Biden is wrong on climate change and cannabis, but...

[garybeck]

I know some people think we should all shut up and not say anything negative about any democratic candidate.

I say until the the primaries are over, it is OUR JOB to discuss the differences. It is our job to evaluate and decide which candidate we want, and our RIGHT to persuade others to vote for the democratic nominee that we favor, for whatever reasons we have to favor them.

Once the primaries are OVER, I will vote for whoever it is in the general election. And I will encourage others to do so. PERIOD.

Now that that part is over over....

Biden is wrong on climate change. I just read this disturbing article by Bill McKibben, one of the leaders of the climate change movement. There are reasons to believe that Biden does not understand the dire urgency of transforming our energy policy away from fossil fuels. He favors fracking which is horrible for the environment, the surrounding community, and just burns more fossil fuels.

disturbing fact:

Biden’s energy advisor is Heather Zichal. During the Obama years she headed up an interagency working group to promote the development of domestic natural gas. The working group had been formed after pressure from the American Petroleum Institute, the chief fossil-fuel lobbying group, and Zichal, in a talk to an API gathering, said: “It’s hard to overstate how natural gas—and our ability to access more of it than ever—has become a game changer.” Zichal left her White House job in 2013; one year later, she took a gig on the board of Cheniere Energy, a leading exporter of fracked gas, which has earned her over a million dollars.

Full article:
Joe Biden is stuck in the past when it comes to climate change
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/may/11/joe-biden-no-middle-ground-climate-change

Notice towards the end of the article it says:
"Obviously Biden will be better than Trump on this (and every other) issue; obviously everyone who cares about the earth should support him if he’s the nominee."

He's also wrong on cannabis, has stated that it's a gateway drug, which is not. there are many many articles outlining his long history of opposing progressive legislation towards cannabis. just google it.



So I would like to say that as long as there is still a democratic primary process, and that we accordingly have a right and a duty to respectfully discuss the differences between the candidates, I would say that Joe Biden not one of my top choices.

I would like a candidate who understands that dire situation of global warming, has no ties to the oil industry, and realizes that getting off fossil fuels can actually help our economy and create jobs.

I would like a candidate who understands that alcohol is more dangerous than cannabis and the laws are currently unfair to people who want to ingest a plant in the privacy and comfort of their own homes. And legalizing cannabis would help to our economy.

I would like a candidate who understands that universal single-payer health care is the best way to provide coverage for every person in our country, which is what we need to do. It does not appear that Biden has outlined his policy on health care yet but it seems pretty clear he does not support single payer universal health care.

these are not the only three issues that matter to me but they are both very important to me, and Joe Biden appears to be on the wrong side of all three.

There are other candidates who are on the correct side of all three.

I would like to encourage anyone reading this to support a candidate that knows fracking is NOT the answer to global warming, cannabis should be legal, and that we need single payer universal health care. If you agree these are important issues, I believe at the very least that Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, are on the correct side of these issues and I'm sure there are others.

Let's nominate the best candidate with the best ideas, not just the one we think is the most moderate and would therefore supposedly attract more voters (a false assumption in my opinion).





i encourage others to promote progressive ideals and vote for candidates who also believe in them.

[ucrdem]

1. Just dialing back to Obama-era policy would be a huge step forward.

Biden could do that as he was there when it was put in place. Also there's one issue you didn't mention which is guns: I think this going to prove very important with swing voters tired of hearing about school shootings and Biden has already rolled out legislation on it.

[garybeck]

2. OK

i'm glad to hear he's good on guns but is there any D candidate who isn't? I'm looking for the differences.

dialing back to Obama policy is not going to save our planet. fracking is not part of the solution and we need people who don't have ties to the oil industry.

[ucrdem]

3. Fracking isn't pretty but it's not the whole picture.

Obama spun the energy industry like a top. We went from peak oil -- remember that horseshit? -- to energy independence in 8 years. Meanwhile Trump took us out of the Paris accord and is working on getting rid of even the most basic fuel standards. Maybe Obama standards won't save us but we'll be doing a hell of a lot better.



p.s. cannabis is pretty much a done deal. You're in Calif right? Well other than the formalities it's legal. It won't be long before it's national policy.

[mr_lebowski]

13. Peak Oil is not 'horseshit' ... only new tech like fracking kept it from happening ...

And it absolutely WILL HAPPEN, it's physically impossible for it not to. It's just the timing was a bit off.

And with the US shipping off it's crude now (thanks Obama, for signing that GOP legislation that reversed the 20+ year old law against doing so), we are only 'energy independent' until the private oil companies finish slurping up the very last recoverable bits and selling them to the highest bidders. The US is enjoying a one-time bounty, at great environmental cost, that will not last long. Depletion rates on the tight-shale plays we're fracking and selling off ... are much, much higher than conventional fields ever were.

Fact is, Obama's energy policies were decent, but not great.

However, a big part of the reason is ... the world economy is still massively dependent on fossil fuels, and there's actually no way around that fact for the foreseeable future. And maybe never.

[ucrdem]

15. It was horseshit.

I knew it was when the oil boys were astroturfing it in ZeroHedge etc. But they had a good run of hundred-dollar-a-barrel oil eh?

p.s. it's possible that we'll deplete supplies but not until we've turned the place into a cinder by burning the stuff. We're about 100 years overdue for a replacement technology and keeping Trump in office is only going to put it off longer. The thing with Biden is that he won't have to reinvent the wheel and can start where Obama left off at the end of this term.

[mr_lebowski]

16. Yeah, I'm sure M. King Hubbard was 'in on' the big Zerohedge.com 2007-2008 scam ...

When writing his treatises ... back in the 1950's

[HopeAgain]

54. Not never...

When the world is either choked up on it's fumes, or we run out, then it will happen and it will be really ugly.

[George II]

57. There is one candidate whose voting record is not "good on guns", he's proven he is good for guns.

[pnwmom]

9. No, it wouldn't. We'll have lost 4 years since Obama and half-measures are no longer enough. nt

[ucrdem]

11. Have a taco.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

25. BINGO!!!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[pnwmom]

26. Jay Inslee is making this the center of his campaign. n/t

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

27. Yes, one of the reasons Inslee passed Biden on my list of preferred 10 candidates.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[earthshine]

4. Joe Biden: The more I look, the less I like. nt

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

28. Joe's position on cannabis is another that has me SMH...

Hopefully, Joe will come out soon with a statement that he's evolved on that issue, along with his 100% support for the GND. The longer Joe waits to make these pivots, the harder it will be to convince the electorate that he really is the most progressive among the Democratic primary candidates.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[earthshine]

33. Joe is not and will not attempt to convince anyone that he's a progessive.

He'd lose his economic backing. No one is paying him to be to the left; they want him in the center.

He'll be like Obama without the "hope," "change," and general enthusiasm. Part of Obama's appeal in 2008 was that he was an "unknown quantity."

Joe's quantities are very well known.

I predict he will lose much of his lead when the debates come.

[brooklynite]

37. I predict that the avearge Democratic voter won't sink or swim on cannabis policy or GND.

This will still be a Primary (and election) based on economics.

[earthshine]

39. I think Trump is going to do drastic and desperate things. There will be unforseen gamechangers.

I think there will be war, and half this country will get behind it enthusiastically.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

40. I respectfully disagree...Joe is already making the argument that HE'S the most progressive

primary candidate running. While I'm quite skeptical of that, I certainly am willing to hear Joe out on where he has previously stood on progressive issues.

You're right, Joe is a known quantity, so he'll have to convince Democratic voters that his "return to normalcy" agenda doesn't mean going back to those old positions, but rather, showing that he has evolved to become the most progressive Democratic candidate.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[earthshine]

41. "Joe is already making the argument that HE'S the most progressive"

I haven't heard this. I just hear talk of "the center lane."

I'll pay more attention. Thanks.

[Nuggets]

65. Biden said that he doesn't support criminal actions against weed

Likely will allow states to legalize as they wish and leave them be judging how the previous administration didn’t try and stop CO, WA, OR, MA, etc and he was part of that administration.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

68. Well, that would be progress... though I would like to see weed decriminalized on the Federal level.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Nuggets]

72. That's likely to happen regardless of which

Democratic candidate who might be elected.


Pelosi is a huge advocate of legalization.

[Thekaspervote]

5. Biden supports america's re-entry into the Paris accord

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/05/10/joe-bidens-baffling-misread-climate-change/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.ceea2623dc70

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

30. That certainly is a logical first step deserving of a tip of the hat... good for Joe.

Look forward to also hearing that Joe has boldly joined his fellow Democrats in supporting the GND.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[garybeck]

51. So?

if there is ANY dem candidate that does not support Paris agreement, they would be laughed off the stage in the first 5 minutes of a debate.

supporting paris is a given for any D candidate and is not really something to be praised for.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

71. I see your point... Joe just needs to get out in front of environmental issues

given their level of importance to those in the environmental movement and to progressive voters in this upcoming primary election. It's going to be difficult, however, to advocate for normalcy in this area, given the politics involved.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

6. Is he the candidate most likely to beat Trump?

That’s what I care about.

[Thekaspervote]

7. Have to agree!!

[Kentonio]

22. If effective action isn't taken on climate change very, very soon..

..it really won't matter who sits in the White House.

[LAS14]

61. Yup. I'm waiting to be persuaded otherwise. I'd really like a younger, more...

... progressive candidate, but only if he/she will attract former Trump voters.

[msongs]

8. oh my your anti biden sources. got anything from joe lips recently on these issues? nt

[Thekaspervote]

10. See the link in post #5..Biden supports America's re-entry into the Paris accord

[garybeck]

50. i would be extremely surprised if any D candidate didn't support that.

that is a given. it doesn't really do much. it is symbolic.

[Cha]

14. Yeah so of course he's

trying to bring down Biden.. but so far it's Backfiring.

BS is the one with the most high negatives.. ironically enough.'

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=114114

[revmclaren]

17. Yup.

DU is absolutely reeking of desperation from some political 'fans'.

ONLY!!! 2019 and beyond.

[garybeck]

53. hiring a Fracking consultant as an energy advisor says more than any words ever could. n/t

[betsuni]

18. LOL

[EveHammond13]

19. who can beat trump

[EveHammond13]

20. purity tests usually work out great.

[True Blue American]

21. I thought we were not supposed to bad mouth

Democratic figures. Yet every time I come on I see a bad mouthing headline.

Do we have trolls among us, trying to sow dissension?

[LAS14]

63. Bad mouthing and disagreeing with policy are two different things. If we can't...

... do the latter we're sunk.

[Kentonio]

23. We're talking about the future of the planet for goodness sake!

This isn't something you can just brush aside because he's good on other policies. NOTHING else matters more than this. It's about the very future of our species and our ability to continue to feed and support the worlds population.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

31. Ding! Ding! Ding!... We hava winner!!!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[revmclaren]

24. You should read the Politifact article linked below...

Was Joe Biden a climate change pioneer in Congress? History says yes.

By John Kruzel on Wednesday, May 8th, 2019 at 2:30 p.m.


Joe Biden may not be the most progressive candidate in the crowded Democratic primary field. But one thing is for certain: Among 2020 presidential candidates, he has the longest legislative record on climate change.

In fact, Biden has taken this title a good deal further by claiming to have pioneered some of the earliest climate change legislation in U.S. history.

"I’m one of the first guys to introduce a climate change bill, way, way back in ‘87," Biden said during a stump speech in Des Moines, Iowa, on May 1.

We were curious if that was accurate. A review of the legislative history shows Biden is right.

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2019/may/08/joe-biden/was-joe-biden-climate-change-pioneer-congress-hist/?bcmt=1



ONLY!!! 2019 and beyond.

[garybeck]

52. so back in 1986 he introduced a bill to

call on the president to have a task force to look into climate change

and

30+ years later his energy policy advisor is in the pockets of the fracking industry.

what does that tell you?

[rainy]

29. I agree with you! Biden will not excite

the base and the young which is needed for this time in history and for a large turnout. What young group is going to get out and knock on doors for someone with Biden’s vote history? He is wrong for the times in my opinion, however, I 100% respect other opinions here

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

32. I couldn't agree more. Elizabeth certainly fits the bill...why she's currently #2 on my Top-10 list.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[TwilightZone]

42. "Biden will not excite the base"

The polls indicate otherwise. At present, "the base" is preferring him roughly on par with the other 21 candidates combined.

[Autumn]

47. Who are you using as the base and what are their numbers ? nt

[LovingA2andMI]

78. Exactly!!!!

Thank you!

[Demsrule86]

75. All of my kids and their significant others ...those old enough to vote are voting Biden.

They find winning exciting. People tend to think others agree with them. I find many want candidates to be for Medicare or for all for the green new deal. I don't. I prefer candidates with plans that might get through congress. We have over 40 moderates in the house and there is not enough support in congress for either medicare for all or the green new deal. We will have to begin again on climate change as the left left green slime ...Stein voters cost us the last election. Trump is a disaster for climate change policy and the environment in general...the only thing worse is Trump with a second term. The country is center left. Accept it. Sometime one has to just vote for the Democrat.

[samnsara]

34. his veep pick is bound to change his mind on some issues..

[honest.abe]

35. I agree more needs to done regarding climate change. It is a crisis in the works.. however...

To dismiss Biden's approach as wrong is ridiculous. In comparison to where we are now with Trump its a 180. Furthermore if he comes on too strong he might lose some GE voters. Once elected there will be opportunities to make stricter changes.

Our first and foremost goal for 2020 is to remove the wannabe dictator from the WH. If we dont, he will become an actual dictator.

[still_one]

36. Shame on those who are distorting Biden's position on climate change. This garbage is coming from

likes of Bill McKibben, who is part of the Justice Democrats, and the Sanders 2020 campaign so it is no surprise.

ALL the Democratic candidates running are for fighting Climate Change and the Paris Accords. However, when you have Joe Biden as the biggest threat to Sanders getting the nomination, of course McKibben and the Sanders camp are behind this falsehood.

Here are some of Biden's positions:

Set out vision for young people to deal with global warming.
Unprecedented investment in renewable energy.
Cause of global warming is clearly Man-made.
Supports cap-and-trade for greenhouse gases.
Make every automobile sold be a flex-fuel automobile.
Voted against the Trans-Alaska Pipeline.
Voted YES on tax incentives for energy production and conservation.
Voted YES on addressing CO2 emissions without considering India & China
Voted YES on removing oil & gas exploration subsidies.
Voted YES on factoring global warming into federal project planning
Voted YES on disallowing an oil leasing program in Alaska's ANWR.
Voted YES on reducing oil usage by 40% by 2025 (instead of 5%)
Voted YES on banning drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge

and I could go on, because there is a lot more, but shame on Bill McKibben, and the Sanders campaign for pushing this kind of garbage implying that Biden is out of touch with environmental issues.

It is early in the campaign, and things may change, but these kind of tactics coming out of the Sanders campaign, and make no mistake about it, McKibben's is part of the Sanders campaign, so far appears not to have gained much traction, because I think people are much wiser today, and realize when someone's record is being misrepresented and distorted

Sanders has lost a good percentage of support he had from 2016. A good number of those folks have moved to the other wonderful candidates that are running for the Democratic nomination. The shine is gone, and the Sanders campaign distorting Biden's record on climate change, and other things is not going to help it.

[Cha]

44. Tom Watson is not a supporter of Biden

but I've noticed he's gone from saying he doesn't want Biden to defending him against what he considers unfair smearing by the BS campaign..

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Thanks for your post, still_one

[still_one]

45. Thanks Cha. That is very interesting. They keep pushing this garbage, and I agree, this is not

going to help them, but actually hurt them when Biden refutes them, and they are left with egg on their face

[garybeck]

56. then why did he hire a fracking consultant to be his energy advisor? n/t

[still_one]

67. If you are referring to Heather Renee Zichal, she is one of several advisors to Biden, and Zichal

was also an advisor for President Obama and John Kerry.

I just look at Biden's voting record and where he has been on climate change etc., and that tells the story,
and the suggestion that his current policies would be in direct contradiction to his long record of understanding climate change as an existential threat, is a distortion and misrepresentation of where he has been and voted.

There are some who want to play what they consider a "purity" candidate. The voters will decide, and Biden's record speaks for itself.

[garybeck]

62. disagree. you are putting the cart before the horse and distroting people's motivations

McKibben likes Sanders because of Sander's VERY LONG history of supporting efforts to combat global warming and recognize it as the #1 threat to humanity.

you are suggesting that McKibben is just friends with Sanders and he is criticizing Biden because he supports sanders.

that is wrong. McKibben is pointing out real, valid, differences and serious concerns about Biden's energy policy. McKibben has LONG history of correctly speaking against fracking and Biden appears to be a big supporter of fracking. McKibben correctly pointed out that Biden's energy advisor is in the pockets of the fracking industry.

you think he's just making the stuff up because he's friends with Sanders? give me a break. McKibben has way more integrity than that. If sanders favored fracking, he would be saying the same thing to him.

[still_one]

70. If someone is part of the Justice Democrats, it is more than just about fracking. Biden has a long

history of combatting global warming. The league of conservation of voters give Biden an 83% lifetime score on the environment, and he has been doing this since the seventies.

http://scorecard.lcv.org/moc/joe-biden

The voters will decide in the primaries and the general election

[Bayard]

79. Thanks for this!

Anyone bad-mouthing Biden on these issues needs to get their facts straight first.

[samnsara]

38. well this mornings poll has Joe up to 46% so hes doing something right

[NYMinute]

43. Climate change policy won't decide this election

despite the publicity stunt of the GND.

If you are running a horse in a race, you choose the one that will run faster and trip the republican horse. Whether the horse had a healthy, non-GMO lifestyle and whether he was brought to the race in a solar powered vehicle is not important.

[lark]

46. What do you suggest they do if Biden is our candidate for the general?

If your premise is try to get the progressives through during the primaries but vote Dem and work hard for the Dem in the general - whoever it is -that's 100% ok with me. If it's only support the most progressive and sit out the general if a moderate represents us or vote 3rd party - that's just anathema and will kill any chances at all of winning if enough people do that.

[garybeck]

64. you must have not read the OP. n/t

[Demsrule86]

74. They should vote Trump and out accept that at the moment they don't have enough support

to win a primary or a general...change minds and hearts. It was moderates who won the House not AOC type candidates. We are fighting for survival here...one more justice and the fat lady will sing for our party and our country.

[LongtimeAZDem]

48. Biden was trying to pass global warming legislation years before most of the world had heard of it

[garybeck]

59. and what has he done since?

I mean, besides being the VP when fracking went mainstream and hiring a fracking consultant as their energy advisor?

[bahrbearian]

49. I'm disturbed by his Hawkishness,

Iraq , Libya, Syria,and now Venezuela. John McCain and Henry Kissinger are good friends of mine I thought the Democratic party was against War.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

55. I didn't know that. Thanks for the info.

[Uncle Joe]

58. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread garybeck.

[LAS14]

60. I totally agree that it is our right and duty and thanks for the McKibben article.

The person I really want as president is Jay Inslee. His focus on climate change was the original reason, and then he seemed electric on Rachel. It seemed we had the issues and the charisma together. But he seemed flat on his CNN town hall. (Sort of like Harris.... I think these people are getting over and badly coached). My primary criterion is electability, and I'm waiting to see who takes off. I will cast my vote in the primary for Buttigieg, not because I think he is electable, but because I want him to make a strong showing as a trail blazer..... That is, unless Inslee has shown himself to be able to attract voters. Then it will be Inslee.

[awesomerwb1]

66. Anyone who cares about the planet

should put getting rid of trump in 2020 as their first priority.

Keep waiting for the perfect candidate and trump wins and then the planet is TRULY fucked.

Any of our Dem candidates is order of magnitudes better than trump for the environment/planet.

[garybeck]

69. yes i agree, but i would add

that as long as we have primaries and the D candidate hasn't been chosen yet, we should be discussing all these things

[corbettkroehler]

73. I'm A Climate Zealot But Won't Attack Biden

As you stated, "discuss the differences."

Bernie's strength on climate is part of why I support Sanders. However, my commitment to voting for the eventual nominee, whoever he/she may be, is ironclad.

[MineralMan]

76. Biden was right. Burning natural gas for things like electrical generation

is far less harmful than burning coal or fuel oil. It's a much cleaner fuel that produces less harmful emissions.

Of course, it's still a fossil fuel, and produces carbon dioxide at a high rate, but less of other harmful pollutants.

Nuclear electrical generation produces no carbon dioxide, so it is neutral with regard to climate change. However, it has long-term negative effects, due to its radioactive waste, along with the potential to create Fukushima-type disasters.

Hydroelectic power generation is also neutral, but has its own environmental effects, and isn't available everywhere.

Wind and solar power generation are also better for the environment, but are not always in operation.

Biden is stuck with some realities, and has worked to minimize negative environmental effects. The realities, however, have still not changed materially. Less energy consumption is essential, but is not easily created by governments.

Biden has been involved with climate change measures since 1987. He is not ignorant about the needs.

[LovingA2andMI]

77. Biden's Position on Marijuana.....

Will get our vote. Any "Free The Weed" candidate, will not.