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El_Johns

(1,805 posts)

41. It may be used in a racist way today (though I don't think so). But that has nothing to do

Reply to Dark n Stormy Knight (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 23, 2014, 03:47 AM

Jan 2014

with it (allegedly) being used in a racist way during the Indian colonial period, as there were long stretches when "thug" was used near-exclusively to refer to white gangsters/toughs.

It's the "gangster" link that's important, IMO.

Raymond Chandler (July 23, 1888 – March 26, 1959)

Collected Stories - Page 546
books.google.com/books?isbn=0375415009
Raymond Chandler - 2002 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
Raymond Chandler. It was getting dark early. I left the sedan a couple of blocks from my own ... I told him I thought they were the thugs that machine-gunned Larry Batzel. I didn't tell him anything about Dud O'Mara. “Nice work," Grinnell said in ...

Trouble Is My Business: A Novel
books.google.com/books?isbn=1400030234
Raymond Chandler - 2002 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
A Novel Raymond Chandler. “Let's get a couple of more important things straightened out,” I said. ... “A thug named Andrews and a Mexican calling himself Luis Cadena. I daresay you've heard of them.” “I don't know such people,” Dorr said ...

The Long Goodbye: A Novel
books.google.com/books?isbn=140003020X
Raymond Chandler - 2002 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
A Novel Raymond Chandler. be the only guy around not holding a chisel. Likely enough then I'll flunk out. ... Inside he's as ruthless as a Gestapo thug. Sylvia is a tramp. He knows it and he hatesitand there's nothing hecando about it. But he ...

Farewell, My Lovely:
books.google.com/books?isbn=6155421331
Raymond Chandler - 2013 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
Raymond Chandler. He leaned back and stared at me. "I don't make you out. You risk your hide to come out here and hand me a card to pass on to some thug I don't even know. There's no sense to it." "There isn't ifyou don't know him.

The Big Sleep & Farewell, My Lovely
books.google.com/books?isbn=0307807967
Raymond Chandler - 2011 - ‎Preview
Raymond Chandler. were on our way back to her home from there. A car brushed the ... “Eight thousand dollars. It's dirt cheap. But if my friend couldn't get another like it, these thugs couldn't very easily dispose of it either. It's probably known to ...

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The Racist Origins of the term �Thug�. [View all] Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 OP

Tupac wasn't exactly fleeing from the term XemaSab Jan 2014 #1

About that... Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #5

And what about the machine gun? XemaSab Jan 2014 #9

Oh, now I see what you're trying to do. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #14

"50 Niggaz" Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #19

Here's my problem with Tupac: XemaSab Jan 2014 #40

All of this has traveled so far over your head. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #58

You don't know anything about me XemaSab Jan 2014 #61

It's called reappropriation. Maybe you should do a little light reading on it. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #83

Once again with the ad hominem Shivering Jemmy Jan 2014 #65

Here's where thugging leads: XemaSab Jan 2014 #81

You forgot to include the link to the article. scarletwoman Jan 2014 #2

Dammit. I hate when I do that! Link added. Thanks for the heads up. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #3

You're welcome. Happens to all of us. scarletwoman Jan 2014 #4

I think this isn't quite correct. It wasn't particularly "British colonialists" the thuggee El_Johns Jan 2014 #6

So then, it's not quite complete. But clearly the writer was just focusing on how the word came Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #7

I think the author's linking the British use of the word under colonialism to current use is kind El_Johns Jan 2014 #39

They never try to back up their claim that the British used it as a racial term muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #80

Oh brother. Skip Intro Jan 2014 #8

I don't know, maybe as far detached from specificity as your response. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #11

maybe what matters is currently useage Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #31

It *is* about usage. But it's not about what *you* hear. It's nice for you that you don't Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #34

and some choose to hear Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #48

No, the claim doesn't make it so. Nevertheless, it is so. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #53

there is racism... Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #57

Fairly simple concept. Inkfreak Jan 2014 #68

the constantly offended Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #69

This makes about as much sense as saying that "pundit" is racist DavidDvorkin Jan 2014 #10

That would be a reasonable objection if the author claimed the word "thug" was racist simply Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #12

I grew up hearing "thug" used to refer to dangerous white men DavidDvorkin Jan 2014 #13

What is it that you just don't see? And, surely you don't believe that that of which you are unaware Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #15

It does refer to dangerous men (and women), of any race. Skip Intro Jan 2014 #16

Why would you think the incident needs deflecting from? morningfog Jan 2014 #18

You'd have to ask the one deflecting the attetion. n/t Skip Intro Jan 2014 #20

I am. morningfog Jan 2014 #21

Or so you think. n/t Skip Intro Jan 2014 #23

It seems your knowledge of modern cultural history is rather limited sammythecat Jan 2014 #72

The word thug *can* be used to describe any dangerous man or women. In fact, any word, *can* be Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #28

I use it to describe Zimpig JustAnotherGen Jan 2014 #64

I've always kind of suspected that algebra is racist. Orrex Jan 2014 #71

the word boondocks comes from the Filipino tagalog word bundoks which means mountains Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #17

Yeah, kind of in the same way that the etymology of "whore" refers to girl? Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #24

I have no idea what you are talking about. Douglas Carpenter Jan 2014 #25

Of course any word *can* be used in *any* way. But the current discussion is about the fact that Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #38

It may be used in a racist way today (though I don't think so). But that has nothing to do El_Johns Jan 2014 #41

Are you using Raymond Chandler's 1950's books to support your claim about usage in the Indian Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #44

Yes, because it demonstrates that there is no such straight line between British usage during El_Johns Jan 2014 #46

Defending the article like it's gold? Where do you get that? In fact, please note that this is my Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #47

This message was self-deleted by its author El_Johns Jan 2014 #50

It's tricky, that one. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2014 #78

Richard Sherman sure seems to think it's racist. He made the comment that no one liberal_at_heart Jan 2014 #22

Wellllll, what does he know? I mean, some dudes here on DU never heard that shit, so Sherman's Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #33

"NHL Video: 50 Biggest Thugs in Hockey History | Bleacher Report" Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #84

Surly George Zimmerman is the quintessential thug? (nt) Nye Bevan Jan 2014 #26

Yet I'd wager that Trayvon Martin was called a thug about a thousand times as often as Zimmy was. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #29

I actually get more hits for Zimmerman. El_Johns Jan 2014 #42

If you examine the results for Zimmerman thug, a large number of them are people responding to those Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #43

I'm not going to argue about something so meaningless. The fact is that thug has been widely El_Johns Jan 2014 #45

Oh. I see. Your argument doesn't hold water, so suddenly the discussion is meaningless. Riiiiihgt. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #49

It wasn't an "argument". The number of hits a phrase gets on the internet is essentially meaning- El_Johns Jan 2014 #52

No shit, Sherlock! That's what I was telling you. YOU're the one who posted your pointless search Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #55

That reminds me... killbotfactory Jan 2014 #27

Ha! That was awesome! I can't wait to check out some of his other ones. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #30

and just why is the media concentrating on Sherman and Derrick Coleman is getting no liberal_at_heart Jan 2014 #32

Most news outlets cater to the lowest instincts of the human race. Sadly, that's what sells. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #35

See also "barbarian", "philistine" n/t Silent3 Jan 2014 #36

I've already seen them. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #37

K&R This & the frequent use of the term by authoritarians to describe union members is why I am a Thug. Egalitarian Thug Jan 2014 #51

The thuggees were a specific Indian cult that went in for murdering people, not just any Indians. Donald Ian Rankin Jan 2014 #54

What's your point? Does the article say thuggees went in for murdering just any Indians? Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #56

Yes, but people also call white men, and sometimes women, thugs. Donald Ian Rankin Jan 2014 #59

Sure, any word CAN be used in a racist way. We're talking about this particular word that IS Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #60

Yes dipsydoodle Jan 2014 #62

Does this mean "union thugs" refers only to non-white members of a union? n/t Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2014 #63

Although I had never looked up the word left is right Jan 2014 #66

thug is a good word, and I'll keep using it when I think it fits quinnox Jan 2014 #67

When I was young in the 80s, I recognized the word "thug" as being about gollygee Jan 2014 #70

That's pretty close to my experience with the term Orrex Jan 2014 #73

I agree. nt laundry_queen Jan 2014 #75

Yeah, I remember how often the "thug" word was used to Blue_Tires Jan 2014 #74

Well, it appears to be shifting to a race-based term, but MineralMan Jan 2014 #76

Joh Kerry used the word ''thug" to describe Assad, A 'Thug And Murderer' Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #77

There's no whining in football. Sherman is the badass bully on the block. Just ask him. Baclava Jan 2014 #79

So I guess "rethuglican" won't be seen at DU again huh? n/t cherokeeprogressive Jan 2014 #82