How Will Democrats Respond to Bernie Sanders & Donald Trump's "Open Borders" Attacks?

[TomCADem]

Bernie Sanders has continued his attacks on "open border" policies arguing that such policies attract poor immigrant into the U.S. Likewise, Trump has often criticized Democrats for their immigration stances, claiming they're "the party of open borders."

https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-open-borders-poverty-world-immigration-1388767

Trump has inaccurately accused opponents from both parties, but especially Democrats, of supporting open borders, claiming they would allow "criminals" and "terrorists" to enter the U.S. undeterred. Democratic leaders have pushed back, pointing out that they support secure borders, and as Sanders said, wanted comprehensive immigration reform. But they have staunchly opposed the president's plan to construct a wall along the U.S.-Mexico border, as they believe such a measure would prove ineffective and costly.

Some immigration advocates and progressives have pushed for open borders, however, and many were quick to criticize Sanders's response on social media. Many said he sounded like Trump on immigration, while others argued that the U.S., as a wealthy nation, should show more concern about the plight of migrants.

Sanders, however, has long criticized open borders. In 2015, he referred to them as a "right wing proposal" pushed forward by the wealthy Koch brothers. "You're doing away with the concept of a nation state, and I don't think there's any country in the world which believes in that," he said in an interview with Ezra Klein of Vox.

While no Democratic candidate has supported "open borders," many progressives have called for decriminalizing crossing the border without papers. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Elizabeth Warren and Julian Castro have all called to decriminalize crossing the border without papers:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/07/12/alexandria_ocasio-cortez_on_border_this_is_a_manufactured_crisis_because_the_cruelty_is_manufactured.html

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Border: "This Is A Manufactured Crisis Because The Cruelty Is Manufactured"

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) testified as a witness at a House Oversight and Reform Committee hearing on migrant children and border security. The Congresswoman insisted on being sworn in even though it was not necessary, as Chairman Rep. Elijah Cummings (D-MD) noted.

Ocasio-Cortez likened the Trump administration's policy of "remain in Mexico" to human trafficking because it puts migrants in the "crosshairs" of human traffickers. AOC also said there is no reason to arrest "innocent" illegal immigrants and treat them differently than common criminals. The Congresswoman broke down while lamenting how families are being held in facilities where American flags hang.

Elizabeth Warren has articulated a policy that represents a sharp break from Trump's current policies that are predicated on scapegoating and inspiring hate of immigrants.

https://www.vox.com/2019/7/12/20690200/elizabeth-warren-immigration-proposal-2020

Presidential candidate Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) calls for decriminalizing crossing the border without papers, reducing immigration detention, and increasing funding for aid to Central America in her campaign’s newly unveiled comprehensive immigration platform.

At a League of United Latin American Citizens event in Milwaukee, where 2020 hopefuls Julián Castro and Sen. Bernie Sanders were also in attendance, Warren released a proposal that unsurprisingly serves as a clear rebuke of President Trump’s immigration agenda.

Five 2020 Democratic candidates — Warren, Castro, Beto O’Rourke, Washington Gov. Jay Inslee, and Sen. Cory Booker — have now put out immigration proposals. All of them call for reversals of Trump’s most controversial immigration policies, and Warren’s is no exception: As the administration teases plans for mass immigration raids in the coming days, her plan proposes protecting schools, medical facilities, and courthouses from immigration enforcement and ending programs that allow local law enforcement to be deputized as federal immigration officers.

Amid reports of unsafe and unsanitary conditions in immigration detention centers along the southern border, Warren’s plan seeks to pare back detention overall and eliminate private detention facilities.

[Tom Rinaldo]

1. Newsweek Sanders story is from April and it does NOT line up with Trump policies

This OP framing is a trash hit on Sanders trying to equate him with Trump in any way. Name one Democratic Presidential candidate who believes that the U.S. border with Mexico should be "Open".

[TomCADem]

4. Vox - Bernie Sanders's fear of immigrant labor is ugly -- and wrongheaded (2015)

This is not a recent gotcha or misquote. Bernie Sanders has consistently scapegoated immigrants for the troubles faced by American workers.

https://www.vox.com/2015/7/29/9048401/bernie-sanders-open-borders

If I could add one amendment to the Constitution, it would be the one Wall Street Journal editorial page editor Robert Bartley once proposed: "There shall be open borders." There is no single policy that the United States could adopt that would do more good for more people. An average Nigerian worker can increase his income almost 15-fold just by moving to the United States, and residents of significantly richer countries like Mexico can more than double their earnings. The humanitarian gains of letting everyone who wants to make that leap do so would be astounding.

So I was disappointed, if not surprised, at the visceral horror with which Bernie Sanders reacted to the idea when interviewed by my colleague Ezra Klein. "Open borders?" he interjected. "No, that's a Koch brothers proposal." The idea, he argued, is a right-wing scheme meant to flood the US with cheap labor and depress wages for native-born workers. "I think from a moral responsibility, we've got to work with the rest of the industrialized world to address the problems of international poverty," he conceded, "but you don't do that by making people in this country even poorer."

There are two problems with Sanders's view on this, one empirical and one moral. He's wrong about what the effects of an open-border policy would be on American workers, and he's wrong in treating Americans' lives as more valuable and worthy of concern than the lives of foreigners.

[KPN]

10. So you agree with "open borders" and

making them (open borders) a Constitutional amendment? Sounds like it.

[TomCADem]

13. As I noted in OP, No Democratic Candidate Has Supported "Open Borders"

Yet, both Trump and Bernie consistently attack this straw man. Why is this? Its because it is a dog whistle to the white working class and designed to tap into racial resentment. Thus, how do Democrats respond, particularly when Bernie Sanders himself repeatedly attacks open border policies as though this is a serious policy proposal?

[KPN]

17. Who's attacking a straw man here?

That’s all.

[TomCADem]

6. Bernie Sanders Against Open Borders: "That Would Substantially Lower Wages In This Country"

Here is Bernie sounding like Trump and Sessions blaming immigrants for low wages:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/07/31/bernie_sanders_against_open_borders_that_would_substantially_lower_wages_in_this_country.html

At an event hosted by the United States Hispanic Chamber of Commerce on Thursday, Democratic candidate for president Sen. Bernie Sanders made it clear he is against open borders because it drives down the wages of American workers.

Responding to the criticism he received from Hispanic groups after an interview with Ezra Klein of Vox earlier this week where he made similar comments Sanders dismissed them as organizations who support "completely opening up the border."

"What they are talking about is completely opening up the border," Sanders responded. "That was the question. Should we have a completely open border so that anyone can come in the United States of America? If that were to happen, which I strongly disagree with, there is no question in my mind that that would substantially lower wages in this country."

Sanders also addressed the already high unemployment rate of Hispanic and African-American youth and how illegal immigration would affect their job opportunities.

[TomCADem]

8. How Trump and Sessions cherry-picked data to blame immigrants for lower wages

How are Bernie's arguments against immigrant labor different from Trump and Sessions?

https://publicintegrity.org/immigration/how-trump-and-sessions-cherry-picked-data-to-blame-immigrants-for-lower-wages/

In April of 2015, the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service responded to a confidential request from the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee. The memo was short, but it ignited a fiery outcry about the perceived threat of immigration from Jeff Sessions, then a Republican senator from Alabama.

Sessions seized on charts in the CRS memo featuring a six-decade timeline estimating average incomes — mostly flat after 1970 — and another showing a rise in the foreign-born population. Exhorting GOP presidential candidates to take these “forbidden facts” seriously, Sessions called on Republicans to fight to slash immigration — legal or illegal. “It is not caring, but callous, to bring in so many workers that there are not enough jobs for them or those already living here,” Sessions, a Judiciary Committee member, co-wrote in a column published by Roll Call, a congressionally focused news outlet.

Far-right media also sprang into action. The Breitbart website, led by future Trump aide Stephen K. Bannon, blasted out posts about the memo, along with TheBlaze and the Washington Examiner. Mark Levin, who hosts the nation’s fourth-most-consumed talk-radio show, read from a Daily Caller story.

“Wages and share of income for the bottom 90 percent of American wage earners declined over the last 40 years, as the foreign-born population increased dramatically,” Levin read with disgust. “Ask the phony economists who play around with the numbers, who try to persuade you that this is a good thing for the economy. These are facts. These are statistics.”

[KPN]

12. So again, we should have completely open borders?

If that’s not what you think, how about stopping the disingenuous crap that Bernie supports what tRump is doing. You are making stuff up as are some journalists who apparently see Bernie as the enemy.

Geesh. Talk about fake news. And right here at DU.

[TomCADem]

15. The Point As Noted I OP Is That It Is Strawman That Trump/Bernie Attack

It is one thing for Trump to make it a point to attack this straw man, but why has Bernie consistently attacked "open border" policies?

I have attached several links to videos of Bernie doing this throughout the years. This is not an isolated flub by Bernie. This is a consistent talking point that Bernie raises. I ask you why? Are you saying that all these videos of Bernie saying the same things said by Trump scapegoating immigrants for low wages are made up?

[KPN]

22. Bernie has not. He has been asked about "open borders" and said he doesn't think it's a good idea.

I agree with him.

Do you?

You still have not answered my question.

Doesn't matter. I'm not going to waste any more of my time in a frankly disingenuous openly-biased discussion.

ps- even the term "flub" you used here is made up. Nobody said anything about flub anywhere in any of this discussion.

[TomCADem]

29. Jeff Sessions slams 'open border crowd' in LA speech, as hundreds rip Trump immigration policy

My point is that Bernie's attacks on open border proponents is a racist dog whistle, since no Democrat is pushing for open borders. So, why would I want defend what I think is a make believe debate, which Bernie Sanders continues to push like Jeff Sessions?

Does it bother you that Bernie repeatedly appropriates the same kinds of racially tinged language as Trump and Sessions when it comes to discussing immigration?


https://www.dailynews.com/2018/06/26/two-dozen-clergy-arrested-in-downtown-la-protest-slamming-attorney-general-jeff-sessions/

LOS ANGELES — U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions blasted what he called the “open border crowd” in comments delivered Tuesday in downtown Los Angeles, citing Democratic immigration policies that have allowed over one million undocumented immigrants to remain free of prosecution in the Southland.

“This is the Trump era,” Sessions said at a meeting of the Criminal Justice Legal Foundation at the Millennium Biltmore Hotel. “We are enforcing our laws again. We know whose side we’re on — we’re on the side of police, and we’re on the side of the American people.”

With a crowd of protesters gathered outside the hotel, Sessions told the conservative advocacy group that in the United States, “we have the most generous immigration laws in the world,” but when they are enforced, “we get attacked in the media by the so-called elites and their special interests.”

The attorney general’s comments came on a day when the U.S. Supreme Court upheld President Donald Trump’s ban on foreign visitors and immigrants from seven nations. For the past several weeks, the Trump administration’s “zero tolerance” policy on undocumented immigrants — including the now- rescinded policy of separating children from their parents when they are apprehended at the Mexican border — has sparked an international outcry.

[KPN]

30. Oh brother. It's sll about hate Bernie for some folks, regardless of what he says or context.

The glasses one wears affects the view one sees I guess. Bye since you won’t answer my simple question and refuse to consider what question he was asked. Too bad.

[Autumn]

27. Why not just post it pisses you off that Bernie isn't for open borders and you are?

None of our Democratic candidates are for open borders.

[TomCADem]

31. Democrats Must Destroy Trump's 'Open Borders' Myth (Not Spread It Like Bernie)

Well, why does Bernie repeatedly invoke the open borders myth like Jeff Sessions and Donald Trump. I understand that you want to frame the debate as whether a person is for "open borders or not." My whole point is that framing the debate in those terms, as Bernie has done and has Trump and Sessions have done, is a racist dog whistle.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/democrats-must-destroy-trumps-open-borders-myth

SAN DIEGO, California—What’s the definition of “open borders”?

It’s just a buzz phrase to rile up people who want to get rid of illegal immigrants, cut back on legal immigrants, and make America white again. It’s the new weapon of choice, replacing the tired-out zinger of the 1990s: “amnesty.”


Take the reader who recently called me a “hate-all-who-are-not-Hispanic-or-Latino racist like other Trump haters who writes for open borders brainwashing rags like the Washington Post.”

Or look at President Trump himself, who says “Democrats want Open Borders, which equals violent crime, drugs and human trafficking…”

[Autumn]

32. Trump lies. Democrats do not want open borders and you are wielding it as a club to bash

Bernie and only Bernie, because like all other Democrats he has said he is not for open borders. People ask him questions about immigration and he answers. Bernie does not repeatedly invoke open borders, that's a lie. You take a few of his references to open borders, and since immigration is a big part of the discussion he gets questions about it and you tie him to Trump over it. YOU are using right wing talking points to post your hate screeds about Bernie and you're not even original. You drag this same old crap out every few months, using old interviews and twisting them to smear him. You are as obvious as a train blowing its whistle on a train track.

[Autumn]

28. I'm happy to know Bernie is consistently against "open border" policies.

Yay Bernie!!!

[KPN]

9. Bingo! The artifice is astounding.

Bernie is apparently our enemy here or at least some say so. Well, i say bullpucky to that.

[TomCADem]

14. Jorge Ramos presses Bernie Sanders on 'open borders' comments

Once again, here is Bernie being pressed on his attacks on the open borders strawman:

[KPN]

21. Yup in 2015. And he answered the "open border" question openly, honerstly and clearly.

He did not say anything about immigrants are bad for America, or that immigrants effect wages in America. He said "open borders".

How about you just stop making stuff up please and try to stick to your positions and ideas about policies as well as why you support candidates, what you like about them, or how you might have a different view than them on a particular issue as opposed to thinly veiled candidate assassinations. It would be a hell of a lot more productive, i.e., not destructive and divisive.

[Autumn]

2. Are Warren, Castro, O'Rourke, Inslee, Booker and Biden,calling for open borders? nt

[still_one]

5. no one is calling for open borders, and all the candidates made that clear in the debates, including

Castro, who stated clearly that was a right wing talking point

[Autumn]

7. I know. Just wanted to track the OP like the last time he posted it. nt

[TomCADem]

18. Exactly. The Point of OP is That It is A Strawman Used By Bernie/Trump

In the OP, I noted that no Democratic candidate is pushing "open borders". Democrats and progressives are pushing for decriminalizing crossing the border without papers. Nonetheless, Trump and Bernie used the coded language of "open border policies" to attack Democrats. This talking point is designed to tap into racial resentment. Look at this thread where some folks immediately attack "open border" policies, when the OP states that no Democrat supports an open border. My point is that attacks on "open border policies" is coded , dog whistle language that candidates should refrain from using.

[Autumn]

24. Bernie didn't call for open borders either. You are twisting and leaving out that

Bernie responded to a question of why he was for open borders and he clarified he wasn't.

[George II]

3. "Open borders" is a concoction of the right wing, I don't think ANY Democrat calls for....

..."open borders". republicans interpret resistance to a barbed wire/steel/brick wall as advocating "open borders".

[TomCADem]

11. Bernie Sanders: "Open borders? That's a Koch brothers proposal"

According to Bernie Sanders and Tucker Carlson, it is the Koch Brothers that are pushing open borders, Here is Bernie in his own words:

And who agreed with Bernie Sander's argument? Tucker Carlson!

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/06/20/tucker_carlson_the_truth_about_the_koch_brothers_and_the_republican_party.html

But in the case of the Kochs, conservatives might want to pause and rethink the relationship. As it turns out, the Kochs don’t have much in common with conservatives. They are totally opposed to most conservative policy goals. The Kochs are libertarian ideologues, passionate and inflexible. America first? The Kochs find the very notion absurd, if not fascist. An economic policy that seeks to strengthen families? The Kochs denounce that as “crony capitalism,” or “picking winners and losers.” They think it’s immoral. Controlling our borders? The Kochs consider that racist. A few years ago, Bernie Sanders noted that the Koch brothers are far to the left of him on immigration. Open borders? Quote: “That’s a Koch brothers proposal,” he said.

Bernie wasn’t wrong. But it’s more than a proposal. It’s in effect what we have now, thanks in part to the Kochs. The overwhelming majority of Republicans want a secure border and less immigration. That’s why they voted for Donald Trump. Two and a half years later, the border is more porous than ever. A tide of humanity is flooding in illegally. Republicans in congress have done almost nothing to help. Why? You can thank the Kochs for that. In 2018, Koch-backed organizations, Freedom Network and Americans for Prosperity, pressured Republicans in Congress to use their post-election lame duck session to pass an amnesty for the so-called Dreamers. Going into the 2020 race, amnesty remains the Kochs' top legislative priority.

[Autumn]

25. You are using Fucker Carlson to smear Bernie. Just admit you are for open borders.

Because Bernie isn't for open borders

[KPN]

16. More Bernie hate BS. Got it. Sheesh.

It never ends. Imagine, it could be otherwise. It could be talking about what one supports, what one likes in a candidate of choice. Wouldn’t that be refreshing.

[TomCADem]

19. Are You Saying That The Videos of Bernie Are Fake?

Or, that the quotes to his speeches are fabricated? Show me where a quote or video of Bernie that I posted is fake or fabricated.

This is what is frustrating. I can post a video of Bernie saying something objectionable and rather than defend what Bernie says, the response is, "You just hate Bernie."

I don't see similar types of responses when quotes or the statements of other candidates are posted. Instead, you get a more substantial dialogue. With Bernie, I can quote post a video, quote his speech, or post his voting records such as his votes to protect gun manufacturers, his 2007 vote against immigration reform, or his votes against Russian sanctions, and rather than defend these votes or statements, its just, "Sheeh. You hate Bernie."

It would be nice if a Bernie supporter would actually defend Bernie statements and votes that are antithetical to the views of many Democrats.

Does anyone want to defend Bernie's statements and reconcile them with the very similar statements made by Trump and Jeff Sessions on immigration and its impact on American workers?

[KPN]

20. I'm saying he's talking about "open borders". In effect, ignoring the context -- the question

Bernie was actually asked. Why don't you answer my question? You keep coming back disingenuously to he's just like tRump instead. Do you agree that we should have wide open borders?

As for undocked immigrants' role in wage stagnation, it hasn't not had an effect, that's for certain. A ready supply of workers to do work at minimum or lower wages has the same effect as any other surplus relative to price.

[TomCADem]

23. Bernie's Statements On "Open Borders" Are Not a One Time Gaffe

Looked at the links and stories. I attached videos from 2015 through the present year where Bernie attacks "open border" policies as though open borders is actually on the table. Bernie Sanders might as well talk about the merits of placing a pet hospital on the moon.

Whether it is Trump or Bernie asking, " Do you agree that we should have wide open borders?" This is a straw man. As my OP notes, no Democratic candidate has advocated open borders.

Now if you ask me whether we should decriminalize crossing the border without papers, as AOC, Elizabeth Warren and Julian Castro proposed, I say, "yes." These are migrants. The U.S. is a country of immigrants. Immigration issues should be addressed as a civil manner, and stigmitizing immigrants and refugees as "criminals" just reinforces racist stereotypes.

Put another way, what's the difference between a Trump supporter or a Bernie supporter repeatedly trying to get other Democratic candidates to defend the strawman of open borders? It is not on the table. You might as well demand that I defend the imposition of Sharia law, which is a more overt example of creating a strawman to incite racial resentment. Bernie and Trump's attacks on Open Borders are similar to the strawman attacks on Sharia Law, which no one is seeking to impose throughout the U.S.:

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/steve-king-muslims-congress-sharia-law

Steve King: Even Muslims In Congress Won’t Renounce Sharia Law

Rep. Steve King (R-IA), who’s previously made clear that he doesn’t believe immigrants from the Middle East want to assimilate into American culture, wants Muslims who come to the U.S. to reject Sharia law. King made the comments when TPM asked him on Wednesday whether he supported Trump’s proposed ban on Muslims entering the U.S.

King said he wasn’t confident any immigrants from the Middle East would do so, citing what he said was the failure of the only two Muslim members of Congress to renounce Sharia.

[KPN]

26. Bernie's not trying to get any democrat to defend open borders that I am aware of. Though you seem

to want to project that onto him. So why are you attacking him on this?