Sanders surrogate Josh Fox goes on the attack.

[crazytown]

Link to tweet

"See a pattern"? Yes. Anyone who saw David Sirota, Nina Turner et al. appointed to the 2020 campaign leadership can see a pattern. Anyone who saw Susan Sarandon tapped to introduce Bernie at campaign events can see a pattern. Berners tweeting #NeverWarren see the pattern: Bernie or Bust 2.0

[Cha]

1. lol.. I "see a pattern" from Josh Fox.

Meeting with Hillary! Those guys crack me up!

[betsuni]

2. Meeting with Hillary.

THE CAT IS OUT OF THE BAG!



With one speech, Hillary put everyone in jail. Another speech made Wall Street control America. With one vote she started the Iraq War. With one meeting she hopelessly corrupted Warren. Accepting donations from Americans with jobs hopelessly corrupts Democratic candidates. Democrats are "ideologically bankrupt," but Republicans are fine, you just have to talk to them.

[crazytown]

3. When all else fails

blame The Clenis

[mcar]

50. The Clenis Lives!

[Cha]

4. Epic Twilight Zone Episode!

You Have Now Crossed Over Into The Twilight Zone



No Turning Back

[crazytown]

5. Breaking

Warren is Putin's girl. Warren met with Hillary met with Putin.

[Cha]

6. putin chose trump.. even the

jprs should recognize that

No?

[crazytown]

7. Not likely

They are too busy pushing Tulsi for VP. Wood from the trees.

[Hortensis]

14. That one accusation "Met with Hillary" is a real identifier

of who and what the Sanders camp is about.

Warren is accused of WRONGDOING by meeting with the DEMOCRAT a majority of Americans voted to elect our first woman president. One of the most admired women on the planet.

More than just despicable, extreme and rejecting of all most of us hoped so eagerly for.

And of course that first smear is the usual synergitic copying of RW swiftboarding. We should expect one of them to eventually write a book on how to campaign on less than $100 a day by letting Republicans do your political advertising for you.

[blm]

19. That sums it up, bets.

[betsuni]

8. In the tweet thread, a Josh Fox tweet from 2015 doing a "just not THAT woman":

"Kind of stunned how fake and bad Hillary Clinton's video is. This won't win. Run Senator Warren please."

[Cha]

9. Yeah.. I see a pattern here...

A tweet replying to that says.. "Josh Fox is not to be taken seriously".. No shite, Sherlock!

[uponit7771]

10. desperation smells aweful

[TSIAS]

11. Get used to it

Biden's not going to prevail in a rigorous primary. It will come down to these two. We are not going to let MSNBC and Neera Tanden pretend the Warren and Sanders are identical on policy and their willingness to fight for those ideas.

Sender's candidacy is vitally important and worth fighting for. He's a once in a lifetime politician and we're not content to go down without a fight.

[betsuni]

12. "He's a once in a lifetime politician and we're not content to go down without a fight."

Bernie is establishment, been a politician for many decades. Get used to it.

[pangaia]

27. in my view being a politician for many decades does not necessarily make one 'establishment.'

[Fresh_Start]

55. being part of the establishment does in fact make one establishment

the fact that your candidate has been unable to change the establishment in those decades is proof of his being ineffective rather than being non-establishment

[pangaia]

77. My candidate? And whom, might I ask, would that be.

[Cha]

69. Exactly.

[kcr]

17. Josh Fox is a prime example

of why it's likely to come down to Biden and Warner.

[awesomerwb1]

26. Hahaha

Cool story bro.

BS reminds a little bit of trump. They both hire really shitty surrogates.

[qazplm135]

29. yeah neither is Bernie

if Biden does fall, where do you think the "establishment" is going to go? Bernie? Nope. They will likely go to Warren, so with a combination of most of the establishment and a good chunk of progressives, tell me how Bernie overcomes that.

See you spend your whole life labeling an entire party as corporatist sellouts and you risk that backfiring when you try to run for that party's nomination.

[samnsara]

31. who ever it is that gets the Dem nom..gets my vote in the General..

[emulatorloo]

41. Bernie deserves surrogates who won't lie about and smear his friend Elizabeth Warren

Knowing what I know about Bernie, he wants to win the nomination fair and square.

[Cha]

68. BS hired jill stein

advocators to run his team.

[Cha]

70. Oh please. The majority Do NOT think so.

And, you will have to do what you're telling others to do.

[treestar]

13. What corporate money?

EW was specifically not taking it.

[blm]

18. They are going back to her senate campaign when she did accept some of it,

But for this presidential primary she has refused it to make it people driven. If she becomes the nominee the campaign will accept corporate donations. Her voting record and platform certainly isn’t that of a corporate shill. That’s for sure.

[kcr]

15. Not sure why 2 is such a problem with them.

I thought Bernie was supposed to have campaigned so hard for Hillary after she was nominated. They praise him for that all the time.

[crazytown]

16. Warren is HRC's puppet

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287271399

[George II]

20. Thanks crazytown, excellent find. Turner and Sirota are equally on the attack on twitter, too...

...but unfortunately those two instantly block anyone who posts a single word in opposition, so many of us have lost track of their recent negative attacks on anyone and everyone who opposes Sanders, including most of our remaining Democratic candidates.

[BlueMississippi]

21. When one puts on the reality blocking eyeglasses

and gets into a hypnotic state of devotion to a candidate no matter what

This happens.

Pied Piper 2.0

Sen. Warren is not my first choice but I have no doubt that if nominated, she will make a terrific POTUS that we can be proud of.

[pangaia]

28. "...gets into a hypnotic state of devotion to a candidate no matter what...."

I think this can and does happen with 'devotees' to any candidate.

I've seen it here with different 'devotees' over the years...

[BlueMississippi]

34. No. It is uniquely applicable to only one candidate. nt

[pangaia]

40. Well, we'll just have to disagree on that one.

[samnsara]

33. same here.. shes my second choice for sure!

..and any of our candidates will be a better prez than the orange blob of ocean phlegm in the WH now!

[George II]

22. For what it's worth, Sanders has accepted "corporate money" and "fossil fuel money"....

...in the same sense that they claim other candidates accept "corporate" and "fossil fuel" money.

It's all in his FEC filings.

[crazytown]

23. "For what it's worth"

$27 and a free book

[samnsara]

43. ive never been concerned or even curious about the $$ candidates take or from whom..

...nothing can ever be as blatantly corrupt as trump...and I dont even know what $$ he took or from whom. When you're corrupt you're corrupt irregardless of the $$ influencing factors. Its the persons overall character I care about. Matt Dillon often had to walk on the dark side for justice....and yet he never let Kitty or Dodge City down.

[George II]

44. I don't either, this is the 21st Century and it takes money to run a winning campaign. As long as...

...it comes from legitimate sources, does not exceed the FEC maximum, and is fully documented I don't care who contributes it.

[NYMinute]

24. I see a pattern

1. Malign Democratic candidate/s with smears and false memes like establishment, corporatist etc.
2. Kneecap them when it is obvious that one cannot win.
3. Make any loss a fault of others, a conspiracy or rigging.
4. Get supporters incensed enough that they stay home or vote for anyone but the Democrat
5. Trump wins.

[George II]

45. ...

[thesquanderer]

25. It's a terrible tweet. But Sanders surrogate? What association does he have with the campaign? (n/t)

[crazytown]

32. Creative Director of Our Revolution

[thesquanderer]

35. Although OR spun out of Sanders' 2016 campaign I'm unaware of it having any current affiliation...

...with Sanders or his 2020 campaign. I mean, obviously, their sympathies are going to be aligned with his candidacy, but I think it's a stretch to call OR or any of its board members Sanders surrogates. Unless they say they speak on behalf of (or have been hired by) Sanders or his campaign, I think it's just false to call them surrogates.

[crazytown]

36. De jure or de facto

the tweet would have been cleared with HQ.

[thesquanderer]

38. I think that is a huge assumption on your part,

to believe that Sanders (or senior campaign officials) were aware of and approved the tweet before it was sent.

I think legitimate criticisms of our candidates is fair game, but exaggerating/misrepresenting to make one of our candidates look bad is contrary to the goals of DU.

[crazytown]

39. After the smoke and mirrors of 2016

who was speaking officially, unofficially, off the record, or just briefing, and having made up my own mind about the character of David Sirota, this one one campaign I'm not prepared to cut any slack at this time.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/128730834

[George II]

46. From the website of Our Revolution:

https://ourrevolution.com/about/

Our Board

Senator Nina Turner - Former Ohio State Senator
Jim Hightower - Political Leader, National Radio Commentator and Writer
Jim Zogby - Arab American Human Rights Leader
Huck Gutman - Former Chief of Staff for Sen. Bernie Sanders
Shailene Woodley - Actress and Environmental Leader
Justin Bamberg - South Carolina State Representative
Lucero E. Mesa- Our Revolution South Carolina
Richard Rodriguez- Our Revolution Illinois Chicago
Larry Cohen, Chair - Labor
Deborah Parker, Vice-Chair - Native American Leader
Jane Kleeb, Treasurer - Environmental and Rural Leader

Nina Turner - National Co-chair of Bernie2020, resigned as Our Revolution President (but didn't resign from the Board of Our Revolution)

More about Josh Fox:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josh_Fox

In 2016, he worked as a surrogate for Senator Bernie Sanders as the Creative Director for Our Revolution and as a member of the campaign's NY Platform Committee.

[thesquanderer]

48. Josh Fox as a 2016 surrogate does not make him a current surrogate.

Nina Turner is a current surrogate, but in her capacity in the 2020 campaign, not in her capacity as being on the board of OR. As you presumably know, just being on the board does not necessarily imply day-to-day involvement, and I similarly would not assume she was aware of that tweet before it went out.

Assigning that tweet to a (implied current) "Sanders surrogate" is just a smear.

[George II]

52. Okay, fine. You're not convincing anyone, though.

[thesquanderer]

54. I'm sure DU thanks you for speaking for everyone. (n/t)

[George II]

71. There's also this from Sanders himself dated September 6 2019, only four days ago!

Link to tweet

[thesquanderer]

73. Yes, posted by gothmog...

and answered in my post #57.

[George II]

74. Thanks, I appreciate it.....

[Gothmog]

51. The daughter of one of our posters think that Fox is a surrogate

Link to tweet

[thesquanderer]

53. So I guess it's possible for more than one person to be wrong. Who knew?

I think it is self-evident that unless the Sanders campaign says that someone speaks for the campaign or is officially in such a position, one should not assume they speak for the campaign.

[crazytown]

58. And the whole backwards and forwards in 2016

about whether their people were speaking for the campaign or not?

[thesquanderer]

61. Confused

re: "And the whole backwards and forwards in 2016 about whether their people were speaking for the campaign or not?"
I don't understand the question.

[crazytown]

63. Do you remember those times?

Statements, tweets by Sanders campaign staff which would be later disowned?

[thesquanderer]

65. It is legitimate to disown a surrogate's statements.

Unless they run everything by the candidate before they say it (unlikely, especially in things like live TV interviews), there is a chance that even an official representative will say something the candidate disagrees with. People are imperfect.

[crazytown]

67. And the only one who knows for sure is Bernie himself

and we have to take his word for it. Pass.

[crazytown]

60. Holly Otterbein is a journalist at Politico

assigned to covering the Sanders Campaign. She retweeted Fox's attack, identifying him as a Sanders surrogate.

Are you saying that you will accept nothing less that a statement by the campaign on official letterhead?

[thesquanderer]

64. Journalists get things wrong all the time.

That's why, for example, you don't bet the bank on paraphrases, but look for the exact quotes. That's also why the NY Times has corrections on a regular basis. And Politico isn't even the NY Times.

Are you saying that you will accept nothing less that a statement by the campaign on official letterhead?

What I'd accept is, being on the campaign payroll, having some official position within the campaign, or some acknowledgment from the campaign or the candidate that this person speaks for them. Or, as it turns out, as has been provided, placing the person's self-representation as a surrogate on the campaign's own web sites/feeds. That's more convincing than a journalist's characterization.

[crazytown]

66. Well

I CAN see a correction coming if the heat is on. That was Sanders Campaign modus operandi in 2016 - Put something out there, and if it get too hot, disown it. These are not honest people.

[mcar]

78. +1

[Gothmog]

62. Fox is a sanders surrogate in the real world

Has sanders repudiated the statements from Fox?

[Gothmog]

49. Fox is a sanders surrogate

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[thesquanderer]

57. Thanks, good one! The second tweet was good support for the surrogate argument.

The first, not so much, since it was from early 2017 and would have been referencing his 2016 activities. But the new one does carry weight, somewhat for what he said and when he said it, but moreover, the fact that it was reposted on the official Sanders account, which is an implicit campaign endorsement of what he put forth in that speech.

So yup, I'll give it to you! I'm always open to changing my mind, I just need actual facts.

[Me.]

30. Was That When HRC Was Honeymooning In Moscow

Oh right, only one candidate did that.

[Renew Deal]

37. Yes, I see a pattern

Of desperate Sanders operatives.

[highplainsdem]

47. Josh Fox attacks Biden, too. It helps Sanders say he isn't indulging in these attacks if his

surrogates do it for him.

As for those surrogates going after Warren -- I've been expecting this for some time. Despite their much-touted non-aggression pact, they both want to be president, and I haven't expected either of them to bow out gracefully and try to turn over their base of support to the other.

Warren has a LOT of support in the media. Nate Silver tweeted a while back about her having more support from the media, apparently, than any other Democratic candidate. He mentioned Sanders as another media favorite, too, but in a second tier with Buttigieg and Harris, as I recall. (And Biden isn't getting much support from the media, but has been maintaining his lead without it, which must be frustrating for those in the media who've been specializing in attacking him.)

Without as much favorable media attention as Warren has, Sanders probably feels he needs his surrogates to go after her. (And to go after Biden, too, of course.)

I don't like it. But I'm not at all surprised by it.

Maybe Warren could say something to Sanders about his surrogates at Thursday's debate...

[stonecutter357]

56. See a pattern? "Bernie Bro" getting desperate ?

[George II]

72. For those doubting Fox' status as a "Sanders surrogate", he AND Sander confirm it here:

Link to tweet

[crazytown]

75. but but but "Negative attacks on Democratic candidates," Sanders said in 2018

“just continues the process of debasing the Democratic system in this country, and is why so many people are disgusted with politics."

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/03/sanders-promised-civility-hired-twitter-attack-dog/585259/

[sheshe2]

76. Wow.

[betsuni]

79. Bookmarking. Thanks for posting.

[ecstatic]

81. His surrogates are hateful, bitter clowns.

I really hope that they fade into obscurity by 2021.

[Cha]

82. KICK!