General Discussion

leftynyc

(26,060 posts)

203. Call it rhetoric

Thu Aug 28, 2014, 05:27 AM

Aug 2014

or call it realistic (which it happens to be). And I'll thank you and everyone else who wants to shove words in my mouth to just freeking stop it already. I live in the real world where there is a choice between the Democratic candidate and the Republican candidate. I wish the system were different but it isn't. Are you also one of the ones who convinced themselves that Sen Obama was to the right of Sen Clinton? We tried to tell you there was virtually no difference between the two but you knew better. Just like you think you know better now. You don't. A far left candidate that wants to expand entitlements (I hate that world but whatever) will get just enough support to throw the election to the one who will put more scalia's on the court. That is unacceptable to me. I'm old enough to remember what happened to McGovern. The same thing will happen here.

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Why do I feel like Hillary is being forced on me? [View all] SheilaT Aug 2014 OP

PUMA: Party Unity My Ass... NYC_SKP Aug 2014 #1

I'm rather pleased that I got such a quick response. SheilaT Aug 2014 #3

What about those of us leftynyc Aug 2014 #60

There was quite a stretch between when it was certain Hillary had zero chance & when she finally KittyWampus Aug 2014 #110

Before I answer your questions leftynyc Aug 2014 #111

She was responsible for allowing it to continue long after there was any reason for it. Because she KittyWampus Aug 2014 #114

Well, I think that's bullshit leftynyc Aug 2014 #119

You said, "Before I answer your question,..." and then you never did. She answered your rhett o rick Aug 2014 #148

Well said! Thank you! n/t markpkessinger Aug 2014 #185

Well excuse me for having alife leftynyc Aug 2014 #200

You do realize that you just outlined the ENTIRE problem... elzenmahn Aug 2014 #175

I'm all for nominating leftynyc Aug 2014 #204

Domestic policy... elzenmahn Aug 2014 #244

There are more than a few leftynyc Aug 2014 #247

And Cuomo's "shuckin' and jivin' comment. And her own comment about her constituency being merrily Aug 2014 #222

For starters leftynyc Aug 2014 #201

Bless you Dems to Win Aug 2014 #116

No problem leftynyc Aug 2014 #118

Never supported her Thespian2 Aug 2014 #182

Why do you support her? Why do you think she would make a good president? n/t cui bono Aug 2014 #121

I thought she was a terrific senator leftynyc Aug 2014 #130

There is a bit of illogic in what you say. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #150

it was QUITE the opposite for me...Hillary had a track record of supporting Universal Single Payer VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #157

I don't recall her supporting single payer. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #176

what do you call... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #177

There is no provision for a single-payer system in this plan. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #179

Your "logic" is based on an unproven premise. You have no proof that most people voted for Obama pnwmom Aug 2014 #160

His antiwar stance was certainly more in line with liberal thought than Hill's Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #180

According to a brilliant political analyst, Bubba Clinton, Obama's stand the Iraq War vs. Hill's merrily Aug 2014 #209

Hillary was not to Obama's right. Based on their Senate records, they were virtually the same, pnwmom Aug 2014 #213

Not factually, no-- but rhetorically he was. Marr Aug 2014 #215

As Reply 209 stated, it does not matter. The relevant issue is voter perception, period. merrily Aug 2014 #216

But you aren't reflecting voter perception -- you're reflecting DU perception. pnwmom Aug 2014 #220

No. My Reply 209 is not about me, except where I specified. And, DU merrily Aug 2014 #224

As I said, Obama was much freer to make this statement as an outsider to the Senate. pnwmom Aug 2014 #226

Again, only voter perception is relevant. merrily Aug 2014 #248

There was NOTHING in the 2008 leftynyc Aug 2014 #202

How about health care? Marr Aug 2014 #217

That really pissed me off leftynyc Aug 2014 #219

That's a bunch of rhetoric that says that you are tickled to death with the status quo. rhett o rick Aug 2014 #193

Call it rhetoric leftynyc Aug 2014 #203

I always get a chuckle when people say, "I live in the real world " as if they and rhett o rick Aug 2014 #242

Hey - if you want to pretend leftynyc Aug 2014 #246

I think you nailed it there. Marr Aug 2014 #218

I think that Royal Families are swell as long as they don't have any power and rhett o rick Aug 2014 #228

We have no idea if "firebrand liberals" can get elected nationwide. cui bono Aug 2014 #235

Those of us old enough know leftynyc Aug 2014 #236

As if polls at this date mean anything. cui bono Aug 2014 #237

I cited polls leftynyc Aug 2014 #238

Yes she is. That's exactly why the meaningless polls are being put out there by the media cui bono Aug 2014 #240

Sigh leftynyc Aug 2014 #243

double sigh cui bono Aug 2014 #249

I've read every single word leftynyc Aug 2014 #251

You said I was attibuting the polls being out there to Clinton supporters cui bono Aug 2014 #252

Oh, they are still around, bashing Obama daily. No, I won't link them here. They're nauseating. freshwest Aug 2014 #137

PUMAs = democratic birthers paulkienitz Aug 2014 #147

+1 A lot of racism at those sites. merrily Aug 2014 #208

Love it or leave it, she is our only option.. Unless? OLDMADAM Aug 2014 #254

PUMA=party unity my ass. CaliforniaPeggy Aug 2014 #2

Only two minutes behind the first correct answer, SheilaT Aug 2014 #4

I'm used to coming in second! CaliforniaPeggy Aug 2014 #5

I hope you're not describing your love life. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #152

Agreed - we need to look to the future; a progressive future or we are toast. gtar100 Aug 2014 #6

Doesn't matter if it's conservative extremists (republicans) or conservative light (blue dog Democra Vincardog Aug 2014 #122

+1000 JEB Aug 2014 #188

Approved by Wall Street. n/t moondust Aug 2014 #7

Yes, if HRC gets in she will follow Obama's footsteps on the financial front and not beef up the Dustlawyer Aug 2014 #163

Do you think she should be a contender at all? Wella Aug 2014 #8

Her record is mostly Bill's record and it seemed good at the time, but the afteraste JDPriestly Aug 2014 #28

She was Secretary of State and a Senator Wella Aug 2014 #33

Her service as Secretary of State was in my opinion good, but since then she has come across JDPriestly Aug 2014 #41

Now that's legit: you don't like her policies Wella Aug 2014 #42

I like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders so far. JDPriestly Aug 2014 #47

My hope is that people with principles can keep them in Washington Wella Aug 2014 #50

Studying the miserable economic situations of people who declare bankruptcy was Elizabeth Warren's JDPriestly Aug 2014 #52

Yes, a Warren/Sanders ticket might be seen as a Northeast Liberal ticket. Wella Aug 2014 #53

I love both Sanders and Warren leftynyc Aug 2014 #61

Pity, isn't it. Wella Aug 2014 #195

Northeast Liberal ticket? I will take that over a Texas Conservative ticket any day. n/t A Simple Game Aug 2014 #169

:Grin: I think the party is worried about the rest of the country Wella Aug 2014 #194

"The party" should just run on what is good policy for "the people". cui bono Aug 2014 #234

We focus too much on personalities and not enough on policies. winter is coming Aug 2014 #239

Bush/Cheney come to mind? JDPriestly Sep 2014 #256

Lizzie Warren had the facts eridani Aug 2014 #69

Haha, that's good! closeupready Aug 2014 #90

Wonderful! May I quote you? JDPriestly Aug 2014 #134

Sure! I want to spread the meme n/t eridani Aug 2014 #145

Bernie Sanders didn't claim to see a UFO. Enthusiast Aug 2014 #138

No, Kucinich did. (Weird. punctuation. My bad.) Wella Aug 2014 #196

Kucinich never claimed the UFO was piloted by aliens. Enthusiast Aug 2014 #205

I never he said he made that claim. Please check with what was actually posted Wella Aug 2014 #229

Attack? Enthusiast Aug 2014 #230

Yes. And not based on anything that was posted. Wella Aug 2014 #231

I wasn't directing those words at you, specifically. Enthusiast Aug 2014 #241

Since the reply was to me, I had no choice but to assume that the remarks in it were addressed to me Wella Aug 2014 #250

*stands and applauds* LittleGirl Aug 2014 #151

Thank you, JDP. Bohunk68 Aug 2014 #210

It's also instinctive. But the policies are the reason that I dare express my ideas JDPriestly Aug 2014 #127

Feingold grahamhgreen Aug 2014 #144

"since then she has come across as an even worse war-mongerer"? ieoeja Aug 2014 #104

Wow! It' worse than I thought. I'm moving to some extent on my political JDPriestly Aug 2014 #126

I am a personal witness to how she got the title of Senator Man from Pickens Aug 2014 #103

+++++infinity nt newfie11 Aug 2014 #58

I'll gladly and enthusiastically support and promote Legalequilibrium78 Aug 2014 #66

H. Clinton has shown that she lacks integrity. Sorry, but that's a deal breaker. nm rhett o rick Aug 2014 #149

WHAT? MADem Aug 2014 #225

She has a right to run, period. Not that I want to see her run, but she has that right. A Simple Game Aug 2014 #168

Tell me, what are your true feelings toward Big Sister? MannyGoldstein Aug 2014 #9

Anyone who proclaims victory over an empty field is a loser Scootaloo Aug 2014 #10

Oh, boy. You are bringing back a lot of bad memories. SheilaT Aug 2014 #19

Yes, the PUMA's we're WAYYY over the top. Will never forget the venom they spit and their utter contempt for Obama...it was disgusting. InAbLuEsTaTe Aug 2014 #73

I used to follow a PUMA's writers blog LittleGirl Aug 2014 #154

Because she's being forced on us. Everyone else has been pushed aside TwilightGardener Aug 2014 #11

As far as I am concerned, murielm99 Aug 2014 #16

I used to be more involved in party politics SheilaT Aug 2014 #21

I just cannot support Hillary. I'm in California. As I have said before, if she cannot win here, JDPriestly Aug 2014 #37

Agree on every point. I just can't accept her, I'm too old for any more of this shit. NYC_SKP Aug 2014 #96

Swear fealty to Hillary now, or you will be Zorra Aug 2014 #12

Maybe it's you. zappaman Aug 2014 #13

preemptive outrage Skittles Aug 2014 #17

Both Hillary and Bernie Sanders are making test visits to Iowa and New Hampshire in the coming JDPriestly Aug 2014 #39

I regret that I have just one rec to give. obxhead Aug 2014 #14

Exactly right! Veilex Aug 2014 #44

I remember it all.. but I don't feel Hillary is being forced on me.. she and her supporters Cha Aug 2014 #15

Thank you! murielm99 Aug 2014 #18

Thank you, murielm! Good Luck to Gov Quinn! Cha Aug 2014 #20

Why do I feel like the endless parade of posts about '16 here Jeff Rosenzweig Aug 2014 #22

I think people look to Hillary due to nearly 16 years of failed leadership. joshcryer Aug 2014 #23

In 2008 I was involved in another Democratic site No Vested Interest Aug 2014 #24

I'm with you on this. blackspade Aug 2014 #25

You do not have to vote for her if you do not want to. I cannot akbacchus_BC Aug 2014 #26

Almost All States Support Write In Ballots cantbeserious Aug 2014 #32

Oh, trust me. I won't vote for her. SheilaT Aug 2014 #35

I still say this pick would flip out the Republicans... Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #27

The Republicans hate her, don't you remember, but am glad we get akbacchus_BC Aug 2014 #29

People forget she also studied law. Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #36

Huh... yeah, I'd vote for her over HRC. Veilex Aug 2014 #45

She's too smart to run davidpdx Aug 2014 #59

Amen JustAnotherGen Aug 2014 #207

Why do I feel like Hillary is being forced on me? Oldenuff Aug 2014 #30

The thing is that the Democrats is not for the working class! How can you akbacchus_BC Aug 2014 #34

I'm quite sure you meant to say "Republicans" instead of "Democrats" Veilex Aug 2014 #46

We dropped the ball. jeff47 Aug 2014 #86

Agreed - We Need To Move Forward cantbeserious Aug 2014 #31

Disagree Hillary was an "abject failure in 2008. lexington filly Aug 2014 #38

I disagree a bit davidpdx Aug 2014 #62

Ah, Come on. DU come primary time is -always- a Defcon 5 level clusterfuck. Warren DeMontague Aug 2014 #40

Agreed and besides for all we know she might just decide not to even run so its all premature until cstanleytech Aug 2014 #43

Of course. But if I'm to be totally honest Warren DeMontague Aug 2014 #48

I want video of that if it happens cstanleytech Aug 2014 #102

Its simple MFM008 Aug 2014 #49

This is why hillary jonjensen Aug 2014 #51

Sounds like pure DLC/Third Way/New Democrat. merrily Aug 2014 #57

What is your excuse for mondale? jonjensen Aug 2014 #128

Excuse? I posted a substantive reply, which you ignored. For what do I need an excuse? merrily Aug 2014 #198

This message was self-deleted by its author merrily Aug 2014 #199

PLUS ONE, a whole bunch! Enthusiast Aug 2014 #143

What might have happend in 1972 had the Democratic leadership not decided to support Nixon? eridani Aug 2014 #71

I think you're refering to the Dixiecrat wing of the party Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Aug 2014 #167

The entire leadership actively worked against McGovern eridani Aug 2014 #197

Even if what you say is true Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Aug 2014 #227

Probably true, but the election would have been much closer n/t eridani Aug 2014 #253

I will vote for the Democratic candidate... Sancho Aug 2014 #54

I will vote for Hillary if she gets the nomination. I won't vote for her in the primaries. Kalidurga Aug 2014 #55

Why do you feel like that??? ReRe Aug 2014 #56

I agree with one slight difference davidpdx Aug 2014 #63

The problem is. sendero Aug 2014 #64

Apparently, we fought a revolution to get away from the monarchy in 1776, merrily Aug 2014 #65

Hilary Clinton lost in 2008 because Barack Obama was capable of raising more money than she. MohRokTah Aug 2014 #67

That is not why I chose Obama in the fall of 2007, when she was 30 points ahead and merrily Aug 2014 #74

Obama laid the ground work for being a fund raising juggernaut in 2006. MohRokTah Aug 2014 #75

The Clintons had a fund raising juggernaut already in place before 2006. merrily Aug 2014 #76

And they would have never gone with Obama had he not demonstrated he could raise funds. MohRokTah Aug 2014 #79

That is different from saying Obama won the primary because he raised the most money. merrily Aug 2014 #81

You will be mocked when Hillary wins. eom MohRokTah Aug 2014 #85

If she is the nominee, I hope she wins the general. So, as I said, I will welcome the mocking. merrily Aug 2014 #87

Clinton lost largely because once Obama proved he could win a primary, blacks went with him> KittyWampus Aug 2014 #113

I don't blame you for your reservations about HRC. Laelth Aug 2014 #68

Because more people are buying her records than your favorite teen idol's? wyldwolf Aug 2014 #70

Ummm . . . because she is? InAbLuEsTaTe Aug 2014 #72

Lots of words, yet no alternative recommended. JoePhilly Aug 2014 #77

Because you post at DU JustAnotherGen Aug 2014 #78

Hey, did you notice George W. Bush* being forced on you? rock Aug 2014 #80

Electoral Kabuki Tom Ripley Aug 2014 #82

I don't know...why do you? brooklynite Aug 2014 #83

Because their arguments are reasons to vote against others. jeff47 Aug 2014 #84

Because she is. nt LWolf Aug 2014 #88

Because she is. The moneyed interests need to maintain the status quo. Autumn Aug 2014 #89

Simple answers to your first three questions negate the rest of your post. NCTraveler Aug 2014 #91

Who's failing you? Not Hillary. Proud Public Servant Aug 2014 #92

I'm glad we are not Republicans libodem Aug 2014 #93

Agreed. I will never forget 2008. I will consider any Dem. nominee but her. eom. SweetieD Aug 2014 #94

I don't think she's being forced on anyone. hamsterjill Aug 2014 #95

Forced? oh my, no! librechik Aug 2014 #97

My vote goes to Bernie Sanders!! 1monster Aug 2014 #98

Her Wall Street backers are using the media to make her inevitable LittleBlue Aug 2014 #99

I hate the idea of a candidate being "forced on" people who don't want her. Nye Bevan Aug 2014 #100

i think we need to force ourselves on her accepting the nomination samsingh Aug 2014 #101

If it is only money that counts: sadoldgirl Aug 2014 #105

When she resigned as SoS because of "exhaustion"... Ino Aug 2014 #106

You (and I) don't support her but many other people do. n/t pampango Aug 2014 #107

To be fair, she only barely lost in 2008 Proud Liberal Dem Aug 2014 #108

Because the DCCC wants everything wraped up tight before the convention. Javaman Aug 2014 #109

Um, DCCC is responsible for electing Congressional candidates. brooklynite Aug 2014 #132

You're right, my bad, I meant the DNC. nt Javaman Aug 2014 #211

Because she is. EOM Le Taz Hot Aug 2014 #112

I want a nominee other than Clinton, but don't want to fight about it in 2014 Dems to Win Aug 2014 #115

Because she is. hifiguy Aug 2014 #117

Because she is. I believe carrots and sticks have been used behind the scenes to essentially create TheKentuckian Aug 2014 #120

As with by opinion on religion, I'll avoid "belief" that isn't supported by actual evidence... brooklynite Aug 2014 #131

Who made a we all know statement? Believe or pretend to believe as you will. TheKentuckian Aug 2014 #255

Only you can answer that question Progressive dog Aug 2014 #123

Hilary voted for Iraq knowing it was a lie, and then blamed it on Bush when public opinion turned. chrisa Aug 2014 #124

I don't know you, so I have no idea. MineralMan Aug 2014 #125

Why hillary wins jonjensen Aug 2014 #129

I totally agree. I can think of no one who would galvanize the right Damansarajaya Aug 2014 #133

Hint: the corporate money candidate will be forced on you, one way or another Maven Aug 2014 #135

So Hillary -wasn't- the corporate money candidate in 2008? brooklynite Aug 2014 #139

They were both the corporate money candidates Maven Aug 2014 #140

Well, THAT's a convenient apologetic... brooklynite Aug 2014 #141

No apologia intended. Maven Aug 2014 #142

Very true. It's no coincidence that Obama's cabinet was full of Third Way Clintonites. Marr Aug 2014 #232

Absolutely Maven Aug 2014 #245

It's the corporate thing to do! BlueJac Aug 2014 #136

What are you talking about? Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #146

Again, again, again! LuvLoogie Aug 2014 #156

Let's not get greedy now Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #161

i agree with most of your post but i wouldn't call her an abject failure... she got a lot of votes. dionysus Aug 2014 #153

I don't care flying-skeleton Aug 2014 #155

I don't know. Why do you? She's not even announced she's running yet. n/t pnwmom Aug 2014 #158

Did Hillary announce? still_one Aug 2014 #159

Bernie Sanders believes in everything I do urbuddha Aug 2014 #162

Her poll numbers are absurdly high, much higher than 2008 Hippo_Tron Aug 2014 #164

There were some long, steep hills in the neighborhood I lived in when I had my first car. winter is coming Aug 2014 #165

lol -had a Jeep like that, about half way up, it would start backfiring... whereisjustice Aug 2014 #172

LOL, mine never backfired, but I was usually doing about 15 when I crested the hill. n/t winter is coming Aug 2014 #173

+1, lol-- nice metaphor. Marr Aug 2014 #233

I really don't giveba shit. Old and In the Way Aug 2014 #166

I didn't really oppose Hill 'n Bill, until people started shoving her down my throat. ColesCountyDem Aug 2014 #170

HU8GE k/R 840high Aug 2014 #171

"we MUST look forward, not backward" Mnpaul Aug 2014 #174

Did you know that Harriet Christian died? Capt. Obvious Aug 2014 #178

I have never heard of Harriet Christian. SheilaT Aug 2014 #223

K & R Myrina Aug 2014 #181

I disagree. She absolutely would beat anyone that the Republicans can put up. And I suspect that totodeinhere Aug 2014 #183

She is not treestar Aug 2014 #184

Elizabeth Warren would make a great President and she would INdemo Aug 2014 #186

You couldn't possibly be the only person who feels Elizabeth Warren is the truedelphi Aug 2014 #190

+1,000: "Hillary Clinton is NOT the future. She is the past." blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #187

Because she is being forced on Dems by virture of her war chest of money KauaiK Aug 2014 #189

The Cons are so childish . . . Utopian Leftist Aug 2014 #191

Try and focus on the idea of Mitt Romney being forced on you! DrewFlorida Aug 2014 #192

Been there, done that. Did NOT buy the T shirt. merrily Aug 2014 #206

If she's being forced on us, LloydS of New London Aug 2014 #212

It's almost 100% because Wall Street wants her. Marr Aug 2014 #214

I wish I could unrec this... joeybee12 Aug 2014 #221