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Precisely

(358 posts)

212. that is so full of it

Reply to Drale (Reply #5)

Thu Sep 19, 2013, 08:08 PM

Sep 2013

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what is it with DU's collective reluctance to criticize violent video games? [View all] cali Sep 2013 OP

Our culture has always celebrated the worst, crudest, most violent shit. Orrex Sep 2013 #1

OK, but I'm talking about DU specifically, which cali Sep 2013 #2

DU celebrates the sexism and racism of these games? Orrex Sep 2013 #29

the question was: Precisely Sep 2013 #210

That was the original question. Here is the clarification: Orrex Sep 2013 #253

there was no Precisely Sep 2013 #260

Actually, there was Orrex Sep 2013 #266

you read it wrong Precisely Sep 2013 #270

Read it again. Orrex Sep 2013 #275

Good night Precisely Sep 2013 #276

Our culture has also segregated blacks, treated gay members like 2nd class citizens KittyWampus Sep 2013 #50

Our culture has also fed children and produced beautiful architecture Orrex Sep 2013 #88

So, you are asserting that the architectural beauty and inadequate nutritional support Egalitarian Thug Sep 2013 #192

"always"? Precisely Sep 2013 #207

Yes. Why do you ask? Orrex Sep 2013 #254

think about what you're claiming. Precisely Sep 2013 #261

Has there ever been a time when our country hasn't had a death penalty? Orrex Sep 2013 #265

You say, "I know exactly what I'm claiming, and my claim is correct." defacto7 Sep 2013 #271

yes Precisely Sep 2013 #277

Nowhere have I suggested that our culture is static. Nowhere. Orrex Sep 2013 #278

oh please Precisely Sep 2013 #279

I have to disagree on every one of your assumptions. defacto7 Sep 2013 #281

You seem to believe that I am campaigning for violence. If so, then you are incorrect. Orrex Sep 2013 #287

"Our culture has always celebrated the worst, crudest, most violent shit." Precisely Sep 2013 #290

One thing that video games do is let you do things you can't do in real life. backscatter712 Sep 2013 #274

I agree with marking them as such PowerToThePeople Sep 2013 #3

Free speech. sibelian Sep 2013 #4

Because they are protected by the first amendment and are an art form Drale Sep 2013 #5

^this^ Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #10

Criticizing others is not BANNING. And it's telling that many jump to that erroneous position. KittyWampus Sep 2013 #53

That's where it leads. bobclark86 Sep 2013 #85

I can't remember the exact quote, but it's something along the lines of: Orrex Sep 2013 #98

I love Ice-T, but don't take those lyrics seriously. alp227 Sep 2013 #153

Bullshit (I hope you're being sarcastic, actually) bobclark86 Sep 2013 #170

She asked for parental advisory. That is not censorship. Changing definitions does not make it so seabeyond Sep 2013 #179

Or, it could be caused by... bobclark86 Sep 2013 #235

Parent advisory. No different than a movie. No different the a computer game. seabeyond Sep 2013 #267

Ice -T was full of stinking shit about "Tip." She wasn't trying to "censor" anyone. MADem Sep 2013 #159

She might not have been "trying" to censor bobclark86 Sep 2013 #172

I disagree. And at the end of the day, so did the complaining Ice-T. MADem Sep 2013 #250

So you are all for spouting misogyny. Do I have the free speech to call your quote sexist seabeyond Sep 2013 #177

Indeed, and we have other amendments that protect things as well The Straight Story Sep 2013 #110

that is so full of it Precisely Sep 2013 #212

Because they are enjoyed by so many pintobean Sep 2013 #6

What reluctance? Ohio Joe Sep 2013 #7

You don't get the nuance... Throd Sep 2013 #8

Americans are brought up to Honor...Respect...Play...Support and Enjoy War. Why wouldn't.. BlueJazz Sep 2013 #9

Lets start with banning Chess. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #12

you are exactly what I"m talking about. for fuckity fuck's sake cali Sep 2013 #17

Horseshit... what's the fucking end goal then? opiate69 Sep 2013 #37

Oh that's just crap el_bryanto Sep 2013 #43

Criticizing video games, or art, or movies, opiate69 Sep 2013 #47

it points out a connection between the "art" product Precisely Sep 2013 #213

And the point of pointing that out would be??? opiate69 Sep 2013 #214

back to the OPs question Precisely Sep 2013 #215

Well then, my alternate answer to the OP would be something along the lines of: opiate69 Sep 2013 #227

unless it impacts you and those you care about Precisely Sep 2013 #232

Well I was also under the (apparently misguided) impression opiate69 Sep 2013 #233

bs Precisely Sep 2013 #234

Well.. I guess I've been told.. opiate69 Sep 2013 #236

you deflect Precisely Sep 2013 #242

I never referred to any research.. Shall I find you a roster card to keep track? opiate69 Sep 2013 #244

The criticism generally takes the form of "BAD THINGS" "THINK OF THE CHILDREN" Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #48

A suggestion thats two words: "Decaffeinated Coffee" Katashi_itto Sep 2013 #57

I realize you got huffy and left your OP after like 2 hours, but what was I unwilling to criticize? CreekDog Sep 2013 #247

The United States military ... TeeYiYi Sep 2013 #169

I do not find them anymore terrifying than Facebook NoOneMan Sep 2013 #11

Yes - it's like the phone or the television or the radio or the telegraph el_bryanto Sep 2013 #23

I shed tears when the telegraph bullies push young telegraph teens to suicide NoOneMan Sep 2013 #49

Blaming the technology itself is an easy cop-out fujiyama Sep 2013 #186

My kids did not get one til 16. And a year for smart phone. seabeyond Sep 2013 #196

Smart thing fujiyama Sep 2013 #197

Yeah, its like blaming guns for gun crimes NoOneMan Sep 2013 #202

It's Easy. JesterCS Sep 2013 #13

I think at a fundamental level, everyone realizes that garbage in equals garbage out LanternWaste Sep 2013 #14

I'll be critical BKH70041 Sep 2013 #15

You sound like the people who censored bobclark86 Sep 2013 #89

Different game cemaphonic Sep 2013 #161

Appreciate It BKH70041 Sep 2013 #171

here it is Precisely Sep 2013 #218

There are people here that criticize them. HappyMe Sep 2013 #16

no fucking duh. and this thread is ample evidence of exactly what I said in the OP cali Sep 2013 #24

Well fucking duh! HappyMe Sep 2013 #30

Football has a documented public health issue. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #51

I think in time there will be such studies and they will show harm. Mojorabbit Sep 2013 #77

There have been such studies. They show no harm. jeff47 Sep 2013 #94

Your avatar undermines your credibility Orrex Sep 2013 #100

Pfft. Those bad guys were just asking to be eaten. (nt) jeff47 Sep 2013 #106

30 minutes? Precisely Sep 2013 #220

It's gonna take some digging jeff47 Sep 2013 #289

Thanks Precisely Sep 2013 #291

There have been lots of studies. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #125

This is how I see it Mojorabbit Sep 2013 #143

Theyre no diifferent than violenty books,music,movies,magazines, poetry, plays etc bowens43 Sep 2013 #18

I assume that some DUers enjoy them el_bryanto Sep 2013 #19

I have no problem at all criticizing any distraction for the brain-dead 1-Old-Man Sep 2013 #20

This is exactly what I was referring to above - a blanket condemnation based on nothing el_bryanto Sep 2013 #34

The GTA games are good games. JVS Sep 2013 #21

It's a deflection from the real issue, guns. Dash87 Sep 2013 #22

nailed!...eom Kolesar Sep 2013 #229

The sexism and racism aren't what made the games fun leftstreet Sep 2013 #25

Cognitive dissonance Mosby Sep 2013 #26

Which raises the question why people love them so much and spend hundreds of hours a grantcart Sep 2013 #142

I wish there were more dark video games. ZombieHorde Sep 2013 #284

It is sad that anyone is entertained by violence. I don't understand the attraction to Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #27

But you realize that people have been entertained by violence for millennia, right? Orrex Sep 2013 #35

Yes, in many different forms. That does not mean imo that we are not capable Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #41

At least they're not on your lawn Orrex Sep 2013 #58

People are free to qualify their socialization to include these games, I don't agree there is Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #74

Kids used to play cops-and-robbers in my neighborhood Orrex Sep 2013 #97

The benefit is not comparable imo because there is no room for an altered beginning, middle Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #101

Um....no. jeff47 Sep 2013 #109

Interesting, so they resolve the problem by what other means? Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #112

Whatever they feel like. jeff47 Sep 2013 #116

Whatever the trappings, in the end, shooting is utilized for the vitual games. Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #119

So you aren't familiar with "Cops and Robbers" as played by kids then? jeff47 Sep 2013 #123

Oh, so I wasn't actually pretending to shoot all of those Indians when I was a kid? opiate69 Sep 2013 #126

Of course you were. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #136

"Valuable time" is in the eye of the beholder Orrex Sep 2013 #121

You're not taking me to task. It is my opinion, and would only be your problem if they were banned Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #134

except there werent Precisely Sep 2013 #223

What game features blacks hanging from trees? Orrex Sep 2013 #252

how well Precisely Sep 2013 #259

How poorly you made the point Orrex Sep 2013 #262

you're done Precisely Sep 2013 #264

MacBeth. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #59

I believe there is a striking difference, but you likely already knew that. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #61

Game of Thrones. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #66

Yep, differences there too. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #69

The Iliad. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #62

Yep, differences there too. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #64

Actually perhaps you ought to (re)read the Iliad. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #67

I did not suggest it was not violent. I believe my post you responded to earlier explained Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #71

perhaps you should take a course on how the iliad was experienced in its time Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #129

In it's time and it is the equivalent of the participation required of virtual games we Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #135

Sort of word salad, but if I understood your question, "yes". Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #224

I see. One can spend their leisure time doing many things, violent games are one. Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #256

It's not the violence that is entertaining. jeff47 Sep 2013 #63

The game requires an active participant..that is a significant difference, imo. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #68

IMO it makes the media you like worse. jeff47 Sep 2013 #73

MacBeth was a tragedy that provokes the mind to think, the characters, the dilemma, the Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #78

Only because you are not familiar with the stories in video games. jeff47 Sep 2013 #90

I don't like the games and most especially, what I don't like is what you have highlighted Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #99

You sometimes take on the role of a killer jeff47 Sep 2013 #105

You're presuming I prefer these games were banned. I stated much earlier, I do not. Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #108

No, I'm not. I'm responding to your own arguments. (nt) jeff47 Sep 2013 #111

Really? Then why bring up banning? Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #114

Because I'm talking about the media you are using as a positive example. jeff47 Sep 2013 #115

I told you what I believe is the difference. Virtual games involve and Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #118

And I've told you that I feel passive acceptance of violence is worse. jeff47 Sep 2013 #120

No, you should not feel any need to bother to repeat. The dullness is not the objection in and Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #144

They aren't rote games jeff47 Sep 2013 #152

I know, it's just like dodge ball snooper2 Sep 2013 #81

Yea, just like that. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #84

Modern culture seems bound and determined.. MicaelS Sep 2013 #28

Movies have been much less violent and porny over the last 20 years or so. ZombieHorde Sep 2013 #285

My guess? Many of us play them. Laelth Sep 2013 #31

I think because it's become a Republican mantra BainsBane Sep 2013 #32

These games are popular in many countries, not just the US. bvar22 Sep 2013 #46

As I say, I think it's worth examining the evidence BainsBane Sep 2013 #52

What evidence? Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #162

studies on the effect of video games BainsBane Sep 2013 #168

You are laying out problems that have to do with economic instability... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #178

Actually, no BainsBane Sep 2013 #187

The problem is that available research into video games shows a negative correlation... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #188

Meaning games reduce the propensity toward violence? BainsBane Sep 2013 #198

I don't see why it would be strange, games, of all sorts, including video games... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #248

What is your source for this? BainsBane Sep 2013 #255

where is this research? Precisely Sep 2013 #228

I shouldn't have to do this, but look at the various sources here... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #249

I agree. I play some games from time to time on xbox cui bono Sep 2013 #33

These games seem to fullfill a need in the human psyche. gordianot Sep 2013 #36

GTA is satire, it is mocking American society Bjorn Against Sep 2013 #38

I haven't played the newest version, but yes, I saw the satire in older versions. backscatter712 Sep 2013 #83

It's like people who think Romeo and Juliet is a serious romance... bobclark86 Sep 2013 #96

The GTA series has always had a certain amount of satire/parody vis a vis American culture Mike Daniels Sep 2013 #39

sounds about right. obxhead Sep 2013 #107

Discussions about the impact of art & entertainment DirkGently Sep 2013 #40

I like this: G_j Sep 2013 #45

except they don't Precisely Sep 2013 #230

Bans or control are what people DirkGently Sep 2013 #268

No one has suggested a ban except those opposed to bans Precisely Sep 2013 #272

So jump in with something more intelligent. DirkGently Sep 2013 #295

GTA is crap. Crap is made on purpose so that all media becomes a dumpster-dive... dogknob Sep 2013 #42

What can I say about GTA 5 that has not already been said about Afghanistan? Bluenorthwest Sep 2013 #44

I was listening to a podcast today about Native Son. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #54

Because the average DUer is smarter than a plate of clams? Rex Sep 2013 #55

Damn dude. zappaman Sep 2013 #65

I cans teach. Rex Sep 2013 #70

Clams are shit eating bastards. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #130

Indeed they are.. but, we have our first dig of the season tonight.. I'm hoping for more of this! opiate69 Sep 2013 #131

No respawn points for you! Rex Sep 2013 #138

Ha! Respawn points are for noobs! lol... and don't forget the lobster! opiate69 Sep 2013 #141

Steak and lobster might be in order. Rex Sep 2013 #146

heh.. well, let's write one up! There's brazillians to be made, Rex! We'll be moguls!! opiate69 Sep 2013 #148

But will we be GTA moguls? Rex Sep 2013 #150

Hell yeah.. GTA moguls for life.. with a fleet of Faggios opiate69 Sep 2013 #154

Sweet. Rex Sep 2013 #155

I'm totally buying a mansion on Starfish Island... opiate69 Sep 2013 #156

Buy!? Hell no we are stealing it! Rex Sep 2013 #164

lmao! My bad! Damn straight, we're stealing it! Ricardo's going down! opiate69 Sep 2013 #167

Discussion is indeed, a waste of time LanternWaste Sep 2013 #193

Because it's just the latest in a long, tired trend jeff47 Sep 2013 #56

I guess a lot of us don't like them, but I don't think anyone thinks they should be banned. Nye Bevan Sep 2013 #60

Welp Tien1985 Sep 2013 #72

Grand Theft Auto has a horrible history of how it portrays women... cynatnite Sep 2013 #75

So does the Smurfs. jeff47 Sep 2013 #80

If this was satire you did a really good job snooper2 Sep 2013 #87

Because for all the violence in some titles, video games are actually pretty good. NuclearDem Sep 2013 #76

Free speech. backscatter712 Sep 2013 #79

Because it's artistic expression LittleBlue Sep 2013 #82

"How Evil Should a Video Game Allow You to Be" PoliticAverse Sep 2013 #86

Estes Kevauver flipped a shit about violent comic books which led to the Comics Code Authority Hippo_Tron Sep 2013 #91

"flipped a shit" Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #127

It's slang for "freak out" Hippo_Tron Sep 2013 #147

Gotta love that warmongering piece of human shit like Joey Lies... ProudToBeBlueInRhody Sep 2013 #184

Because so many folks think of themselves as propagandists rather than persons discussing things cthulu2016 Sep 2013 #92

Probably RobinA Sep 2013 #93

You seem to be doing fine... SomethingFishy Sep 2013 #95

Because I hate any form of censorship The Green Manalishi Sep 2013 #102

The OP is about criticism not censorship - do you think the two are the same thing? n/t PoliticAverse Sep 2013 #122

Because moral panics over media *invariably* drag things in that direction. (nt) Posteritatis Sep 2013 #176

+1 woo me with science Sep 2013 #237

Another poster already beat me to my point. The Green Manalishi Sep 2013 #294

Germany and Japan have games that are Politicalboi Sep 2013 #103

I think it's repulsive, personally. dkf Sep 2013 #104

IMO it's more than just games. washnwmn Sep 2013 #113

Because not all of us feel the same way you do about video games. n/t Daniel537 Sep 2013 #117

I love GTA Gore1FL Sep 2013 #124

Because here on DU, we know the difference between *real* and *pretend*. beerandjesus Sep 2013 #128

Are you unhappy that others play the game or because it has some tangible effect on you? lumberjack_jeff Sep 2013 #132

Not the 21st century version of the "backward masking" Puritans form the early 80's? TheKentuckian Sep 2013 #133

Didn't know there was a DU blackout but I am here AllyCat Sep 2013 #137

There is a huge waste of money on a lot of shitty video games. Rex Sep 2013 #139

All that talent that could be plunged into educational AllyCat Sep 2013 #151

I think eventually a lot of the physics in the software engines behind video games fujiyama Sep 2013 #191

There are two issues here grantcart Sep 2013 #140

We didn't and don't allow violent video games in our home. hunter Sep 2013 #145

I have no time for this Broken_Hero Sep 2013 #149

More ridiculous than the decline in pirates causes global warming Major Nikon Sep 2013 #157

Because they're fun to play. PeteSelman Sep 2013 #158

I don't understand, youth violence is down, across the board, in the United States, since about... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #160

Do we also criticize violent or misogynist books, movies, and music? Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #163

No we don't Dpm12 Sep 2013 #165

The problem, is again, criticizing whole genres rather than individual works... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #166

We generally don't, since those are grandfathered in as "different" and therefore okay. Posteritatis Sep 2013 #175

The thing is, people have no problems talking about bad books, movies, songs, etc. Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #180

Mostly just that - they're a new medium, and novelty plus generation gap brings that out Posteritatis Sep 2013 #185

What is it with the anti-game crowd's reluctance to criticise any other forms of media? (nt) Posteritatis Sep 2013 #173

I don't have a problem. 95% of video games are me-too garbage. bluestate10 Sep 2013 #174

Heh, reminds me of movies, and books, Paranormal romance crap for young teens... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #181

I'd say that's rapidly changing, actually Posteritatis Sep 2013 #189

I feel the same way about violent video games Kelvin Mace Sep 2013 #182

Well said. n/t MirrorAshes Sep 2013 #225

Because free speech! kcr Sep 2013 #183

The problem is criticizing a medium due to ignorance based on... Humanist_Activist Sep 2013 #190

I love video games. kcr Sep 2013 #200

Critcize all you want.. opiate69 Sep 2013 #195

Exactly. It goes both ways. kcr Sep 2013 #201

Well... opiate69 Sep 2013 #203

How is the end result the same? kcr Sep 2013 #206

Okay then.. opiate69 Sep 2013 #211

But is that going to happen? kcr Sep 2013 #219

In my opinion.... opiate69 Sep 2013 #221

I think it's important how one goes about it though. kcr Sep 2013 #226

I find it difficult to criticize a game or any media title I am not familiar with fujiyama Sep 2013 #194

Many of the people on this site who rip on the game would love it if they actually knew about it Bjorn Against Sep 2013 #199

I notice a lot of the people who criticize aren't real familiar with what they actually are. Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #204

The fact that most game panics are framed entirely in terms of GTA or FPSes is telling Posteritatis Sep 2013 #241

I've noticed a general tendency of some people to argue against the fictions in their own heads Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #245

Definitely, on both counts Posteritatis Sep 2013 #246

I think the last thing I played was Bioshock Infinite. Warren DeMontague Sep 2013 #282

I haven't played it yet, but nearly everything I've heard echoes what you're saying Posteritatis Sep 2013 #286

Free speech. Don't like them? Don't buy them. Arkana Sep 2013 #205

GTAV has been highly criticized in the gaming world MirrorAshes Sep 2013 #208

Lack of evidence. JaneyVee Sep 2013 #209

Becuase it'd be as dumb as lambasting cinema, literature, or sculpture. eom TransitJohn Sep 2013 #216

Oh Please.. I been playing Violent Video games sense the Sega Genesis first gaming system. Walter-White Sep 2013 #217

You lucked out. I replayed Portal 2 last month and I'm a potato now. (nt) Posteritatis Sep 2013 #239

A game is just a game. Vashta Nerada Sep 2013 #222

Don't criticize the gamers' pot, either. Common Sense Party Sep 2013 #231

parent's perspective steve2470 Sep 2013 #238

I like to play really violent video games justiceischeap Sep 2013 #240

The sexism discussion in the industry the last few years has been something to follow. Posteritatis Sep 2013 #243

I enjoy them vdogg Sep 2013 #251

Dunno. There's so much talk of gun culture Union Scribe Sep 2013 #257

Its only a problem if there is Poor Parenting involved. Walter-White Sep 2013 #258

I don't have any trouble criticizing them. LWolf Sep 2013 #263

Violent video games are violent video games. MNBrewer Sep 2013 #269

Everyone make your own choices, play your own games. defacto7 Sep 2013 #273

Do you mean other than "correlation does not imply causation"? longship Sep 2013 #280

I am not a big fan of the GTA franchise. ZombieHorde Sep 2013 #283

Because most children and adults can usually distinguish between fantasy and reality. baldguy Sep 2013 #288

The idea that people can't generally leads to poorly performing theoretical models Major Nikon Sep 2013 #293

Most don't have problems with violence in videogames Bradical79 Sep 2013 #292