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happyslug

(14,779 posts)
231. A parent's legal liability for the acts of their children is limited
Thu Feb 21, 2013, 01:47 AM
Feb 2013

The Common Law Rule is a parent is NOT responsible for the acts of their Children UNLESS they are part of the underlying action OR have reasonable expectation that the child would do something bad (i.e. parents are NOT liable of their child pull a chair from under someone else UNLESS it can be shown they know the Child would do so AND could have prevented it, if the parents do NOT meet BOTH requirements, the parents are NOT liable for the act of their child).

Now, many states have passed laws making parent's liable for the acts of their children, but these laws, being in derogation of the Common Law are strictly construed, i.e. The parents MUST meet all of the requirements of those laws, or the parents are NOT liable. If a Child does an act and someone is harmed, the Child can be held liable, but except if there is a law passed by the State Legislature, the parents are NOT liable.

Now, parents are liable to their children when it comes to support, generally a place to live, food and clothing, but only to what would be expected of a person of the parent's income (i.e. if the parents have no income, their children can starve, live on the streets and go around in rags). On the other hand, of the parents have income (or can get welfare and most parents fall into one or the other categories) then they have a duty to provide housing, food and clothing.

As to entering into a valid contract, a teenager can do so if emancipated. i.e. not under the care, control or supervision of their parents by the act of the parents. Some states permit judges to emancipate minors, other states require no such finding by a judge (but permit such findings if needed).

Here is a paper I did several years ago on Emancipation in Pennsylvania, a state that does NOT require a child to go in front of a judge to be emancipated: I deleted the section on what type of employment a minor can do, for that is a restriction on EMPLOYERS not parents, and I excluded the section of the law where 18-21 years olds are now treated as if there were over age 21.

Paper on Emancipation

Note: This paper was written so my clients have a better idea of what emancipation is and is not. This letter provides information on what is emancipation of a minor.

Reference to the P.L.E.

Enclosed herein are copies of a section of the Pennsylvania Law Encyclopedia (P.L.E.). The P.L.E. is an encyclopedia of Pennsylvania law. I have attached the section of the P.L.E. regarding emancipation of children . The section covers the subject of emancipation of minors fairly completely therefore I will not repeat what is covered by the P.L.E. in this letter.

EMANCIPATION OF CHILDREN - CONTRACTS (Footnote 2)

An emancipated minor has all of the responsibilities and duties of an adult. All contracts agreed to by an emancipated minor are enforceable against the emancipated minor. Most, if not all, of the case law involve the issue of contract law. The reason being is that is when the issue of whether the minor was emancipated or not is a factor (Footnote 3)

Since 1972, by statute, the right to enter a contract and the right to sue (or be sued) starts at age eighteen (18) not twenty-one (21) (Footnote 4).

ACT OF EMANCIPATION.

For children under age Eighteen (18) the legal presumption is that they are not emancipated, but this can be rebutted. The burden of proof of showing whether a child is emancipated or not is on the party seeking to show the minor was emancipation.

Careful reading of the P.L.E. section cited above (and attached to this letter) requires an "juristic act" of the parent before an minor is emancipated. Now the "juristic act" does not have to be any formal act, but some indication that the parent is no longer exercising "care, control or supervision" over the minor. It can be as simple as not requiring the child to go to school or to the act of ordering the child out of the parents' home.

When a parent orders a minor out of their home, that is clearly a "juristic act" that makes the child emancipated, but does not relieve the child (or the parent) of any statutory restrictions or duties imposed by age.

On the other hand a minor moving to college is probably not a "juristic act" because while the minor is no longer living with the parents, the parents are indirectly exercising "care, control and supervision" of the minor.
Holding a job.

Do remember merely having a job does not make a person emancipated, what is required is to be no longer to be under the Acare, control or supervision of one's parents. Work is a factor, but not conclusive by itself.
Marriage (footnote 5)

Marriage is not a conclusive factor in determining whether a child is emancipated, but is a factor to be considered under the totality of the circumstances. Berks County Children and Youth Services vs Rowan, 631 A.2d. 615, 428 Pa Super. 448 (1993).
Pregnancy

Pregnancy does not make a minor emancipated. Now Pregnancy is often evidence of a lack of care, control and supervision, but the pregnancy by itself is only evidence of a lack of care, control, and supervision not proof of such lack of care, control and supervision. Please note special rules covers abortion and emancipation . (Footnote 6)

Payment of Child Support

Payment of child support indicates a minor in un-emancipated for emancipation of a minor ends all duty to pay child support for that minor.

Ending of Emancipation before age Eighteen 18.

Also note that an emancipated minor can cease to be an emancipated minor if the minor returns to the "care, control and supervision" of his parent.

If such an event occurs all contracts formed by the minor, while emancipated, are still valid. The minor is still liable for such pre-existing contracts, but any contracts entered into by the now un-emancipated minor are treated as if the minor was never emancipated. i.e. all such contracts are voidable. This is rare but can occur.

To better understand this remember that the common law rule was developed to reflect the working conditions in rural America and England prior to 1900. It was not un-common for minors to leave the family home and go to work on various farms in the spring, summer and fall. During the winter they would return to the family home.

During the time away from home the minors would have to be able to contract for housing and food (As while as work). Since the minor left the family home with permission of their parents the A "juristic act" part of emancipation would have been fulfilled, thus their were emancipated minors during such periods. Such emancipated minors could make valid enforceable contracts.

When the minor returned to the family home the minor would become "un-emancipated". As a now un-emancipated minor they could no longer make valid enforceable contracts.


As to the contracts formed while emancipated, those would still be enforceable against the minor, but no new valid contracts could be entered until emancipated again the next planting season.
Please remember more than just moving out or into the family home would be needed to show a change in emancipation status, but such a movement would be strong evidence of such a change. (See the attached paper from the P.L.E. for more details).

EXCLUSIONS FROM EMANCIPATION.

Emancipation only relates to non-statutory age restrictions or statutory restriction where age is silent. Emancipation was the common law recognition that until this century it was not uncommon for minors to start to work independent of their parents at age fourteen (14) or younger. Thus it was and still is mostly a contract issue.
CRIMINAL JURISDICTION AND CHILDREN AND YOUTH JURISDICTION.

Thus the issue of emancipation has no effect on juvenile criminal law (42 Pa. C.S.A. § 6302, 6322) or Children and Youth Services (23 Pa. C.S.A. § 6303) jurisdiction, both are covered by statutes that clearly set a jurisdictional age of eighteen (18).

Thus it is possible for an emancipated minor to be under the jurisdiction of CYS. Emancipation does not, and can not, relieve a minor of supervision by CYS or a probation officer, both are given authority by statute which is independent of the issue of emancipation of the minor.

SCHOOLING AND EDUCATION.

Emancipation has no effect on education law due to the enabling statute (24 P.S. § 13-1327) which requires "parent, guardian, or other person having control or charge of any child or children of compulsory school age" to send that child or children to school. A parent can be required and even fined if an emancipated minor does not go to school. Compulsory school age is defined by 24 P.S. § 13-1326 as children between age eight (8) and seventeen (17). (An exception is made for home-schooling, but that is still education.)

Do note the 24 P.S. § 13-1327 does not require the parent or guardian to have control of the minor. The "control or charge" used in the act addresses who had control of children in addition to parents and guardians.

While the state statute only require attendance between the ages of eight (8) and seventeen (17), most school districts require attendance till graduation. Since such requirements exceed state law requirements such school districts rules are fully enforceable against the minor. FOR THIS REASON BEFORE YOU DECIDE TO DROP OUT OF SCHOOL PLEASE CONTRACT YOUR SCHOOL ON HOW TO DO SO. Furthermore we at AAAAAA strongly recommended you do complete High School . (Footnote 7)

AUTOMOBILES AND DRIVING.

Emancipation has no effect on driving an automobile. Driving is governed by the Vehicle Code. Under 75 Pa. C.S.A. § 6303 of the Vehicle Code a person over age Sixteen (16) will be treated AIn the same manner as an adult@ for an summary offense under the vehicle code.

One must be over eighteen (18) to drive after 11:00 PM.

ALCOHOL AND WORK.

Emancipation does not permit an emancipated minor to buy alcohol [47 P.S. § 4-493 (1)] or be employed by a tavern or other dangerous occupations [43 P.S. § 44]. Those require the minor to be over eighteen 18.

I have attached a copy of 43 P.S. § 44 so you can see the restrictions imposed by age on employment. Emancipation has no affect on the restrictions imposed by age in 43 P.S. § 44 . (Footnote 8)

VOTING.

Emancipated minors can not vote in an election, 25 P.S. § 2811 requires all voters to be over eighteen (18).

MILITARY SERVICE.

Emancipated minors can not enlist in the U.S. military until the minor is eighteen (18). High School graduates below age 18 may enlist with permission of their parents. At one time the U.S. Military did take other minors into the military, but always required parental permission (See Footnote 8). The federal acceptance of such non-high school graduates ended in the 1970s, because the military wanted high school graduates (See footnote 7 for more details).

POLICY OF AND THE ISSUE OF EMANCIPATION

Our policy at XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX on emancipation of minors is driven by both the XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX requirement that the minor "prove" they are emancipated and the need to provide such minors legal means to obtain such housing. XXXXX policy is to prepare affidavits signed by the minor (and if possible the parents) that the parents are not exercising any Acare, control or supervision" of the minor. To satisfy the requirement of some "juristic act" of the parent we try to state the facts of the case completely as it can be done in the affidavit. For example if the parent is no longer living with the minor, that is stated in the affidavit. If the minor is living with the parents we try to state facts that shows a "juristic act" and a lack of "care, control and supervision" by any adult.

Change of the Age of majority for Contracts is now Age 18.

While Pennsylvania still follow the common law rule that majority is achieve at age twenty-one (21), this Rule is defined more by the exception to age twenty-one (21) than by the Rule itself. This can be seen above where the cut off is almost always age eighteen (18).

Under 23 Pa. C.S.A. § 5101 any minor between the ages of eighteen (18) and twenty-one (21) can make a valid contract (or sue or be sued) as if he was over age twenty-one (21). Since contracts dominate our lives this change made most emancipations moot except for minors less than eighteen (18) years of age .(See footnote 10)

JUDICIAL FINDINGS OF EMANCIPATION.

Unlike some states, Pennsylvania does not have a procedure to be Emancipated by Court Action. While there is no stated procedure, if the affidavits mentioned above are not enough AAAAAA will file in Common Pleas Court for a Declaratory Judgment that the minor is Emancipated. A Declaratory Judgment of Emancipation is where the minor files an action against the minor=s parents that the minor is emancipated. It would be than up to a Judge to decide as a matter of law whether the minor is emancipated. Once that finding is done than the Judge would enter an ORDER declaring the minor an emancipated minor. That way the Minor would have a Court Order saying the minor is an emancipated minor.

Please note for a judge to find the minor to be emancipated the minor must not be under the care control or supervision of the minor's parents do to some "juristic act" of the parents. (The same test as stated above and in the P.L.E. on the next page).

Footnotes:

1. See page 8 of this paper.

2 Please note contracts can be classified into three categories:
I. Valid Contracts, enforceable by either party.
II. Void Contracts NOT enforceable by either party.
III. Voidable contracts which are enforceable by one party but not the other. Regarding un-emancipated minors all contracts entered into by un-emancipated minors are voidable, i.e. may be enforced by the minor against the other side, but can not be enforced against the minor.

3. At a minimum, absent some clear exception to the contrary, a person reaches the age of majority by act of law when that person reaches age Twenty One (21). 1 Pa. C.S.A. § 1991, 23 Pa C.S.A. § 5302. Marino vs Marino 601 A.2d 1240, 411 Pa Super. 424. As you will see in the rest of this paper most areas of the law grants the age of majority at Eighteen 18.

4. See the page 12 of this paper for a copy of the statute in question, which is 23 Pa. C.S. A. Section 5101. In most circumstances a person reaches the age of majority at age eighteen (18), but the general rule is still age twenty-one (21). I do not know of any area of the law that still looks at age twenty-one (21) as the age of majority, almost all have adopted age eighteen (18), but if an area of the law is silent, majority is twenty-one (21) not eighteen (18). Please note Alcohol is governed by its own statute which sets the minimum age limit at Twenty-one (21).

5.Please note Pennsylvania as of January 1st 2005 no longer permits Common Law Marriages. Under the Common Law a child as young as 12 could marry. That is no longer the law in Pennsylvania

6.See 18 Pa C.S.A. § 3206, for purposes of the "Abortion Control Act", age of majority is set at eighteen (18) but also permits a "Emancipated Minors" to obtain an abortion without permission of their parents. Please note under 18 Pa. C.S.A. § 3206 (c) if the minor's parents refuse consent OR the minor decide NOT to inform her parents, the minor can obtain permission from the Court of Common Pleas through an expedited petition system under Orphans Court Rule 16. The records of the petition must be confidential and sealed from the public. Thus the mere fact that a woman=s parents has refused permission to have an abortion (or the woman has refused to ask her parents for such permission, DOES NOT MAKE HER AN EMANCIPATED MINOR.
Please note do to Federal Funding Restrictions, AAAAAA can not participate in any such abortion petition, I only list it as an example of what is needed to be an emancipated minor.

7. One of the best reasons to complete high school is the experience it gives you. The best way to see this is to the explain the US Army recruiting scandal of the Mid 1970s. After the Draft was abolished in 1972, the US Army had a problem recruiting. As a result to get recruits, recruiters would take the test for recruits who could not pass the entrance test into the Army. After the scandal broke the Army found out many of the recruits had succeed in their military obligations while many had not. The Army did a study and determined only one factor set the recruits who fulfilled their military obligations apart from those that did not. How well the recruits did on the entrance exam had no bearing, how well they did in school, how intelligent their where, were not the difference. The difference was whether the recruit finished High School, not how well they did in High School, just finished High School. Basically the study pointed out that if you can take what occurs in most High Schools, you can succeed in life.

8. See Page 9 for the text of 43 P.S. § 44.

9. The states did take emancipated minors into the National Guard until 1947. In 1947 Congress required all members of the National Guard to have prior federal military experience so the Federal rules also applied to the National Guard.

10 See page 11 of this paper for the text of 23 Pa. C.S.A. § 5101. Now, theoretically, there may be an area of the law where majority is still age 21. While it appears that every possible law has been passed making majority at age 18 instead of age 21, they may be areas of the law where none of the above cited statutes apply and therefore the age of majority for that area of the law would be age 21. At present I do not see any area of the law which is not covered by the above statutes.

Pennsylvania Law Encyclopedia
PARENT AND CHILD
28 P.L.E. ' 19
Emancipation


A minor child is emancipated when he is released from legal subjection of his parents33. Emancipation results not from conduct of the child, but from some juristic act or other conduct of the parent from which the extinguishment of parental rights and filial duties may be inferred34. Emancipation from parents' service may be as perfect when children continue to live with parents as if they were living separately therefrom 35.

Child's retention of wages. The mere fact that a child is allowed to retain his own wages while living in the home of his parents does not of itself constitute emancipation of the child 36.

Failure to support and abandonment. The non-support of a minor child, when established by a court order of support, constitutes abandonment by the non-supporting parent, and is tantamount to an admission of the emancipation of the child37.

Attainment of majority. Ordinarily, a child is emancipated at the age of 21, even though he continues to live with his parents. However, if the child is incompetent when he reaches the age of 21, his status continues to be the same as that of an minor38.

Evidence and questions of law and fact. Emancipation of a minor child is not to be presumed, but must be proved39. The burden of establish the emancipation of a minor child by a parent is on the party asserting it40.

The question of whether a minor child has been emancipated by a parent is one of fact for the jury where the evidence on the issue is in conflict41. On the other hand, where the facts are undisputed, whether there has been an emancipation is a question of law42.


Footnotes:

33 Parks v. Parks, 135 A.2d 65, 329 Pa. 287 (1957)
Marino by Marino v. Marino, 601 A.2d 1240, 411 Pa. Super. 424 (1992)
Ross v. Com. Dept of Public Welfare, 431 A.2d 1135, 60 Pa. Cmwlth 403, (1981).
York County Probation Dept. v. Creech, 12 D & C 4th, (1991 York Co)
Zoba v. Zoba, 40 D & C 3d (1981).
34 Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A. 2d 426 (1948),
Trosky v. Mann, 398 Pa. Super. 369, 581 A2d 177 (1990)
35 Beaver v. Bare, 104 Pa. 58, 14 W.N.C. 53, 32 P.L.J. 161 (1883).
36 Dunks v. Grey, 3 F. 862 (1880).
Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A. 2d 426 (1948).
37 Com. v. Simpson, 49 Berks 144, (1957); Adoption of Budziak, 28 Erie 195 (1946).
38
Gaydoes v. Domabyl, 301 Pa. 523, 152 A. 549 (1931).
Colantoni v. Colantoni, 220 Pa. Super 46, 281 A2d. 662 (1971)
Com. ex rel Walsh v. Welsh, 222 Pa. Super 585, 296 A2d 891 (1972)
39 Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A.2d 426 (1948);
Caddy v. Com Dept of Public Welfare, 14 Pa. Cmwlth. 317, 322 A2d 140 (1974);
Ross v. Com. Dept. of Public Welfare, 60 Pa. Cmwlth. 403, 431 A.2d 1135 (1981)
40 Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A.2d 426 (1948).
41 Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A.2d 426 (1948);
Beaver v. Bare, 104 Pa. 58, 14 W.N.C. 53, 32 P.L.J. 161.
Dunlevy v. Butler County Nat. Bank, 64 D. & C. 535, 62 York 117, 30 West. 155 (1948).
Mumma v. Friendenhart, 25 Dauph. 8, (1921).
42 Detwiler v. Detwiler, 162 Pa. Super. 383, 57 A. 2d 426 (1948); Delaware County Nat. Bank v. Headley, 4 A. 464, 1 Sad. 499, 2 Cent. 374, 2 Del. 282, 3 Lanc.Rev.133, 17 W.N.C. 557.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Pregnant Teen Wins Abortion Battle [View all] davidn3600 Feb 2013 OP
(her choice) annabanana Feb 2013 #1
Yes, BUT HockeyMom Feb 2013 #2
I guess that will have to be annabanana Feb 2013 #4
agree, or to pay for the health costs Tumbulu Feb 2013 #6
Agreed. TEXASYANKEE Feb 2013 #10
At 18 she's legally an adult HockeyMom Feb 2013 #11
Oh right, like parents are not going to feel that they have to step in and help? Tumbulu Feb 2013 #14
Then call me guilty HockeyMom Feb 2013 #27
I complete agree Drale Feb 2013 #61
That's just punishing the grandchild demwing Feb 2013 #81
Adoption HockeyMom Feb 2013 #85
You didn't tell us you know the people involved. Since you know "THAT is the best choice", I must uppityperson Feb 2013 #90
You don't understand why a grandparent would want to have their grandchildren around? Exultant Democracy Feb 2013 #145
Hands down best choice Tumbulu Feb 2013 #161
"You people?" Ouch!!!!!!!! nt MADem Feb 2013 #204
That's just punishing the grandchild AlbertCat Feb 2013 #96
Yes, correct demwing Feb 2013 #156
but that's not what the OP was referring to. AlbertCat Feb 2013 #207
My quote was in response to her quote demwing Feb 2013 #217
Exactly nt Tumbulu Feb 2013 #136
Well goody goody for you Tumbulu Feb 2013 #137
if we're celebrating choice then no one should call you anything leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #151
Her parents are legally responsible for her (and her troubles) til she's 18 yrs old riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #53
The parents were not wrong to make the girl avebury Feb 2013 #82
They have to pay her medical bills, house her, clothe her and feed her riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #87
I would like to know why the parents of the boy are not legally avebury Feb 2013 #94
why the parents of the boy are not legally liable for some of the girl's expenses AlbertCat Feb 2013 #97
I'm presuming they are responsible for the other half of medical costs riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #105
I'm going to guess that's why they were only ordered to pay half medical riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #98
You keep making such good points! Tumbulu Feb 2013 #163
very tho0ughtful response, with which I concur elehhhhna Feb 2013 #113
A teenager has no idea Tumbulu Feb 2013 #139
The girl does not need a cell phone avebury Feb 2013 #148
Oh, I was thinking you were saying no phone.. Tumbulu Feb 2013 #154
The parents might be able to get her a cheap cell phone and provide avebury Feb 2013 #171
I see the young people of today as so much more irresponsible Tumbulu Feb 2013 #172
Why rent an apartment? Why not just keep her at home? MADem Feb 2013 #206
This message was self-deleted by its author Horse with no Name Feb 2013 #106
That's not true from what I've read. Do you have a link? riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #109
This message was self-deleted by its author Horse with no Name Feb 2013 #117
Not sure any law requires them to pay for her phone or car. Just her food and lodging and health. McCamy Taylor Feb 2013 #122
Oh agreed. They also have to give her clothing. The car thing is weird. riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #123
Exactly -- Unless she becomes emancipated obamanut2012 Feb 2013 #127
And why I think parents should make the abortion decision Blue4Texas Feb 2013 #129
Or you can be 100% trying to help and teach your kids, and they just don't give a damn. loudsue Feb 2013 #70
+1. nt riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #78
This child is but sixteen. MADem Feb 2013 #203
Yes, it boggles my mind Tumbulu Feb 2013 #16
I am sick of the glorification of birth married to a complete absence of responsibility. Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #35
+1000 smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #141
agree 100% Tumbulu Feb 2013 #158
Thanks nt Tumbulu Feb 2013 #157
+1. freshwest Feb 2013 #168
Fifth pregnancy? By the time she's 16? muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #185
No, I only do sarcasm for Republicans, not real people or DUers. freshwest Feb 2013 #196
I think that's the girl's mother who'd had 4 abortions muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #201
I agree--that would be way past grounds for a visit from Child Protective Services or a MADem Feb 2013 #208
Thanks, I'll edit. I was going by a post, not the original article. I defer to the court documents. freshwest Feb 2013 #210
Absolutely. wisteria Feb 2013 #39
And WHY do her parents have to pay HALF Tumbulu Feb 2013 #12
She's under 18 leftynyc Feb 2013 #17
So this group should pay for the whole thing Tumbulu Feb 2013 #23
Fathers dont get a say either...yet are on the hook financially davidn3600 Feb 2013 #28
True to a point, but the father had more to do with creating the pregnancy wisteria Feb 2013 #43
Well they at least had something to do with it Tumbulu Feb 2013 #135
So true! n/t wisteria Feb 2013 #41
Her parents are legally responsible for her (and her troubles) til she's 18 yrs old riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #51
She doesn't live with them anyway Marrah_G Feb 2013 #74
Yes, because they, themselves, should hot have had to commit to any parental ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #225
I agree but why didn't they get her some birth control The Flaming Red Head Feb 2013 #243
Yes, but the parents shouldn't be liable for hospital bills, her transportation etc. wisteria Feb 2013 #31
Oh yes her parents are legally responsible for her. riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #55
Excellent points nt Tumbulu Feb 2013 #142
She is 16 TexasBushwhacker Feb 2013 #238
Do children really have "my body my choice"? alp227 Feb 2013 #80
tough question. what if the plaintiff was 12? would DU still be whooping elehhhhna Feb 2013 #118
Well, at that point the issue is rape, without the cover of "Romeo and Juliet" laws, MADem Feb 2013 #211
We'd defend a 16 year old boy whose parents tried to force him to get a tattoo muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #186
And who is the judge of when a medical procedure is necessary? alp227 Feb 2013 #197
A doctor is muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #199
Looks like no decision is right at all. alp227 Feb 2013 #202
No, her parents should not get the ultimate decision over her body muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #205
So if parents can't have the ultimate decision, what's the point of parenthood then? alp227 Feb 2013 #209
Parenthood doesn't mean complete control of a child muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #212
Parents force cosmetic procedures on their children all the time without their consent. riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #219
And I oppose them all muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #221
In the US, Hispanic baby girls very commonly sport pierced ears. Baby Hindu girls with bindis riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #222
Well, pregnancy isn't illegal. MADem Feb 2013 #213
thats the truth. The Flaming Red Head Feb 2013 #241
and anti abortion people will trumpet this as a win for their side booley Feb 2013 #3
Ironic, isn't it, that when.... Jerry442 Feb 2013 #45
They are ProBIRTH HockeyMom Feb 2013 #57
I am pleased that she will get to exercise her CHOICE. n/t CaliforniaPeggy Feb 2013 #5
based on what? Some pseudo science spewed by pro-life groups? wordpix Feb 2013 #101
Agree - really I hope the Tumbulu Feb 2013 #143
Would you make your 16 year old have an abortion if she didn't want to? Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #153
yes i would - at 16, she had no idea how to take care of herself, much less a baby wordpix Feb 2013 #183
Forcing people to have abortions because of your opinion of their abilities muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #187
OK, YOU take care of the baby and 16 y.o., then. I don't want to wordpix Feb 2013 #228
No forcing anyone to do something like that The Flaming Red Head Feb 2013 #242
i dont understand the 'consequences be damned all that matters is she got her choice' leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #159
Me too, and I hope she has some real plan for her future bhikkhu Feb 2013 #160
Very happy that her right to choose was protected rox63 Feb 2013 #7
I agree.... kurtzapril4 Feb 2013 #46
Unfortunately when the girl is a minor, the parents are on the hook riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #56
Which is still ironic. Igel Feb 2013 #116
Agreed. Its odd that neither the parents nor child pursued emancipation riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #121
Many young people are rabidly anti-choice. Something is not right in the education system. n/t SylviaD Feb 2013 #8
I think polls of shown that most young Americans are socially liberal. iandhr Feb 2013 #20
This girl is from Texas, so she may be more conservative then most others her age. alp227 Feb 2013 #84
True iandhr Feb 2013 #131
Sounds like she chose just fine. Dreamer Tatum Feb 2013 #58
a few things do not add up here - from the original DU post about this case azurnoir Feb 2013 #9
Looks like the parents were trying to show her some adult responsibility. Dont call me Shirley Feb 2013 #25
Thank you HockeyMom Feb 2013 #30
well that is possible but myself I think the whole thing is a steaming pile azurnoir Feb 2013 #34
They were paying the phone bill, owned the car and, as her parents, could Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #40
they could not withdraw her from school against her will NCLB azurnoir Feb 2013 #44
Perhaps the grandparents don't live in the same school district? Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #52
that's possible but IMO the antichoicers capitalized on bad blood azurnoir Feb 2013 #59
Perhaps.... Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #65
thatcould well be azurnoir Feb 2013 #71
Yep. Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #72
Perhaps she is an KatyMan Feb 2013 #92
She clearly is not--otherwise, her parents wouldn't be required to pay for her care and car. nt MADem Feb 2013 #214
Don't know the background, but what you said is completely possible. Igel Feb 2013 #120
WOOOT! A win for us! Pro-Choice wins! This will make a great precendent! Katashi_itto Feb 2013 #13
Her body, her choice. The parents couldn't have done that better SaveAmerica Feb 2013 #15
Odd though she did not live with her parents azurnoir Feb 2013 #22
According to CNN, the girl lives with her mother muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #188
thanks because we all know CNN is always accurate azurnoir Feb 2013 #195
It is her choice. And the grandparents and she should JDPriestly Feb 2013 #18
If the father is still in HS HockeyMom Feb 2013 #32
The grandparents appear to be supporting this young JDPriestly Feb 2013 #177
LOL, and her boyfriends fathers mechanic friend.. snooper2 Feb 2013 #48
If the 16 year old left her parents home, they owe her NO SUPPORT happyslug Feb 2013 #162
This seems so topsy turvy.. JDPriestly Feb 2013 #178
I use to deal with Children and Youth and Child placement. happyslug Feb 2013 #223
Per the article, the girl is living with her mom. And the parents have been ordered to $upport her riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #224
A parent's legal liability for the acts of their children is limited happyslug Feb 2013 #231
Ok but that's PA, not TX which does require a judge for emancipation riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #232
Illinois your limit is $20,000 plus attorney's fees happyslug Feb 2013 #233
As to emancipation, the Illinois Emancipation of Minors Act has the following sentence: happyslug Feb 2013 #234
A child cannot simply declare themselves emancipated and voila! Its done riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #236
Look at Section 2, the last sentence of the second paragraph, it reads as follows: happyslug Feb 2013 #237
If she want to have the child its her choice. iandhr Feb 2013 #19
even for juveniles? alp227 Feb 2013 #88
All rights. Igel Feb 2013 #124
Forced abortions are what happen in dictatorships. iandhr Feb 2013 #133
But her PARENTS, not government are forcing the abortion. alp227 Feb 2013 #200
So would it also be okay for parents to force a girl Crunchy Frog Feb 2013 #175
Is it against the law for parents to make such decisions? alp227 Feb 2013 #198
I agree, but requiring the parents to give her a car? Xithras Feb 2013 #21
Quite a message to teenage girls in Texas huh? azurnoir Feb 2013 #24
Actually, I thought they agreed to that in some sort of mediation. NaturalHigh Feb 2013 #134
Very good bluestateguy Feb 2013 #26
Absolutely VA_Jill Feb 2013 #38
Choice is one thing, forcing the parents to pay for the choice is another. wisteria Feb 2013 #47
It's her body, her life, and her choice rachel1 Feb 2013 #29
Then she should make the choice to not use the car, the phone or wisteria Feb 2013 #36
as I said to my daughter at this age, when you're paying for wordpix Feb 2013 #107
The parents should not be responsible for anything-it isn't there choice. wisteria Feb 2013 #33
Is she an emancipated minor? I hadn't seen that. Link? Otherwise they are responsible riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #49
I think she is independant of her parents. wisteria Feb 2013 #60
Unless she's won a legal emancipation, they are still responsible for her legally riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #63
link she was not living with her parent now or at the time she became pregnant azurnoir Feb 2013 #62
Oh I agree. This case sucks but the parents are still legally responsible riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #66
The proof is the fact that she wasn't living with her parents and I'll tell you how I know. notadmblnd Feb 2013 #91
Those cops were wrong. The law is clear, you must follow a legal riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #100
I have no opinion to express about the girl or her parents here. notadmblnd Feb 2013 #103
Sounds like kind cops who took your side and fudged things. riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #114
It seems an abnormal situation Yo_Mama Feb 2013 #130
Choice VA_Jill Feb 2013 #37
Absolutley it's about choice. Jerry442 Feb 2013 #50
Maybe they know their daughter all too well. wisteria Feb 2013 #54
This sort of thing makes me glad I don't have kids. DaveJ Feb 2013 #64
Yup. I have a wild teen. Unfortunately I'm experienced nt riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #67
The thing is it's the daughter's choice, which means all the responsibilities of that choice jeff47 Feb 2013 #69
The law makes her parents live with the consequences of that choice riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #76
Which means nothing. jeff47 Feb 2013 #146
I agree its unfair regardless of the law. And you put your finger right on the heart of the matter riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #218
Is the father in the picture here? bluestateguy Feb 2013 #42
His pic is at the link, along with some zombie-like guy. DollarBillHines Feb 2013 #73
Best not to judge people by their looks muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #192
He wants to marry her muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #190
Forced Support for Grandchildren? HockeyMom Feb 2013 #68
If a woman can not support herself and her child(ren), the child(ren) should be fostered out or adop uppityperson Feb 2013 #75
My husband's father and uncle HockeyMom Feb 2013 #83
I understand this is a minor, but was expanding on what you wrote, trying to clarify. uppityperson Feb 2013 #89
This message was self-deleted by its author Horse with no Name Feb 2013 #119
Good luck to that teen. I hope if she changes her mind or needs help later she can get help. Choice uppityperson Feb 2013 #77
This is the best post I've read on this thread. tammywammy Feb 2013 #229
The parents could have (should have?) petitioned to have her declared an "emancipated minor". marybourg Feb 2013 #79
The person being "emancipated" has to prove that they can support themselves. MADem Feb 2013 #215
Not in most states. happyslug Feb 2013 #235
A family I knew about had a pregnant 15 year old. They made her Ilsa Feb 2013 #86
1) "Roe" made this her choice. There can be no obligation for her to abort. OmahaBlueDog Feb 2013 #93
Good. krispos42 Feb 2013 #95
so the parents are forced to raise the baby they don't want to raise wordpix Feb 2013 #99
why didn't the court mandate any percentage of support from the baby's father?? Blue_Tires Feb 2013 #102
My question. Where is the dad? McCamy Taylor Feb 2013 #115
He wants to marry the young lady, per CNN. nt MADem Feb 2013 #216
I saw. UnseenUndergrad Feb 2013 #230
This message was self-deleted by its author Horse with no Name Feb 2013 #104
apparently you have not experienced dealing with teenage mothers wordpix Feb 2013 #111
So...you don't want your taxes to support a single mother and baby. NaturalHigh Feb 2013 #138
actually, if I had my CHOICE, every school would begin in middle school to have a class in wordpix Feb 2013 #184
I agree with all of that. NaturalHigh Feb 2013 #226
The only way this should be done is if the teen is also 'emancipated'. AzDar Feb 2013 #108
Thank YOU! smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #144
agree nt Tumbulu Feb 2013 #165
She wins? I don't see any winners here. Pool Hall Ace Feb 2013 #110
I wonder what the lawsuit was based on treestar Feb 2013 #112
Curious about how the right wing will cover this. Basically, it means that no one can "punish" their McCamy Taylor Feb 2013 #125
good points Tumbulu Feb 2013 #166
It's her life & the baby's life. See how she deals with it.Could go either way.Her body / her choice judesedit Feb 2013 #126
Hopefully you're right christx30 Feb 2013 #244
Now the kid's a saint for saving her unborn baby.. (which is, of course, her choice) mountain grammy Feb 2013 #128
Oh yes, I wonder how helpful they will be then....... Tumbulu Feb 2013 #167
Good obama2terms Feb 2013 #132
Anyone who thinks the parents should have the authority to force an abortion... NaturalHigh Feb 2013 #140
So hopefully when the court gets CC Feb 2013 #147
As I posted somewhere else... NaturalHigh Feb 2013 #150
The bus service in Houston is horrible. You have to have a car to get anyplace Manifestor_of_Light Feb 2013 #174
What a brave young woman! Pterodactyl Feb 2013 #149
I don't see it that way Tumbulu Feb 2013 #170
But in two years, she won't be a teen. And her child will have a whole life ahead of her! Pterodactyl Feb 2013 #173
being "pro-choice" means defending THIS choice, too. Ken Burch Feb 2013 #152
Yes, I am proud to defend both sides of the coin too. Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #155
I am with you. etherealtruth Feb 2013 #180
Agreed. I guess it's true that some people are pro-abortion... EastKYLiberal Feb 2013 #182
agreed La Lioness Priyanka Feb 2013 #189
There is something wrong here, this was filed February 11 and the parents had 20 days to respond happyslug Feb 2013 #164
it's an agreement between the sides muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #194
Thank you for the additional information. (nt) Nine Feb 2013 #227
I agree with those who've said information is missing from this story. Nine Feb 2013 #169
The fundies will pick up the tab, wait and see.. I can already see her in her own McMansion and with secondwind Feb 2013 #176
Norma McCorvey aka "Jane Roe" TexasBushwhacker Feb 2013 #239
My take on this Notafraidtoo Feb 2013 #179
At the end of the video report it states that her avebury Feb 2013 #181
Very tough choice but in the end it was her choice. Jennicut Feb 2013 #240
Something tells me the girl would've lost her legal battle pink-o Feb 2013 #191
Here is some more information. Nine Feb 2013 #193
The girl's parents deny all of the allegations. riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #220
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