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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: Mustn't we reevaluate our party since it is is going through a right wing realignment? [View all]Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)40. They are Right Wing by definition, their goals and their actions, their only "moderation" lies in
their social platform, over time even that has slowly begun to erode.
Was Eisenhower Right Wing? I believe he was. Here is a quote naming him in the Republican platform of the time:
Our great President Dwight D. Eisenhower has counseled us further: "In all those things which deal with people, be liberal, be human. In all those things which deal with people's money, or their economy, or their form of government, be conservative."
While jealously guarding the free institutions and preserving the principles upon which our Republic was founded and has flourished, the purpose of the Republican Party is to establish and maintain a peaceful world and build at home a dynamic prosperity in which every citizen fairly shares.
While jealously guarding the free institutions and preserving the principles upon which our Republic was founded and has flourished, the purpose of the Republican Party is to establish and maintain a peaceful world and build at home a dynamic prosperity in which every citizen fairly shares.
That belief is almost identical to that of the New Democrats that have taken control of the party.
New Democrats, in the politics of the United States, are an ideologically centrist faction within the Democratic Party that emerged after the victory of Republican George H. W. Bush in the 1988 presidential election. They are identified with centrist social/cultural/pluralist positions and neoliberal fiscal values. They are represented by organizations such as the Democratic Leadership Council (DLC), the New Democrat Network, and the Senate and House New Democrat Coalitions
After the landslide electoral losses to Ronald Reagan in the 1980s, a group of prominent Democrats began to believe their party was in need of a radical shift in economic policy and ideas of governance. The Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) was founded in 1985 by Al From and a group of like-minded politicians and strategists. They advocated a political "Third Way" as a method to achieve the electoral successes of Reaganism by adopting similar economic policies (Reagan Democrats and Moderate Republicans would provide burgeoning new constituencies after adding these new economic policies and politicians to our tent they contended) While hoping to retain, woman, minorities and other social issues allies with long ties to the party. Such would be their new Democratic coalition forged between fiscal right and social left under the "New" Democratic banner. The DLC disbanded in 2011 during an apparent re-branding of the New Democrat movement when money ties to the Koch bros. and Koch representatives placed on the DLC's board embarrassingly became common knowledge among the Democratic left. The DLC is survived by the Third Way, The New Democrat Coalition, and Al From's Progressive Policy Institute among other corporate funded groups that continue to sell their Economic-Right/Social-Left brand of "Centrism" to America.
After the landslide electoral losses to Ronald Reagan in the 1980s, a group of prominent Democrats began to believe their party was in need of a radical shift in economic policy and ideas of governance. The Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) was founded in 1985 by Al From and a group of like-minded politicians and strategists. They advocated a political "Third Way" as a method to achieve the electoral successes of Reaganism by adopting similar economic policies (Reagan Democrats and Moderate Republicans would provide burgeoning new constituencies after adding these new economic policies and politicians to our tent they contended) While hoping to retain, woman, minorities and other social issues allies with long ties to the party. Such would be their new Democratic coalition forged between fiscal right and social left under the "New" Democratic banner. The DLC disbanded in 2011 during an apparent re-branding of the New Democrat movement when money ties to the Koch bros. and Koch representatives placed on the DLC's board embarrassingly became common knowledge among the Democratic left. The DLC is survived by the Third Way, The New Democrat Coalition, and Al From's Progressive Policy Institute among other corporate funded groups that continue to sell their Economic-Right/Social-Left brand of "Centrism" to America.
The only difference between the Eisenhower Right Wing and the New Democratic Right Wing that anybody with an ounce of political historical understanding is that the New Democratic version of moderate Right Wing appears to include a great deal more Military "adventurism" and a great deal less "maintain a peaceful world and build at home a dynamic prosperity in which every citizen fairly shares within it", I will admit however that the New Democratic Right Wing is split on this issue of "the eternal war Doctrine", Hillary Clinton being on the side of the neocon hawks in such internal debates.
You mistakenly believe that by comparing Moderate Right Wingers to near Fascists (Modern Republicans) somehow changes the meanings of words in the political lexicon, it does not. Your argument is both lacking in substance and is also fallacious.
Perhaps you are conflating Right and Left political definitions with what is called the "Overton window"
The Overton window, also known as the window of discourse, is the range of ideas the public will accept. It is used by media pundits.
But even then, Bernie Sanders and "New Democrats" both fall within that window and still fall respectively with Center Left and Right Wing as is revealed by national polling on issues
82% oppose cutting Social Security benefits in order to reduce the debt.
67% oppose cutting Social Security to make the program more solvent in the long term.
63% oppose reducing Social Security benefits for people earning more than $60,000 or more when they retire.
69% oppose raising the Social Security retirement age to 69.
66% support enacting Social Security taxes on wages about $106,800 (the Pay Roll Tax Cap) to make the program more solvent....
82% oppose reducing Medicate benefits in order to reduce the nations budget deficit.
64% oppose spending cuts to Medicare.
76% believe cutting Medicare to help reduce the budget deficit is mostly or totally unacceptable.....
58% say people should not have their Medicaid benefits taken away in order to deal with state budget problems.
69% oppose cutting spending on Medicaid in order to reduce the national debt.
76% oppose cutting state funding for the Medicaid health insurance program....
76% support increasing the taxes paid by people who make more than one million dollars a year
63% support increasing the taxes paid by people who make more than $250,000 a year.
64% think it is a good idea for the wealthy and corporations to pay their fair share in taxes and can afford to pay more for programs and government operations......
67% oppose cutting Social Security to make the program more solvent in the long term.
63% oppose reducing Social Security benefits for people earning more than $60,000 or more when they retire.
69% oppose raising the Social Security retirement age to 69.
66% support enacting Social Security taxes on wages about $106,800 (the Pay Roll Tax Cap) to make the program more solvent....
82% oppose reducing Medicate benefits in order to reduce the nations budget deficit.
64% oppose spending cuts to Medicare.
76% believe cutting Medicare to help reduce the budget deficit is mostly or totally unacceptable.....
58% say people should not have their Medicaid benefits taken away in order to deal with state budget problems.
69% oppose cutting spending on Medicaid in order to reduce the national debt.
76% oppose cutting state funding for the Medicaid health insurance program....
76% support increasing the taxes paid by people who make more than one million dollars a year
63% support increasing the taxes paid by people who make more than $250,000 a year.
64% think it is a good idea for the wealthy and corporations to pay their fair share in taxes and can afford to pay more for programs and government operations......
Now, let us compare the New right Wing Democrats to an actual Center left Democrat, Franklin D. Roosevelt
It is our duty now to begin to lay the plans and determine the strategy for the winning of a lasting peace and the establishment of an American standard of living higher than ever before known. We cannot be content, no matter how high that general standard of living may be, if some fraction of our people whether it be one-third or one-fifth or one-tenth is ill-fed, ill-clothed, ill-housed, and insecure.
This Republic had its beginning, and grew to its present strength, under the protection of certain inalienable political rights among them the right of free speech, free press, free worship, trial by jury, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures. They were our rights to life and liberty.
As our nation has grown in size and stature, however as our industrial economy expanded these political rights proved inadequate to assure us equality in the pursuit of happiness.
We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. "Necessitous men are not free men." People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.
In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all regardless of station, race, or creed.
Among these are:
America's own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for our citizens.
This Republic had its beginning, and grew to its present strength, under the protection of certain inalienable political rights among them the right of free speech, free press, free worship, trial by jury, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures. They were our rights to life and liberty.
As our nation has grown in size and stature, however as our industrial economy expanded these political rights proved inadequate to assure us equality in the pursuit of happiness.
We have come to a clear realization of the fact that true individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. "Necessitous men are not free men." People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.
In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all regardless of station, race, or creed.
Among these are:
The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;
The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;
The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;
The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;
The right of every family to a decent home;
The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;
The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;
The right to a good education.
All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.
America's own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for our citizens.
If the theme seems familiar, you will not find it on the "far left", as you would describe such, they are not the words of Trotsky Or Eugene Debs, but rather those of a center right Democrat, the closest thing we have to such a Democrat in our modern party is Bernie Sanders, who, like FDR, is not "far left fringe" but ideologically a center left Democrat, nothing more than a pre "Al From, Clinton - takeover of the party" Democrat.
His words sound rather like those spoken by FDR, do they not?
Quite the contrast to the agreeing words of both Eisenhower and the New Democrats.
I like the pre Right wing Democratic party and it was the one I joined many years ago. I feel we must return to what we once were AND MORE, I would like that party as it was but with added unity and equality for all humans no matter their insignificant differences in melanin, sex, sexual preferences, gender identities, or other minor differences. I would also like to see an effort to save the environment on a scale that would make the Manhattan Project, and the moon landing appear as trivial hobbies in comparison.
I suppose that would make me a "mouth frothing raving Communist" in your eyes, but I care so very little about how others judge by political beliefs that such would not even phase me, let alone leave me feeling insulted or disgraced.
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Mustn't we reevaluate our party since it is is going through a right wing realignment? [View all]
Dragonfli
May 2016
OP
Hillary and the DNC are not right wing. They are more moderate than you like, that's all.
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#1
Aiding and abetting the ongoing power grab of Wall St and Corporate Monopolists is not moderate
Armstead
May 2016
#3
If allowing the people to decide is a CHANGE that reduces profits it may beforbidden by trade policy
Baobab
May 2016
#44
And bumper-stickers filled with the flavor-of-the-day pejoratives are not arguments.
LanternWaste
May 2016
#41
So ok Clinton's didn't start it. When should we grab the platform of the *real* Dem party?
whatthehey
May 2016
#156
The Right wing is pro War ,pro Wall Street, against Single Payer , just like Hillary.
bahrbearian
May 2016
#8
Bernie voted to remove Saddam, build F-35s, deregulate derivatives. He's a conservative!!
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#12
Lol and Hillary is a Progressive who like to get things done" Like War, Coups, and Donations
bahrbearian
May 2016
#16
but regime change does not, nor does it always, come through war. Saddam was a
Exilednight
May 2016
#28
A conservative Democratic Socialist? Twisting political categories to avoid the painful truth about
Kip Humphrey
May 2016
#26
If there is no, as you put it, serious left, the center is not where you think it is.
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#58
If left,right, and center mean different things in different places, they are meaningless words.
arendt
May 2016
#63
I didn't say the center's 'ok', just that it's the center. Center is a measurement, not a philosophy
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#66
Liberal is immediately to the left of center. Conservative immediately to the right
AgingAmerican
May 2016
#106
There are 3 centres. The center between the Republicans and the Democrats. And then the two
Seeinghope
May 2016
#116
They are Right Wing by definition, their goals and their actions, their only "moderation" lies in
Dragonfli
May 2016
#40
That's fine. It doesn't change that Hillary is to the left of TODAY'S center.
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#49
I disagree, besides, you are CHANGING DEFINITION AGAIN did you not read the polls that refute even
Dragonfli
May 2016
#52
Since there is no set philosophy from the "center party", of course I meant the center of our two.
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#56
So you can't define the center, and yet it can never shift? Yeah, that's a solid argument.
CrowCityDem
May 2016
#75
They appear to have constructed their own reality, it really is quite fascinating in a detached way
Dragonfli
May 2016
#143
"And political science paradigms are not dependent on relative things." Thank you for stating that.
Dragonfli
May 2016
#120
This genie is out of the bottle... this party will change forever when Sanders is denied
yourpaljoey
May 2016
#2
The timid and Republican lite Democrats simply create a bigger monster Republican Party all the time
highprincipleswork
May 2016
#14
That's right. Not all at once, but it is already underway. And now that Sanders has
silvershadow
May 2016
#57
Any compliment from you I consider high praise as your posts have always been so well thought out
Dragonfli
May 2016
#42
Liberal and progressive ideals are much, much more important than the Party. [n/t]
Maedhros
May 2016
#24
Just because Bernie gets support from primarily white voters in conservative areas ...
Onlooker
May 2016
#25
The Democratic Party started to leave me when I was told it was a big tent that included Rick
djean111
May 2016
#27
I came to the conclusion that the democratic party is not my party so I left it.
Autumn
May 2016
#32
Jamie Dimon whipping votes on the Senate floor at Obama's behest was the final straw.
Autumn
May 2016
#111
I think it is going through a "progressive vs. elitist" realignment even more than a "right vs. left
Attorney in Texas
May 2016
#60
Better idea: The losers could start their own party. The majority wins in this Country.
Lil Missy
May 2016
#62
Take heart. They may take the radical step of redesigning the donut logo and....
Tierra_y_Libertad
May 2016
#65
I've decided I will no longer aid and abet the rightward drift of the party by voting for DINOs.
Arugula Latte
May 2016
#68
Seems like you should have done some introspection about the 'revolution' -BEFORE the 'revolution'.
randome
May 2016
#88
I have to admit that I stopped registering Democrat after Bill Clinton's first term.
bjo59
May 2016
#92
I'm sure you were quite pleased with my FDR quote in response to a sock that claims that Hillary
Dragonfli
May 2016
#110
Good post we should have had this conversation after the conservative Clinton administration. I am
Todays_Illusion
May 2016
#97
I did not, nor have ever wished to realign the party as a Right wing fiscal party that Resembles
Dragonfli
May 2016
#108
Pretty long winded answer tio dance your way out of falsely claiming I wanted a party realignment
Dragonfli
May 2016
#135
So basically you're saying that you reject reality and substitute it with your own?
vintx
May 2016
#137
You are most welcome, all I do is simply speak my mind, I have payed attention for decades /nt
Dragonfli
May 2016
#119
Yes, I believe Bernie supporters are probably the most highly informed of the entire electorate.
2banon
May 2016
#127
So incredibly well thought out, I wish more people saw this dynamic for what it is.
vintx
May 2016
#129
It is not a "right wing alignment." It is a right (as in correct) alignment. The days of just
Jitter65
May 2016
#141
You didn't read the OP, it is coming from politicians and corporate "think tanks"
Dragonfli
May 2016
#142