General Discussion

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)

80. But those people are still no where

Mon Oct 8, 2012, 12:04 PM

Oct 2012

near a majority of those working. The population of this country is still growing. The number of births each year is greater than the number during the Baby Boom.

There are a lot of things that need fixing, such as rewarding the amazing productivity of the average American worker, and stop sending jobs overseas, but sheer demographics will tell you that we are a very long way away from more people withdrawing from their 401(k) than are putting in to it.

If there is a population crash, or even a genuine slow-down, if we actually get to a Zero Population Growth place (as I believe is the case in Japan and much of Western Europe) then that will happen.

In reality, the fundamental problem with capitalism is that it assumes growth will last forever, and depends on growth to stay alive. There is a practical limit to how many people can live on this planet, and at some point we collectively have to stop reproducing so enthusiastically. THAT'S our real problem.

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Know the FACTS: Simpson-Bowles only calls for tiny cuts to Social Security [View all] MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 OP

This is the stuff that angers me more than anything............ kooljerk666 Oct 2012 #1

Well ok newfie11 Oct 2012 #2

Oh, it's this thread again... SidDithers Oct 2012 #3

Better Believe It! MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #5

I knew you reminded me of someone... SidDithers Oct 2012 #16

boom goes the dynamite... dionysus Oct 2012 #26

I thought it was nap time in Canada... hay rick Oct 2012 #32

... SidDithers Oct 2012 #36

Are you in favor of cuts to SS? R. Daneel Olivaw Oct 2012 #48

No. And neither is Obama...nt SidDithers Oct 2012 #54

I hope so. I would be in favor of a tax adjustment on the wealthy. R. Daneel Olivaw Oct 2012 #58

No, not Obama! Ever heard of Google? A Simple Game Oct 2012 #77

Thanks for introducing Firedoglake into this thread... WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #88

I just listed the first four that came up. There were about 2.5 million, A Simple Game Oct 2012 #94

I'd say two dozen *at most* are peddling and/or buying into the bullshit... WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #104

I heard it from President Obama in a clip on the TV, you believe what you want. A Simple Game Oct 2012 #124

What I believe is that you and I are likely in agreement. WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #138

Sorry, I think I misunderstood your post. n/t A Simple Game Oct 2012 #159

No need to apologize. WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #168

In taking the time to open up the first link, truedelphi Oct 2012 #173

I'm too old to wear blinders willingly. n/t A Simple Game Oct 2012 #174

Um, then why is he trying to implement the recommendations? yardwork Oct 2012 #116

Oh yeah? DeSwiss Oct 2012 #121

... SidDithers Oct 2012 #123

.... DeSwiss Oct 2012 #139

Post removed Post removed Oct 2012 #172

Hey, Sid, if you do not like this thread Trailrider1951 Oct 2012 #130

"Nobody will miss that" Glitterati Oct 2012 #4

It was satire MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #7

Sorry.... Glitterati Oct 2012 #9

Nah, it's fine MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #12

You had me until I got to the "sell a kidney" a line JonLP24 Oct 2012 #19

Your satire may be dry, but there's nothing dry with this product. R. Daneel Olivaw Oct 2012 #53

you need to cut and paste the faces of the elderly and put that on the can with a saying something leftyohiolib Oct 2012 #57

I'm working on it. :D R. Daneel Olivaw Oct 2012 #60

"For Frisky Seniors!" WinkyDink Oct 2012 #118

Hmmmm..... DeSwiss Oct 2012 #141

Simpson-Bowles failed, and it ProSense Oct 2012 #6

Zombies! MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #11

Facts: ProSense Oct 2012 #14

"No current beneficiaries should see their basic benefits reduced." MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #17

"the administration will not accept an approach that slashes benefits for future generations." ProSense Oct 2012 #20

Yep. "What's a 'slash' versus a 'cut' in Social Security?" MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #21

"Cut" means cut, "Slash" means ProSense Oct 2012 #22

No, it's not clear at all. That's why people are concerned. Chef Eric Oct 2012 #71

Maybe it will "never end" given the looming 401(k) crisis. ieoeja Oct 2012 #35

Precisely my view. That's the reality of the Wall Street scam. JDPriestly Oct 2012 #42

Nailed it JDPriestly... And..when all "savers" can't earn much above 0% in KoKo Oct 2012 #75

QE is working.. girl gone mad Oct 2012 #95

Yes...it's working for those it serves....and the devil is in those details and weeds KoKo Oct 2012 #108

On the positive side of this, lower stock prices would allow SheilaT Oct 2012 #73

"Buy Low and Sell High" but, how many of those getting in do their research on markets KoKo Oct 2012 #109

Your example works great if the country's economy is growing enough, but it no longer is. jtuck004 Oct 2012 #125

The four million jobs that were lost in the first SheilaT Oct 2012 #137

Mi$$ RobMe and his ilk have people they don't care about, too. jtuck004 Oct 2012 #143

At what point will there be more people over the age of 70 SheilaT Oct 2012 #74

People who've lost jobs or houses were underwater, with unemployed kids are withdrawing KoKo Oct 2012 #76

But those people are still no where SheilaT Oct 2012 #80

Actually if it were not for immigration the US population would be stable or shrinking Fumesucker Oct 2012 #90

If. We still have the net immigration, SheilaT Oct 2012 #99

Main factors tama Oct 2012 #149

The Reason that I support Obama is that I think he allowed the Banksters to Reign KoKo Oct 2012 #112

Current, current, current. R. Daneel Olivaw Oct 2012 #56

That's the weak part of the progressive case tama Oct 2012 #148

Simpson Bowles failed because Ryan sunk it Doctor_J Oct 2012 #114

I am so relieved that legislation failed. Lasher Oct 2012 #156

K&R 99Forever Oct 2012 #8

most folks will end up dying more often fascisthunter Oct 2012 #10

It's never too late to learn hard work and take personal responsibility jsr Oct 2012 #13

Older Americans are currently underrepresented in that socioeconomic group MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #23

I live in an inner city area and see a small, but growing number of elderly women among the homeless JDPriestly Oct 2012 #44

We need to flip the argument around... raising the cap on SS taxes won't be very much... reformist2 Oct 2012 #15

Nice try. MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #24

Hey! you forgot your sarcasm smilie! n/t tech3149 Oct 2012 #18

Sell plasma and aluminum cans progressoid Oct 2012 #25

If selling a kidney works for the people in India, OnyxCollie Oct 2012 #27

K&R - lol closeupready Oct 2012 #28

Clinton said it to Ryan the other day, Obama is ready to deal on SS and other entitlements! Dustlawyer Oct 2012 #29

Which Dems? Which ProSense Oct 2012 #33

"in any deficit reduction package" MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #49

Ask Senator Sanders. Maybe he's in on selling out Social Security too. n/t ProSense Oct 2012 #50

Maybe that's the best wording he could get a large group of Senators to agree to. nt MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #61

So he's gullible? ProSense Oct 2012 #66

You're seeing a letter signed by many people who are running for reelection. uberblonde Oct 2012 #131

I hope you are right! There is a lot of money in play and Clinton did say it. They will not stop Dustlawyer Oct 2012 #165

If we just learn to adjust our wages, using the Hedonic Index, the way they adjust the CPI.... Fuddnik Oct 2012 #30

Slow death by a million cuts. nc4bo Oct 2012 #31

du rec. nt xchrom Oct 2012 #34

Only 22%? fadedrose Oct 2012 #37

Social Security has absolutely nothing to do with the debt. NOTHING! RC Oct 2012 #38

Well, Social Security "used" to have nothing to do with the debt, bvar22 Oct 2012 #69

Maybe, it's a bit more complicated than that. Sirveri Oct 2012 #155

Not in principle tama Oct 2012 #150

K&R. Kids. Think of it. Your generation gets to return to the real conservative, traditional JDPriestly Oct 2012 #39

Multigenerational families are not necessarily bad tama Oct 2012 #152

Kicking for the under-55 crowd. Me included. WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #40

That's the problem alrighty - not enough facts are known stupidicus Oct 2012 #41

A blogger??? Please. Ikonoklast Oct 2012 #46

Please what? stupidicus Oct 2012 #84

And OBAMA WILL TAKE AWAY OUR GUNS and FORCE YOU TO MARRY A HOMOSEXUAL11!!! emulatorloo Oct 2012 #47

my my, a hapless exaggerator stupidicus Oct 2012 #85

... not unlike the OP. AtomicKitten Oct 2012 #86

not sure what you mean by "OP" stupidicus Oct 2012 #103

Dumbass Conspiracy theories are like assholes. Everybody has one. emulatorloo Oct 2012 #91

do you mean the one I posted? stupidicus Oct 2012 #101

The Social Security 'issue' could be COMPLETELY SOLVED with just ONE change: TahitiNut Oct 2012 #43

Productivity increases over last 3 decades show avg wage should be approx. 90k$$ A YEAR.......... kooljerk666 Oct 2012 #63

The decimation of working class wages is the major problem with the whole economy! LongTomH Oct 2012 #67

I agree. TahitiNut Oct 2012 #107

are you fucking serious??? ONLY $50,000??? NoMoreWarNow Oct 2012 #45

Know the facts: Simpson-Bowles does not include Soc. Sec. as part of its deficit reduction plan frazzled Oct 2012 #51

The OP is fiction, but ProSense Oct 2012 #52

Worse than fiction, it is Romney/Ryan enabling. emulatorloo Oct 2012 #55

No, he's blaming Dems for inadequate defense against what Repukes are doing n/t eridani Oct 2012 #161

Here it comes ... absolutely, definitely any second now .... wait for it ... wait for it ... JoePhilly Oct 2012 #72

It's regurgitated. AtomicKitten Oct 2012 #81

Is there a specific fact that you take issue with? MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #87

Yes, the part about SS not being included in the hypothetical computations. AtomicKitten Oct 2012 #89

Then fucking educate Americans about the Romney/Ryan plan then emulatorloo Oct 2012 #93

What, precisely, is fiction? MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #106

Clever wording by the Commission, but functionally false MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #59

Who says a re-elected President Obama supports such a plan? frazzled Oct 2012 #62

So exactly when... 99Forever Oct 2012 #70

No, the "brilliant strategy" is to let Romney and Ryan win emulatorloo Oct 2012 #92

The question you didn't answer... 99Forever Oct 2012 #97

But But But...Manny Oilwellian Oct 2012 #96

Thankfully all I have heard from the Pres. is that he wants to strenghtnen SS. raouldukelives Oct 2012 #64

Let's say there is a secret deal to cut Social Security, what will you do? ProSense Oct 2012 #65

I'll dedicate my life to making the name of the President responsible the Bluenorthwest Oct 2012 #79

Cool, that's all that matters. n/t ProSense Oct 2012 #83

Well done! And thanks for bringing up something very important. 20score Oct 2012 #68

Yelp for trash pickers! Call it "Hobo's List"! KamaAina Oct 2012 #78

Kick and Rec! Fuddnik Oct 2012 #82

Yep and with gas approaching $5 a gallon, we won't miss those little cuts at all. Cleita Oct 2012 #98

Just out of curiosity tama Oct 2012 #153

Hear, hear, Manny! woo me with science Oct 2012 #100

DURec leftstreet Oct 2012 #102

I'm not sure that's accurate. The cut percentage could entail a mzmolly Oct 2012 #105

Bill Clinton did during his speech the Democratic Convention, bvar22 Oct 2012 #110

I heard Clinton say that Simpson-Bowels was a bipartisan commission, mzmolly Oct 2012 #111

The commission's plan calls for a 22% lifetime cut for middle-income earners MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #113

Got a link that doesn't spin COLA? And, any thoughts on vouchercare? mzmolly Oct 2012 #128

Messing with COLA isn't a cut? MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #135

That depends on who does the analysis. mzmolly Oct 2012 #136

Democrats have screwed the 99% with great glee over the past 20 years MannyGoldstein Oct 2012 #140

It's not a matter of cutting the COLA. It's a matter of interpreting mzmolly Oct 2012 #142

A means test will turn SS into "welfare" and it will then be killed... Odin2005 Oct 2012 #120

That's the plan leftstreet Oct 2012 #122

It's meant to be more like insurance mzmolly Oct 2012 #129

Oh great, GEICO Social Security !! leftstreet Oct 2012 #133

No. Just a social "safety" net. mzmolly Oct 2012 #134

No, it would turn it into an insurance plan. mzmolly Oct 2012 #127

+1,000 n/t LarryNM Oct 2012 #145

WE need a Democratic Congress. nt patrice Oct 2012 #115

As always, happy to rec this Autumn Oct 2012 #117

Thank you, 3rd Way Manny Doctor_J Oct 2012 #119

YUP Skittles Oct 2012 #126

this KG Oct 2012 #132

We'll probably get blamed at the end too Doctor_J Oct 2012 #158

The real irony is.... bvar22 Oct 2012 #167

The Repub reps definitely fear the teabaggers Doctor_J Oct 2012 #170

Twittered it. madfloridian Oct 2012 #144

I don't keep track of all comings and goings, but... WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #146

Not all the way back yet. Thinking about it. madfloridian Oct 2012 #147

Lord knows we need "outspoken on education." WorseBeforeBetter Oct 2012 #151

Well well Rex Oct 2012 #154

Hi madfloridian! a2liberal Oct 2012 #164

If I hadn't seen your name I would have gotten had. Zalatix Oct 2012 #157

K&R. Please, no cuts to Social Security. DLevine Oct 2012 #160

Here are some bullet points from a thread I wrote here in July 2011 Samantha Oct 2012 #162

K&R (n/t) a2liberal Oct 2012 #163

Schumer To Dems: Abandon Simpson-Bowles Tax Model ProSense Oct 2012 #166

And if there remains any doubt of their plans for SS & Medicare cuts... Oilwellian Oct 2012 #169

Just like our "leadership" to call SS and Medicare "entitlements" 4 weeks from the election Doctor_J Oct 2012 #171