A Hillary supporter said to me yesterday that she supports Hillary because she is "presidential."

[JDPriestly]

She claimed that Bernie is not "presidential."

What in the world is that about?

How would you respond?

I started talking about Hillary's weak stance on the TPP. I explained that Hillary supports the TPP with the exception of the labor provisions and that the problems with the TPP go way beyond the labor provisions. I pointed out that people who represent labor would have no way to enforce stronger labor provisions, and that the arbitration courts the TPP sets up would deprive us of our constitutional right to a jury trial in civil cases worth over a certain amount. The TPP would put an arbitration court in place instead of a jury trial.

She then said that Hilary is a woman and she wants a woman. I said I want a woman too, but not Hillary.

I pointed out that Hillary's economic plan is unrealistic. She said that Bernie would not be able to get things done. Obviously, Hillary will be completely unable to get things done. Bernie understands the ways of Congress. Hillary spent only a few years in Congress, not long enough to get bills passed or even learn how that gets done. Bernie has relationships with members of Congress. They may not be always cordial, but Bernie at least knows where the buttons are to push on various members of Congress.

Any ideas about how to respond to these rather canned pro-Hillary memes?

[L0oniX]

1. Hillary won't get anything done. The GOP hates her almost as much as they hate Obama.

[dorkzilla]

3. Honestly? I think they may hate her more than Obama.

They’ve got 20+ years of hatred built up for her. I mean, they’ll hate any Democrat but i think their hatred for her is overwhelming.

[MissDeeds]

10. I agree

They tried to get Bill impeached and failed, so it will be open season on Hillary. Besides that, she has given them enough fodder to keep them happy for the duration of the election process, and beyond.

[dorkzilla]

11. They’re already talking about impeaching her on DAY ONE

I mean really, who the fuck wants to go through this shit? I’d personally like to see our government govern but I’m old-fashioned that way.

And here is a good overview of life from the “other side” (with links) - if anyone thinks they’ll stop being batshit crazy any time soon they’ll be in for letdown.

http://gawker.com/house-gop-now-an-ouroboros-with-the-snakes-butt-eating-1738611285

[LiberalElite]

16. So, in a way, although H denies it

if she were elected we would have a third Obama term insofar as the Repugs will clog up the works perhaps even more. (if that is possible).

[dorkzilla]

17. Totally how it will play out

Come on, they're talking about impeachment before the primaries and if you look at the link I posted above the GOP RWNJs are going to get even nuttier than before. So basically we are looking at eating a shit sandwich.

[City Lights]

14. They succeeded in impeaching Bill. They failed at removing him from office. nt

[n2doc]

2. If she has her mind made up, don't bother

Your energy is better spent taking to those who are undecided or who haven't heard about Bernie and are interested in hearing more. Just like DU, you will never convince a hard core supporter to change their mind, and will probably just make them mad. IMO.

[cascadiance]

4. Ask her if she would support Bernie if Warren is his VP selection?

That might mitigate the gender issue to some degree. Or look in the opposite direction and ask that if it were Bernie against someone like Carly Fiorina (or if somehow Sarah Palin were somehow to win the primary this year), whether she'd vote for that Republican woman over a Democrat just because that Republican is a woman.

Just like I don't think most of us would want to have someone select someone like Clarence Thomas for the Supreme Court just because that person is black or another POC. We need substance as well as an identity for a candidate to get behind.

"Presidential" is a label. It is meaningless when trying to evaluate who should be our president, without some degree of definition of what that label really means.

Americans are tired of labels. Even "Hope and Change" turned out to be a label when people felt that it meant more back in 2007 to have something behind it that they wanted to have happen. These labels need definitions and being backed up by more specific stances on issues. Ask her what issues she feels that Hillary supports better than Sanders and why. If she doesn't think that important, then ask her why how candidates vote and stand on issues aren't important in a democratic election. She's a lost cause if she can't see the wisdom of that.

[peacebird]

5. Remind her Hillary is against $15 min wage, FOR fracking, FOR monsanto and GMOs, she is

Against reinstating Glass Steagall, she is against breaking up too big to fail banks.

Remind her that Hillary waited until there was no political risk (convenient) to evolve on GLBT rights. Hillary has already come out hawkishly regarding Iran. She was a vocal and staunch booster of war in Iraq, claiming she was misled by Bush. Bernie saw through the lies.

[NRaleighLiberal]

6. cult of personality. hero worship instead of policy. don't bother to even try.

It's the TV/media driven society in which we live.

[arcane1]

7. The difference between campaigning for the job of prez, and auditioning for the role of prez.

We've been conditioned to favor the latter at the expense of the former.

[bvf]

8. She sounds like a lost cause,

but I would still demand she provide a detailed description of what she means by "presidential."

It probably sounds better to her own ears than "just because," but it's obviously nothing but a substitute.

[valerief]

9. Just tell her she's stupid. Cuz she is. She can't see the forest for the trees. nt

[Vincardog]

12. Don't agrue with stupid people, they draw you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Better spend time with the persuadable people. The time wasted reasoning with unreasonable people can't be regained.

[KoKo]

13. Sounds like you did the best you could...Lost Cause.

Sadly...unless you want to give her History Leaflets and spend time that still won't convince her. Sounds like you tried to get her interest and she wasn't buying.

That old expression: "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink if they aren't thirsty.."

In MSM America....its very hard to undo conceived perceptions, or to convince those who just aren't thirsty?

[Demeter]

15. Tell them she's as Presidential as Nixon

without the wry humor of a dry (or even a wet) drunk.

And we don't want to go back to that kind of Imperial Presidency.

[Fawke Em]

18. Ask her if she liked Sarah Palin.

When she says, "No. She doesn't stand for anything I stand for," then go in for the "kill" (metaphorically). Tell her that Hillary doesn't stand for much, outside of some social issues, she stands for, either.

You have to take what they say and make them understand it from a different point of view.

But, I wasn't there. That might have been too rude. I don't know the dynamics.

[eridani]

19. The "can't govern" problem applies to any Dem elected as president n/t