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Sun Nov 16, 2014, 12:56 PM

UPDATED: Vote Deadline Extended to Name Our Populist Movement within Democratic Party

Last edited Sat Nov 22, 2014, 04:40 PM - Edit history (8)

This discussion thread was locked by demwing (a host of the Populist Reform of the Democratic Party group).

UPDATED: Poll Deadline Has Been Extended From 3 Days to 2 Weeks
Formerly Titled: Olympus Isn't All About Thunder - Time to Settle on a Name and Move On

Olympus in reference to the recent thread titled Stealing Thunder. Thunder represents the lightning to come. We need to concentrate on the lightning - the policies we want to see enacted, and how we want to best educate our fellow Americans so they are informed and motivated voters (I have suggested PSAs, mass e-mails, phone calls, etc.). We need to get beyond the thunder and get to the lightning - defining ourselves. Americans need to know everything from Social Security is solvent to we want Universal Healthcare (spelling out what that is), and "Obamacare" was a conservative think tank idea that does not go far enough because it leaves people without healthcare.

I have been open to discussion on naming, but at some point this discussion must end. Throughout this discussion I have supported the Roosevelt Party (represented by a blue rose and in honor of the three notable Roosevelts in our history), The Democratic Wing (represented by a blue wing), or the Party of Social Responsibility (symbol open to discussion). All have their strengths and weaknesses, and there have been other suggestions.

In an attempt to resolve this issue I have created a poll that gives everyone three days to vote on various name I have seen suggested. I would like consent to adopt whatever name wins in the end. If I neglected to add one of the many names suggested over the last days that can be resolved by write-in votes, which will be counted and compete against those listed.


THIS POLL IS TO NAME A NEW POPULIST MOVEMENT WITHIN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, NOT TO RENAME THIS GROUP OR FORM A THIRD PARTY. WHAT FORM THIS MOVEMENT TAKES IS UP TO THE GROUP. I BELIEVE WE SHOULD FOCUS MAINLY ON EDUCATION AND OUTREACH TO VOTERS AND IDENTIFYING/SUPPORTING PROGRESSIVES IN THE PARTY WHILE EXPOSING REPUBLICANS IN DEMOCRATIC CLOTHING.

My vote is for The Roosevelt Party: The records of FDR, Eleanor Roosevelt, and Teddy Roosevelt taken together cover many of the ideals liberals hold dear. While those ideals were limited by the era they lived in, the name Roosevelt can help us lead the Democratic Party back to the left through educating our fellow Americans how socialism is one of the things that makes America great. Liberals should be known as Roosevelt Democrats, as should politicians who have records in line with liberal ideals.

ManyGoldstein's Argument (Post 23):

Roosevelt Democrats

I think the name, like a good headline, should:

1. cut through the noise (make people say "huh?" when they first see it)
2. say something about what we're up to
3. be a good way to start a conversation with people
4. fulfill 1-3 in a way that they work for all Americans, not just political junkies

"Democratic Wing" would work great for political junkies, but I think it will confuse others (i.e., doesn't meet 4 above).

"Roosevelt Democrats" is great for 1-4. The Roosevelts in question did so many great things, great Progressive/Liberal things, and the results were fantastic: those are stories that I like to tell. "Why am I a Roosevelt Democrat? Do you know that in FDR's first term, because of Liberal policies, unemployment halved and the economy grew at three or four times the rate it's growing now? Let's talk about the policies that made this happen, and why we need them again today."

"They did X and it worked. Everytime X has been tried, it worked. Doesn't it make sense to do X?" Those are the arguments that win people's hearts and minds.

Both Teddy and Franklin were flawed, as are all people, and there will be some nitwits (even on DU!) that will fling poo at 'em. But both, as they aged, improved, and also one person's poison is another person's meat. For example, some people (not me) feel that the US developing atomic weapons was an awful thing, but to others it could be seen as a sign that Roosevelt Democrats will do what's needed, when needed.

And by including Teddy, Franklin, and Eleanor, it sends a great message about inclusion: Democrats and Republicans, men and women. They were not people of color, but did work hard to advance the ball for all Americans. Whatever we call ourselves, we'll not perfect America either, but we'll fight hard for all.

14 votes, 1 pass | Time left: Poll closed
The Roosevelt Party
1 (7%)
The Democratic Wing
5 (36%)
The Populist Progressive Party
3 (21%)
The Citizen's Reform Caucus
0 (0%)
The Progressive Caucus
2 (14%)
The Social Democrats
1 (7%)
Other (Please Declare Your Preferred Name in Comment)
2 (14%)
The Populist Reform Group
0 (0%)
Show usernames
Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

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Reply UPDATED: Vote Deadline Extended to Name Our Populist Movement within Democratic Party (Original post)
EEO Nov 2014 OP
Jackpine Radical Nov 2014 #1
L0oniX Nov 2014 #2
EEO Nov 2014 #32
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #62
KoKo Nov 2014 #3
F4lconF16 Nov 2014 #8
EEO Nov 2014 #20
Jackpine Radical Nov 2014 #38
merrily Nov 2014 #58
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #86
merrily Nov 2014 #87
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #88
merrily Nov 2014 #89
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #90
merrily Nov 2014 #94
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #95
merrily Nov 2014 #96
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #93
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #92
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #97
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #98
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #100
99Forever Nov 2014 #4
GeorgeGist Nov 2014 #5
grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #9
EEO Nov 2014 #22
EEO Nov 2014 #21
Jim Lane Nov 2014 #6
EEO Nov 2014 #31
PADemD Nov 2014 #7
Dragonfli Nov 2014 #10
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #42
NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #11
KoKo Nov 2014 #12
EEO Nov 2014 #16
Martin Eden Nov 2014 #13
JimDandy Nov 2014 #14
EEO Nov 2014 #15
Martin Eden Nov 2014 #17
Martin Eden Nov 2014 #18
EEO Nov 2014 #19
MannyGoldstein Nov 2014 #23
Dragonfli Nov 2014 #24
sabrina 1 Nov 2014 #26
KoKo Nov 2014 #29
EEO Nov 2014 #30
EEO Nov 2014 #27
Eleanors38 Nov 2014 #25
EEO Nov 2014 #28
Eleanors38 Nov 2014 #33
NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #34
Eleanors38 Nov 2014 #39
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #40
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #35
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #43
demwing Nov 2014 #59
peacebird Nov 2014 #76
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #79
demwing Nov 2014 #80
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #83
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #103
merrily Nov 2014 #85
Scootaloo Nov 2014 #36
demwing Nov 2014 #65
demwing Nov 2014 #72
cantbeserious Nov 2014 #37
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #41
NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #44
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #45
nxylas Nov 2014 #46
LeftInTX Nov 2014 #74
nxylas Nov 2014 #75
LeftInTX Nov 2014 #99
NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #47
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #48
nxylas Nov 2014 #52
EEO Nov 2014 #66
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #69
EEO Nov 2014 #70
Zorra Nov 2014 #49
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #50
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #51
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #73
EEO Nov 2014 #67
demwing Nov 2014 #53
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #54
demwing Nov 2014 #55
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #56
EEO Nov 2014 #68
merrily Nov 2014 #57
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #60
merrily Nov 2014 #61
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #63
merrily Nov 2014 #64
merrily Nov 2014 #78
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #81
merrily Nov 2014 #84
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #91
demwing Nov 2014 #71
peacebird Nov 2014 #77
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #82
TheNutcracker Nov 2014 #101
EEO Nov 2014 #104
Maedhros Nov 2014 #102
EEO Nov 2014 #105
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #106
Cosmic Kitten Nov 2014 #107
demwing Nov 2014 #108
scarletwoman Nov 2014 #109
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #110
demwing Nov 2014 #111
rhett o rick Nov 2014 #112
tokenlib Nov 2014 #113
demwing Nov 2014 #114

Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 12:59 PM

1. OK. (nt)

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 01:07 PM

2. PPP - Populist Progressive Party.

 

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #2)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 08:46 PM

32. Added to poll.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #2)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 05:36 PM

62. Another plea not to use "Party" in the name. It sounds like a third party.

 

The Roosevelt Party for example. Is that the Roosevelt Party of the Democratic Party? I suggest using "Wing" or "Caucus".

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 01:24 PM

3. I don't see any rush for a name...but this was a good one suggested:

"Progressive or Populist Reform Caucus"

rhett o rick 's Post

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1277434

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Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 03:03 PM

8. I second this. nt

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Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:16 PM

20. Added to poll.

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Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 09:56 AM

38. Same initials as "People's Republic of China," fwiw.

Might carry some subliminal negative value, depending on where one intends to use the name.

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Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 03:16 PM

58. I like Populist Caucus.

Progressive is way too muddled a word, IMO. Everyone from Hillary to Sanders uses it to describe his or her own policies--and the head of the Progressive Policy Institute was a DLC founder who later signed the PNAC letter.

"Reform" sends shivers up my spine these days. It never means anything good for people anymore. Welfare "reform," entitlement "reform," and so on. Seems to have become a euphemism for stick it to the 99%.

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Response to merrily (Reply #58)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:30 AM

86. I could live with Populist Caucus. However, I would like to continue

 

my pitch for Progressive. We can't let others steal the meaning. There are a lot of conservatives that are DEmocrats but we will fight to keep the meaning of Democratic, never considering changing the name just because some Conservatives are using it.

The more I think about it the better I like Populist. And either Caucus or Coalition would work for me.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #86)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:34 AM

87. I don't think they stole the meaning. I think liberals misunderstood it as a synonym for liberal.

The Progressive Party was formed by the left wing of the Republican Party. I think that is exactly why DLCers started throwing the term around.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1277646#post85

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Response to merrily (Reply #87)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:48 AM

88. I am not an expert but think differently on this. The Republican Party of Teddy Roosevelt was the

 

more liberal of the two parties and the Progressive Party was made up of the left of the Republican Party. Todays DLC is the left of the Republican Party which is now a conservative party.

The DLC using Progressive is a clever trick to disenfranchise the true progressives. We see the same trick here in DU. Posters calling themselves Left, Liberal or progressives yet supporting Pres Obama 100%. They don't understand you can't be both progressive and conservative (status quo).

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #88)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:29 PM

89. Lincoln was left of Douglas.

However, by TR's time, I think the crossover of the parties may have been in progress. In other words, I don't think the switch happened in an instant or in one Presidency. Republican Taft succeeded TR and I don't think Taft was liberal. So, I am not sure which party was the more liberal when TR was President. As immigrants were coming in, the Irish, the Jews, the Italians, and so on, they were becoming Democrats.

Obama has compared himself with TR a few times, excluding TR's racism. Well, whoopee. That takes us clear up to about 1909, when women's suffrage was the cutting edge.


Think about this: When and why did the left of the left stop calling themselves liberal and start calling themselves progressives? Wasn't it when the DLC types re-popularized the term?

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Response to merrily (Reply #89)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:52 PM

90. I thought the left switched from liberal to progressive because of the demonization of the

 

word liberal. Not sure of the time frame.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #90)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 01:02 PM

94. Who helped Republicans demonize the word "liberal" so much that even

Democrats walked away from it?

Yep. The DLC types. That was the time frame, when they started feeling their oats (whatever that means).

Republicans were/are always demonizing everything Democratic. Democrats would not have shed the word just because of them.

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Response to merrily (Reply #94)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:09 PM

95. That makes sense. I lost track where we were going with this.

 

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #95)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:28 PM

96. My journal used to contain a post entitled something like

"Why I don't use the word progressive." I have not looked at my journal since the software glitch because I don't want to see what might have happened to it. But, basically, I don't use it because it is associated with a Republican President, with the DLC/Third Way/Progressive Policy Institute/Century for American Progress/No Labels crowd and because, despite that, some liberals see it as a synonym for "liberal." So, it means all things to all people, which means the meaning is muddled.

That is my view, anyway.

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Response to merrily (Reply #87)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:57 PM

93. The fact this is being debated now is exactly why is not the best idea.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #86)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:55 PM

92. Shouldn't this be designed to grow BEYOND a caucus?

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #92)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:33 PM

97. Well I hope it grows until it's the DEmocratic Party. nm

 

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #97)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:55 PM

98. Me too. Thats why the BRANDING is so important!

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #98)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 05:49 PM

100. I absolutely agree. We shouldn't be in a hurry. nm

 

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 01:29 PM

4. Actually...

... my suggestion should read Citizen's Reform Caucus. Not to pick nits, but it's the Democratic party and our government that desperately need reform, not us citizens.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 02:39 PM

5. Social Democrats ...

in contrast to the anti-social ones.

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #5)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 03:12 PM

9. Have to go with this too, makes it more present, new and youthful. Add to poll?

 

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Response to grahamhgreen (Reply #9)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:20 PM

22. Done.

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #5)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:20 PM

21. Added to poll.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 02:39 PM

6. OTHER - I like the current name.

 

"Populist Reform of the Democratic Party" is better than any of the suggested changes.

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Response to Jim Lane (Reply #6)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 08:44 PM

31. It's not a change of name for the group. It is a selection of a name for a new populist movement.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 02:52 PM

7. The Peoples Wing of the Democratic Party

as opposed to the corporate (blue dog, Third Way) wing

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 04:23 PM

10. I like "The Populist Way" as a response to "The Third Way"

The third way of governing to enrich the corporations must give way to
The Populist way of governing to enrich the people - it's really that simple IMO

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Response to Dragonfli (Reply #10)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 01:11 PM

42. Could be a good option!

"The Populist Way"...
would make a great soundbite!

It has a lot of marketing potential to
any average American and most voters.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 04:45 PM

11. Populist Reform Group. I think the original name of the group is fine, AND

 

We can't change it now. Admins don't change things like the name of a group, typically.

I don't know why we are even having this discussion, unless I missed something.

Are we talking about naming the group or renaming something else?

I'm confused.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #11)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:11 PM

12. I'm totally confused, also.

Thought it was to give a name to the activist actions the group wanted to do in moving forward to find a voice in the Dem Party ...not to ReName the "DU" Group.

The current name of the DU Group is really good, imho...

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #11)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:41 PM

16. Updated the info in the OP.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:12 PM

13. To be clear: are we talking about naming a new political party ...

... separate from the Democratic Party and fielding third-party candidates to compete in the general election?

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Response to Martin Eden (Reply #13)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:37 PM

14. Clearly no. Read the last paragraph of the OP. n/t

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Response to Martin Eden (Reply #13)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:40 PM

15. Updated the info in the thread.

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Response to EEO (Reply #15)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:50 PM

17. Thanks. In that case ...

... I think we should work with and make an effort to expand the ranks and the influence of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. I think this is a much more realistic way to advance progressive policy goals than attempting to form a completely new political organization in DU.

If our efforts are to expand the Congressional Progressive Caucus and increase their influence within the Democratic Party nationwide. I think our group should be titled:
Progressive Caucus (or something along those lines that clearly associate us with the Progressive Caucus)

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 05:51 PM

18. Progressive Caucus

(see post #17)

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Response to Martin Eden (Reply #18)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:16 PM

19. Added to poll.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:45 PM

23. Roosevelt Democrats

 

I think the name, like a good headline, should:

1. cut through the noise (make people say "huh?" when they first see it)
2. say something about what we're up to
3. be a good way to start a conversation with people
4. fulfill 1-3 in a way that they work for all Americans, not just political junkies

"Democratic Wing" would work great for political junkies, but I think it will confuse others (i.e., doesn't meet 4 above).

"Roosevelt Democrats" is great for 1-4. The Roosevelts in question did so many great things, great Progressive/Liberal things, and the results were fantastic: those are stories that I like to tell. "Why am I a Roosevelt Democrat? Do you know that in FDR's first term, because of Liberal policies, unemployment halved and the economy grew at three or four times the rate it's growing now? Let's talk about the policies that made this happen, and why we need them again today."

"They did X and it worked. Everytime X has been tried, it worked. Doesn't it make sense to do X?" Those are the arguments that win people's hearts and minds.

Both Teddy and Franklin were flawed, as are all people, and there will be some nitwits (even on DU!) that will fling poo at 'em. But both, as they aged, improved, and also one person's poison is another person's meat. For example, some people (not me) feel that the US developing atomic weapons was an awful thing, but to others it could be seen as a sign that Roosevelt Democrats will do what's needed, when needed.

And by including Teddy, Franklin, and Eleanor, it sends a great message about inclusion: Democrats and Republicans, men and women. They were not people of color, but did work hard to advance the ball for all Americans. Whatever we call ourselves, we'll not perfect America either, but we'll fight hard for all.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #23)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:01 PM

24. Hi, how ya been man?

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #23)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:43 PM

26. You made some excellent points. I had chosen The Democratic Wing, but realize that as you said

that would have meaning mostly to Political Junkies.

My second choice would have been Roosevelt Democrats.

I can't change it now, but I agree with your points, including the 'inclusiveness' by including Teddy and Eleanor.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #26)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 08:17 PM

29. Are we talking about "Re-Naming this DU Group or How we can Deal with Our Party?

to become as William Greider says: "The Rump of Reform for the Dem Party" connecting with other Resources? There is some confusion here over this.......

I'm not comfortable with fighting over the Name of the DU GROUP....when it's the Efforts that We Need to Make to try to be Activists on DU (like the old days of DU) to connect with Groups that we can make a difference with in our Participation to Drag our Dem Party (kicking and screaming) back to Populist/Progressive Issues!

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #26)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 08:24 PM

30. You can totally undo your vote and go for another selection.

Just saying...

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #23)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:49 PM

27. I think that was a great argument. And I voted for The Roosevelt Party.

The concept of the Roosevelt Party and Roosevelt Democrats was, after all, the catalyst that started this group. Demwing and I had a discussion based on a ideas I threw out in a thread. And I am happy this group was created.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:13 PM

25. Why I choose Democratic Wing:

 

It acknowledges the Democratic Party, but strongly implies (in a bit of blunt-force irony) that the Party has gone way off course such that it no longer represents its progressive and populist ideals, and should be steered in another direction.

EEO, I appreciate this move off dead center. As I see it, the new name will put a handle on this Group for use in communicating with the outside world; here in DU, we remain the Populist Reform Group.

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #25)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:58 PM

28. I will admit I was nearly swayed by the Democratic Wing argument.

But I did vote The Roosevelt Party. I see it as very productive to identify Democrats as Roosevelt Democrats and put pressure on those Democrats who just don't measure up. The name Roosevelt honors three very diverse figures (two from divergent parties) who had major and lasting impacts on our history.

I think the Roosevelt Party will stand out far more than the Democratic Wing and be a lightning bolt. I am concerned the Democratic Wing may be too confusing for the American people. If it wins, I will support it, but we better have a pretty kick-ass logo. In either event, once this issue is settled it is time to get to the real work.

We have already started drafts of a pretty comprehensive platform from what I have seen.

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Response to EEO (Reply #28)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 09:08 PM

33. Ah, hell, I switched to Roosevelt Democrats since the

 

Name is less important than the coalition we should be building.

Not so sure if we should consolidate WillyT's list and the 30-item list I made. I think what is more important is deciding what's next. I started a thread proposing the group act as a organizing committee. Response was roaring silence. But I think at a min. we should task ourselves with reaching out to the other groups mentioned in the pinned thread dealing with such.

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #33)

Sun Nov 16, 2014, 10:09 PM

34. Sometimes silence is just bad timing. Post a link to your proposal thread for more input.

 

Organizing committee seems reasonable to me.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #34)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:23 AM

39. The title: "I propose PRG be run like an organizing committee."

 

My old & defective Samsung does not reliably link without crashing for long periods.





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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #34)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 12:21 PM

40. Here's the link to the "Organizing Committee" thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1277582

I see from Eleanor's reply to you that she would have computer problems in trying to post it herself.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 12:19 AM

35. I would far prefer our movement be named after a PRINCIPLE rather than a person.

Both Teddy and Franklin were flawed, as are all people, ...
Exactly.

I, for one, am unwilling to ignore or gloss over the fact that it was FDR who ordered the Japanese Internment . Nor am I willing to ignore or gloss over Teddy Roosevelt's role in the rise of American Imperialism. Yes, they did many great things, and it is well and good to be grateful for those things.

Surely a name for "progressive" movement ought to be indicative of something larger, more holistic, and more forward looking, than paying homage to a pair of dead presidents - some of whose policies we in this movement would most certainly oppose and reject.

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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #35)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 01:16 PM

43. Yep

I would far prefer our movement be
named after a PRINCIPLE rather than a person


Yes, personal names have inevitable baggage.
Something simple, clear, concise, and inclusive
is a much better marketing device.

Think how the MSM will portray "Roosevelt Party"

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #43)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 03:52 PM

59. Is there a way to incorporate the word "Blue" without automatically reminding us of Blue Dogs?

 

Blue Party Dems
True Blue Dems
Blue Nation Dems
Blue Rose Dems (nod to the Roosevelts)
Blue Collar Dems
Blue World Dems
Blue Eagle Dems


I kinda like Blue Party - It's Dem, but it isn't. The branding is already in place.

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Response to demwing (Reply #59)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 07:27 AM

76. Blue is too ties to the blue dogs.... So I vote no.

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Response to demwing (Reply #59)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 09:23 AM

79. I'm totally perplexed about the direction this is moving

Far from being a PR, marketing, Advertising wizard
it makes no sense to me why folks are looking
BACKWARDS to create a movement for the future???

Exactly what demographic is this intended to appeal?
The important demographics are millennials and Hispanics.
How will "Roosevelt" or "blue" resonate with them?
So far, the suggestions harken to a nostalgic day gone by
or terms that have tangent associations which are not flattering?
Whatever, I can't wait to see this "brand"

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #79)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 10:00 AM

80. Don't be perplexed, we're just brainstorming

 

How will Blue resonate?

It's familiar - We already have a Green Party
It's iconic - almost everyone knows that Red states are Conservative, Blue States are Liberal.
It's not named for a person (I thought you'd like that one )

You have a huge variety of Blue Icons you can use. Water is blue. The Sky is blue. The Earth is blue.

Working Class Collars are Blue.

Truth is blue.

According to http://www.statesymbolsusa.org/National_Symbols/National_colors.html blue stands for vigilance, perseverance, and justice.

To me, "Blue Party Dems" sounds like a group of Dems with hard-core Democratic values.

Think Blue.
Vote Blue.

Does that not resonate?

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Response to demwing (Reply #80)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:03 AM

83. Blue is a great color in "advertising"

but does a Populist movement
want to front load a bias that will
immediately turn a segment of
potential allies, based on the red/blue divide?

A better approach would be less divisive
and far more inclusive.
Keep in mind, ultimately, the 99%
is the potential membership base.

This may be a "Democratic Party" movement
but it would be wise to look at the long game.

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #79)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 09:16 PM

103. Thank you. I have the same reservations about "harken(ing) to a nostalgic day gone by".

Nostalgia does not build a viable movement.

A sharp eye on the here-and-now and clear-eyed analysis thereof is what's needed.

Yes, the roots of the System we are up against today were planted in the past, but the tools we need to oppose and ultimately disable that System need to be found in the present.

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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #35)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:22 AM

85. Besides, Teddy was a Republican President

Granted, he was a good one, but he was still a Republican. Then he ran as a Progressive, but lost, the Progressive Party having been formed by the left wing of the Republican Party. The left wing of the Republican Party is how I sometimes see Third Way (which loves to use the word "progressive," btw). Isn't that exactly what we're trying to distinguish ourselves from?

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 03:05 AM

36. Sadly, I don't like either leading choice, but have no suggestions of my own

 

"The Roosevelt Party" ties us to a person which as others have noted, brings with it flaws and perceived limits. if we wanted to cleave with the Roosevelts, aiming for their policy - the Square / New Deals - is preferable to allegiance to the persons.

"Democratic Wing" implies that those outside this wing are by default, not "Democratic" - it's inherently antagonistic, without actually defining the principles. democratic Wing? What, like, we vote, what does "Democratic Wing" mean? We need more than a "nyah-nyah" at the establishment. And like Manny says, it's just not snappy.

I have, personally, forever hated the title of "progressive." It's a cop-out, a retreat from the L-words of liberalism and leftism. "Progressive" cedes ground to the Republicans... and rather ironically the historical "Progressives" were the third way of Theodore Roosevelt's time, those trying to moderate the left without totally throwing over to the right (of course back then, the scale was MUCH different... but principle).

of the list, "Social Democrats" is probably most accurate, though again that lacks "pop" in the same way "Democratic Wing" does.

I would say to just outright embrace the "socialist" label. it's fairly accurate, and it's sure as hell going to catch attention. Ripping the word "Socialism" out of the grips of those John Birch ratfuckers is reward in itself, I think.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #36)


Response to Scootaloo (Reply #36)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:30 PM

72. socialist?

 

It's my firm belief that the only way Socialism ever takes in the US is if it is brought in by the Christians.

Socialism and Christianity go hand in hand...

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 07:16 AM

37. Progressive People's Party - PPP - For Short

eom

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 01:05 PM

41. POPULIST WING

The POPULIST WING

I prefer to leave out anything that would
be alienating to potential allies through
"baggage loaded" terms/names.

Roosevelt might work in theory...
but Third Wayers and right-wingers
will go right for the FDR "entitlement" angle.
Then we will have to untangle the argle-bargle they create.
Do we really want to waste time continually redefining "Roosevelt"?
Basically, it could end up crating more noise than it cuts through.

Plus, Roosevelt "Party" would clash with
The Democratic Party.
The Roosevelt Party of the Democratic Party?
The Democrat(ic)-Roosevelt Party?
Seems to violate term #1?

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 02:12 PM

44. My thoughts about all of the candidate terms:

 

Depending upon whether we're looking for a name to call ourselves among ourselves, or are looking for a name that will attract new people outside the progressive sphere, some names are better than others.
To me, for growing the wing nationally, most of the words are loaded and have connotations that aren't helpful, or may be harmful:

The Roosevelt Party --I like this best because it's hard to find a bad connotation, war president, social programs. Only drawback is that younger folks have no idea.


The Democratic Wing --People hate both parties and they screw with the word "Democrat Party" and I don't think it distinguishes us well enough. It's like an inside joke that we get but doesn't work outside of us.


The Populist Progressive Party --I don't even know if WE agree on what "populist" means, much less other. And unfortunately, Progressive is a loaded term to some, made that way by RW radio, could be a turn-off.


The Citizen's Reform Caucus --I like the word "reform" and "citizen's", too. Much better than "peoples" which sounds too much like China.


The Progressive Caucus --Not bad, not sure we are technically a Caucus or not.


The Social Democrats -While we might in our hearts lean Socialist, there's danger in using variants of the term if we want to grow the wing.

In conclusion, I like where "reform" is used and where we avoid terms that tend to be already overused and exclusive-- I'd like something that says "we are the middle and lower and working classes and we are fucking serious about taking back our party!"

But that's just too long!

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #44)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 02:37 PM

45. I see plenty of "bad spin" from MSM with ROOSEVELT

The Roosevelt Party --I like this best
because it's hard to find a bad connotation, war president,
social programs. Only drawback is that younger folks have no idea.


Respectfully, that does seem pollyanna.

First, the name/term has already became about 1 person,
not about a larger "Roosevelt legacy"

Second, Limbaugh has created a "Roosevelt" pejorative.

Third, FDR is yoked to the "entitlement" meme.

I too enjoy the positive connotations of Roosevelt.
But consider naming your kid, and the playground
name calling that comes from a name that is so
easily besmirched!
Think of the children, pleeeeez

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 04:27 PM

46. The First Way?

After First Way Manny (Goldstein) vs Third Way Manny. Might be alienating to non political junkies, though. Ideally, it should be something along the lines of the Tea Party, ie taken from the stuff you learned in grade school, so that everybody knows instantly what it means. I'm not American so I don't know - what, if anything, did y'all learn about FDR in elementary school? Any popular stories/images, like George Washington and the cherry tree or, well, the Boston Tea Party?

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Response to nxylas (Reply #46)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 04:21 AM

74. We learn about him in high school because we study the great depression and WWII

FDR rescued the country from the great depression. He created Social Security. He created numerous public works programs that were a source of employment. He had a strong foreign policy who led us to victory in WWII. He turned hundreds of factories into war/weapons assembly plants. Very few complained and these jobs were a boost to the economy. He brought the country together in ways that I can't imagine today. Yes most Americans know and admire FDR. We also learn about his Republican predecessor, Herbert Hoover.

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Response to LeftInTX (Reply #74)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 04:41 AM

75. But is there a specific image associated with him?

The only one I can think of is the song Happy Days Are Here Again, sometimes referred to as the "New Deal anthem". But calling yourselves Happy Days Democrats would make most people think of The Fonz! A pity really, as I think that song's optimistic spirit would be more appealing to voters than the stereotype of the "angry left".

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Response to nxylas (Reply #75)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 03:49 PM

99. He ranks up there with Lincoln and Washington

Abraham Lincoln
Franklin D. Roosevelt
George Washington
Theodore Roosevelt
Thomas Jefferson

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 08:01 PM

47. ~ "21st Century Democrats" ~

 

I stumbled on this page, "21st Century Democrats", search by state for candidates, etc.

http://www.21stcenturydems.org/endorsements/

Cool name, but nice that they have lists and names and might be a good partner in organizing.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 09:06 PM

48. More thoughts: No name that ends in "Party".

Since we are decidedly NOT intending to create a new party or a third party- right? - we should not use a name that implies those things. We are here to work on moving the Democratic Party to the left, and out of the hands of the Third Way/corporatist factions.

To name this movement a "Party" blurs and confuses that distinction - our party IS the Democratic Party.

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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #48)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 08:35 AM

52. But the Tea Party is the Republican Party

There was talk in the early days of them splintering off and forming a third party, but realistically, their masters were never going to let that happen. It was a fascist coup within the Republican Party, pure and simple. Having said that, I agree with you. They sought to practice a deception, this group does not.

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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #48)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 10:18 PM

66. Very well.

Roosevelt Wing?

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Response to EEO (Reply #66)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:01 PM

69. I'm not sure I care anymore. We can call ourselves the "Purple Turnips" & it won't mean anything if

we don't actually DO something.

We aren't anything at this point. We aren't a force, we aren't an activist organization, we aren't anything more than a few people on an internet forum dreaming dreams about what we would do if we had a say.

Sorry, I think this naming business has gotten silly. Right now, all we are is a few people posting in the "Populist Reform of the Democratic Party" group. Frankly, I think that's name enough unless and until we actually organize into something that might actually have some possibility of having an impact out in the real world outside of DU.

Also frankly, I have no interest in harking back to some mythical past of early 20th century "liberal" politics by invoking a long-dead president who was dealing with an entirely different national paradigm. We need to deal with today's reality, with language relevant to today.

Deciding on the perfect name does not a movement make.





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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #69)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:18 PM

70. Well, I'm learning to ignore criticism from some people, as it devolves into feigned apathy.

Some people just like to criticize. Got it.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 10:28 PM

49. People's Democratic Alliance, or United Democratic Populists. nt

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 12:57 AM

50. I like "Democratic Wing" or "Progressive Caucus or Coalition" and would recommend against a name

 

with "party" in the name. That implies that it's a third party.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #50)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 07:53 AM

51. I totally agree - see my post #48 above.

As I said, we already have a party - it's the Democratic Party.

I like the idea of a coalition, since I hope that we will be joining our efforts with other already extant progressive organizations.

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Response to scarletwoman (Reply #51)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:33 AM

73. I like "coalition" nm

 

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #50)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 10:19 PM

67. Roosevelt Wing?

The art of compromise.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 10:11 AM

53. Just to throw a wrench in the works

 

In honor of The Roosevelt family, but in an attempt to tie the past to the future, please consider the following:

Teddy gave us the Square Deal
FDR gave us the New Deal
Let's call out Platform "A Real Deal for America"
Then call ourselves "Real Deal" Dems?

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Response to demwing (Reply #53)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 10:58 AM

54. Great sentiments...

but sounds be a little close to a sales pitch.

I'm seeing a used car/mattress salesman
barking about "A Real Deal for America".
Come on down folks, for a real deal.
Vote for us and get a "real deal".

Could become fodder for MSM jokes
and late night comedians?

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Response to Cosmic Kitten (Reply #54)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:10 AM

55. So let's play with that theme for a bit

 

What about "Fair Deal"?

Now that I think about it, having the Late Nighters crack wise is great advertising...

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."

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Response to demwing (Reply #55)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:49 AM

56. YES! The Daily Show does it BEST.

Humor can disarm psychological defenses.

As to "deals" in todays jaded, cynical, marketplace
it comes off as "selling" when it should be
about creating an identifying element.
People want to belong, they want to feel
"at Home", part of the "in group".

A "deal" sounds like a pitch, a sale.
That automatically changes the relation between
the communicator and the audience.

Capturing Late Nighters attention would be better
served if they throw in WITH the ideas rather than ridicule.
Some would argue that "there is no such thing as bad publicity".
And that may be true for an established brand...
For an upstart brand there are plenty of case examples
where that axiom has been proven fatally flawed.

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Response to demwing (Reply #53)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 10:20 PM

68. Roosevelt Wing would be an acceptable compromise.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 03:10 PM

57. I like Populist Caucus.

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Response to merrily (Reply #57)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 05:33 PM

60. Yes, how very PC.

 

Just kidding.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #60)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 05:35 PM

61. Right away, I saw what you did there. I started smiling from the subject line,

before I even saw the body of the post.

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Response to merrily (Reply #61)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 05:39 PM

63. I figured you would get it but I have a habit of adding the "just kidding" because some here

 

have chips on their shoulders and are quick to fly off the handle. And if that sounds like projection, it is.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #63)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 05:43 PM

64. To be candid, I usually lean literal (sic). But I did get that one.



To me, PC just makes it better because being PC seems to infuriate the right. Then again, almost anything infuriates the right.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #60)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 08:32 AM

78. Well then, how about Populist American Caucus?

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Response to merrily (Reply #78)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 10:00 AM

81. I like it, I also like Coalition. But I am torn between "populist" and "progressive".

 

Populist can mean "Tea Party". And Progressive might scare some away although I am not sure I care. Help me out here.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #81)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:10 AM

84. You're okay with PAC?



Populist does not remind me of the Tea Party. Thing is, you can't use "people's" or the cold warriors start screaming communist.

As for progressive, I have issues with it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1277&pid=930

And I wonder if it's really a coalition? Wouldn't it be just a group of like-minded people within the Democratic Party?

99% Caucus? Fair Deal Caucus? (That does evoke Truman, though.)

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Response to merrily (Reply #84)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 12:53 PM

91. ^^^^^ I'm thinking the same

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:26 PM

71. One more wrench

 

What about keeping it short and simple:

Blue Party Dems

It's familiar - We already have a Green Party
It's iconic - almost everyone knows that Red states are Conservative, Blue States are Liberal .
It's not named for a person.

You have a huge variety of Blue Icons you can use. Water is blue. The Sky is blue. Truth is blue. Collars are Blue. The Earth is blue.

According to http://www.statesymbolsusa.org/National_Symbols/National_colors.html blue stands for vigilance, perseverance, and justice.

The Blue Party Dems sounds like a group of Dems with hard-core Democratic values.

Think Blue.
Vote Blue.

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Response to demwing (Reply #71)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 07:30 AM

77. Maybe, but blue always brings blue dogs to mind, and we are the antithesis of the blue dog dems....

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Response to demwing (Reply #71)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 10:09 AM

82. Not bad. Again I don't like the use of "party" as it may infer a separate party.

 

I do like Blue. Maybe Blue Dem Coalition or Blue D Coalition? Or Democratic Progressive Coalition? Note: We should be sure and search the acronym to insure no bad connotations are related.

Before we actually choose we need to make sure all nominations are seen. I think this selection is very important. We shouldn't be too quick with the selection.

Then we should have a run off of the top two choices.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 06:01 PM

101. I like the Roosevelt's because the general population made thier DVD movie number one!

 

The general populace can relate to two people of both parties, that got a lot done and had lots of courage. The miniseries was a hit, and expensive as it was to purchase, 129.00, it was number one the next week in sales.

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Response to TheNutcracker (Reply #101)

Fri Nov 21, 2014, 09:36 PM

104. And one of them said "We have nothing to fear, but fear itself."

Time to call politicians who promote endless paranoia.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Wed Nov 19, 2014, 07:28 PM

102. How about the "Wealth Inequality Is Too Damn High!" Party?

 

"Roosevelt Democrats" could come off as obsolete or out-of-touch, given that many consider Roosevelt to be ancient history.

I like the PPP - Populist Progressive Party.

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Response to Maedhros (Reply #102)

Fri Nov 21, 2014, 09:45 PM

105. I don't understand this argument.

We have a woefully ignorant electorate, which needs to be educated and told what needs to be protected and why. The Roosevelts are a great starting off point. I can already hear the PPP being called communist and bringing up ridiculous talking points like "it makes me think of the CCCP." Then they can explain to the idiots sitting on their couches that it was the evil Soviet Empire, which Reagan single-handedly destroyed with his mediocre acting skills. I will at least give credit for the word "Peoples" not being in there.

With the Roosevelts you have three strong Americans. Teddy and FDR were solid and strong on foreign policy, and both pissed off a lot of rich people with their domestic agendas. Eleanor was the conscience of the family when it was in the White House, and helped FDR immensely with her counsel regarding social policies.

I just don't understand the "Americans don't know their own history, so why the hell should we teach it to them?" argument.

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Response to EEO (Reply #105)

Sat Nov 22, 2014, 08:32 AM

106. A Populist movement needs to change the paradigm

A new paradigm is inherently forward thinking.

Roosevelts are part of a history worth teaching,
but not a beacon to the future.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sat Nov 22, 2014, 08:33 AM

107. POPULIST MAJORITY

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sat Nov 22, 2014, 03:43 PM

108. I've Changed my Vote

 

Cosmic Kitty and others have swayed my opinion. i've taken back my vote for "Roosevelt Party"

I now am leaning to just using the name of the Group - The Populist Reform Group (wing, party, whatever...). More than 200 DUers liked that group idea enough to vote it into existence.

I look back, and I wonder why it was never on the Names Poll.

I say we go with what we already have.

Populist Reform Group (the PRG stands for Progressives)

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Response to demwing (Reply #108)

Sat Nov 22, 2014, 08:13 PM

109. Thank you. I'm with you.

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Response to demwing (Reply #108)

Sun Nov 23, 2014, 12:22 PM

110. A name is important. Our effectiveness depends on our unification. It is important that

 

we choose a name that all of us will be proud to use to better make a presence.

I will go with the consensus but don't like "party" in the name. I think it's confusing. "I am part of the Roosevelt Party of the Democratic Party". Wing, group, caucus, coalition, are ok.

I think Reform is ok because reform will always be needed.

Populist is ok with me. Some point out that populist doesn't designate right or left leaning. But if we "own" the name we can define the name.

Progressive is ok with me. Again if we own it, we can define it.

Having said all that, unless you can get other posters to undo their votes for Roosevelt Party, it looks like that is the choice.

Although I would like to see a run-off between the top two unless the top choice gets over 50%.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #110)

Sun Nov 23, 2014, 12:45 PM

111. Honestly, the idea of a deadline for selecting a name was arbitrarily set

 

but the Hosts didn't lock the thread, just expanded the time frame. There is a still another week in the poll, and a brand new item to vote on.

All that being said, I'll gladly follow the group on this. It's just a name, and if it doesn't work out as we form goals, we'll change the name again. No need to lock us into a path if that path ends up going nowhere.

let's move forward and see what happens

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Response to demwing (Reply #111)

Sun Nov 23, 2014, 01:13 PM

112. I agree completely.

 

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Mon Nov 24, 2014, 07:44 PM

113. Ok, Roosevelt Dems or Roosevelt Caucus...

The arguments to not use "party within a party" make sense to me. And as the name of Roosevelt is a statement of itself..I wish we had one of those options..so OTHER here I come.

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Response to EEO (Original post)

Sun Nov 30, 2014, 01:45 PM

114. The poll has closed, the thread is now locked.

 

No result took 50% or more, so there will be a run off.

Here are the three players:

Roosevelt Wing = 42%
Variation of "Democrat/Democratic" Wing = 20%
Variation of "Populist/Progressive/Reform" = 17%

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