General Discussion

TreasonousBastard

(43,049 posts)

8. You're right, but while we have no idea...

Mon Sep 24, 2012, 04:26 AM

Sep 2012

how long someone might live, we have to reduce the costs for the years they do live.

But, as I said in another post above, I have no idea how to do that.

And, of course, there are those horribly gray areas where we have to make decisions almost blindly. One surgeon says to cut, another says there's a 2% chance of recovery... At what percentage do we decide it's worth it to do a major surgery on an octogenarian? At what age or over all health condition do we start questioning procedures and asking for the percentages?

I'm dealing with it now, and all i have are more questions.

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If we want Medicare to work we are going to have to raise Medicare taxes and premiums. [View all] dkf Sep 2012 OP

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #1

Make end of life care less expensive, since that's where the money's going... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #2

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #3

I'm not suggesting anything, except... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #7

a large percent of patients rip the tube out? reference, please. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #9

Her doctor, the nurses in the facility, and several... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #11

when you make a statement like "a large percentage of patients pull their tubes out" as if it's HiPointDem Sep 2012 #41

I'm not sure I care what you want... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #51

two people have confirmed people pulled out their feeding tubes. i've seen no evidence that HiPointDem Sep 2012 #53

Seems like a strange fight to pick demwing Sep 2012 #71

My uncle with dementia pulled out his IV and tried to leave the hospital on several earlier visits. dkf Sep 2012 #77

an iv isn't a feeding tube. the most common feeding tube is a button on your gut. it's not HiPointDem Sep 2012 #83

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #28

what kind of tube? and what kind of facility? HiPointDem Sep 2012 #39

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #58

the poster wasn't talking about "breathing" (sic) tubes or ivs he was specifically talking about HiPointDem Sep 2012 #61

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #69

an endotracheal tube is a breathing tube again. i think we already established we're discussing HiPointDem Sep 2012 #73

Post removed Post removed Sep 2012 #80

show me the statistics that say a "large percentage" of patients rip out their feeding tubes, HiPointDem Sep 2012 #82

I can say this... SkyDaddy7 Sep 2012 #37

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #47

yeah, all the docs are talking about the 'quick money' in peg tubes. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #56

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #70

yes, i have. and i've never heard a doc say 'quick money' when he finished. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #76

Does your mother have Alzheimer's? Freddie Sep 2012 #30

Nope. Severe dementia, but not Alzheimer's. TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #36

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #66

I thought that was illegal? TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #74

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #86

Doctors selling drugs, particularly unapproved drugs. TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #113

You are describing fraud forthemiddle Sep 2012 #114

My Mom has had a feeding tube for over 2 years. begin_within Sep 2012 #126

its a deep and difficult question. grantcart Sep 2012 #59

Question - DURHAM D Sep 2012 #96

I am not sure. My brothers are attorneys and handled all of the claims. grantcart Sep 2012 #98

Medicare does not pick up the tab for the care you described. DURHAM D Sep 2012 #105

The problem is we don't know when the end will be. pnwmom Sep 2012 #5

You're right, but while we have no idea... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #8

we could just euthanize them. very comfortable. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #10

Yes. We could set an age, say 70... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #12

We could at least offer people that choice. I don't want to sit in a home with GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #60

if you want to die on your own, no fluids is quick and relatively painless. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #62

With my luck I will get just so thirsty and drink something. Besides, relatively painless is GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #68

i don't want it to be even a *small* part, especially with 20% of the population over 65 in HiPointDem Sep 2012 #79

I hear your concern. I totally do. But I think it sucks to force people to live who do not want to. GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #87

no one's forcing anyone to live. people always have the option of ending it. what you're talking HiPointDem Sep 2012 #90

You are assuming that no medical personnel want to assist people through death. Perhaps GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #117

then they should arrange their own suicides. i'm totally opposed to turning medical personnel HiPointDem Sep 2012 #122

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #72

Thank you for being there for those people when their time came. I was not there for GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #120

I saw my father suffer for years with cancer... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #116

Yeah. My Dad always told me to take him out back and shoot him if his mind started to go. Both GreenPartyVoter Sep 2012 #119

We live in France most of the year. cyclezealot Sep 2012 #23

Since the UN and other organization consistantly rate France... TreasonousBastard Sep 2012 #34

Wow. Get back to us when YOU'RE at that point, mm-kay? WinkyDink Sep 2012 #46

Remove the FICA cap and dedicate the "over the cap" $$ to Medicare Freddie Sep 2012 #4

Agreed newfie11 Sep 2012 #24

"that would be a tax increase on the rich!" Freddie Sep 2012 #27

right newfie11 Sep 2012 #95

Also treat all income the same way. daleanime Sep 2012 #25

Including social security and pensions and retirement distributions? dkf Sep 2012 #35

Social security isn't income. It's insurance payments. Recipients pay premiums throughout their valerief Sep 2012 #107

This is the answer! peace13 Sep 2012 #102

Ok, no. There has to be another way. JNelson6563 Sep 2012 #6

What is your solution then? Expect the same services but at 1/3 the cost? Is that realistic? dkf Sep 2012 #13

Reduce expenses. JNelson6563 Sep 2012 #18

That is cost-shifting Freddie Sep 2012 #26

Romney's comments on using the emergency room bluestate10 Sep 2012 #108

dfk ignores the effect of compounding in his claims. bluestate10 Sep 2012 #106

my solution is universal health care like every other civilized country on the planet. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #57

I wish. It seems obvious to me that its the only end point that will work. dkf Sep 2012 #64

The is a sane end goal. bluestate10 Sep 2012 #110

it wasn't an incremental program at all. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #112

Not true. aandegoons Sep 2012 #14

Medicare doesn't have a payroll cap. dkf Sep 2012 #16

Social Security does aandegoons Sep 2012 #17

Great minds think alike & post at the same time! Freddie Sep 2012 #20

Social security funds social security not Medicare. dkf Sep 2012 #29

But SS does Freddie Sep 2012 #19

If you use social security funds to fund Medicare you will stress both funds. dkf Sep 2012 #44

I think he/she is not talking about taking anything from the current Social Security MiniMe Sep 2012 #89

Yes, thank you! JNelson6563 Sep 2012 #21

The ACA was supposed to do that or so it's name implies. dkf Sep 2012 #33

Ok, now you're being deliberately obtuse. JNelson6563 Sep 2012 #67

I'll believe it maybe when a politician actually proposes something. Pelosi? Obama? Reid? dkf Sep 2012 #81

OMG. Just go the fuck back to FR. JNelson6563 Sep 2012 #93

Maybe we need to get the legal profession's hand out of the expenses? customerserviceguy Sep 2012 #129

"What you are suggesting is a republicans wet dream" Capt. Obvious Sep 2012 #115

Allowing people like myself to Ship of Fools Sep 2012 #15

Or the government could set prices the way they do in civilized countries eridani Sep 2012 #22

They also set limits and budgets at least in Canada and the UK. dkf Sep 2012 #32

es--it's called global budgeting. It goes along with single payer-- eridani Sep 2012 #125

There is another thread in my parallel universe... littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #31

Or maybe we just stop building weapons for a war we'll never fight. obxhead Sep 2012 #38

But without all that military build-up raouldukelives Sep 2012 #131

Here's how it works... bl968 Sep 2012 #40

+1 HiPointDem Sep 2012 #42

We couldn't even get a public option which made me very unhappy about the ACA. dkf Sep 2012 #43

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #45

This message was self-deleted by its author RandiFan1290 Sep 2012 #49

Did it, really? WinkyDink Sep 2012 #50

She was so upset RandiFan1290 Sep 2012 #52

Yes. I support single payer because that is one way I know to keep health costs under control. dkf Sep 2012 #54

The Pentagon lost track of trillions, according to Rummy in 2001. Adjust your target. WinkyDink Sep 2012 #84

Thank you. littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #88

Price controls. The price gouging on medical care for terminal illness is out of control. reformist2 Sep 2012 #48

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #55

I'm still skeptical of RLS - "restless leg syndrome" reformist2 Sep 2012 #65

no...open it up to everyone ibegurpard Sep 2012 #63

Medicare needs to be more strictly audited. My late mother said that 30 years ago. nt raccoon Sep 2012 #75

The Defense budget beats all. WinkyDink Sep 2012 #85

You won't get any argument from me--the MIC is eating us alive. nt raccoon Sep 2012 #97

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #78

And the latest Medicare thing, Dr's charging patients to take Medicare MiniMe Sep 2012 #91

How about LOWERING the eligibility age to 55 or 50? thucythucy Sep 2012 #92

And think of how many people 55-65 would retire tomorrow Freddie Sep 2012 #123

You are on to something awake Sep 2012 #128

I agree. thucythucy Sep 2012 #130

This message was self-deleted by its author littlemissmartypants Sep 2012 #94

That's just not fucking true Cal Carpenter Sep 2012 #99

Well, we have to tax or cut something, not necessarily Medicare itself. porphyrian Sep 2012 #100

Would you raise premiums on everyone? kentuck Sep 2012 #101

Increase the pool. Allow everyone on the plan BlueToTheBone Sep 2012 #103

If you pay $100,000-$150,000 into a savings account over 44 years, bluestate10 Sep 2012 #104

I'd gladly take the premiums I'm paying for insurance now to pay for Medicare AllyCat Sep 2012 #109

We need to do what France does. nt valerief Sep 2012 #111

The Answer Is Single Payer Which Bends The Healthcare Cost Curve for Everyone Yavin4 Sep 2012 #118

This betrays a much simpler solution Major Nikon Sep 2012 #121

Allow young people to buy into Medicare. begin_within Sep 2012 #124

Are these reliable figures? MadDash Sep 2012 #127

We are at the point were the boomers are reaching the age when they use these programs and like jwirr Sep 2012 #132