General Discussion

athena

(4,187 posts)

79. What you posted was not in any way empowering.

Tue Jan 21, 2014, 01:30 PM

Jan 2014

Some feminists have tried to reclaim the word and worn it "like a badge of honor." That doesn't mean it's no longer offensive to use the word in its original, misogynistic, form, which is what you did.

Someone who wears the word "like a badge of honor" does not turn around and use it against other women. What you posted was misogynistic, in a very traditional way. It blamed the woman in the picture. It represented her as the bad person, letting the publisher, the photographer, and the maker of the chair completely off the hook.

BTW, as others have pointed out "twit" is not a gendered word. According to the Oxford American Dictionary, it means "a silly or foolish person" and may have been derived from the Old English word "aetwitan", which means "reproach with."

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Yes, this is still a racist, sexist, unequal world. [View all] riqster Jan 2014 OP

That image is disgusting. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #1

I'm only one of that list, and it pissed me off big- time. riqster Jan 2014 #2

Your post was alerted on by the word police Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #6

Some people are politically correct TO THE EXTREME. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #13

No, I'm not ok with racism and misogyny. redqueen Jan 2014 #14

Never claimed you were. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #16

The way the post reads (to me) is that the person would be OK with it, IF they Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #28

She seems to be referring to anyone who objects to her using a misogynist slur. redqueen Jan 2014 #36

agreed. as far as you go with it, redqueen. I take it a step farther and wonder about Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #39

Aha... redqueen Jan 2014 #42

in the kindest way possible, I give the poster the benefit of doubt as to misunderstanding Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #46

Then you read it wrong. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #44

For all you know someone was standing off camera with a gun pointed to the woman's head. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #95

What's your position on the feminist Bitch magazine? Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #32

so, you'll be calling African Americans n****rs soon, according to your line of thinking? bettyellen Jan 2014 #47

Didn't want to answer the question, huh? oldhippie Jan 2014 #59

this reply is a dodge, LOL. bettyellen Jan 2014 #63

What are you going on about? Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #73

your incredibly transparent, disingenuous and insincere lines of questions…. bettyellen Jan 2014 #77

Is that a "yes"? You do find the title of the magazine offensive? Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #92

why don't you use racial slurs if some African Americans do, and that is your benchmark? bettyellen Jan 2014 #111

Okay, you are unable to answer the question, and I have better things to do. Bye now. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #119

can't defend your own line of "reasoning", got it. bettyellen Jan 2014 #140

You know, bettyellen, it was a simple question, not an argument. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #177

You know there's a difference between in-group use of slurs KitSileya Jan 2014 #207

I understand what you're saying, but I'm not sure that's what bettyellen was saying. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #208

I think the point is gollygee Jan 2014 #219

i never said any of that. you took issue to people having a problem with the usage of b*tch here…. bettyellen Jan 2014 #225

I didn't take any issue; I asked a question. And you still haven't answered it... Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #229

Usage of word "in group" is explained well here- but basically -AS A SLUR- it is not good practice, bettyellen Jan 2014 #233

So all women can use the B word then? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #228

I dunno. n/t Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #230

Well, I am sure some authority will tell others what they can use shortly The Straight Story Jan 2014 #231

Usage of word "in group" is explained well here- but basically -AS A SLUR- it is not good practice, bettyellen Jan 2014 #232

So it has uses other than as a slur? And again - what is 'in group' in a liberal group? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #234

the "in group" may use it as a term of affection within that group. so yes- african americans can bettyellen Jan 2014 #235

Still not answering the Q - which women are in 'the group' The Straight Story Jan 2014 #237

it's about USAGE. words are used in different ways…. since you claim this is a new concept to you, bettyellen Jan 2014 #238

And again I have to say that you know there's a difference between an in-group use of a slur. KitSileya Jan 2014 #239

thank you Kit- I don't know where this idea of a group of judges came from, unless it is resentment! bettyellen Jan 2014 #248

it is usage as a slur that is not okay. How many times do you need that explained? bettyellen Jan 2014 #254

What words used as slurs are? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #268

I'm not taking your stupid quiz, LOL. Never said anyone can use slurs- what part of "ingroup usage" bettyellen Jan 2014 #271

It is a conceptual discussion The Straight Story Jan 2014 #272

no, it is definitely and transparently angling for permission to use slurs. bettyellen Jan 2014 #273

"Some folks think the use of n****r by white men, at all, is wrong - but not by African bettyellen Jan 2014 #275

So only people you can see as being black can? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #277

such an impassioned plea for permission to use vile racial slurs without being judged for it…. bettyellen Jan 2014 #281

"permission" is that yours to give other humans now? The Straight Story Jan 2014 #283

So sad to see you preaching the same hate filled notions about "uppity" people causing racial strife bettyellen Jan 2014 #290

oh look, here is someone who agrees with you bettyellen Jan 2014 #278

So, in other words, the best you have is trying to insult. As usual The Straight Story Jan 2014 #279

i just posted you a video of someone making identical arguments to your own…. bettyellen Jan 2014 #280

People will fear using the word "n*****r" - and you don't think that is a GOOD thing? Noted. bettyellen Jan 2014 #293

I imagine there are many people who believe that feminism is simply one block of demographic... LanternWaste Jan 2014 #68

And I imagine some people are pretty full of themselves. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #76

this, thank you…. bettyellen Jan 2014 #85

Well that is just a stupid question. morningfog Jan 2014 #243

It is OT shit stirring of the lowest order. Looking for loopholes so white men can get their bettyellen Jan 2014 #249

Reclaiming a slur: cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #250

Here is another way to explain it: riqster Jan 2014 #252

I love it! cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #253

Made audiences squirm, that it did. riqster Jan 2014 #255

Conversations like that are so necessary cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #259

Two good starts: riqster Jan 2014 #264

You're the best. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #265

Enjoy. riqster Jan 2014 #266

Intent. Some people claim they cannot ever discern intent, LOL. They blather on and on and on….. bettyellen Jan 2014 #291

oh the RW "PC" meme + "you know you love it, b*tches" all in one post. Lovely. bettyellen Jan 2014 #26

and that three DUers do not recognize it therefore, condone it. Much education is needed. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #30

It's DU war over the word Sissyk Jan 2014 #158

I wonder how many wars it took over the word 'retarded' before people stopped thinking it was ok. redqueen Jan 2014 #176

I don't know. It's never been accepted since I've been here. Sissyk Jan 2014 #178

It used to be considered acceptable. Just like it was in general society. redqueen Jan 2014 #182

Well, I just did a search for the word retarded Sissyk Jan 2014 #185

Well that's sad that juries are leaving it, but sadder still, it is not surprising. redqueen Jan 2014 #188

Thank you, also. Sissyk Jan 2014 #191

Same here. She is posing on it as if she's fine with it. redqueen Jan 2014 #193

Well.... Bobbie Jo Jan 2014 #184

Thanks! Sissyk Jan 2014 #186

On reflection, I agree, the word should be removed. riqster Jan 2014 #18

I find BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #53

I think you are confused: riqster Jan 2014 #60

Nope. Not confused. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #64

It is not used primarily against women. riqster Jan 2014 #69

Neither is the B word. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #98

And your response to "twit"? riqster Jan 2014 #109

That is among the most disingenuous shit I've read. morningfog Jan 2014 #244

On reflection, I think some folk just love to bitch Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #67

This is news to you? BainsBane Jan 2014 #129

Would you please delete the misogynist slur from your post? nt redqueen Jan 2014 #8

It's already been alerted on and FAILED to be removed. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #15

It *is* a misogynist slur. redqueen Jan 2014 #17

No, it's NOT. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #19

Enjoy living in denial. redqueen Jan 2014 #22

How is the word "bitch" a misogynistic slur in this instance? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #33

Re-write the dictionary? oldhippie Jan 2014 #38

No need to rewrite it. It is already there. That you choose to willfully misunderstand it is indeed Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #41

Yes Ma'am! oldhippie Jan 2014 #45

much better ... Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #48

Bitchin' response, dude! Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #43

I see what you did there! ..... oldhippie Jan 2014 #49

Yes, over time words can evolve, sometimes to end up meaning the exact opposite. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #70

Great links. Thanks TA Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #123

did you get lost on the way to an unmoderated board or something? bettyellen Jan 2014 #62

I still chuckle when I remember the time in Meta when Skinner suggested that female DUers Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #99

Ewwww, why would Skinner suggest we PM people who offend us, instead of discussing it openly? bettyellen Jan 2014 #105

Honestly, bettyellen, if you ask me, I find the whole notion of DU3 ... bizarre. As usual Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #108

Buddy? oldhippie Jan 2014 #104

too bad for you, words have actual meanings. so take it how you want to, and it still means bettyellen Jan 2014 #132

Look cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #75

Indeed, it's not acceptable for people to compare women to animals, for not agreeing with them Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #93

I can't speak for anyone but myself, of course. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #107

not a question. A statement that certain things ought to be recognized as unacceptable on DU. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #110

It would be very nice if gendered and racist language cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #118

Yes, I agree. I think there are a couple of overdue apologies, there. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #127

. one_voice Jan 2014 #112

I love it when people keep up with me. thank you ... #1 Fan. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #126

I'm sure you must be very proud. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #128

just for YOU because you are so very speical to me. I will address one LAST time the post you linked Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #133

You know, a simple "I'm sorry, I was wrong" would probably cut it. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #136

Where did you mention anything about her 'daughter?' polly7 Jan 2014 #137

The only thing I can think of is this post. RiffRandell Jan 2014 #210

That was a sweet thread (except for the usual knee-jerk, holier-than-thou crap). polly7 Jan 2014 #211

Thank you; she's a gem. RiffRandell Jan 2014 #213

She sounds like a thoughtful, intelligent and caring little girl ... polly7 Jan 2014 #216

What does my daughter have to do with this? RiffRandell Jan 2014 #146

So 'like a bitch' would be okay? Violet_Crumble Jan 2014 #240

Excellent post. RiffRandell Jan 2014 #241

Thanks. And thanks for the tip about Sirius... Violet_Crumble Jan 2014 #242

Sorry, but I totally disagree. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #135

I just figured I'd tell you cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #143

OK, I take your point about calling a woman a bitch with no qualifier Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #183

You can't be serious. You don't see the sexism in 'SOB'? redqueen Jan 2014 #187

Wrong! Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #192

That was insightful ..... oldhippie Jan 2014 #202

But what cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #256

I never said it was .... oldhippie Jan 2014 #257

so you think SOB is praise? cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #258

Nope. The issue wasn't ...... oldhippie Jan 2014 #260

In that case cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #261

No oldhippie Jan 2014 #262

When I ask, I mean in the hypotethical sense cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #263

Thanks for seeing my point! cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #247

Thanks for your thoughtful and insightful post. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #267

Good to see that you're open to discussion! cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #269

Thanks again. I think we're on the same page. Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #270

That's great to hear! cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #274

+1 get the red out Jan 2014 #81

check the dictionary BainsBane Jan 2014 #141

Being female does not make one automatically a feminist. athena Jan 2014 #27

it sure as hell doesn't. not sure why a jury leaves a slur like that up... bettyellen Jan 2014 #31

Never said I was a feminist. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #40

That is because twit has no gender connotation Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #52

I think the poster might want to buy a vowel. JTFrog Jan 2014 #80

GMTA .... oh lordie .... LMAO over here ... because that was my first thought as well. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #83

twit is genderless, meaning not rooted in anything gendered. b*tch is a slur used against women. bettyellen Jan 2014 #54

Sure, it is. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #87

then prove it- find any ONE scholar or ONE blog claiming twit is a sexist term. One. bettyellen Jan 2014 #100

New Yorker, July 2012: "Mitt the Twit" WorseBeforeBetter Jan 2014 #223

Gonna have to disagree with you here... one_voice Jan 2014 #121

You think using 'b*tch' as an insult is fine, but 'twit' is a misogynist slur? redqueen Jan 2014 #55

yeah, I'm thinking this is bullshit too. bettyellen Jan 2014 #72

What you posted was not in any way empowering. athena Jan 2014 #79

+1,000,000,000 redqueen Jan 2014 #91

^^^ AWESOME POST ^^^ Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #106

FWIW, I've always considered myself a feminist Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #165

She's using a bigoted slur and getting called on it. That is not being "bullied". redqueen Jan 2014 #179

Yes I do. Are men not allowed to consider themselves feminists? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #189

I don't consider bigoted slurs to be "petty bullshit". nt redqueen Jan 2014 #190

Neither do I. Are you accusing someone here of that? Starboard Tack Jan 2014 #194

post #1 absolutely used it as a slur. it absolute is sexist. bettyellen Jan 2014 #236

it's "a big turn off" to hear sexist slurs are not okay? Cry me a river, LOL. bettyellen Jan 2014 #226

using sexist slurs on a progressive website is also disgusting, btw. bettyellen Jan 2014 #12

Good thing I didn't, huh? BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #20

the * doesn't get you off the hook for slurring women with that word. your intent is clear. bettyellen Jan 2014 #23

Well, you're entitled to your opinion. BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #34

tossing out slurs is problematic on a progressive board, so "expressing opinions" using slurs bettyellen Jan 2014 #37

If that's true, BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #50

Twits is a genderless insult, so….no, it is not inherently misogynistic. HTH! bettyellen Jan 2014 #56

And yet it's used exclusively against women BlueCaliDem Jan 2014 #61

i have seen just as many men called twits, maybe more so. pls find cites where it is considered a bettyellen Jan 2014 #65

Look up "twit" in a dictionary. riqster Jan 2014 #66

That just ain't true. Throd Jan 2014 #89

it's complete nonsense. bettyellen Jan 2014 #114

I think you're mixing "twit" up with a different word gollygee Jan 2014 #115

You'll appreciate the irony of the use of the filthiest word I've ever heard to describe a woman msanthrope Jan 2014 #198

Bullshit, you did and you know it. morningfog Jan 2014 #245

Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #35

This message was self-deleted by its author Hutzpa Jan 2014 #58

Please delete the misogynist slurs from your post. nt redqueen Jan 2014 #82

This is exactly what the jury had to say: In_The_Wind Jan 2014 #120

Three ignorant jurors there. morningfog Jan 2014 #246

That is fucking appalling. MadrasT Jan 2014 #3

That image is only partially the truth Shankapotomus Jan 2014 #4

Did you know that this picture had already been posted here in GD? cali Jan 2014 #5

I hadn't seen it. And it's beyond disgusting. But I'm not sure that the OP should delete it. Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #7

I don't disagree but there's a long thread with this photo and I don't see the need cali Jan 2014 #9

Perhaps the OP should insert an "offensively racist photo" warning in the subject line Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #10

Due to ignore lists some people won't see the other post (or this one) The Straight Story Jan 2014 #51

Porn is encroaching into other forms of media. Racism has been deemed acceptable in porn. redqueen Jan 2014 #11

I suspect athena Jan 2014 #24

I suspect that you're 100% correct. redqueen Jan 2014 #29

Your wish has been granted! athena Jan 2014 #101

This chair has nothing to do with porn. Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #57

If you don't think this chair is related to porn, MadrasT Jan 2014 #97

Isn't that the goal? ForgoTheConsequence Jan 2014 #276

"oppresses anyone who is not rich, white, and male" hfojvt Jan 2014 #21

I suppose the sexism is too subtle for some people to notice. athena Jan 2014 #25

Yes, it's disgusting, but maybe that's the point of it as art? mainer Jan 2014 #71

Well, their reaction speaks volumes. riqster Jan 2014 #74

The chair is made by a Norwegian artist. Here's their followup comment mainer Jan 2014 #78

A lot of art is specifically disturbing to make a point. Throd Jan 2014 #84

I'm thinking specifically of "Piss Christ" mainer Jan 2014 #86

So they should have done it differently and better. riqster Jan 2014 #88

link to the quote mainer Jan 2014 #94

Thanks! riqster Jan 2014 #102

I'd be pretty upset, too, to see that it had been used in a way that portrayed the photo polly7 Jan 2014 #103

It's a recreation of original work by Allen Jones. The original subjects were white women and it seaglass Jan 2014 #90

Ah, thank you. WorseBeforeBetter Jan 2014 #113

Yeah thank goodness for google and wiki - I wonder what just dropped out of my brain because I seaglass Jan 2014 #116

LOL Well, it did help me with overall context. WorseBeforeBetter Jan 2014 #125

As a work of "art," it did its job, didn't it? mainer Jan 2014 #96

the artist not only employed racism. The sexism is very evident, too. -- Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2014 #122

I don't think that it should get a free pass just because it's "art." athena Jan 2014 #138

Intent is everything. mainer Jan 2014 #142

No, the consequence is everything. athena Jan 2014 #144

I am a nonwhite female. mainer Jan 2014 #147

There we go again. athena Jan 2014 #152

You accused me of lining up with male artists against women mainer Jan 2014 #155

Not cool to post lies. athena Jan 2014 #162

Well, I can't show you a photo of myself mainer Jan 2014 #166

If you are a non-white female athena Jan 2014 #168

Alas, poor civility, I knew you well. mainer Jan 2014 #171

Have it your way. athena Jan 2014 #172

Not cool to call other posters liars without a shred of evidence. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #174

Yep ..... oldhippie Jan 2014 #180

DU also has a lot of women who proudly claim themselves feminists and can't polly7 Jan 2014 #156

What makes you think I was referring to you? athena Jan 2014 #161

I didn't say who you were referring to, just as you didn't. polly7 Jan 2014 #163

Just look further up the thread. athena Jan 2014 #164

This proves the poster is female and 'proudly misogynistic'? polly7 Jan 2014 #169

So it's totally non-misogynistic to use misogynistic slurs against women? athena Jan 2014 #170

Did I say anyone was out of line for objecting? polly7 Jan 2014 #173

And there we go again. Sorry, Mainer. Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #159

Yeah, and they're even telling me I'm white! mainer Jan 2014 #167

A work of art should speak for itself, though. cinnabonbon Jan 2014 #251

The responses to the OP are fascinating mainer Jan 2014 #117

Agreed. WorseBeforeBetter Jan 2014 #124

+1000 CFLDem Jan 2014 #131

Could you expand on this please? redqueen Jan 2014 #134

Maybe I'm misinterpreting, but there's a tussle up above mainer Jan 2014 #139

A different interpretation isn't necessarily a misinterpretation. :) redqueen Jan 2014 #149

What I'm struck by is which button gets pushed mainer Jan 2014 #151

I'm not sure that's the case, though. redqueen Jan 2014 #157

The opposite perspective is just as valid. athena Jan 2014 #160

"But me, I expected it to happen. I knew he'd lost control... Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #218

Thought exercise: if the artist were a black female... mainer Jan 2014 #130

When an artist creates a controversial work, they are responsible for its reception. riqster Jan 2014 #145

The artist has no control over how you see with YOUR eyes. mainer Jan 2014 #148

And when the artist fails to explain, then they must accept what verbal responses they receive. riqster Jan 2014 #150

Well, yeah. That's what critics dish out. mainer Jan 2014 #153

Oh yeah. I've got a few such scars myself. riqster Jan 2014 #154

The artist was not the one saying it was misunderstood and taken out of context. The artist has not seaglass Jan 2014 #175

Which artist? riqster Jan 2014 #181

The copycat artist who created the chair. n/t seaglass Jan 2014 #195

Ah. The artist I referenced was the model/ editor riqster Jan 2014 #196

Looks like no one wants to take responsibility for this one. Next thing you know she'll seaglass Jan 2014 #197

"Success has a million parents, but failure is an orphan." riqster Jan 2014 #199

No one's actually answered this question yet. No takers? mainer Jan 2014 #200

I will give you my opinion... one_voice Jan 2014 #201

If the races were reversed -- black woman on top of white woman mainer Jan 2014 #203

Interesting point... one_voice Jan 2014 #204

Any way you look at it, one human being atop another... mainer Jan 2014 #205

Yes I think you're right... one_voice Jan 2014 #212

Useless speculation masquerading as thoughtful commentary. athena Jan 2014 #206

Yes, far more noble to be angry and shut off any discussion mainer Jan 2014 #209

Have you ever heard of punctuation rules? athena Jan 2014 #214

Repeatedly ignored which comments? mainer Jan 2014 #215

I don't recall you disagreeing with anything I posted. athena Jan 2014 #221

Your posts go on and on. I pointed to the quotation marks mainer Jan 2014 #227

Pretty damn fucked up. AverageJoe90 Jan 2014 #217

For what it's worth ... polly7 Jan 2014 #220

Well, alright then, I guess I was wrong. AverageJoe90 Jan 2014 #222

She was educated in America, so ignorance is not an option. riqster Jan 2014 #224

This message was self-deleted by its author mainer Jan 2014 #282

The chair was not the work in question. riqster Jan 2014 #284

The art critic was writing about the hullabaloo involving Zhukova mainer Jan 2014 #285

Pertinent, yes. riqster Jan 2014 #286

So I shouldn't have posted it, then? mainer Jan 2014 #287

I said no such thing. riqster Jan 2014 #288

I merely posted an art critic's piece from The Guardian newspaper. mainer Jan 2014 #289

Projection only works if there is a suitable reflective surface for the projector. riqster Jan 2014 #292