Jon Meacham on MSNBC just said the most liberal progress has historically been made by people like

[highplainsdem]

Last edited Wed Mar 4, 2020, 01:54 AM - Edit history (1)

Biden, rather than people like Sanders.

[Sloumeau]

1. Of course

How much was done by Moderates like JFK, LBJ, Carter, Clinton, and Obama? A heck of a lot was done by them.

[W_HAMILTON]

2. I love Meacham, but...

...DUH!

[BootinUp]

3. Where are these historians when U need 'em? Jk

[democrattotheend]

4. I think it's more complicated than that

Biden is probably the best candidate in terms of the legislative muscle to get a progressive agenda passed. But Bernie has changed the conversation and pushed the party to adopt policies like $15 minimum wage (which has become a reality in many places since 2016). Whatever happens, Bernie has changed the party and its agenda for the better.

[cilla4progress]

8. Totally agree and

I want his progressive agenda strong in the Biden presidency!

Obama should help with that.

[Eyeball_Kid]

18. That's what's SUPPOSED to happen.

Biden SHOULD adopt some of Sanders' agenda. And Sanders should be lauded for his tireless work in shifting the terms of the political debate.

And if Sanders wins the nomination, he MUST adopt some of the more moderate positions favored by Biden's coalition. That's how the party unites.

[BootinUp]

9. The 15 dollar min wage movement,

Wasn’t that more or less adopted by Bern after it started?

[Blue_true]

14. Yes. As was a lot of other stuff he claims to lead on. nt

[AlexSFCA]

19. I first heard it from Bernie

and I recall it was controversial at first even Hillary wasn’t on board with it. But it’s now mainstream. So he certainly evangelized the idea and put companies on notice.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

29. Yes it was

The city of Seatac just South of Seattle passed a $15 minimum wage before Sanders made it part of his agenda. The city of Seattle also did likewise.

[zaj]

17. Activists change the conversation, but rarely win national elections

I what they understood their role.

[Captain Zero]

23. Bernie has made the whole country face the fact that socialism

is not some mean terrible ogre if your 80 year old white haired grandpa makes sense talking about it.

[certainot]

26. i wonder where the 'whole country' would be if the left and dems had not ignored 1500 radio stations

and their constant corporate drumbeat determining what socialism was and how 'acceptable' it is.....

[cilla4progress]

5. Well, whose more likely to get

legislation passed?

[Blue_true]

15. Biden. nt

[RockRaven]

6. FDR and LBJ did a hell of a lot whilst being rather "establishment"

Neither of them perfect, of course, but then neither are any of today's progressive ideologues.

[TwilightZone]

7. Give any of our candidates a solid Congress and we'll get progressive legislation passed.

I wrote a post about that thought earlier today, in support of Biden.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287618857

[AlexSFCA]

21. absolutely

senate and house majority with Biden. I prefer senate majority leader other than Shumer. We need someone who would immediately cancel filibuster rules so we can pass everything we need with a simple majority. We now know from Obama era that GOP will always treat us like enemies so we can never trust them on anything and should operate as they don’t exist. Uniting americans is different from uniting congress. All bills will be passed to help middle class thus uniting against GOP which is the enemy of middle class. One of the most important priorities for us will be expanding SC to 11 in order to restore constitution - Merick Garland was a violation of constitution. Biden is the only one who can safely push for these things and have support from majority of Americans.

[dhill926]

10. yep....you gotta win first....

and just love listening to Meacham.

[Cha]

11. Thank You, John Meachham! & that's what Biden

said too the other day. And, what a lot of us have been saying!

[Blue_true]

12. He is exactly right. nt

[oasis]

13. Biden's the who'll get it done. nt

[PatrickforO]

16. There is an element of truth in that.

Most progress happens in the middle two thirds of the bell curve.

[yaesu]

20. Tell that to FDR who was way left of Bernie but hey, its MSM, they love to rewrite history. nt

[Captain Zero]

24. FDR was out of necessity, and if he had died in his third term then president would have been

Henry Wallace. From Iowa, You think Bernie has capitalists shaking in their boots.... haha. Read about Henry Wallace some time.

[Awsi Dooger]

30. Wallace tried to be Ralph Nader in 1948

I've read several books about that election. Consensus is that Wallace and the Progressive Party did tip a few states to Dewey but not nearly as many as the Truman camp had feared.

If FDR hadn't dumped Wallace in '44 I don't see how Wallace wins as incumbent in '48, although it is always difficult to comment on things long before my time.

It certainly would have been a famous 3+ years as president, regardless of the '48 outcome

[SunSeeker]

25. That is simply incorrect. FDR was NOT to the left of Bernie. FDR was opposed by socialists.

The Socialist Party opposed FDR. They had their own candidate, Eugene Debs, Bernie's hero.

Bernie has spent his entire adult life bashing the Democratic Party. His hero is Socialist Eugene Debs, not FDR.

Bernie made a glowing documentary of Debs in which Bernie does the voice over for Debs' speeches, including the one where he says both the Democratic and Republican Parties are equality opposed to workers rights (which is of course a lie):

Bernie admiringly recites Debs speeches from memory:

FDR was a capitalist. In many ways, FDR saved capitalism by regulating it and establishing a safety net for workers so that capitalism was livable and sustainable.

Bernie is a socialist who thinks workers should be given ownership of the means of productions by the government. Watch the videos. Debs and Bernie are WAY to the left Of FDR.

[LanternWaste]

34. Tell yourself that 'most' does mean 'all,' as you seem confused to it.

Hence, bringing up one example doesn't really deny their premise, or strengthen your conspiracy that the MSM loves to "rewrite history..."

It does make you look sour, though.

[SunSeeker]

22. Or, by people like FDR, not people like Eugene Debs (Socialist and Bernie's hero). nt

[Cicada]

27. Only Nixon could go to China

Only a person with impeccable anti commie credentials could negotiate with Commie China without being blasted as soft on communism. Nixon fit that bill. And maybe only a person known for established main stream credentials can get away with flirting with socialist sounding policies. If Bernie proposed the same policy he might be shot out of the water as a damn socialist. So this seems plausible.

[certainot]

28. until they factor talk radio, meachum et al analyze fish without water

the last 30 years is totally different

[colsohlibgal]

31. FDR

He just about quadrupled the top tax rate.Seems pretty progressive to me. That rate is I believe between 1/3 or 1/4 now of where FDR had it. Now raising it 2-3% is far left nonsense.

It’s all good for me I am financially secure. But a lot of people are not.

[gollygee]

32. Yes because he's effective and can build a large base of support

Having progressive ideas doesn't mean much on its own. You have to have the ability to build support and the knowledge of how to make things happen.

[llmart]

33. Yes...

and we need to take the Senate so we can begin to move forward. If we don't, McConnell will continue with his stonewalling all bills.

[Martin Eden]

35. Dedicated radicals like Sanders help pull the center of the party towards progressive policies

I give Sanders credit for making universal healthcare and affordable college more mainstream.

But I agree it takes a practical and well regarded politician like Joe Biden to actually get things done in Washington.

[ProfessorPlum]

36. WTF?

based on what?

[treestar]

37. Absolutely

The country in general has to be ready.