Most unbelievable part of Clinton email story

[kcjohn1]

Is that the 30,000 deleted by Clinton was personal. She handed 30,000 emails to State Department. So for every work email, she had a personal one? How many wedding, yoga, etc emails could there be? I don't work for government but I get tens and sometimes hundreds of work emails in day but only handful at most of personal emails.

I would imagine good chunk of deleted emails are work related. Clinton might have thought wiping server we would never know but FBI is looking at backup IT servers. In addition to classified issue there will be issue around deleting work product content.

http://www.businessinsider.com/hillary-clinton-it-firm-platte-river-says-email-backups-are-likely-2015-8

[monmouth4]

1. I may be a Bernie supporter but I am getting so tired of these childish innuendos re

Hillary and the e-mails. Stop and think for a moment....As SOS and even before that, Hillary knew she would be running for President...Do you honestly think she would be so careless and non-thinking to e-mail or ignore important documents???? How about going after one or two of the nimrods on republican on their "work product."

[kcjohn1]

3. Its precisely

That she knew she was running for president that this is an issue. If she wasn't she wouldn't give a shit and would not have gone great lenghs to shield public records.

Putting your head in sand is not going to make this go away. Aside from the relevancy and content of deleted emails, if sizeable portion of these emails are not personal, there could be legal issues for Clinton, and at best there will be ethical and political issues.

IMO I have hard time believing that the 30,000 emails deleted are all personal in nature.

[jberryhill]

7. Okay, you have a hard time believing that

Anything else?

As a political issue, I'm going to bet that voters rank things like "the economy" well above "trumped up go-nowhere suspicions about Hillary Clinton's email".

"Aside from the relevancy and content of deleted emails"... relevance to what? The secret orders to cover up Vince Foster's murder? The "stand down" order to Benghazi? Or any of the other flavor-of-the-day aspersions?

But, hey, call the press "kcjohn1" has a hard time believing someone can send or receive 20 personal emails a day over a period of four years.

[kcjohn1]

8. Ask anyone

Who works for large organization. What is the ratio of personal to work emails? Hillary wants us to believe she sent and received as many work emails as personal.

I call BS on that. In couple of months FBI will be able tell us if her claim is true.

[jberryhill]

11. You mean, ask the CEO of the large organization, who also happens to be a politician

This isn't some cubicle job and, yeah, politicians keep up a lot of social contact as part of who they are and what they do.

I gather you are new to the "let's go after Hillary on trumped-up bullshit" game.

[whatthehey]

12. So let's get this straight

Complaint a) She used a personal email server not a State Dept one! (like the two SoS's before her and perfectly ok under regulations at the time).

Complaint b) She got a bunch of personal email on that State...whoops personal email server! (do you get more work emails overall than personal ones if they went to the same address? And even if so, do you have as extensive a personal network as HRC does after decades in high-ranking circles?)

You can't groundlessly moan about b without understanding the impact of groundless moan a.

[wordpix]

55. how come no one is concerned with other candidates using private servers?

Jeb Bush is one, and probably anyone who is/has been gov

[emulatorloo]

2. Maybe she has a better social life than you or I do.

Am with the poster above, it doesn't fucking matter. It is Republican smoke being blown up our asses.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

4. 30,000 private e-mails over four years comes out to about twenty a day.

That doesn't seem extraordinary?

Am I missing something?

[kcjohn1]

6. Ratio

She is saying for every work email, there was a personal one. 30,000 personal / 30,000 work.

We don't have dates these servers were operational, but if 4 years, on avg 20 Emails for work seem low to me. I'm not an executive and I get probably on average 30-50 emails per day. She headed one of largest organizations in the world.

[OregonBlue]

10. I really could care less what was in her emails. It's all a big political game. Total crap.

[TwilightGardener]

13. Yes, total crap. Who cares what these people do? They're not accountable to us. Their records

belong to THEM, not us. We should trust them implicitly--if they're Democrats. We have no need to see any of it. None of it should be archived. And illegally holding classified material on unauthorized systems is only a potential national security problem if you're some schmuck nobody heard of. I love your logic.

[whatthehey]

19. Work emails are generally speaking normally distributed on a rank axis howeever

The people who get the most emails are middle management, because they get copied on all the daily status reports, all the interminable strings that go:

"we're out of component X, machine down in an hour"
"It's in QA waiting test results"
"when can we get the hardness test done"
"Gimme 5 minutes"
"Rc 55 will release now"
"Thanks John"

and are copied to a dozen or so people. Ever notice they are NOT copied to the CEO? Nor are the jokes, the CYA subordinate responses, the hurry up questions to subordinates copying their supervisors, and so on?

Just like forklift drivers get few work emails, so do CEOs because people copying them are really careful not to waste their time and be a nail that needs hammering down. If you send anything to mahogany row you do it either because

a) they asked you to
b) It's a problem filtered and refined through every management layer between you and them and is a single executive summary of a major issue
c) You are close enough to the corner office yourself to interact freely with them, which is a pretty damn small number even in huge companies


In various companies I've been all 3. Now in a huge corp, I am not close to c) and would no more email the guys who are than turn up to work naked.

[dsc]

59. well yeah

you are missing that she did a lot of stuff on the phone and with paper due to alot of her work actually being classified. I would imagine she had way more paper and way less email than many normal occupations.

[TwilightGardener]

5. It's a big fucking deal. Republicans didn't create this problem for her. She invented it

all on her own. I would never want someone so incredibly stupid and arrogant as President.

[Godhumor]

22. Well, that stupid and arrogant person is overwhelmingly likely to be our GE candidate

Hopefully, you can swallow some of that anger when it comes time to vote for her against whatever member of the clown car manages to secure the Republican nomination.

[TwilightGardener]

23. I won't support stupid and arrogant under any circumstances. That eliminates all Republicans.

And maybe a Democrat.

[Godhumor]

26. Hmm. Well, I like your posts in GD, quite a bit. Hope to not lose you

When DU switches into support the nominee mode after the primaries.

[emulatorloo]

51. Then why are you supporting Trey Gowdy and the Benghazi Committe?

[TwilightGardener]

54. You win an award for connecting dots that can't logically be connected.

Although actually, I don't care about Benghazi in the political-damage sense (stand-down orders and videos and other nonsense), but I also think the GOP clowns can't investigate it too much because it will blow back on too many from both parties and most government agencies--we were definitely up to some hinky shit between Libya and Syria, Stevens was being used somehow, and the CIA/Petraeus/DOD/Panetta know more about it than Clinton. No one ever went seriously after those guys, and they never will.

[emulatorloo]

58. Well, the Benghazi committee originally manufactured the email 'scandal"

It pretty much originated with them.

Naive DU'ers were breathlessly quoting Trey Gowdy's every word here about email-gate, seeming not understanding that Gowdy's default setting is lying about Democrats.

Those are the dots I connected.

I think we are agreed on how Republicans are too corrupt to investigate. I think we agree on a lot of things.

However, Republicans are very good at lying, good at fabricating 'scandals'. I'm an Iowan so I'm especially distrustful of Chuck Grassley, remember how he promoted the 'kill grandma' lie about Obama care? Seeing how he's inserted himself in this makes me even more suspicious.

[razorman]

57. I think you are right. HRC has been after this for so long,

I do not believe that anything short of an indictment will cause her to pull out of the race. Perhaps not even that would be enough. Besides, what are our alternatives at this point? I read an editorial yesterday, saying that it is now too late for the Democratic party to change horses, as it were. Also, we cannot count on the Repubs to nominate a complete doofus this time. The public may or may not see through them. The nomination is one thing; the GE another.

[blm]

29. Actually, she followed similar path as two previous Republican SoS and no Republican

cared one whit about their emails, so…..yeah…..Republicans DID create this as a problem for ONLY HRC - and, I say that as someone who is no fan of Clintons.

[TwilightGardener]

33. How is the DOJ "Republican"? This matter was referred to them by the IG's. Are you accusing the

IG's of a partisan witch hunt? Hillary's problem doesn't stem from holding a private account, it stems from setting up her own SERVER, for EVERYTHING, and not turning any of it over until years after her tenure. Setting up your own server is a different ball game. Holding classified materials on it is a legal matter for the FBI. Can you or anyone show that Colin Powell or Condi Rice trafficked in unmarked classified info on private accounts, or otherwise mishandled it?

[blm]

68. How would we know? Who ever went after them with a fine-toothed comb?

,

[leveymg]

66. Where does the cycle of backscratching stop? In 2032 - Pres. C. Clinton succeeds Bush III?

[blm]

67. Not part of my point - GOP lawmakers *acting* concerned about HRC's emails had NOTHING

to say about the similar practices of recent Republican Secs of State.

That is all.

[Motown_Johnny]

9. I thought it was the 2 phones excuse.

I remember lots of people here defending that nonsense.

Now it seems like the good old days.

I also wonder just who the "them" are that HRC won't get down in the mud with and who are playing politics with national security. She said that as part of the same sentence as turning over the server to the DOJ. Is she really accusing the DOJ of playing politics with national security? If not, then who exactly is she talking about?

[KMOD]

21. Republicans

[Motown_Johnny]

31. Which Republicans?

It is the Department of Justice that is investigating the server and how her emails were handled.

[KMOD]

32. Grassley, for one.

HRC willingly gave the Justice Department her server, because Grassley is having a fit over nonsense. The Justice Department will put his worried mind at ease.

[Motown_Johnny]

36. Lets hope so.

But just one classified email will screw the pooch.

[TwilightGardener]

42. The emails had to be turned over because...they didn't exist at the State Dept. and Congressional

inquiries and FOIA's were being ignored. They existed in Hillaryland, and at some company in Denver, and in thumb drives, although they were supposed to have been turned over to the government and archived. And then once the paper print-outs were turned over and the State Dept. started to release them, it was discovered that the State Dept. was stupidly releasing, or preparing to release, information that the intelligence community considered classified. And then Inspector Generals had to get involved, and then they had to refer the matter to the DOJ, and the FBI. It snowballed, because that's what happens when you try to hide shit.

[KMOD]

45. information that Grassley considers classified.

Everyone else, not so much.

[TwilightGardener]

46. Um, no. It's the intelligence agencies that consider the stuff to be classified.

They have intel people at State and from various other departments going through and flagging her emails, Grassley has nothing to do with that.

[KMOD]

47. He is the one who asked that her server be handed over.

Because of one of his emails was forwarded to her staff. An email he considers classified but others disagree.

She willingly handed over her server and thumb drive because he is having a fit.

[TwilightGardener]

49. Actually, the server and thumb drive had to be secured because it potentially held

classified info. Looks like she wiped her server clean, although back in March she declared she wouldn't turn it over. But the thumb drive was held by a guy who isn't necessarily allowed to receive and hold classified info. That's another legal issue on top of the server. Republicans may be enjoying this, but Hillary made the bed she's lying in now.

[KMOD]

50. Grassley, Gowdy and Issa's foolish email hunt,

doesn't worry me at all.

[emulatorloo]

53. Republicans lie, it is what they do.

DU'ers used to understand that. But recently naive DU'ers are promoting these right wing fabricated scandals. Clinton Cash, Benghazi Committee. I even saw Newbusters used as a source a few days ago.

[Motown_Johnny]

62. We understand, but Hillary and her campaign need to deal with it

in a reasonable fashion.

This entire thing has been mishandled from the start. It took 8 days to come up with the crazy "I didn't want to carry two phones" excuse for the private server... Eight Freaking Days for that nonsense!

Not turning over the server was stupid. She/they could have cooperated and come up with some neutral party to go through it and delete anything personal. Doing it themselves looks bad and if something that was deleted should not have been, and is recovered, her campaign might end right then and there.

Even if she did nothing wrong, she is acting guilty. Her trustworthy numbers are bad enough now. This behavior just makes it all worse.

This entire mess should never have happened. Her campaign has proved it can't deal with Republican lies and that it is not up to the task of winning the Presidency.

[karynnj]

65. actually, if she wanted no problems, she could have on her own given all the work email

To the State Department as she was leaving office. She knew there were FOIA requests that should apply. Had she done this giving them the messages electronically, it is likely no one would ever have known that she had her email on a private server. Even had someone noticed the address, the SD could have honestly ssid that she then archived them

[emulatorloo]

70. I see your points about mishandling and they are good points.

Except for the last one; she's been battling made up crap since the '90s and managed to thrive despite the rightwing claims. So I think we will have to wait a little while to see how it plays out

[Motown_Johnny]

71. But this was a freebie

We all know that they have been planning their attacks for years. This one was a bonus she just handed to them.

If she is the nominee it is going to get much much worse.

That is why her trustworthy numbers are so important. Doing damage with this unforced error is more serious than just the immediate scandal.

She can't defend herself from their lies when a majority of voters think she may be the one lying.

[Motown_Johnny]

61. Obviously down in the mud playing politics with national security

Well, somebody is.....

[stevenleser]

14. People at that level? They get a ton more personal emails than work emails.

This is really something you don't know or are you joking with us?

[TwilightGardener]

15. She mingled them on one server to be able to claim her privacy on ALL of it.

And then, after two years, slowly started turning over print-outs that she chose herself, and we're just supposed to look the other way. What a fucking scam, I can't believe anyone's defending this.

[stevenleser]

16. Your attempt to get in Clinton's head means nothing. nt

[TwilightGardener]

18. Not an attempt, she actually deleted shit and hand-selected what to turn over, claiming that she

didn't want people to see her "yoga positions". I wonder which of her underlings will face criminal charges on the classified breaches? Huma Danger?

[hollysmom]

17. obviously you know nothing about wedding arranements.

I did a 50th anniversary and it took up most of my e-mail and even leaked into my office e-mail when people tried to get in touch with me. My wedding predated e-mail, hard to believe and took up my whole phone bill and mail.

[JoePhilly]

20. Were there any leaks?

Did secret info get out?

Any CIA agents exposed?

Troop movements?

Was there some terrible event caused by Hillary's scary email server??

Apparently running around screaming SCANDAL is enough to create one.

Even though nothing actually happened.

Reminds me of the RW screaming about Ebola or the IRS.

[TwilightGardener]

24. Having to turn over servers and thumb drives to the FBI is what makes it a scandal.

Unless you think Obama is just out to get her, or that Repubs control the DoJ.

[JoePhilly]

37. Why?

What exactly is the FBI looking for?

Do we expect to find emails showing she had Vince Foster and Chris Stevens killed?

They are evaluating the security of the system. Of course the ultimate test of that would be "was anything leaked?"

Interestingly, about a year ago, the official email system for the State Department was hacked. I'm sure you heard about it.

oh btw ... the FBI is an independent, non-poitical part of the government that is not controlled by the President. Most Democrats know that if you did not.

[TwilightGardener]

39. I don't think you have a grasp on any of this, frankly.

[JoePhilly]

41. My hair does not combust as quickly as it does for some of you.

Perhaps its my shampoo.

[leveymg]

28. Geez, where have I heard some of those same arguments? You must think Snowden's a-okay?

Or, maybe you're simply applying multiple standards?

[JoePhilly]

34. No, didn't think Snowden was ok ... he leaked info ...

... without even trying to determine if it would put lives in danger.

Now ... let's compare that to Hillary's email. Nothing. Was. Leaked.

Nothing. No leaks.

I suspect however that you would have been THRILLED if Hillary's emails were included in what Snowden leaked.

Ironic, you are very upset about information that WAS NOT LEAKED, and yet thrilled about info that WAS LEAKED.

You are the one using multiple standards. I'm against leaks, and not upset about things that were not leaks.

[leveymg]

48. How do you know any of these things didn't occur? There hasn't been an investigation of HRC, yet.

She may not have leaked, but she may well have revealed classified information by putting classified materials through an unsecured server. That accomplishes exactly the same thing as leaking. Is it really better that she did it to evade compliance with federal laws (the 1950 Federal Records Act and the FOIA Act)?

Think about it.

[Motown_Johnny]

38. Mishandling classified information is against the law.

It doesn't need to get out to be against the law.


Your argument is basically the same as the guy caught doing 90 mph in a 55 mph zone. As long as there wasn't an accident, it must be fine.

Sorry.

[JoePhilly]

40. Ah ... so she's accused of a crime I guess.

Using the same email model as her predecessor.

Actually, the guy doing 90 is doing so intentionally.

Let's pretend there are 10 emails with classified info out of 30,000. Is that the same thing as intentionally doing 90 in a 55?

Only if one is deranged.

[Motown_Johnny]

43. So many things wrong with that post.

First of all, nobody accused her of anything. I simply stated a fact as a rebuttal to your argument.

Next, she set up the server intentionally. She took the risk that something like this might happen.

Just one classified email would be a crime and could easily end her campaign.

Yes, her predecessors (Powell and Rice both) used private email servers. Are our standard so low for her that what Bush administration officials is the bar? Neither Powell or Rice tried to become President. If one had, he or she would have been put under the same scrutiny that Sec. Clinton deserves. This speaks directly to her judgement, which appears to be really really bad.

[TwilightGardener]

44. No, unless you can show that Condi Rice set up her own email server and held classified info on it.

Private email accounts are not the same as an entire server system set up to be beyond reach of: Congress, the White House, the people, political enemies, what have you.

[panader0]

25. As a Bernie supporter, I think the e-mail kerfuffle is a bunch of hooey.

There are much more important issues to deal with. Like Benghazi!!11 for goodness sakes! "sarcasm"

[leveymg]

27. You haven't been paying attention or you're more of a Hillary supporter than you realized. n/t

[emulatorloo]

56. I support Bernie, but have zero belief in Chuck Grassley, Trey Goudy, Issa, Benghazi Committee

Faux News, The Arkansas Project, etc etc. I wouldn't believe them in their tongues came notarized. Telling lies and fabricating scandals is what they do.

I am going to have zero tolerance for their lies when they start fabricating shit about sanders. Like wise I have zero tolerance when they lie about any Democrat.

[leveymg]

60. Absoutely agree. All the GOP corn dogs ever do is poison the well for real investigators

This goes back to the House and Senate investigations of BCCI and Iran-Contra. The House investigation was a whitewash which the GOP turned into the partisan mush of Whitewater and Filegate. Meanwhile, the Kerry Committee produced volumes of valuable information about BCCI, the takeover and looting of S&Ls by (among others) members of the Bush family working with the Saudi Bin Laden-Bin Mahfouz clans, and details about how BCCI was set up and operated with the cooperation of the CIA to fund the Pakistani nuclear program and Saudi paramilitary groups (not yet known by the name, al-Qaeda).

[emulatorloo]

69. Oh yeah, thanks for reminder of those days. Kerry Committee did a hell of a job,

And all that solid investigation was swept under the rug.

[ismnotwasm]

30. Yawn

[Mike Nelson]

35. Probably, thousands about the wedding...

...less about yoga...

I deleted 400 yesterday!

[obnoxiousdrunk]

52. This could be HUGH AND SERIES !!!!

[HereSince1628]

63. The most troubling part for me, was Clinton didn't hand the server over until an IG reported.

Which is to say Clinton didn't act until there was a real threat of her campaign getting harmed.

I don't see it as a matter of emails. I don't see the emails as criminal.

I see it as a matter of handling federal documents that are required to be archived.

The most powerful outcome is the irony. Clinton wants to be champion of the people, until she's asked to cooperate with what the government of the people requires of her in order to serve the people.

[pnwmom]

64. The non-State Department emails include political and other personal emails.

And people were sending her many emails.

It's not hard to imagine how she had that many.