General Discussion

lumpy

(13,704 posts)

166. Martin was probably afraid for his own life as well he should have been.

Wed Jul 3, 2013, 01:59 PM

Jul 2013

Perhaps Zimmerman was in fear that Martin would secure the gun and that might have contributed to his fears. If Martin had glimpsed the gun as Zimmermn claims or struggled to get possession of the gun no doubt Zimmerman would have become very fearfull. The resident eye witness who claims the killer was on top subduing the victim at the time of the shot appears to be a more reliable witness.
There is not a doubt that Martin was terribly frightened for his life; that is most likely the reason for his frantic screaming for help. Of course Martin was in fear, he didn't know what the hell was going on or who the hell was pursuing him; little or no mentioned of how Martin was reacting to the pursuer who appeared to be stalking him. Zimmerman should have to answer to the his deadly debacle and be taken out of the public, preferably for enough time to reflect on his actions and feel some remorse and guilt.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

269 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

ZIMMERMAN TRIAL: Day 8, Wednesday, July 3, 2013 [View all] GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 OP

Looks like they started early today. N/T GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #1

Hope she allows the wannabe evidence riverwalker Jul 2013 #2

Wannabe evidence is in... (nt) pokerfan Jul 2013 #9

O'Mara wants more time riverwalker Jul 2013 #3

he had time to go on AC360 riverwalker Jul 2013 #57

O'Mara really doesn't want the college records in. Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #4

The course in question taught specifically about SYG law Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #11

sounds like they don't know what the testimony riverwalker Jul 2013 #12

I'm glad the judge boxed his ears warrior1 Jul 2013 #5

yes!!!! riverwalker Jul 2013 #6

School records are admissible. nt Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #7

Goes to Z's motive warrior1 Jul 2013 #8

The evidence is in. bravenak Jul 2013 #10

nice!!! uponit7771 Jul 2013 #16

The defense tries this a lot Nevernose Jul 2013 #13

witness Sonja Boles-Melvin riverwalker Jul 2013 #14

This attorney reminds me of Skeletor.. HipChick Jul 2013 #15

Vladimir Lenin KurtNYC Jul 2013 #32

why did defense bring up bad credit riverwalker Jul 2013 #17

Not at all Lurks Often Jul 2013 #35

Riddle me this Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #18

well, now things get interesting..Zimmerman was the best student uponit7771 Jul 2013 #19

Well he shouldn't plead ignorance on self-defense laws. Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #28

If the defense thought bad credit is prejudicial, why did they bring it up? bravenak Jul 2013 #20

Captain Alexis Francisco Carter riverwalker Jul 2013 #21

BOOM! SYG introduced and Zimmy was one of the best students... Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #22

+1, by a lawyer!! NICE uponit7771 Jul 2013 #23

He learned about stand your ground and self defence . bravenak Jul 2013 #24

How do you have a 1.5 GPA? HipChick Jul 2013 #25

That one class being the only one he was interested in... uponit7771 Jul 2013 #26

...and here comes the Defense to discredit the Captain Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #27

This guy isn't RJ, he's going to make it hard as heck for them uponit7771 Jul 2013 #29

I focused on Florida law .. boom...he's going to be harder to break than RJ. He knows where they're. uponit7771 Jul 2013 #30

All they have is that the course wasn't "specific" to Florida. madaboutharry Jul 2013 #31

They are going for the SYG defense Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #34

BOOM!!!! "did you cover Stand Your Ground"? riverwalker Jul 2013 #33

Look at his eyes Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #36

Isn't this giving... NCTraveler Jul 2013 #37

YES!!!...Good catch, the judge caught it too uponit7771 Jul 2013 #39

The professor isn't giving them what the defense wants. madaboutharry Jul 2013 #40

Where is the Defense going with this?! tia uponit7771 Jul 2013 #38

They want to confuse the jury. But the judge madaboutharry Jul 2013 #42

Did you hear Knock Knock's sigh? avebury Jul 2013 #41

This lawyer on the stand is good, he's going to now explani "imperfect" self defense uponit7771 Jul 2013 #43

"Disproportionate"..... Cuts both ways. Defense wants us to believe it only chelsea0011 Jul 2013 #48

Well now RGR375 Jul 2013 #56

keep dreaming noiretextatique Jul 2013 #184

Alexis Carter - JAG prosecutor and eye candy panAmerican Jul 2013 #44

I have a daughter I would like him to meet.. Ninga Jul 2013 #45

oh yeah riverwalker Jul 2013 #46

I want John Guy to randomly ask, "Hey dad, wanna have a catch?" Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #50

You're right! John Guy has a soothing, calming kind of voice panAmerican Jul 2013 #54

He is very cute.... madaboutharry Jul 2013 #47

While on the topic..... Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #49

"Disparpoetionate deadly force, like a gun shot" says therofessor.. Ninga Jul 2013 #51

the professor....we've come a long way from the first day of the trial uponit7771 Jul 2013 #59

Force meeting force HockeyMom Jul 2013 #52

That isn't the way disproportiante force is applied in self-defense law. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #61

I think Zimmerman had only one hand to "defend" himself Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #62

The same could be said for Trayvon's right to defend himself. Just Saying Jul 2013 #72

Not the way it works. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #78

Total bs Just Saying Jul 2013 #89

Check out the U.S. Army height/weight/age standards. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #97

Zimmy was 185 lbs. Not 200. He is obese now, but did not weigh 200 Lbs at time of shooting. uppityperson Jul 2013 #119

200 lbs. See link. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #125

I was going by what was by his photo, this. Thank you. uppityperson Jul 2013 #132

Trayvon last played football at age 13 JimDandy Jul 2013 #217

Thank you for taking the time to counter the claims. It gets old and I appreciate your doing it. nt uppityperson Jul 2013 #218

Justice requires the truth. Happy to do it. JimDandy Jul 2013 #224

Thanks for the corrrection regarding football. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #233

As have you. Just Saying Jul 2013 #240

I am not a Z fan. I have posted several times that I think he is guilty of manslaughter. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #245

You rock! Just Saying Jul 2013 #241

Awe, thanks! JimDandy Jul 2013 #242

Hockey mom you obviously don't know fl law ceonupe Jul 2013 #187

The major difference in Florida HockeyMom Jul 2013 #204

Wrong ceonupe Jul 2013 #219

Fleeing is the same as retreat HockeyMom Jul 2013 #229

Handgun vs. Hands bravenak Jul 2013 #53

wrong again RGR375 Jul 2013 #58

...and REASONABLE is a judged by Jury as Knock Knock stated in his own filibuster uponit7771 Jul 2013 #60

Reasonable fear. bravenak Jul 2013 #66

I would not follow anybody RGR375 Jul 2013 #74

I haven't seen any proof that his head was beat into the concrete. bravenak Jul 2013 #76

The cuts on the back of his head RGR375 Jul 2013 #116

Maybe they wrestled through those bushes Trayvon was supposedly hiding in. uppityperson Jul 2013 #118

The body of the victim was found nowhere near the concrete. bravenak Jul 2013 #123

Nowhere near the concrete? GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #135

Jump up in surprise and take a few steps? bravenak Jul 2013 #139

Well, hell. Trayvon then managed to tuck his arms back under his body by the time others got there uppityperson Jul 2013 #156

This goes back to that wonderful post saying " Trayvon should have just dodged the bullet" bravenak Jul 2013 #169

Dr. Bao has just testified that TM was alive for 1 to 10 minutes after he was shot. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #247

He also said that Trayvon couldn't move after he was shot. Nt bravenak Jul 2013 #248

don't forget the part where he sez "ya got me!" frylock Jul 2013 #172

and: "You're going to die tonight" noiretextatique Jul 2013 #178

made it, ma! top of the world! frylock Jul 2013 #182

right...how many 17yo kids talk like that in 2013? noiretextatique Jul 2013 #188

keep repeating that lie noiretextatique Jul 2013 #179

Ah, then you get into the reasonable person standard HockeyMom Jul 2013 #68

I read an article riverwalker Jul 2013 #90

My friend the Sensi HockeyMom Jul 2013 #106

Martin was probably afraid for his own life as well he should have been. lumpy Jul 2013 #166

today's link Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #55

Here's the live link I use displacedtexan Jul 2013 #67

thanks very much! I will check it out. Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #198

what the hell? n/t riverwalker Jul 2013 #63

LOL! 4 dozen people calling into the Skype connection Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #64

They don't have their SKYPE account setup correctly HipChick Jul 2013 #70

SKYPE AMATEUR TIME! HipChick Jul 2013 #65

He wanted to be a prosecutor. bravenak Jul 2013 #69

Does that guy sound like Costner to you too? uponit7771 Jul 2013 #71

Yes, he does. pintobean Jul 2013 #73

I predict he will do an excellent closing. Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #199

Yup, riverwalker said the same thing earlier panAmerican Jul 2013 #77

Indeed he does. Not gonna hurt with the mzmolly Jul 2013 #151

is this true about the weapon warrior1 Jul 2013 #75

So says MSNBC legal analyst, Atty Bloom. Ninga Jul 2013 #79

Atty Bloom said the prosecution was to demonstrate that the gun Ninga Jul 2013 #81

Well that's interesting. warrior1 Jul 2013 #83

It is impossible to cock a Kel-Tec PF9. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #82

you'd have to tell me warrior1 Jul 2013 #87

No, it's double action only (DAO) pokerfan Jul 2013 #84

I thought I heard atty Bloom say that the bullet had to be loaded first into the chamber Ninga Jul 2013 #88

All guns have to have that done prior to firing. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #100

Right pokerfan Jul 2013 #115

I heard him cock the gun while exiting his truck on the 911 mzmolly Jul 2013 #152

That type of gun can not be cocked Lurks Often Jul 2013 #235

Semantics. I heard him pull the slide back mzmolly Jul 2013 #243

Not semantics Lurks Often Jul 2013 #244

It is relevant. mzmolly Jul 2013 #250

Then based on your own cite, you have just proven you did not hear the slide drawn back Lurks Often Jul 2013 #252

I heard what sounded like him, readying his gun. mzmolly Jul 2013 #253

Very familiar with those sounds Lurks Often Jul 2013 #254

He was out of his truck by that time. mzmolly Jul 2013 #255

Speculation Lurks Often Jul 2013 #256

Uh huh. mzmolly Jul 2013 #260

Believe what you like, Lurks Often Jul 2013 #262

You didn't see testimony saying he had a bullet mzmolly Jul 2013 #263

Of course he had a bullet in the chamber Lurks Often Jul 2013 #264

Ahhh, protection. mzmolly Jul 2013 #268

My answer had nothing to do with whether the shooting was justified or not, Lurks Often Jul 2013 #269

Listen to the testimony of the firearms expert. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #266

We mzmolly Jul 2013 #267

That is the seat belt being released. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #258

Funny. He was long out of his automobile at that mzmolly Jul 2013 #259

OK. My timeline was off. You still didn't hear the slide being racked. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #265

The testimony goes against you. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #246

More semantics. I heard what sounded like Z getting his gun ready. Understand? mzmolly Jul 2013 #249

His gun was already ready and needed no further preperation. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #257

I hope you don't shoot an innocent person, mzmolly Jul 2013 #261

This forensic witness is fascinating Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #80

She is very easy to understand, And I think not good for defense. Ninga Jul 2013 #85

Actually in this case ceonupe Jul 2013 #196

BAMB!!! A CONTACT SHOT!!! Meaning the Muzzles was AGAINST the fabric uponit7771 Jul 2013 #86

Yet Zimmerman says riverwalker Jul 2013 #99

Zimmy would've been better off to say "I don't know" rather than try to make things up uppityperson Jul 2013 #121

Well, what would one expect him to say, not that it truly matters. lumpy Jul 2013 #173

Yes. mzmolly Jul 2013 #153

I love this chick! Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #91

She is very smart and I love how she isn't letting him lead her 'round the rosy. madaboutharry Jul 2013 #92

He keeps trying to get her to express an opinion about degrees of safety Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #95

Yep, one sharp cookie! Her testimony about the clothing was in my opinion damaging to Ninga Jul 2013 #96

Defense is blah blah blah, trying to distance jury from her earlier testimony - good grief Ninga Jul 2013 #93

+1 uponit7771 Jul 2013 #94

Very typical questioning when you have nothing to say. madaboutharry Jul 2013 #98

ah, thx...means it most likely hurt them uponit7771 Jul 2013 #101

Defense is doing a good job with her. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #102

I don't think so, they established that the shot was at arms distance at least meaning there had to uponit7771 Jul 2013 #103

She made it clear that the gun was touching the fabric Lisa D Jul 2013 #104

Very clearly stated. Ninga Jul 2013 #110

How does that help the defense when Zimmerman claimed he thought the shot went wide Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #105

Doesn't. Ninga Jul 2013 #108

That he thought he missed is irrelevant to the positions. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #113

Good point, and a damn good reason to restrict people from carrying firearms in public. Hoyt Jul 2013 #122

HOW did Z straddle TM and spread his arms apart, yet TM had his arms under his body? uppityperson Jul 2013 #124

That requires speculaton on my part. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #131

Zimmerman claimed he wasn't sure if he even the gunshot even hit Trayvon. madaboutharry Jul 2013 #111

That is fairly common in self-defense shootings. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #120

And, a good reason Zimmerman and others should not be allowed to carry in public. Hoyt Jul 2013 #126

+1 mzmolly Jul 2013 #154

I haven't read that testimony, do you have a link to it? (Z shooting TM X3 in the back). uppityperson Jul 2013 #127

Google Jane Surdyka GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #145

She said she thought she heard 3 shots. Nothing about shooting into his back. uppityperson Jul 2013 #147

She claims that she saw Z on TM's back, then heard three shots. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #165

Heard her testimony also; never heard her say Martin was shot in the back; lumpy Jul 2013 #177

See my post #191 N/T GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #234

I think she said she heard three shots, not that she saw three shots into the back - hedgehog Jul 2013 #149

Correct. She does not say that the saw the shots, only heard three shots. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #162

Thank you , i had missed that. hedgehog Jul 2013 #170

Here is the testimony GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #191

So much, then, for "You got me!" Lies, lies, lies. WinkyDink Jul 2013 #159

By Zimmerman saying that Martin sat up and quoted (supposidly) Martins lumpy Jul 2013 #210

I am a mom, grandmother and a fair minded person. I think that already too much has been said Ninga Jul 2013 #107

+1 uponit7771 Jul 2013 #109

Having that tiny woman effortlessly pull the trigger for them Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #112

+1 Ninga Jul 2013 #114

Guns aren't designed to require heavy trigger pulls. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #117

Hey - it was the defense that kept trying to make a 4lb trigger pull Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #129

I don't see why they emphasized that. N/T GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #141

of course you wouldn't CatWoman Jul 2013 #221

If you have special insight, please share it. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #237

Two women on the jury RGR375 Jul 2013 #130

Outstanding. I wasn't aware of that. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #137

only one, the parrot lady riverwalker Jul 2013 #176

Well, While There Are Many Positive Comments For Prosecution.... ChiciB1 Jul 2013 #128

Because they want you to keep watching? Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #133

Faux was doing the same ... Myrina Jul 2013 #134

On that note RGR375 Jul 2013 #146

CNN and Headline News have been catering to the Zimmerman ... ThePhilosopher04 Jul 2013 #136

That's why I watch the WFTV live feed and commentary. displacedtexan Jul 2013 #142

I just watched CNN HL for a few minutes and was shocked to see their live chelsea0011 Jul 2013 #181

after testimony that Z studied SYG riverwalker Jul 2013 #138

not really RGR375 Jul 2013 #143

you mean like Trayvon? riverwalker Jul 2013 #174

++ Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #200

Two Women On Jury Are Very "Iffy" Because ChiciB1 Jul 2013 #175

Here you go: Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #183

Yep, That's The One... ChiciB1 Jul 2013 #226

Sorry, Forgot To Mention The Other Case. ChiciB1 Jul 2013 #227

I was fought over in Voir Dire HockeyMom Jul 2013 #216

So The Reality Really Is... ChiciB1 Jul 2013 #228

Because in a nut shell RGR375 Jul 2013 #140

if this is the law riverwalker Jul 2013 #144

It was over at "Initially provokes" Duer 157099 Jul 2013 #148

not a bruise, not a scratch riverwalker Jul 2013 #195

Zimmerman was on the ground RGR375 Jul 2013 #232

Which is moot Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #150

Walks? You have to believe he was in so much of a struggle that he feared for his chelsea0011 Jul 2013 #186

bullshit....zimmerman LIED again noiretextatique Jul 2013 #189

Consider the source. mzmolly Jul 2013 #155

Their recreation video has TM's clothing all wrong. displacedtexan Jul 2013 #160

that's the same stupid meme some keep posting here noiretextatique Jul 2013 #180

The judge has about had it with the defense arguing with her Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #157

That won't go anywhere. No trial has to be extended on the Defense's request. WinkyDink Jul 2013 #163

Thats good to know. Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #171

SHUT HIM UP, JUDGE. You have SAID the subject is OVER. WinkyDink Jul 2013 #158

Defense isn't prepared? Ninga Jul 2013 #161

too busy giving interviews riverwalker Jul 2013 #168

Here's the good ish .... uponit7771 Jul 2013 #164

Judge: talk to the hand. n/t riverwalker Jul 2013 #167

Zimmerman's lies about knowing full well how the STG law works Wash. state Desk Jet Jul 2013 #185

just a question here.. What is the difference whether zimmy knew about the SYG laws or not, besides HeroInAHalfShell Jul 2013 #190

Uh....read your last four words. WinkyDink Jul 2013 #193

That he knew what to say to the police to seem innocent, goes against Serinos comments about him uponit7771 Jul 2013 #194

Well that's easy, Wash. state Desk Jet Jul 2013 #197

let's hope he doesn't get away with it this time noiretextatique Jul 2013 #192

What to make of the DNA evidence here? Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #201

No Zimmerman DNA under Trayvons fingernails riverwalker Jul 2013 #202

If I understood correctly, the only place Trayvon's blood was on Zimmerman Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #203

Over half Trayvon's blood was in his pleural cavities csziggy Jul 2013 #251

1. No DNA from Zimmy on TM's hands - mzmolly Jul 2013 #205

#4 excellent point riverwalker Jul 2013 #206

Not that I disagree, but how do you wash your own DNA away from your own hands? Duer 157099 Jul 2013 #225

Thanks. nt Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #207

YW. Just my understanding based upon a brief mzmolly Jul 2013 #211

and none on the cuffs which I think is especially significant Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #214

Yes. Excellent point, I forgot to include. mzmolly Jul 2013 #215

So WHY did the DNA expert just VOLUNTEER that evidence might have been stored incorrectly??? FGSake. WinkyDink Jul 2013 #208

If state plans to finish today, does that mean we don't hear autopsy report? Duer 157099 Jul 2013 #209

It might be stipulated to. Tommy_Carcetti Jul 2013 #212

Regarding Zimmermans weight voteearlyvoteoften Jul 2013 #213

Related: I can explain the weight gain since (w/o jokes!) Nevernose Jul 2013 #220

Really, what was he prescribed? targetpractice Jul 2013 #222

Your basic adderall prescription. Nevernose Jul 2013 #223

Tegretol. Don't know if that is what Z was on, but fits your description. (I take it). nt s-cubed Jul 2013 #230

You're right, but I was wrong Nevernose Jul 2013 #231

Not Trazadone, but Temazepam according to this... targetpractice Jul 2013 #239

I found this on a Zimmerman trial blog. displacedtexan Jul 2013 #236

The rain didn't wash any of the other blood off zimmermans head or nose or the gun, they're uponit7771 Jul 2013 #238