General Discussion

NoOneMan

(4,795 posts)

5. Question Manny....

Sun Nov 10, 2013, 10:49 PM

Nov 2013

I don't mean to thread jack so I just wanted to ask quickly....

What if you turn it around and get things cranking for everyone. All those middle age people get retirement, comfort, security, money to spend to make em happy, etc, etc, and the GDP undoubtedly reflects all those things. Somehow you are able to implement a social democracy that cranks over the economy and spreads wealth from the bottom up to revitalize the nation. I'm positive there will be less economic hardship, which is awesome... But if the GDP is tied to carbon emissions, and climate change is going to damn well do it in for everyone's children and starve off billions, how do you reconcile this dilemma? Do you think we can really spread economic justice to everyone according to the current American standard while simultaneously finding a way to live on this small, blue planet, without some fundamentally shift to our civilization drastically outside of the current paradigm? Just curious if you've thought of that at all in your free time. And another question: if we figure out to solve all our economic and political problems to create an egalitarian society, what happens if Asia/India/Africa does the same following our example? Those would be some crazy boom times indeed

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Why are you so *angry*, Manny? [View all] MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 OP

The budget under sequestration is ~already~ less then Ryan's plans, isn't it? Fumesucker Nov 2013 #1

Yes. But so wonderously bipartisan! MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #2

I'm a bit puzzled by how many smart people can't recognize a "Briar Patch" gambit when they see one Fumesucker Nov 2013 #69

...and NOBODY has to go home to the voters and take responsibility for cutting Meals-on-Wheels, bvar22 Nov 2013 #174

Actually, you also know them by their excuses... R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2013 #186

Who do they think they are fooling? We KNOW who they are! sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #234

"Know your enemy and know yourself... leftstreet Nov 2013 #3

'Don't ask me to be nice to people who only want to complete the destruction a little sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #4

+1. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #115

Question Manny.... NoOneMan Nov 2013 #5

Well, we need to fundamentally shift the paradigm MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #6

Yet technophilia might not be drastic enough NoOneMan Nov 2013 #8

Both are true, IMHO MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #11

Well, for starters, let's put people to work building that green infrastructure. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #133

As long as we're dreaming... Doremus Nov 2013 #168

Nationalize? erronis Nov 2013 #176

I won't quibble about nationalizing, and take your point. Jackpine Radical Nov 2013 #178

+100 Sounds good! Especially the last sentence. Auntie Bush Nov 2013 #173

Great point. JDPriestly Nov 2013 #244

Well this is long...2 hours. zeemike Nov 2013 #21

Thanks. NoOneMan Nov 2013 #30

Attitude altering hopeful film, thanks for posting. canoeist52 Nov 2013 #175

My opinion? defacto7 Nov 2013 #7

I know why you are mad Manny. And we know who the enemy is. The 1% of course goes without saying. rhett o rick Nov 2013 #9

Me too. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #116

I Love You Manny... Did You Catch This ??? WillyT Nov 2013 #10

Thanks for pointing it out - it's great! MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #12

This country was never quite as great as we like to say it used to be frazzled Nov 2013 #13

*Progress* MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #15

Oh, don't pull out the Hitler card ... please. frazzled Nov 2013 #16

Don't think it can happen here? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #20

It could happen anywhere frazzled Nov 2013 #27

But Social Security went from 0% to 50% - huge progress! MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #32

And we're still having progress today frazzled Nov 2013 #43

The median American wage is dropping, dropping. MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #46

Median ... frazzled Nov 2013 #51

I'd like for us to all do equally well MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #53

Interesting ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #111

Important observation. Laelth Nov 2013 #120

I'm still trying to figure that out ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #125

Honest answer. Thanks. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #127

I would add ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #131

A while back I got roasted alive for pointing out that minorities have gotten battered far worse Flatulo Nov 2013 #152

"you seem to want" MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #180

Okay ... you're correct ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #209

Did I break that in to black 99% vs. white 99%? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #212

Okay n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #214

You must be reading somebody else's post since that is not what Manny wrote. R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2013 #189

Okay n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #211

+1 Go Vols Nov 2013 #163

And we women too... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2013 #56

It works that way with class, too. QC Nov 2013 #142

I'm not seeing the big improvement since 1967. NewDeal_Dem Dec 2014 #288

I guess it's how you measure. More unemployed, more losing homes, more rhett o rick Nov 2013 #258

It sounds like we grew up at about the same time. blue neen Nov 2013 #45

Indeed! frazzled Nov 2013 #48

Manny, I know someone who is quite the expert on the NAZIs and Hitler, lived through the period JDPriestly Nov 2013 #29

Hitler and FDR both brought jobs. MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #34

Yes. Because people with college degrees are working in fast food joints, and that JDPriestly Nov 2013 #38

Spot on, Manny. Laelth Nov 2013 #122

Oh, don't pull the 'godwin card' .... please. sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #237

Manny, I assume you're white Cali_Democrat Nov 2013 #274

k&r idwiyo Nov 2013 #14

It's probably all those ProSense Nov 2013 #17

Manny has the education to understand and analyze what he sees around him. JDPriestly Nov 2013 #24

Yeah, we're doomed and they suck. ProSense Nov 2013 #26

That's the way it is now. It doesn't have to stay that way. JDPriestly Nov 2013 #35

What ProSense Nov 2013 #39

Don't adopt the TPP. Change our trade agreements to protect American jobs -- not too much JDPriestly Nov 2013 #47

Best thing to do: Increase the minimum wage ProSense Nov 2013 #50

The minimum wage doesn't apply if you're jobless MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #57

Yeah, ProSense Nov 2013 #62

See my post #1 on this thread n/t Fumesucker Nov 2013 #71

I suppose that if someone's punching us in the face, taping MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #73

Like I said, ProSense Nov 2013 #75

+1 progressoid Nov 2013 #202

A not-yet-in-effect minimum wage increase trumps a not-yet-in-effect "free" trade bill? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #76

Yes, and ProSense Nov 2013 #78

A bill could be written that did both at the same time Fumesucker Nov 2013 #79

Yes. But unless we change our trade policy, the underlying problems will not be solved. JDPriestly Nov 2013 #89

Seriously, this is a joke. ProSense Nov 2013 #165

Yes. Raising the minimum wage will help people short-term, but it will not bring back the lost JDPriestly Nov 2013 #183

"Raising the minimum wage will help people short-term" Phlem Nov 2013 #231

No, THEY'RE doomed and they suck. grahamhgreen Nov 2013 #102

We're only doomed if we don't start changing what we've been doing which sure hasn't worked sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #238

10000++++^^^^^^^^ 2banon Nov 2013 #223

I'm reading this shitty OP and my eyes almost rolled out of my head Number23 Nov 2013 #28

So, how do you think things are going these days? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #42

Who doesn't? Number23 Nov 2013 #49

You don't understand, ProSense Nov 2013 #52

Are things getting better or worse for the average American? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #55

Well, ProSense Nov 2013 #61

Why wake up? The Sun will explode in a few billion years. MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #66

LOL! Yeah, you got nothing. n/t ProSense Nov 2013 #68

Just Ride it out? bvar22 Nov 2013 #160

"Throwing tax dollars at problems " is what wingnuts say and usually towards people of color JI7 Nov 2013 #63

Weird, isn't it? n/t ProSense Nov 2013 #70

coming from someone who said if they could overturn any election JI7 Nov 2013 #72

Yep. And I'll just leave it at "yep" Number23 Nov 2013 #86

You don't understand ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #123

Dear Strong Black Man 2banon Nov 2013 #221

I disagree ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #224

Carlin and Marx 2banon Nov 2013 #227

Yes ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #250

Indeed I agree with you.. 2banon Nov 2013 #263

Hey man, good luck. You're dealing with some special stuff right there Number23 Nov 2013 #236

thanks for bumping a thread you have no time for.. 2banon Nov 2013 #241

+1 uponit7771 Nov 2013 #138

What is the minimum wage where you live? n/t Fumesucker Nov 2013 #67

$16.88. QC Nov 2013 #121

things are still bad heaven05 Nov 2013 #110

Which brings us to Frazzled's point n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #117

Frazzled posts in this thread should be the ones with 329 recs. But you and I know BOTH know Number23 Nov 2013 #276

Yup ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #287

Manny, the comment you just responded to COMPLETELY validates this OP. sabrina 1 Nov 2013 #239

Then why dont you simply trash this thread and/or put Manny on ignore? rhett o rick Nov 2013 #132

So why don't you ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #137

And here comes the White Knight to the rescue. No one with a less than glowing word for Manny Number23 Nov 2013 #181

What I notice is that those of you that seem to attack in harmony dont have rhett o rick Nov 2013 #188

Considering the amount of misspelled hysteria-ladden vitriol you spew all over this web site Number23 Nov 2013 #190

Let's look at the irony. You posted that the OP was shitty. Now why would you do that if rhett o rick Nov 2013 #192

Posting an OPINION of a post does not mean that I am trying to dictate what is posted here Number23 Nov 2013 #194

You just cant help yourself can you? rhett o rick Nov 2013 #196

I see you attack dog anyone that dares to post a different opinion in thread after thread after Number23 Nov 2013 #198

So let's look at who the bully is. rhett o rick Nov 2013 #280

The fact that you chose to overlook my comments is on you, not me Number23 Nov 2013 #281

Go bully someone else. nm rhett o rick Nov 2013 #282

And people that make it their life's mission to disparage centrists and moderates should be the last 2banon Nov 2013 #229

You are aware you lost any ground when you used this phrase: Raine1967 Nov 2013 #208

The OP is expressing the feelings typical of those on the left that are unwilling to accept rhett o rick Nov 2013 #260

Manny has laid out his premise. I think you are missing the deeper message here. Raine1967 Nov 2013 #261

There is a misunderstanding. I am referring to those posts that provide rhett o rick Nov 2013 #268

No. I disagree with this. Raine1967 Nov 2013 #278

Great post and I sincerely appreciate your trying to understand and explain to those who need this Number23 Nov 2013 #275

I wish my point was understood by more than you. Raine1967 Nov 2013 #279

The whingeing of the overprivileged is a sound that can be heard for miles. nt msanthrope Nov 2013 #162

Ain't that the truth. And the whining of the overprivileged left is practically indistinguishable Number23 Nov 2013 #182

How much is the minimum wage where you live? n/t Fumesucker Nov 2013 #216

Didn't someone else already answer your pointless little question? Number23 Nov 2013 #217

Most of those other posters aren't telling Americans to shut the fuck up Fumesucker Nov 2013 #219

LOL Like I said, we don't have a damn thing to say to one another Number23 Nov 2013 #225

Bless your heart Fumesucker Nov 2013 #226

Oh, honey I have been blessed in so many ways. Which is why I have 1/100th the level of bitterness Number23 Nov 2013 #228

Three hundred and twenty recs for an OP you described as "shitty" Fumesucker Nov 2013 #232

LOL! You say that like it means ANYTHING at all. To ANYBODY Number23 Nov 2013 #235

your reactions are curiously over the top 2banon Nov 2013 #240

Are you lonely or something? You keep replying to me... why? Number23 Nov 2013 #242

oh, really? Like You for instance? LOL! 2banon Nov 2013 #243

define "Over Privileged Left" please. 2banon Nov 2013 #230

Going to an Ivy. Which is why I don't whinge. nt msanthrope Nov 2013 #254

Well...the two ends meet at "Damn You Obama!" and msanthrope Nov 2013 #270

If you are suggesting Manny is 'overprivileged . . . markpkessinger Nov 2013 #218

Ha, I had you pegged as an Ivy Leaguer. joshcryer Nov 2013 #18

Because I'm an effete asswipe? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #22

I always pictured you with a pipe. Spitfire of ATJ Nov 2013 #41

Hmm... MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #44

You need more slack Manny... n/t PoliticAverse Nov 2013 #65

And frop. MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #101

Because you're just so wrong all the time. joshcryer Nov 2013 #59

Totally with you, Manny! JDPriestly Nov 2013 #19

I love it, Bro. 99Forever Nov 2013 #23

We need a REVOLUTION IN CONCIOUSNESS. DeSwiss Nov 2013 #25

+1 NoOneMan Nov 2013 #31

+ 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!! - K & R !!! WillyT Nov 2013 #33

How do we get people to wake the #%^* up? MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #36

Like with Pavlov? More conditioned response? DeSwiss Nov 2013 #77

+10000000000 woo me with science Nov 2013 #40

+1 leftstreet Nov 2013 #74

BINGO. Unless you change the way money works, you change nothing. n/t robertpaulsen Nov 2013 #179

Insert some famous quote about "give me the power to issue a nation's currency BelgianMadCow Nov 2013 #191

I've heard that before. robertpaulsen Nov 2013 #200

What money ideas do you like? PETRUS Nov 2013 #205

Technocracy as proposed by M. King Hubbert is an interesting idea. robertpaulsen Nov 2013 #272

Thanks. PETRUS Nov 2013 #285

Yes (X3). Are you familiar with the solutions Bernard Lietaer advocates? BelgianMadCow Nov 2013 #246

I was not familiar with Lietaer. I find his ideas intriguing! robertpaulsen Nov 2013 #271

Glad you liked it. Local currency can connect unmet needs with unused resources BelgianMadCow Nov 2013 #273

''Insert some famous quote....'' DeSwiss Nov 2013 #206

Huge, huge, huge, huge, huge K&R. woo me with science Nov 2013 #37

I'm right there with ya Manny. Phlem Nov 2013 #54

Don't know if you saw this essay, but ... Laelth Nov 2013 #126

Thank you Laelth Phlem Nov 2013 #220

Glad you enjoyed it. Laelth Nov 2013 #249

K&R liberal_at_heart Nov 2013 #58

K&R.... daleanime Nov 2013 #60

Angry... K & R !!! WillyT Nov 2013 #64

I read that Hillary thinks there's not enough "unity" in DC. She is a reason why we're at this bad blkmusclmachine Nov 2013 #80

+1. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #128

Great post MannyG. PumpkinAle Nov 2013 #81

Hey Manny if you want to view something inspiring and maddening at the same time, watch the video Uncle Joe Nov 2013 #82

I'm in GROUP 1, and I've observed the same thing about my college pals. TrollBuster9090 Nov 2013 #83

Excellent analysis. +1. n/t Laelth Nov 2013 #130

I largely agree with your analysis; but ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #136

I agree to a point. I think that powered most of the destruction during the 80s and 90s. TrollBuster9090 Nov 2013 #207

I would agree ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2013 #213

hard for me to believe all those ivy leaguers hfojvt Nov 2013 #84

I think you're on to something there... Blanks Nov 2013 #112

my cars are 20 and 22 years old hfojvt Nov 2013 #139

I used to ride a bike everywhere I went... Blanks Nov 2013 #143

you never negotiate with your betrayer where in the back to be stabbed. NuttyFluffers Nov 2013 #85

100% Agreed! Fearless Nov 2013 #87

I'm with you Manny and in the same boat KauaiK Nov 2013 #88

"Where seldom is heard a discouraging word moondust Nov 2013 #90

Another great post. bearssoapbox Nov 2013 #91

Another "Dems are the same as GOP" thread disguised as a populist rant scheming daemons Nov 2013 #92

+1 treestar Nov 2013 #135

What no counter argument? Just snark? If you support the conservative status quo rhett o rick Nov 2013 #266

-1 L0oniX Nov 2013 #150

-2 Enthusiast Nov 2013 #184

+1 great white snark Nov 2013 #203

Is that all you've got? Snark? If you disagree, provide an argument. nm rhett o rick Nov 2013 #265

awwwww.... try harder fascisthunter Nov 2013 #286

Great post (again) Manny, but perhaps the best comes from your detractors .... Scuba Nov 2013 #93

They have made themselves so obvious in this thread. bvar22 Nov 2013 #166

Completely Agree bvar22 2banon Nov 2013 #233

Agreed. Puglover Nov 2013 #169

Kicked and Recommended. Enthusiast Nov 2013 #94

They "borrowed" the money quaker bill Nov 2013 #95

rec Demo_Chris Nov 2013 #96

Manny, I think this is one of your best posts. Thanks. LuvNewcastle Nov 2013 #97

du rec. xchrom Nov 2013 #98

"The ship's going down, baby" -- TBF Nov 2013 #99

I'm glad that somebody pointed this out... Blanks Nov 2013 #140

If we could adjust both taxes and minimum TBF Nov 2013 #146

. . . Triana Nov 2013 #100

You sound exactly like my hyper-paranoid office-mate. tridim Nov 2013 #103

You're correct, the 99% is losing economic ground, that's definitely change n/t Fumesucker Nov 2013 #113

Absolutely! NealK Nov 2013 #155

Change is happening? bvar22 Nov 2013 #164

Excellent, devastating documentation - thanks dougolat Nov 2013 #245

of course change is happening: Because Obama! KG Nov 2013 #247

Yes you support the "change is happening". The Corporation profits are on rhett o rick Nov 2013 #267

Then spread the word, we fight for Publicly Funded Elections and Complete Campaign Dustlawyer Nov 2013 #104

+ 10000 woo me with science Nov 2013 #105

I do what I can. People from my generation will fare worse in retirement than before SS Dustlawyer Nov 2013 #108

Oh sure. So how do WE choose who will be the candidates? L0oniX Nov 2013 #151

I would find ones that will agree to pass CFR and Publicly Funded Elections. I did not say it Dustlawyer Nov 2013 #159

this is the only way noiretextatique Nov 2013 #172

I get it. Puglover Nov 2013 #106

You're not mad, Manny, you're paying attention. And you're right, change is needed and fast. marble falls Nov 2013 #107

You just described my bumper sticker. navarth Nov 2013 #161

succinctly put! heaven05 Nov 2013 #109

Luck is the primary determinant. Laelth Nov 2013 #114

Lost Causes... adirondacker Nov 2013 #118

Well said, Manny, & I'm with you 100%! K & R mother earth Nov 2013 #119

Reaching up from the swampy economic ground.... Laxman Nov 2013 #124

Righteous rant. The cream of the Wall St crimminal minds have been graduating from those Ivy League raouldukelives Nov 2013 #129

So a sad story of one person means the whole country is going down? treestar Nov 2013 #134

There are a lot of sad stories out there. Wall Street is recovering. The middle class isn't. n/t winter is coming Nov 2013 #259

You've written some great stuff, Manny Ishoutandscream2 Nov 2013 #141

The first thing we have to do is get people to wake the hell up AndyA Nov 2013 #144

THAT'S Why Hillary WON'T do! bluedeathray Nov 2013 #145

Voting will not do either. You can't vote Goldman Sachs out of office. L0oniX Nov 2013 #149

Perhaps, but bluedeathray Nov 2013 #153

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible.... bvar22 Nov 2013 #262

You mad, bro? senseandsensibility Nov 2013 #147

I'm sure that this can all be fixed if the right Dem is voted into office. L0oniX Nov 2013 #148

When DU posters ask "Why you are so angry, Manny?", it is a propaganda device Zorra Nov 2013 #154

Exactly! n/t markpkessinger Nov 2013 #199

K&R NealK Nov 2013 #156

If you want to know why we are losing DonCoquixote Nov 2013 #157

One of the very BEST posts to DU ever. bvar22 Nov 2013 #158

I am angry also. But as you can see from this thread, there are so-called "politically liberal" rhett o rick Nov 2013 #195

The Bubble of Denial! bvar22 Nov 2013 #204

Damn. Right. n/t lumberjack_jeff Nov 2013 #167

K&R... awoke_in_2003 Nov 2013 #170

sounds like my story noiretextatique Nov 2013 #171

We Need Middle Class People to Get It. colsohlibgal Nov 2013 #177

I know who the enemy is, Manny. R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2013 #185

Although it is sad that so many that are well educated are just getting by, truedelphi Nov 2013 #187

agreed DonCoquixote Nov 2013 #193

Wow -- incredibly powerful! markpkessinger Nov 2013 #197

THIS is the reason why: Benton D Struckcheon Nov 2013 #201

K&R pscot Nov 2013 #210

Any American... sendero Nov 2013 #215

amen. nashville_brook Nov 2013 #256

Best Discussion on Class Analysis I've seen on DU yet. 2banon Nov 2013 #222

kr Norrin Radd Nov 2013 #248

I thought you were angry because McCain beat Obama?... SidDithers Nov 2013 #251

Nope, I'm angry because Obama ran on a platform of Hope and Change, MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #252

You must have really been pissed when Obama beat Romney... SidDithers Nov 2013 #253

"Can you believe the Pope doesn't want kids to have to sleep in cars?" ProSense Nov 2013 #255

OK, let's do the numbers. MannyGoldstein Nov 2013 #257

OH, but Manny, its not the President cutting Head Start, Meals-on-Wheels, Food Stamps... bvar22 Nov 2013 #264

And you gotta love how that post was made barely TWO YEARS into the President's tenure Number23 Nov 2013 #277

Good rant Manny. I see you flushed out the conservative-Dems among us. rhett o rick Nov 2013 #269

kick. Stay angry. nt woo me with science Nov 2013 #283

Eugene Robinson: The US is Better Off Than You Think SidDithers Nov 2013 #284