huge rallies, that people don't support her. I support her and I've never been to a single rally. I can get all the information I need about her without leaving my house.

Also, as has been mentioned several times but, again, seems to be discounted, is that a lot of Clinton supporters felt they'd be harangued if they publicly stated their support for her, so they stayed silent but did what actually mattered, they voted.

[reformist2]

54. I know, right? Those demonstrations on the mall in DC? Totally meaningless.

[justiceischeap]

55. There's a difference between demonstrations and political rallies

BUt the same result will play out if action doesn't follow.

[libdem4life]

53. Just plain partisan drivel, I'm afraid. I would Never go through this for

any candidate...and I always vote. TV is good enough for me. But the level of grassroot support and the youth element..and the silly notion that young folk and older folk, as well, just did that to fool some pollsters...I don't think so.

Newsflash. Millenials are not stupid, please pass it on. Probably mostly Boomers singing this song of woe. Many of us remember the Hell No, We Won't Go days and wonder what happened. But then I didn't get into the rioting and such that happened in some places, either. We just hung Richard Nixon in effigy at his alma mater. That felt right.

[GoneFishin]

56. It's a lame-ass white wash story to cover up the election fraud that is laid bare by the enormous

popularity and enthusiasm for Bernie.

They will say anything to avoid the obvious conclusion that Bernie was cheated through election fraud. The record breaking red shifts in nearly every state exit poll would be enough to condemn any election in another country. But not in this country where the media is complicit in the cover-up because the candidate being cheated advocates policies that nibble away a little bit of their profits.

[reformist2]

62. The average US voter has no idea how exit polls are used to detect election fraud.

It's not just that our media won't tell them. Most people here are just not interested in serious things. In America, it's all bread and circuses, all the time.

[Recursion]

57. I'm sure most of them did vote, but a huge rally is tiny in comparison to a state's turnout

He got, what, 80K people in San Jose or wherever? CA primary turnout was in the millions.

[MyNameGoesHere]

58. Well voting doesn't have a 5 star Yelp review

so it's really not worth going.

[itsrobert]

59. Do you understand 20,000 at a rally is a very small fraction of the potential voters?

All the attendees at all the Bernie's rally is still a small fraction of voters.

Do you not understand that?

Hillary won fair and square. Please stop this nonsense.

[onecaliberal]

60. 2.5 million votes NOT being counted in California.

How is a fucking state called with 2 million votes uncounted?

[Ford_Prefect]

64. I believe the term you are looking for is "The Powers That Be".

Change is not in their interest so the votes for change did not count, nor were they counted.