Stop the Marianne Williamson bandwagon right now. Stop it. By Brian Boyle Los Angeles Times

[question everything]

(snip)

Stirring the pot, generally speaking, is good. But there is one clear exception: celebrity whisperer Marianne Williamson (who, I feel obligated to mention as early as possible, has a history of anti-science, anti-vaccination rhetoric that, alone, should be immediately disqualifying).

(snip)

Look, like most 22-year-olds, the line between genuine appreciation and ironic enjoyment blurred in my head long ago. And I hate to crash the tarot card-reading party. But this has to stop. Now. Because we’ve seen this before. Give Williamson enough shine as a “joke” candidate and soon enough voters will start to buy in. No, Williamson’s core beliefs aren’t a fraction as malignant as Donald Trump’s. And no, she isn’t a one-to-one mirror image. But she politics the same way, and that makes her dangerous. Like Trump, she’s uncovered a disaffected corner of the party. The kind that doesn’t vote; the kind that’s inspired more by an appeal to ill-defined existential emotions than effective policymaking. Like Trump, she projects a coming American apocalypse, tapping into liberal nightmares rather than conservative ones. Like Trump, she then presents herself and her own spiritual gut instinct as the sole (and soulful) path to salvation.

Read this Williamson quote from Tuesday night, which received thunderous applause:

“If you think any of this wonkiness is going to deal with this dark psychic force of the collectivized hatred that this president is bringing up in this country, then I’m afraid that the Democrats are going to see some very dark days.”

Read it again.

Bemoaning “wonkiness” — i.e., intellect and proven political savvy — while speaking in vague buzzwords like “dark psychic force” and “collectivized hatred” is not too far off from the Trump 2016 playbook. And matching the GOP’s anti-intellectualism movement is far from what the Democratic Party, and America, need in 2020. Williamson also called out her peers as part of the corruption problem, thus inherently offering her outside celebrity status as proof she is beholden to no one. Sound familiar? This tweet is practically written in Trump’s voice: “There’s some corruption that is so deep, ladies and gentlemen. #BigTruth #DemDebate”

(snip)

But none of this is surprising. Williamson is a self-help guru (whatever that means) and she knows America is hurting right now. She knows liberals are confused and scared and need direction. This is what she does: offer vague solutions — through some combination of positive thinking, religious prayer and spiritual awakening — while decrying the expert opinion in the field. In the past, she’d simply ask that we buy her book. Now she wants us to make her president. We need to stop this before it’s too late. In the meantime, please excuse me while I go consult my healing crystals.

http://www.startribune.com/stop-the-marianne-williamson-bandwagon-right-now-stop-it/513517122/

Brian A. Boyle is a 2019 intern with the Editorial Pages of the Los Angeles Times.

[tblue37]

1. K&R for visibility. nt

[Tarc]

2. The Russian bot farms love her

[MontanaMama]

5. You're correct and Russian bot farms love

Tulsi Gabbard as well.

[Traildogbob]

29. Tulsi

Please explain to me. While traveling through western very rural South Carolina 2 month ago to visit my dad in Georgia, the 3 hour drive had literally a dozen Tulsi billboards. Both going and returning on the opposite side of the road. She claims she has nothing but small donors. Rural South Carolona is not a winning location. DNC would not be spending that money there. This is Lindsay country. Tulsi is a Putin apologist, says get over Russian interference, move on. She is a Assad sympathizer. Why target limited money in rural extremely red states? We know Graham is bought and paid for by Puty Pants. We know Puty Pants financed Jill Stien, not to win, to peel away votes. Someone from Rural Kentucky respond to this and let me know if the same is going on in rural red Kentucky. This smells worse than trumps brown stained white pants while golfing. I truly believe she is Puty's new Jill Stien. He knows we are on to Stien, she is no longer needed. Stein is amazingly silent from this new field, and she has never been so out of sight in presidential primaries. Beware, follow the money, if you can. Puty can hide his cash flow extemely well. Would like to know if DNC is spending cash on a losing cause in Lindsayville. South Carolina does not even know Hawaii is a US state. Any thoughts?

[MontanaMama]

43. I can't answer your questions and hope that one of our KY friends do so...

But, Malcolm Nance firmly believes that Gabbard is Putin's plant in the Dem party. When Malcolm Nance sounds the alarm bells, I listen to him...he's got zero good to say about Tulsi Gabbard. Why even chance supporting her when there are so many stellar Dems running for president? There are nefarious forces at work at the moment and they support her.

[Traildogbob]

50. Chief Nance is screaming the alarm.

He has been spot on with all 3 of his books. When he speaks, I listen closely. He is the new day short term Nostradamus. All his predictions are happening as stated. Makes me very proud of my Navy career. He is Not an officer. And enlisted man, patriotic beyond what most could possibly comprehend. I would charge an incoming missle at his order. And then they have general Flynn as a trumper. Which is a patriot?

[customerserviceguy]

55. I suspected she had a lot of billboards up in SC

I have two of them in my area, on the coast. Also, she buys a lot of TV ads on Charleston-area cable. She's been pushing her military service, and that counts for something here.

I'm doubtful that she's doing it anywhere else, if she can finish fourth or even third in SC, that would be noteworthy, and might get her some attention nationally.

[Traildogbob]

63. I served

Volunteered during Vietnam era. Draft number was 324. I respect her service, but General Flynn served, Tom Cotton served, George Bush served, Lindsay Graham served, many more criminal GOP in congresses served. Money corrupts. Lots of money corrupts lots. Living on service retirement is barely living. Sure seems like Cabbert is spending lots of money, small donation cash, where she would have zero chance, other than peeling votes away from trump's biggest threats, Kamala is a big threat. Let's see if trump starts praising Tulsi, the pro nuke candidate stomping hard in PutY's Lindsay land.

[DaGimpster]

84. all over iowa

I guess this shouldn't be a huge surprise, but her billboards are plastered all over Iowa. It's a picture of her, and a slogan like "courageous heart" or something along those lines.

I saw a couple of the same ones on a drive from IA to FL as well, but I forget where.

[customerserviceguy]

85. Well, then

she's targeting the early primary states. Not unexpected at this point in the process.

[FakeNoose]

20. Really? I thought they created her

[lapfog_1]

77. but not as much as they love Tulsi... according to MSNBC.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. Williamson has no business running for president.

It's true that Trump has created some kind of dark "psychic force of collectivized hatred," but her solution - some fuzzy notion of "love" - isn't going to fix that problem. I'd like to see the candidates crawl out of the weeds of their legislative proposals because presidents don't do legislation and none of their plans will make it through Congress intact, but obviously a certain level of precision and focus is required. They can focus on the important big-picture ideas while rejecting all that silly spiritual fog. And then there's the fact that she's something of an anti-vaxxer, and her ideas about depression and mental illness are anti-scientific and seriously dumb. She won't be the nominee, but she really ought to go back to selling self-help books to rich people with first-world anxieties.

[Docreed2003]

9. +1

[Hortensis]

47. Agree. It's inappropriate to the point of immoral and unethical.

We need candidate criteria that will eliminate frivolous candidacies. People who want to sell books or increase their speaking fees, or even harness love and other mystic forces, need to stick to other ways, including running as Republicans.

On the plus side, one post-debate poll this morning shows her support hasn't grown. If it's at all accurate, there's no "bandwagon."

[BlancheSplanchnik]

72. +2

[TreasonousBastard]

75. No, she doesn't but she played by the rules and got...

the poll numbers, signatures, contributions or whatever else was required.

And while she has no chance in hell of being nominated, I really have no problem adding her voice to the cacophony. Back when there were fewer candidates, we all enjoyed coverage of Vermin Supreme-- and he's running again this year, but no one noticed.

I don't equate Williamson with Supreme, but she has every much a right to be there as Andrew Yang, and a few others.

And as much of a right to fail.

[lostnfound]

4. I agree, but I do think "collectivized hatred" is a good and useful meme for what has coalesced

but I agree with the concern expressed here

[Hekate]

6. SIGH. Yeah, I know I've tried to see what use she could possibly be to us, but this hits too close

...to home. She really should not be running....

[mtnsnake]

7. THANK YOU! The author said she is a "joke candidate" and I could not agree more with him.

The longer she is included with the other candidates, the more damage she will do to our front runners and our chances.

[question everything]

11. I have been saying this ever since she appeared on PBSNewsHour

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287144238

and I concluded

"But then, if we have a TV personality sitting in the White House, why not a love guru? "

Even on these pages, some think that she should be in the debate, someone asked me what i had against her. And this scares me. Many main stream Republicans, like David Brooks, thought that Trump was a joke that he won't make it..

Just now on Ali Velshi he had a table of the nominees, and she is ahead of Klobuchar!

[mathematic]

8. This guy stole my OP!

Needless to say, agree 100%. I'm glad to see the point being made in the press.

[Paladin]

10. I've never favored a Marianne Willamson candidacy.

But if I had, yesterday's supportive NYT column by right-wing twerp David Brooks would have extinguished it, tout fucking sweet. Talk about attracting the wrong sort of company.....

[question everything]

12. Will have to read it. He insisted, to the end, that Trump was not going to make it..

Why does he think that she is different, in her campaign, in her (lack of) experience, in relying on a celebrity status?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

13. Williamson is in it for self-promotion every bit as much as tRump was in 2016 for self-promotion

Neither person expect(s,ed) to win.

I trust Democrats will not make a tRumpian mistake.

[FakeNoose]

21. You're right, and the Repukes were too stupid to realize it in 2016

Or maybe they did realize it, and they didn't care.

[Pepsidog]

14. I agree.

[LW1977]

15. Williamson be cray

Not really a democratic figure either. Hope a jury doesn’t erase this post for telling it like it is.

[bronxiteforever]

16. I agree.We already have a POTUS who is ignorant of science

Along with his whole dirtbag party. We do not need another anti science idiot around, especially in our Party.

[theophilus]

17. Crucify her! Crucify her! HaHa. This is what happens when you talk about love in

our fucked up society of today. She is no where near my top picks but I do like the love part of her message. Love is the best way to counter HATE and that is what we are up against. Love is not a squishing "feeling". Love is a powerful "doing". It is patient, and kind, and that other important stuff that usually produces a positive feeling in a human that has a heart.


Mayor Pete speaks of his faith and that includes love. Mr. Booker has been known to speak of love and compassion. Many of the others. Whoever wins this nomination thing better have Love in their toolbox and know how to use it. This society has a great need of agape love whether we know it or not.

Being mean will just continue to split us. Vlad doesn't care who "wins" as long as we are totally torn asunder.

Give love a chance and let's don't crucify anyone this time.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. No. Anti-vaxxing is NOT love. People against her for stupid stuff not "love". . . . nt

[OnDoutside]

26. +1

[watoos]

35. I listened to her policy

On vaccines and her analysis is spot on. She is not an anti vaxer. She wants the government and scientists to study vaccines instead of leaving Big Pharma with the reins.
Want to know what self help means? You can make yourself sick with your mind and you can cure yourself with your mind. Explain why placebos cure people. Williamson makes more sense than a lot of our candidates.

[robersl]

44. Exactly!

[Bernardo de La Paz]

45. Bogus. People who make themselves sick don't have the tools to cure themselves.

A person who shoots themselves in the foot does not have an X-Ray machine and physiotherapy equipment to cure themselves. Very few people "make" themselves mentally ill. Almost all people who fall mentally ill have a biochemical imbalance or have been injured by external circumstances.

Placebos are not self-help! They are external actions even if nominally empty. Their occasional effectiveness is not evidence of self-help.

The government and scientists are ALREADY STUDYING vaccines. Duh. Saying they need to study them is simply parroting anti-science propaganda based on that discredited scientist who faked data.

The principle of vaccination was discovered and vaccines themselves were invented centuries ago, not by Big Pharma.

[moriah]

86. You might be able to make yourself sick via your mind...

... though the number of actual "conversion disorders" vs doctors who want to tell their patients that ailments like fibromyalgia, etc, are "all in your head" is very low...

Belief in God is NOT more powerful than the AIDS virus. It doesn't matter how hard you pray, without antivirals it's still gonna kill you.

And placebos *don't* cure people, not when statistics come into play to control for ordinary changes in a condition (even with cancer or AIDS, there's gonna be good days and bad days). That's why placebo-controlled double-blind studies are used -- to see if a medication is more effective than the perception they are getting care. And yes, the perception of getting care does help a person -- but it doesn't cure their illness.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

28. Love is great; anti-vaxxers and purveyors of false information about

depression and mental illness, not so much.

[watoos]

36. Those aren't her positions

[IronLionZion]

18. 22 year old intern is terrified of a new age hippie as a liberal Trump

[Bernardo de La Paz]

27. Does your post have ageism? Attacking his age because can't rebut his message?

[IronLionZion]

38. Someone promoting love over hate is not a threat to anyone

[Bernardo de La Paz]

41. Promoting anti-vax & bogus mental health shit is a threat to EVERYONE. tRump says he loves everyone.

Doesn't matter how much Williamson says she loves everyone.

Propagating serious health problems is NOT love.

[IronLionZion]

46. Marianne Williamson Responds To Criticism Over Past Vaccine, Mental Health Remarks

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/marianne-williamson-vaccines-mental-healthx_n_5d422533e4b0aca341182bf3

On Wednesday, Williamson told Melber: “It’s an overstatement to say that I cast skepticism on vaccinations. On the issue of vaccinations, I’m pro-vaccination. I’m pro-medicine. I’m pro-science.”

She continued: “On all these issues, what I’m bringing up ... is questions about the role of predatory Big Pharma.”

Her skepticism was more of the health care industry and big pharma, not the people who need treatment. I can't believe I have to defend this woman here on DU, of all places. She's not even my candidate.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

51. Your selective excerpting is bogus. Here is the real story and it is not ancient. From your link:

Melber played a clip from a podcast recorded in November 2018 with actor Russell Brand in which Williamson referred to clinical depression as a “scam.”

“All that means is somebody in a clinic said it,” Williamson said in the clip.

The author apologized on Wednesday, saying she was “speaking glibly.”

“That was wrong of me to say, and I’m sorry that I said it,” Williamson told Melber.

Only after being called on it does she, with modified self-interest now that she is a politician, recant some of her nonsense.

Serious people with serious policies do not speak glibly on serious topics.

[IronLionZion]

56. If you say so

[Bernardo de La Paz]

57. No. She said so. . . . . nt

[Bradshaw3]

60. I can't believe you ARE defending her on DU of all places

Democrats are either the party of science and facts or they are not. You don't get to pick and choose which science facts you believe in and that which you don't. That's what the repubs do. Her perspective all about the source bullshit. If you are sick it is your fault. I can't believe people on DU fall for this BS.

[IronLionZion]

69. ...

[robersl]

49. Not What She's Saying

I agree with you that "bogus health shit is a threat to everyone" but she is neither anti-vax nor bogus.

Listen to her interview with Ari Melber if you want to get your facts straight.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

52. Serious people with serious policies do not speak glibly on serious topics. Not ancient either.

Read my post #51 above.

[yuiyoshida]

19. She really is the last person we need in

this Democratic party, she is too far off that limb of the tree to be bothered with.

[Gothmog]

22. Is anyone really taking this person seriously??

Is there really a bandwagon for this person? Why?

[littlemissmartypants]

37. Yes. Which is all the more frightening. nt

[customerserviceguy]

58. Only of late-night show joke writers. n/t

[question everything]

65. Read some of the comments upstream..

[YOHABLO]

23. Um I don't think Williamson is much of a threat to any candidate.

I didn't know anything about Williamson, nor did I know she's one of Winfrey's gurus. I don't disagree with her statement she made during the debate. Trump is a ''dark psychic force'' to be reckoned with, and there is an ever growing ''collectivized hatred'' infecting our nation, it's called white supremacy and racism. Marianne has as much right to run for president as you or I.

[Act_of_Reparation]

31. If we need to be worried self-described "socialists" are going to ruin our brand...

...shouldn't we be equally concerned the anti-vaxxing crystal worshippers will do the same?

[Funtatlaguy]

34. This 1000 times.

[question everything]

66. This is what most Republicans and the rest of the country thought of Trump in 2015 and 2016

[Bernardo de La Paz]

68. She is an airhead who is sucking the oxygen out of the policy & strategy rooms.

She has the right to do that and the Democratic Party has the right to ignore her and deny her access that she doesn't earn.

[iluvtennis]

25. + agree. this will lead to what we had in 2016 where Jill Stein and Gary Johnson got votes that

Hillary should have received.

Don't get me wrong, ppl should be able to vote for whoever they want to vote for. However in 2016, we were in dire stratits with the orange madman on the ticket and I think ppl should have voted for the candidate who could win.

nfortunately due to the two party dominance in the current system, this is necessary. I look forward to the day where there is no pary affliation and ppl get to choose from a short list of candidates and it's one person, one vote and none of this EC stuff.

[NRaleighLiberal]

30. She belongs to the Goop party

[greatauntoftriplets]

80. Which begs the question.

Does she use a GOOP vaginal egg?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2018/09/05/gwyneth-paltrow-goop-vaginal-egg-settlement/1201152002/

[Bradshaw3]

32. K&R - There are some on here who need to read this

She is not harmless or spouting "words we need to hear" as some on here have said. She said in the last debate that the answers to our problems won't be found on the debate stage and that policies aren't important. How is that any different than what Bernie has said and been villified for on here for attacking Democrats?

To her and her followers the answers are all to be found within - greedy billionaires. power-hungry autocrats - don't take them to task. If you're sick or poor, it's your fault. It's pretty sad when a 22-year-old intern has more sense than some DUers who have bought her schtick.

[Funtatlaguy]

33. Comparing Senator Sanders to a motivational speaker is ludicrous.

[calguy]

40. I agree 100%

I've heard Bernie speak dozens of times and he has yet to motivate me.

[Bradshaw3]

59. I didn't do that so your comment is ludicrous

I compared the reaction people had (rightly or wrongly) to Sanders comments while nothing has been said about Williamson's comments about the other Democrats on stage. Hopefully you can understand the difference now.

[Funtatlaguy]

67. Sorry, I know it wasn't you, you just passed it along.

The person who said it is a dumass, not you.

[Bradshaw3]

70. Thanks, no problem

[watoos]

39. I listened to her on TV

Yesterday and she was not what everyone here is describing her to be.

[robersl]

42. Chill Brian

I'm not voting for Marianne for president, but she is saying something very important.

Trump is a world-class textbook demagogue. Absolutely unoriginal. His every move is tried and true by tyrants of the past.

She is the only one addressing his demagoguery for what it is. Other candidates certainly condemn Trump, but she is pointing out his methodology.

And until the professional politicians on the debate stage pick up her point, I want to continue to hear her.

[OrwellwasRight]

81. +1

I'm so tired of people being ALL CAPS ANGRY that someone has the gaul to get involved in the democratic process. i guarantee the people SO ANGRY at her are the same ones who wanted Bernie to drop out after South Carolina in 2016 and wanted Brown to drop out before California in 1992 and think Jesse Jackson probably should have never run in 1988.

This is a democracy. We are supposed to be free. Free to run, free to vote, free to choose. Williamson says things that need to be said. Everyone else is promoting censorship for wanting her to shut up.

[nini]

48. Thank you.. I'm sick of people not taking their vote seriously

This is not a freaking game. Our futures depend on getting a qualified person in place to save our democracy.

It makes me nuts to think she's even on the stage with the qualified candidates we have.

[yaesu]

53. She has the right to run for president but shouldn't have imho. We must remember that running

for office can be economically lucrative & many have made a good living doing so plus the publicity that it brings. I'm thinking that is her motivation but I may be wrong.

[MBS]

61. + 1 million n/t

[Ponietz]

62. Who more embodies love than Elizabeth Warren?

Thanks for the cold water.

[bronxiteforever]

64. +1 She does and what I deeply respect about her

Is that she trying to transition compassion into policies which is hard work in the political arena and to me that is the essential difference between us and the other side.

[Hoyt]

78. Her "Economic Patriotism" belies that.

[Skittles]

71. I am NOT "confused and scared and need direction"

I am angry and sickened and hell bent on getting that fascist fucker OUT THE WHITE HOUSE

[colsohlibgal]

73. We Could And Now Have Much Worse

She is not anti vaccination . As for policy I heard her get deep into that both on MSNBC one Sunday and as the early guest on Bill Maher’s Show, I respect and listen a lot to Thom Hartmann and he praises her constantly.

Yes she has virtually no chance but she is not remotely similar to Tulsi Gabbard, who has virtually no chance either.

[jcgoldie]

74. Williamson might have some issues

But I'm a fan after watching her knock Buck Sexton in the dirt while all Bill Maher did was suck him off.

[dflprincess]

76. That was truly enjoyable.

She didn't let him get away with anything. I think her true calling is as a guest on talk shows calling out right wingers.

[Hoyt]

79. I agree on Williamson kicking Eddie Munster Sexton. But Maher all but laughed in his face.

[Grasswire2]

82. No voter should EVER EVER consider a candidate with zero governmental experience again.

NEVER

NEVER

EVER

NEVER

NEVER

NEVER

EVER

[myohmy2]

83. she...

...was the candidate on the end, right?...

...I've never heard of her before the debate,

" "If you think any of this wonkiness is going to deal with this dark psychic force of the collectivized hatred that this president is bringing up in this country, then I’m afraid that the Democrats are going to see some very dark days." — Marianne Williamson​ "

...she impressed the hell out of me...while everyone else was arguing over their latest list of doodads, she was hammering away at our current zeitgeist and psyche, and she nailed it...

" Give Williamson enough shine as a “joke” candidate and soon enough voters will start to buy in. "

...now that's just plain mean...

...I'll bet Brian's powder is getting wet...