General Discussion

Armstead

(47,803 posts)

87. Here's a bit more for the dog to chew on

Thu May 29, 2014, 10:29 AM

May 2014

If you want me to feed the canine a bit more, the message would be that one can think whatever of Snowden and Greenwald, and one can certainly think that people who support what they did are wrongheaded to one degree or another.

However it is totally wrong to compare a guy who basally has forced himself into exile to reveal what he thinks is a gross overreach by the National Security State and a bunch of right wing nut-jobs who made up a bunch of lies and smears about a democratic Presidential candidate, egged on by Karl Rove's tactic of taking an opposing candidate's strength (Kerry's war record) and twisting it against them.

The revelations may be peripherally embarrassing to President Obama, but the overall issue is much bigger than he or any individual president, and goes to the heart of our system and the collective sacrifice of our privacy and freedom that has kicked into high gear since 9-11.

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Whether some DUers like him or not [View all] malaise May 2014 OP

Quite right, that is it, in a nutshell. I am grateful to Mr. Snowden. n/t Jefferson23 May 2014 #1

du rec. xchrom May 2014 #2

Snowden could be a serial murderer anti partisan May 2014 #3

agree G_j May 2014 #4

Completely ProSense May 2014 #5

Kind of like when Bush/Chaney declared that waterboarding... socialist_n_TN May 2014 #7

You're comparing his lawyers to "Bush/Chaney" (sic)? n/t ProSense May 2014 #8

This message was self-deleted by its author Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #14

Simple isn't it malaise May 2014 #9

And segregation and Jim Crow...... socialist_n_TN May 2014 #13

Post removed Post removed May 2014 #10

Yes, "time and a half" the ProSense May 2014 #17

here you go pro. i almost never come into your threads. but, here is the jury. and seabeyond May 2014 #78

Brava sea! nt sheshe2 May 2014 #148

Wow, that is unusual. Major Hogwash May 2014 #154

Writers often get paid by the word, 5 to 10 cents is common. If I were to be paid to write A Simple Game May 2014 #47

If the government privatizes the NSA or any other agency to contractors and malaise May 2014 #18

Take that up with his lawyers. n/t ProSense May 2014 #20

It is simply not true that NSA's activities are clearly legal. spooky3 May 2014 #42

His lawyers are lying? n/t ProSense May 2014 #43

Did you read my post? spooky3 May 2014 #52

So what? Jack Rabbit May 2014 #64

Did you just compare spying to what African Americans endured prior to the Civil Rights Act? stevenleser May 2014 #92

No Jack Rabbit May 2014 #109

+1 daleanime May 2014 #116

Good work... JackRiddler May 2014 #127

Just curious, do you wish that what was revealed remained a secret? gtar100 May 2014 #65

You mean the program that Thomas Drake revelaed to us in 2005? Dr Hobbitstein May 2014 #156

You make this out to be too much about the person. Just a distraction from the real wrong that is gtar100 May 2014 #166

Drake didn't leak state secrets Dr Hobbitstein May 2014 #170

Maybe so (on all your assertions) , but Drake didn't have the impact Snowden has. gtar100 May 2014 #171

Thanks, malaise, I feel exactly the same. LuvNewcastle May 2014 #6

K&R. 'Our-side' is no longer actually 'our-side'. Enthusiast May 2014 #11

Sometimes I do wonder malaise May 2014 #16

Ain't that the truth. zeemike May 2014 #19

"Illegal" doesn't have the same meaning for me that it used to. Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #12

yep Leme May 2014 #23

perhaps this is an example of the yawning black hole between legal and ethical azurnoir May 2014 #25

I think one of the major problems is that our concept Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #28

The abuse of our legal system is utterly the fault of.... MicaelS May 2014 #121

So we should legislate morality? treestar May 2014 #68

We should legislate the effects of it. Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #82

+1 hopemountain May 2014 #145

k/r marmar May 2014 #15

K&R. Well said. Overseas May 2014 #21

Which "seriously illegal practices" did he blow the whistle on? ucrdem May 2014 #22

And it was the NSA that 'blew the whistle' on their own illegal activities! randome May 2014 #36

Ah yes, the compliance reports. ucrdem May 2014 #40

Lying to the Supreme Court muriel_volestrangler May 2014 #57

What does this have to do with Snowden? ucrdem May 2014 #59

You could try reading the article muriel_volestrangler May 2014 #71

Link goes to a different article. nt ucrdem May 2014 #72

p.s. what Senator Rand Paul (R, KY) tells CNN's Wolf Blitzer can be safely ignored. nt ucrdem May 2014 #77

Final paragraph of Guardian article does not mention Snowden: ucrdem May 2014 #73

The final paragraph I quoted mentions Snowden muriel_volestrangler May 2014 #80

A 19-word paragraph in the Guardian is not evidence. ucrdem May 2014 #85

You just can't be bothered to read the article, can you? muriel_volestrangler May 2014 #89

It's a nice editorial, thanks for posting nt ucrdem May 2014 #90

sometimes some people want evidence that satisfies them Leme May 2014 #94

It would have to satisfy the Supreme Court in this case. ucrdem May 2014 #97

The Supreme Court? progressoid May 2014 #108

By this case I mean this subthread, starting with reply 57: ucrdem May 2014 #111

Okay I'll answer: nothing and none. nt ucrdem May 2014 #74

Proving yet again that reporters are really lousy with logic. ieoeja May 2014 #117

No, that's saying "people who mention information" are not "contacts overseas" muriel_volestrangler May 2014 #120

Moscow Eddie needs to come home and defend himself Progressive dog May 2014 #24

That name calling..."Moscow Eddie" ....does that belong here? KoKo May 2014 #51

You are too kind. mattclearing May 2014 #75

pretty tame in comparison to "Piece of shite used car salesman" Sheepshank May 2014 #130

That's the rationalization of someone in jr. high. rhett o rick May 2014 #139

why go the route of personally insulting and judging...is that how "mature" people do things? Sheepshank May 2014 #157

The "he did it so I can do it" rational is childish. That's not an insult. rhett o rick May 2014 #160

oh gawd,....you have a handbook on how liberals are supposed to act? Sheepshank May 2014 #161

I dont like it when conservatives pretend to be liberal and espouse their rhett o rick May 2014 #162

then perhpas you should be more liberal yourself and less judgmental Sheepshank May 2014 #163

I agree that I need to work on it. I should just ignore the conservatives pretending to be rhett o rick May 2014 #164

No different than calling the President, "Barry." mattclearing May 2014 #146

ahhh the, "I can fling poo, but you can't because you're better" standard Sheepshank May 2014 #159

You appear to be talking to yourself. mattclearing May 2014 #165

Well to be fair he was China Eddie first and he was almost Ecuador Eddie but the US forced him... L0oniX May 2014 #79

I have seen our President called a POS and worse here so Progressive dog May 2014 #100

What a childish rational. "Someone called the Pres a POS, so that excuses my similar behavior." rhett o rick May 2014 #140

Yes, your rationale is childish Progressive dog May 2014 #167

"Evidence collected illegally cannot be used in a court." And our security state rhett o rick May 2014 #168

I keep seeing these claims and the Progressive dog May 2014 #169

This message was self-deleted by its author cui bono May 2014 #149

That's rich, given the lies being constantly shit on President Obama here ConservativeDemocrat May 2014 #104

I believe you meant roomtomove May 2014 #53

Then maybe everyone shoukld flee to a country Progressive dog May 2014 #98

We'd be so much better off without whistle blowers. L0oniX May 2014 #76

If you say so, but I'd still Progressive dog May 2014 #93

K&R azurnoir May 2014 #26

He also expose legitimate operations. Adrahil May 2014 #27

Your first sentence is incorrect. MohRokTah May 2014 #29

when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal Capt. Obvious May 2014 #30

Go and ask other leaders of the world if they thought American spying on them was malaise May 2014 #31

It is truly naive to think that any nation is not spying on any other nation. MohRokTah May 2014 #49

So you are now going to take on international law? treestar May 2014 #63

If it's not legal now, wait and it will be roomtomove May 2014 #61

Everything Snowden revealed was legal under the USA PATRIOT Act MohRokTah May 2014 #69

Well, if it was in the Patriot Act, then that's fine. progressoid May 2014 #110

Well said, Malaise. (nt) Paladin May 2014 #32

I feel the same way. Great post Autumn May 2014 #33

I'm not sure how I feel about Edward Snowden gollygee May 2014 #34

Precisely malaise May 2014 #35

We've been discussing it since October 25, 2001, ucrdem May 2014 #37

Allow me to roll my eyes here gollygee May 2014 #41

We weren't aware of the Verizon warrant but we knew warrants were required. ucrdem May 2014 #50

An odious and totally boneheaded comparison Armstead May 2014 #66

Nice title but looks like the dog ate your message. ucrdem May 2014 #70

Here's a bit more for the dog to chew on Armstead May 2014 #87

If you're asking do I think he's a GOP operative, the answer is, probably. ucrdem May 2014 #99

Well. I'll just respectfully disagree Armstead May 2014 #113

It isn't about civil liberties. That's just bait. ucrdem May 2014 #119

I'll agree with you about Benghazi...The rest not so much. Armstead May 2014 #135

Some people have the courage to follow their convictions. raouldukelives May 2014 #38

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ rtracey May 2014 #39

at 8:23 am you were falling asleep in another Snowden thread carolinayellowdog May 2014 #133

why rtracey May 2014 #137

whistleblowers noiretextatique May 2014 #44

We used to be able to rely on the "5th Estate" (aka a free press) Swede Atlanta May 2014 #45

Agree. sinkingfeeling May 2014 #46

Right there with you, malaise Cyrano May 2014 #48

So are we allowed to not like Snowden? mountain grammy May 2014 #54

not a question of like. good for him now come home and face what you did PatrynXX May 2014 #55

I deeply respect Snowden. He risked his life - for what we believe is "America." chimpymustgo May 2014 #56

He re-blew the whistle that had made Congress legalize what the NSA did 8 years earlier Recursion May 2014 #58

K/R Thank you 840high May 2014 #60

Not true treestar May 2014 #62

Then why the discussions about changing the stuff they are doing? nt Logical May 2014 #101

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! n/t malaise May 2014 #102

k & r...n/t NRaleighLiberal May 2014 #67

K&R DeSwiss May 2014 #81

Edward Snowden is a hero. I know the fascists hate santamargarita May 2014 #83

I don't know him, so I can't say if I like him or not. Avalux May 2014 #84

" blew the whistle on some seriously illegal practices" seriously Cryptoad May 2014 #86

May he inspire many more to do the same. K&R Tierra_y_Libertad May 2014 #88

He told us nothing new LuckyTheDog May 2014 #91

Nearly all smallcat88 May 2014 #95

Like Daniel Ellsberg Art_from_Ark May 2014 #152

My thoughts exactly. joanbarnes May 2014 #96

K and R bigwillq May 2014 #103

Doesn't make much difference whether you "like him or not". The American people don't. Tarheel_Dem May 2014 #105

Those polls told Rmoney he was on his way to the WH n/t malaise May 2014 #107

So how do you gauge public opinion, oh wise one? Do you "unskew" the polls as well? Tarheel_Dem May 2014 #114

Uhh no they didn't rep the dems May 2014 #131

This malaise May 2014 #134

First off, Nate Silver doesn't do polling. rep the dems May 2014 #136

That was back in January. I have not seen a poll since the interview last night. Jefferson23 May 2014 #118

My guess is that people who already supported him watched the show. Others had better things to do. Tarheel_Dem May 2014 #122

We'll see...time will tell. Jefferson23 May 2014 #124

It will indeed. Tarheel_Dem May 2014 #132

While I have a very low opinion of Snowden... NCTraveler May 2014 #106

Turning Against Truth Tellers is One More Unconscionable Act. Thanks, malaise. nt tea and oranges May 2014 #112

Is this thread a joke ? It doesn't matter if DUers "like" him or not !!!!!! Trust Buster May 2014 #115

Yep. blackspade May 2014 #123

The Pulitzer Prize was well deserved... bvar22 May 2014 #125

Well said malaise May 2014 #129

Thank you Mr. Snowden montanacowboy May 2014 #126

HUGE K & R !!! - THANK YOU !!! WillyT May 2014 #128

If Mitt Romney were POTUS obxhead May 2014 #138

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe May 2014 #141

+11111111 Tommymac May 2014 #142

The White House is not happy. blkmusclmachine May 2014 #143

I feel the same, malaise. pacalo May 2014 #144

knr thanks n/t slipslidingaway May 2014 #147

Fucking amazing cui bono May 2014 #150

I agree with you and the funny thing is that until I saw the arthritisR_US May 2014 #151

Hahaha!!! Major Hogwash May 2014 #153

Yes! Captain Obvious (Snowden) confirmed what we already knew.... Strat54 May 2014 #155

I wish I could say you were wrong Savannahmann May 2014 #158