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ND-Dem

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2. the horrible thing, actually, is the government giving tax and other advantages to online

Reply to NoJusticeNoPeace (Reply #1)

Tue Feb 3, 2015, 11:51 AM

Feb 2015

sellers (amazon, specifically) to allow them to drive others out of business.

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Borderlands Books in SF announces closure, cites minimum wage increase [View all] benz380 Feb 2015 OP

What a HORRIBLE thing for these people to do to society...Take our money, profit off of us NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #1

the horrible thing, actually, is the government giving tax and other advantages to online ND-Dem Feb 2015 #2

I agree with that, but to blame wages? HORRIBLE message NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #3

Yes, it does, when you have tight profit margins and you're a very small independent. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #6

I think that's a fair statement. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Feb 2015 #60

Right catrose Feb 2015 #62

Agenda jollyreaper2112 Feb 2015 #83

Exactly. And it doesn't sound like they were doing all that great in the first place: arcane1 Feb 2015 #8

wow. the big capitalist paid himself $28K, $13 an hour. Less than the new SF minimum wage. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #16

The minimum wage is being transitioned in. $15 won't be in effect until 2018 suffragette Feb 2015 #51

So what? You don't see to understand the root problem, and it's not because he has a failed ND-Dem Feb 2015 #64

Businesses that can't compete don't make money. I don't doubt he can't compete hughee99 Feb 2015 #5

I don't see that they are blaming the workers. kiva Feb 2015 #7

Of course they are, the main reasons they cant compete is NOT paying someone an extra $3 an hour NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #10

They were just barely profitable paying their workers $11.05 an hour, which was about $2 ND-Dem Feb 2015 #18

tell it to this guy - tell him he is full of shit, be my guest NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #20

I already answered that. And the owner was already paying more than $11 an hour to 6 workers. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #25

How did you answer that? So YOU are the one who cares about unfair competition NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #29

he was paying $11.05 an hour, more than the $11 demanded on your poster, and only $1.95 ND-Dem Feb 2015 #35

you're talking to a brick wall. apparently this guy should run his store as a non profit dionysus Feb 2015 #80

agreed. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #94

does he have a facebook page? snooper2 Feb 2015 #31

Is that all you have to add to this discussion? NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #34

For this discussion yes, everyone else already posted the relevant information snooper2 Feb 2015 #39

I ignored nothing, I have discussed all the points as to this issue, me thinks you just have NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #41

nope, just responding to posts and eating a bagel LOL snooper2 Feb 2015 #45

Did you pay a bagel-slicing tax on that thing? benz380 Feb 2015 #53

That is now the dumbest thing I have read this year so far LOL snooper2 Feb 2015 #55

It sounds like the owner is saying he can't keep his business open without paying hughee99 Feb 2015 #63

yeah, i'm sure fdr would have supported amazon's monopoly position, supported by no taxes and ND-Dem Feb 2015 #68

I support raising the minimum wage. kiva Feb 2015 #43

You dont blame a living wage, it is that simple. The many reasons he is going out of NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #44

I reread the article. kiva Feb 2015 #50

And it is $15 an hour by 2018, not tomorrow NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #52

In May the minimum goes up over $1 per hour, kiva Feb 2015 #54

The headline should say "Huge corporation puts another small business out into the street" NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #56

What we have here is a philosophical difference. kiva Feb 2015 #58

Yeah but the problem of wage exists because we have allowed capitalists and oligarchs NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #59

Of course there is a cost to paying for labor, kiva Feb 2015 #61

Starting in May, he would have to pay each worker $1.20 more per hour Art_from_Ark Feb 2015 #85

In this case, there *is* a cost, and yes, the system is corrupt and backwards and unless you ND-Dem Feb 2015 #69

It doesn't hurt his competition at all though. Amazon doesn't have to pay $15 an hour and in fact ND-Dem Feb 2015 #65

The owner paid himself $28,000 last year - after their best year ever. hack89 Feb 2015 #14

You DONT claim the REASON is the wages when that is NOT the reason, it may be the final NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #30

There is the fact that he would still be in business if the minimum wage remained the same. hack89 Feb 2015 #37

I think you could make some exceptions for maybe $13 vs $15 in certain situations NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #40

and amazon doesn't have to employ *anyone* in san francisco, but can still take the biggest ND-Dem Feb 2015 #67

Yeah, he's making the big bucks at a storefront sci-fi bookstore and probably robbing the till too. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #89

That person has a "blame the management" script that they won't deviate from, which in this ND-Dem Feb 2015 #66

i wouldn't get too fired up using this book store as an example. mom and pop dionysus Feb 2015 #78

"struggling to compete with online book sales and a national shift to electronic readers" arcane1 Feb 2015 #4

Exactly, and not only do these employees lose their job but rightwing TERRORISTS NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #12

He is really blaming it on an inability to increase sales enough to cover increased costs. hack89 Feb 2015 #19

Agreed. This certainly doesn't set an example like the article seems to imply. arcane1 Feb 2015 #21

I think it was a given that an increased minimum wage would shut down some businesses hack89 Feb 2015 #27

Yep, and that the lost jobs weren't really all that great anyway n/t arcane1 Feb 2015 #28

I'm sure that's what the newly-fired are saying right this moment. nt Dreamer Tatum Feb 2015 #32

Yeah, probably not :( arcane1 Feb 2015 #48

I'd love to work in a bookstore, personally. But slave work at Amazon is now almost the only ND-Dem Feb 2015 #38

Same here! One with used books and a cat. arcane1 Feb 2015 #49

yes. i love bookstores with pets and comfy chairs. almost a vanishing culture. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #70

it's sad that in todays world, with everything available onlone, small book and dionysus Feb 2015 #81

Green Apple Books on Clement St. Has opened another store in The Sunset. displacedtexan Feb 2015 #88

Maybe you don't like sci-fi. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #100

if their profit margin was that slim, they would go out of business anyway. spanone Feb 2015 #9

Any increase in the minimum wage would drive some struggling stores out of business hack89 Feb 2015 #22

Bingo! nt ladjf Feb 2015 #33

Yes. Amazon doesn't have to hire *any* workers in SF, or pay taxes to the city. Yet it can ND-Dem Feb 2015 #71

No business that depends for existence on paying less than a living wage to its workers RiverLover Feb 2015 #11

THANK YOU NoJusticeNoPeace Feb 2015 #13

This. So much this. Iggo Feb 2015 #17

Except of course when you give special tax breaks to giant businesses so they can drive smaller ND-Dem Feb 2015 #24

This reminds me of the small DVD rental store in downtown Asheville closing RiverLover Feb 2015 #15

Rents on Valencia Street have gone through the roof. KamaAina Feb 2015 #23

Maybe he could have stayed in business if slavery was legal? hunter Feb 2015 #26

He's already paying above minimum and barely pays himself more than his workers. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #47

All they have to do is copy and paste earlier announcements from Blockbuster Video. lpbk2713 Feb 2015 #36

SURRENDER TO THE BORG ND-Dem Feb 2015 #72

This is an unfair and misleading headline... TreasonousBastard Feb 2015 #42

YEP. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #73

The only people who make money off books are those who move volume. Dreamer Tatum Feb 2015 #46

Everybody else does it for the love, and enough to live on. But that option is fast-disappearing. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #74

This is a crying shame. Borderlands is the best sci-fi bookstore in the whole country. Comrade Grumpy Feb 2015 #57

Not So Fast daredtowork Feb 2015 #75

Please back up your contention that he "cast minimum wage as bad for business". I don't ND-Dem Feb 2015 #87

and to po your bubble, the last line of that article, from the owner himself says... dionysus Feb 2015 #76

Op fail? i posted the first 3 paragraphs. benz380 Feb 2015 #91

Those employees should have the chance to form a co-op to keep the store going by themselves. Ken Burch Feb 2015 #77

If they're making just above minimum wage how could the 6 employees dionysus Feb 2015 #82

Borderlands is right down the street from me- I've always been glad that they're there. NBachers Feb 2015 #79

Since he's keeping the coffee shop, he could sell a smaller quantity of books there. benz380 Feb 2015 #84

he already specializes in sci-fi. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #86

Pay your workers a living wage or give up. 6000eliot Feb 2015 #90

Not that simple when monopoloists like amazon can shift labor cost to low-wage states or cities ND-Dem Feb 2015 #93

It doesn't matter what others are doing. 6000eliot Feb 2015 #96

LOL. Amazon doesn't have to pay ANY labor in San Francisco, or taxes either. And they ND-Dem Feb 2015 #99

And this excuses other businesses from paying a living wage how exactly? 6000eliot Feb 2015 #101

The biggest competitor doesn't have to pay a living wage though, or taxes, and you're fine with ND-Dem Feb 2015 #103

I don't care about Bezos. 6000eliot Feb 2015 #104

Bezos DOESN'T pay his workers a living wage; not only that, he works them until they drop from ND-Dem Feb 2015 #105

I'm still not sure how this excuses the bookstore in the OP from paying their workers 6000eliot Feb 2015 #106

The owner doesn't pay himself a living wage either. The reason is Amazon. Sorry you're having ND-Dem Feb 2015 #107

It doesn't matter what Amazon does or what he pays himself. 6000eliot Feb 2015 #109

He pays his employees. He pays them $11 an hour and pays himself $13. I guess he doesn't ND-Dem Feb 2015 #114

Notice the store owners aren't calling for a national Guaranteed Annual Income (which would KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #92

If you read what the owner actually *said,* he didn't blame the workers. Do all you folks ND-Dem Feb 2015 #95

Sorry, I was keying off this sentence in the OP: KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #98

"In 18 years of business, Borderlands has faced a number of challenges. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #102

Who buys paper books anymore? They make these e-readers where you can have all your books in the dilby Feb 2015 #97

People like Bezos are taking us back to the 19th century. As for your ereaders: ND-Dem Feb 2015 #108

If it was just for books, sure Blue_Adept Feb 2015 #112

My kindle fire has replaced books, my laptop and my tv. dilby Feb 2015 #113

it is only one particular business quaker bill Feb 2015 #110

Something seems off krawhitham Feb 2015 #111

"one would assume a bookstore owner would get an even better price." why would anyone think ND-Dem Feb 2015 #115