Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumIn 2020, authenticity and empathy will, yes, trump ideology
What the Democrats Turn Leftward Means for the Partys Chances in 2020With President Trump and his team delighted by the Democrats leftward turn, a central question emerges: Will running on a more explicitly progressive platform energize the Democratic base, or will it cost the Party the 2020 election? To consider this question and others, I spoke by phone with Dave Wasserman, the U.S. House editor for the Cook Political Report and a contributor to NBC News. During our conversation, which has been edited for length and clarity, we also discussed whether voters are less ideological than people think they are, the ways in which the Electoral College presents a challenge to Democrats winning Presidential elections, and the true lesson of the 2018 midterms.
Do you think Democrats whose primary desire is to see Trump defeated should be concerned or excited that their party seems to be moving leftward?
I dont think Democrats would be wise to run against Trump on a platform of completely open borders and abolishing private health insurance. There are limits. But, generally, the tiny sliver of voters in this country who are still persuadable are not highly ideological people. They are fundamentally anti-élite in nature, and they are looking for three characteristics in a candidate for President that dont have much to do with left-versus-right. And those characteristics are authenticity, being a credible agent for change, and empathy. In other words, does this person understand my daily struggles? And a common thread between Obama and Trump was a common touch.
Its all relative, but, whether it was having been a community organizer on the South Side of Chicago or a billionaire who ate K.F.C. and went to professional wrestling matches, it struck a chord with those voters.
More at https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/what-the-democrats-turn-leftward-means-for-the-partys-chances-in-2020
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)lose if we don't rebuild the blue wall... we have no path to the presidency. The idea that any of our candidates can win this area is not true. Most have gone way to far left. And open borders and MFA with private insurance illegal will hurt us badly.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BeyondGeography
(39,371 posts)But if you nominate someone who doesnt connect with people personally it wont matter.
The flip side is if you have that ability, you can fine tune as needed and win swing voters.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BeyondGeography
(39,371 posts)This line of reasoning is kinder to Biden than it is to Harris, IMO, who I find to be, lets say, a little too personal results-oriented. It also fits Warren.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)IMHO to win in the mid west, but has a better chance than Harris who has none that I can see.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)is increasing African American turnout in the cities. If we do that, we win.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)you shouldn't this year not with Trump...what you overlook is many in the Black community are moderates and won't like the policies either.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)AAs will sit out because a candidate is progressive. They had lower turnout with Hillary Clinton and shes fairly moderate to liberal. I think Biden is our best shot but if he continues to shoot himself in the foot and not tighten up his messaging, hes going to lose the primary.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)you can expect voter suppression shenanigans too...we need to win back the Obama voters...it took them and AA community communities to win here.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)Ive been saying all over threads that one of our main keys to victory is winning back those who voted Obama twice then turned around and voted for the Idiot.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)people in my area both in 08 and in 12...He did a great job. I worked the campaign and Biden is and was beloved in Ohio...He speaks their language. None of the other candidates do.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueWI
(1,736 posts)Between voter suppression and a lukewarm statewide campaign, Democratic voting was down 200K in Wisconsin in 2016. Trump got about the same number of votes as Romney in 2012 with big defections from Republican to Libertarian in the state, bigger than the number of Greens voting for Stein. So the enthusiasm for Trump in WI in 2016 is exaggerated. A big turnout from the Democratic base along with earned independent support wins the election in 2020.
Low turnout among base voters is toxic to Democratic campaigns in a presidential year.
Those are mistakes not to repeat.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)They are not ideological about many things. They are meat and potatoes, wallet issue voters. Jobs. The belief that the trade agreements are sucking jobs out of the country. Empathy, like the OP article says. "Is anyone listening to me? Does anyone care? Do I matter in America, any more?"
I don't personally know, though. I've never been to those states.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)in that the man being interviewed says that the ability to connect is most important. Obama had it, Clinton had it, I guess Trump has a bad version of it.
Who in this field can connect? In my opinion, Biden, Warren, ORourke and Harris. I would say Buttigieg but he has virtually no African American support which is critical for a Democratic victory.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)I'm not sure who has the most ability to connect. I'll have to look for that. Offhand, I'd say that's part of Biden's appeal. He pays attention to people, he listens, he seems to care.
I'll have to pay attention to Warren and Beto for that. I don't think Harris has that warm, fuzzy "I feel your pain." It's not part of her DNA. I could be wrong, but that's my impression. Now, I'm okay with that approach, as long as she lets people know she feels their pain, even if she doesn't show it emotionally, like Clinton did. Obama was one of the best on that, too, as you say.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)elections and then that's it. So they were ripe for the picking with a liar like Trump...not me. I had gone to school in Connectiuct and new Trump was a POS...and I am a yellow dog Democrats. Now Trump has harmed this area and we have a chance even in Ohio if Biden is the candidate. The other candidates have moved too far to the left to to win here...and there is a dislike of coastal elites which fair or not Harris and Warren would be considered.
Also, while my neighbors are unhappy with the treatment of refugees...they are not for open borders and with many here unable to afford health care even with a medicaid expansion... thanks to Trump's attacks on the ACA, they would be infuriated if undocumented folks received 'free' health care...we all know it is not that siimple. But it is what it is. These are not bad people either...they have been kicked around for years...I have heard some even on this site say well...'those jobs aren't coming back;. Well jobs need to come back. It is a disgrace how the midwest has been treated with bad trade deals and neglected too...a few super rich folks( Romney and his buddies) were enriched but the folks lost good paying jobs. Now Trump can't fix this...he doesn't give two shits and after he attacked the union in Lordstown, a plant he caused to shut down with steel tariffs, people are starting to wake up...but they need a candidate that speaks their language...only Biden can do this... He helped Pres. Obama tremendously with this area both in 08 and 12.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)I was dismayed at the cheers when one of the candidates said he/she wanted to provide free health care to undocumented people in his/her state or district, or something like that. How can that be right, when we're not providing free health care to all Americans? And we would ask those Americans w/o health care to pay taxes so that non-Americans can get free health care? I think some of the candidates are getting carried away promising lots of free stuff. Nothing's free, anyway.
Trump doesn't give a lick about the workers in the rust belt, or anywhere else. He made false promises. But they grasped at whatever straw they could get. The Democratic Party can get them back. From a selfish standpoint, we need those states. Plus, we ARE the party that represents the working man and woman.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)badly here.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)Just don't pledge other people's money for it.
If you provide free health care to illegal immigrants, people from around the world will enter the country just for that....free health care. Don't you see? No country offers free health care to anyone in the world who can get in through the borders. No country can afford that. It's also cruel to working class Americans who don't qualify for Medicaid...to give free health care to non-citizens. What does that tell hard working blue collar Americans with no health care? No, it doesn't make sense, and we can't afford it. Everyone sympathizes with anyone in the world without health care (including Americans), but that doesn't mean we can provide it free of charge for them.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)They did not raise their hands to "will your plan provide free coverage to undocumented immigrants?" It was. "Raise your hand ifif your government plan would provide coverage for undocumented immigrants." -- All ten raised their hands, to great applause besides, which was kind of shocking.
To Mayor Pete's credit (and he was the first to speak after the show of hands), he explained that--at least in his plan--it's an insurance policy and the people would be buying into it, like anyone else. But that wasn't in the question, and to a casual watcher, I think it came across like everyone raising their hands for "free health care for undocumented immigrants." And I agree, that would play badly. There is a big difference between "everyone should be able to buy into it" which is well defensible compared to "everyone gets covered, period" which will turn off a whole lot of voters, and I think that distinction got lost, in part because not everyone's hand-raising answer necessarily meant the same thing, because not everyone supports the same plan. The question needed a qualifier... "Raise your hand if your government plan would provide coverage for undocumented immigrants IF THEY PAY FOR THAT COVERAGE." That deserves 10 raised hands, but unqualified, it's dicey, and we really don't know exactly how each candidate interpreted it. As long as they are paying for the coverage, most people who are not already committed to Trump would probably be okay if these folks got the benefit they are paying for, but if they are not paying for it, I think many would say that they are not entitled to any health benefits beyond the E.R. (and many people mistakenly believe that immigrants don't pay any taxes as it is).
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)with it...dangerous for sure.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)And Buttigieg (and the other candidates who raised their hands I'm sure) are fine with even undocumented immigrants getting coverage under their plans if they pay for that coverage. And I don't think that would be too controversial, except to the most rabid anti-immigrants who are going to be Trump voters anyway. So I'm not sure what your point here is.
The ambiguity comes from how you handle the healthcare of undocumented immigrants who don't buy into the system, that's where I think you can easily lose a lot of popular support. Which is further complicated if one doesn't buy into it through a specific healthcare premium, but rather, through some other tax mechanism.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)And while the rest of the country prospered as we climbed out of recession...it didn't happen here.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)It explains that we have to get everything right in order to win in 2020. We must win back two time Obama voters who turned around and voted Trump. Also we must increase African American turnout in the swing states.
It ends by saying Michelle Obama would be our ideal candidate. I agree.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)A candidate just recognizing a group of people, their issues. Remember Bill Clinton's "I feel your pain"? The worst thing for a voter is to feel invisible. They'll go to whoever says "I see you. I hear you. You are as important as anyone else in this country."
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Turin_C3PO
(13,979 posts)Its not so much about ideology but about, what you said, empathy and charisma too.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)Some I agree with, but I'm not so sure about other things.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BeyondGeography
(39,371 posts)Authenticity and empathy. The third is credible agent for change, where she is unsurpassed in my not so impartial opinion.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)mid west. And anyone who wants to make private insurance illegal will not win here.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Do they not like empathy in the mid west?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)ago?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)Hey I would vote for her in a general...I like her. But I want someone as nominee who can win the states we need.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)It's not something you learn, you have to be born with it. If you don't have it, you won't last one day in a special ed. classroom. That's my entire point. Whether people in Michigan will vote for someone from Massachusetts is a good topic for a different thread.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Politicub
(12,165 posts)Thats how the only Biden can win posts make them sound. They will have lived under four years of Trump and will decide to vote on whether or not his approach is working for them.
From what Im seeing, when people are exposed to Warren, they connect with her. She has momentum precisely because shes gaining more visibility and exposure to people. Shes likeable and sincere.
But I am not someone who takes it as an article of faith that only Biden can save us. The electable argument has always been spurious. Because someone leads in polls months before a vote will be cast means very little.
Warren is working tirelessly for every vote. I dont see that with Biden. Biden doesnt seem to grasp modern campaigning. He will drop a slickly produced video and give a speech somewhere and then he disappears for days at a time.
Slickly produced videos are nice and all, but they need to be part of a broader communications strategy.
I am holding Biden to a high standard. But its not higher than the standard Im holding for the other nominees. I want Biden to wow people. He has had some good ideas but doesnt follow through on selling them. I dont know why that is.
If he is the standard bearer, he will need to work as tirelessly as Warren to win. I will be pleased to see it when he starts doing that.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indygram
(2,113 posts)Warren comes across as pretty authentic too. Her positions are too far left for me, though, being a moderate. I don't get that authentic vibe from most of the candidates, sadly.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BeyondGeography
(39,371 posts)And for good reason. From an average voter perspective, there arent many meaningful differences on the issues between candidates. Authenticity comes down to trust, basically. Candidates who have it can go far.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)should be illegal. The positions many of the candidates have taken will cost them the general in 20. They will lose the rust belt.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Indygram
(2,113 posts)But I do believe that she's authentic and she really believes in what she calls for. That authenticity really helps her a lot but some of her positions hurt her in a general.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)not picking on them...they are in the top 3. VP Biden helped Pres. Obama with this area...he speaks their language which is why he has a good chance of beating Trump. In my opinion,the only chance.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Skya Rhen
(2,701 posts)General because he will win these same states (in addition to most of the red states) in the Primaries, thereby providing him with the most delegates.
The rustbelt and red states will make Joe the Democratic nominee, whether we like it or not....
Florida (Biden 47.4%, Warren 11.8%, Buttigieg 8.4%) 219 delegates
http://stpetepolls.org/files/StPetePolls_2019_State_DEM_Pres_June23_I63R.pdf
Pennsylvania (Biden 39%, Sanders 13%, Warren 8%) 153 delegates
https://poll.qu.edu/pennsylvania/release-detail?ReleaseID=2620
South Carolina (Biden 45%, Sanders 18%, Warren 8%) 54 delegates
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByVu4fDHYJgVNFB2S3h5MUQzUzVDNjBQaExTdkZDQ0RGcTU4/view
Ohio (Biden 29%. Sanders 19%, Warren 12%) 136 delegates
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primaries/democratic/ohio/
Texas (Biden 30%, O'Rourke 16%, Sanders 15%) 228 delegates
https://poll.qu.edu/texas/release-detail?ReleaseID=2625
North Carolina (Biden 39%, Sanders 22%, Warren 15%) 110 delegates
http://emersonpolling.com/2019/06/04/north-carolina-2020-biden-with-early-lead-on-trump-and-democratic-primary-field/
Virginia (Biden 36%, Sanders 17%, Warren 13%) 99 delegates
news.hamptonu.edu/release/Nationally-Recognized-Hampton-University-Center-for-Public-Policy%27s-Latest-Poll-Shows-Biden-Leads-Crowded-Democratic-Presidential-Nominee-Pack
Wisconsin (Biden 28%, Sanders 13%, Warren 14%) 77 delegates
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primaries/democratic/wisconsin/
Indiana (Biden 33%, Sanders 23%, Buttigieg 20%) 70 delegates
http://www.weaskamerica.com/surveys/2019/5/9/indiana-statewide-survey-of-registered-voters
Arizona (Biden 35%, Sanders 16%, Warren 10%) 67 delegates
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primaries/democratic/arizona/
Mississippi (Biden 50%, Sanders 7%, Warren 7%) 36 delegates
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primaries/democratic/mississippi/
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
highplainsdem
(48,975 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden