2016 Postmortem

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

104. First of all, Bernie is the one who brands himself a socialist. And then, for some reason, people

Tue Sep 29, 2015, 09:33 AM

Sep 2015

get upset when I quote him.

He also stated very clearly that at one point he believed that the major means of production should be publicly owned. When I pointed that out, a bunch of people tried to pretend that "public ownership" doesn't mean the government, something utterly preposterous. When I ask whether he still believes that (a reasonable question, since one of his supposed strong points is that he's held the same beliefs for 40+ years), I get accused of red-baiting.

Then I point out the fact, supported by polls, that Bernie's supporters are wealthier, whiter, and more male than Hillary's, and the same people get all upset and start lashing out with personal attacks.

Even in this OP, we have more than one person suggesting that BB should leave DU and post somewhere else, and yet of all people, the person you choose to direct more than one personal insult at is yours truly.

Seems to me your concern about civil discourse is pointed in the wrong direction.

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Remember when Bernie said social justice must wait for economic justice? [View all] boston bean Sep 2015 OP

I think bernie has "evolved" on this. leftofcool Sep 2015 #1

yeah, it is OK for Sanders to evolve but riversedge Sep 2015 #15

It took Hillary a lot longer to crawl out of the primordial soup... Human101948 Sep 2015 #84

moving the goal posts once again I see. riversedge Sep 2015 #89

Get your eyes checked... Human101948 Sep 2015 #92

You're comparing a kid pleasing her father with a guy who first tried to qualify as a MADem Sep 2015 #142

So time before evolving is a factor now!?!!?!? wow... uponit7771 Sep 2015 #208

So any ideas on how to solve the stand alone racism issue? jalan48 Sep 2015 #134

Bernie is the only one talking about it. Really? sheshe2 Sep 2015 #203

Thanks for the response and the links. jalan48 Sep 2015 #213

K&R! stonecutter357 Sep 2015 #2

I sure don't and none of your body says any such thing either just your phony headline. TheKentuckian Sep 2015 #3

You are right, it might be to kind... he said it wasn't important. nt boston bean Sep 2015 #5

He did not say social justice was not important. thesquanderer Sep 2015 #133

Also a willful fabrication that is nowhere to be found. TheKentuckian Sep 2015 #171

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2015 #18

Just leave. sibelian Sep 2015 #4

How dare the OP bother "us" with some inconvenient facts! DU is supposed to be an DanTex Sep 2015 #10

It's not "inconvenient" it's just blatant misinterpretation. sibelian Sep 2015 #28

It seems like a pretty straightforward reading of Bernie's statement to me. DanTex Sep 2015 #34

Misleading headline =? inconvenient facts HERVEPA Sep 2015 #155

Translation: I am a bernie supporter so I will pretend bernie did not say this. leftofcool Sep 2015 #13

Oh he said it all right... sibelian Sep 2015 #23

Exactly. tecelote Sep 2015 #60

I agree.. Sanders' meaning is distorted in the OP. pangaia Sep 2015 #69

When you say it's a "first step", you are confirming exactly what the OP said. DanTex Sep 2015 #76

The opposite. tecelote Sep 2015 #80

Racial profiling, for example. DanTex Sep 2015 #82

The prison industrial complex loves racial profiling for economic reasons. tecelote Sep 2015 #87

Sure, there are some links, but they are not "integral" to each other. DanTex Sep 2015 #90

It is not Either/Or Armstead Sep 2015 #88

Yes, you can do both at the same time. Or you can prioritize one of the other, like Bernie does. DanTex Sep 2015 #91

There are many cited instances where successful African-Americans were racially profiled. olegramps Sep 2015 #100

This message was self-deleted by its author Ed Suspicious Sep 2015 #108

It's not a cure, just a step in the right direction. tecelote Sep 2015 #147

I would argue the part where working class whites... Anansi1171 Sep 2015 #161

Then I wonder why Bernie was fighting against segregation while Hillary was supporting Goldwater... cascadiance Sep 2015 #109

Yes, he marched with MLK. We know that. DanTex Sep 2015 #111

And MLK ALSO believed that economic justice issues were important issues to solve... cascadiance Sep 2015 #119

"corporate bought Democrats ... offend their paymasters". Be serious. DanTex Sep 2015 #121

I am! cascadiance Sep 2015 #122

It also won't end hatred in the minds of racists and bigots. Volaris Sep 2015 #123

Yes. Higher education is very important and is definitely an economic and social issue tecelote Sep 2015 #148

Not only that, "since I am a bernie supporter I don't have to worry about a hide on a personal stevenleser Sep 2015 #165

Poor, persecuted Steven. Comrade Grumpy Sep 2015 #193

Always. nt. polly7 Sep 2015 #195

Nope, feel sorry for the 21 folks who received timeouts unfairly. Not me. stevenleser Sep 2015 #197

Results... Major Nikon Sep 2015 #46

Yep. I guarantee you if I post that exact post to a Bernie supporter I will get a 6-1 to HIDE. stevenleser Sep 2015 #166

Making a statement that the "OP should leave" is not very Democratic still_one Sep 2015 #71

You first. n/t JTFrog Sep 2015 #93

He did leave, went to Discussionist made quite a few negative statements about DU and DUers. No seaglass Sep 2015 #106

Yea... there are a shitload of hypocritical jerks spewing crap here lately. JTFrog Sep 2015 #113

And before OET, there was Progressive Independent I think it was called. I don't care either except seaglass Sep 2015 #125

My point exactly. JTFrog Sep 2015 #127

They have their own playpen full of zoo filth to wallow in hifiguy Sep 2015 #204

Distort much? Scuba Sep 2015 #6

Yup. And it's obvious that what he really cares about are economic issues. DanTex Sep 2015 #7

That would be the point... boston bean Sep 2015 #8

But the point is also that he also cares about social justice issues too! cascadiance Sep 2015 #116

Economic issues are social issues Armstead Sep 2015 #30

No, economic issues are economic issues, and social issues are social issues. DanTex Sep 2015 #38

Okay whatever. You seem to prefer neat little boxes. Kind of an OCD thing Armstead Sep 2015 #45

Another personal attack, huh. Y'all are getting a little touchy these days. What's that about? DanTex Sep 2015 #49

Dan your arguments all seem to be bsed on simplistic labeling and non-answers Armstead Sep 2015 #52

Try to rise above the ad hominem and discuss the substance. It might be tempting to DanTex Sep 2015 #54

My post was calm and impersonal Armstead Sep 2015 #58

The one where you called me OCD? Or the one where you compared me to Rush? DanTex Sep 2015 #64

The one where I said this Armstead Sep 2015 #65

Oh, the one before the two personal attacks. Yes, that was not a personal attack. One out of three DanTex Sep 2015 #73

"That's a legitimate viewpoint, but it's not shared by everyone. " Armstead Sep 2015 #86

I've always said that Bernie's viewpoint is legitimate, and that economic injustice is a worthy DanTex Sep 2015 #94

They are his prioity. Armstead Sep 2015 #99

First of all, Bernie is the one who brands himself a socialist. And then, for some reason, people DanTex Sep 2015 #104

I am not saying any one side is blameless or guilty of such things Armstead Sep 2015 #112

I agree, he no longer says anything about nationalizing the means of production. DanTex Sep 2015 #120

I think you need to provide us links to what many here would call fallacious assertions... cascadiance Sep 2015 #132

Yep, and no worries about an alert. A Hillary supporter posting that would get a 6-1 hide. nt stevenleser Sep 2015 #163

+1 uponit7771 Sep 2015 #209

Yep. Trickle down from the left. nt DURHAM D Sep 2015 #9

As Eliz Warren stated a few days ago--that does not work. riversedge Sep 2015 #31

Project much? Armstead Sep 2015 #32

You'd probably get a better audience for this nonsense Warren Stupidity Sep 2015 #11

You mean boston bean Sep 2015 #12

It bothers me. nt Live and Learn Sep 2015 #110

Too bad so sad... Nt stevenleser Sep 2015 #198

How old are you? You looked a lot older on tv but from your posts, I have to say Live and Learn Sep 2015 #212

How's the fishing, Boston Bean? Scootaloo Sep 2015 #14

I haven't fished in years. Does posting an NPR interview distress you. boston bean Sep 2015 #16

Not unless you count a rolling of the eyes to be "distress." Scootaloo Sep 2015 #17

It's bernies own words. I can't imagine what I might have done to cause boston bean Sep 2015 #19

Your headline isn't, though it claims to be Scootaloo Sep 2015 #26

It was being kind, cause as you can plainly see he says it's "not important". boston bean Sep 2015 #27

If that is what he said, you wouldn't have to distort what he said. Scootaloo Sep 2015 #33

Do you give this advice to everyone? nt boston bean Sep 2015 #36

I have no interest in further discourse with you, Boston Bean Scootaloo Sep 2015 #40

No worries. She can hang out with her friends at hillarysupporters.com and trash us from there. Comrade Grumpy Sep 2015 #194

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2015 #20

LOL.. it's an interview... you know where Bernie is asked a question and he answers? nt boston bean Sep 2015 #21

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2015 #25

Ok, so in your own words, what did Bernie say? boston bean Sep 2015 #29

It's entirely in your "mind's eye." Lol. morningfog Sep 2015 #35

Post removed Post removed Sep 2015 #48

It's what is misleading is the quote left out that Sanders ALSO addresses social issues Armstead Sep 2015 #95

Excellent analogy ALBliberal Sep 2015 #157

Blink blink blink Phlem Sep 2015 #158

No, I'm sure you did it right. cyberswede Sep 2015 #164

Great post Gothmog Sep 2015 #22

Too bad HRC provides neither economic nor social justice Android3.14 Sep 2015 #24

Bingo! MissDeeds Sep 2015 #39

You obviously have not keep up with her proposals. riversedge Sep 2015 #68

Her proposals are the political equivalent of vaporware Android3.14 Sep 2015 #77

^This is an example of a strong criticism of a candidate.^ (Not Bashing) U of M Dem Sep 2015 #146

Ding ding ding, we have a winner! jfern Sep 2015 #186

Hillary killed Abe Lincoln!!!!! :rolleyes: uponit7771 Sep 2015 #210

Why post crap that is just flame bait? lonestarnot Sep 2015 #37

I happen to agree with everything Sanders said. mhatrw Sep 2015 #41

Should well off people vote their pocketbook? 6chars Sep 2015 #56

What does that matter? In a true democracy, they are the rounding error. n/t mhatrw Sep 2015 #178

not necessarily 6chars Sep 2015 #180

That is the biggest crock of PR crap ever foisted on our citizenry. mhatrw Sep 2015 #185

do you want an argument? 6chars Sep 2015 #196

I'm glad you posted this, and I will give you a civil response Armstead Sep 2015 #42

There it is! haikugal Sep 2015 #75

I like this response Armstead. MuseRider Sep 2015 #131

Only to add educational "justice". An educated population tends to be less prejudiced ALBliberal Sep 2015 #160

Hear, hear Armstead dorkzilla Sep 2015 #150

I see our cave dwellers have arrived. Android3.14 Sep 2015 #43

And I am sure most of the responses are either spinning or gaslighting... stevenleser Sep 2015 #44

Yeah that's called discussion Armstead Sep 2015 #55

No, defense mechanisms and manipulation are not discussion. nt stevenleser Sep 2015 #57

"What he really meant" is not a defense mechanism or manipulation Armstead Sep 2015 #63

That's manipulation in this context. nt stevenleser Sep 2015 #66

No a very short excerpt from one interview in answer to a specific question..... Armstead Sep 2015 #74

Thank you, First Way BB, I've bean waiting for this. betsuni Sep 2015 #47

Why is this a controversy for Hillary supporters? earthside Sep 2015 #50

In a last ditch effort to beat Obama, after she had clearly lost, she engaged in race based attacks Fearless Sep 2015 #61

Funny, I don't see either the words TM99 Sep 2015 #51

I've got a great idea, instead of working on the tons of problems we have.... daleanime Sep 2015 #53

You parsed two paragraps together with bold that suggests something that he didn't say. Fearless Sep 2015 #59

intentionally distorting the truth is the only way that they can attack him virtualobserver Sep 2015 #128

It really was a terrible attack. Fearless Sep 2015 #172

these weird deliberate interpretations that they post show the win at all costs mentality..... virtualobserver Sep 2015 #173

Because he's not running for himself Fearless Sep 2015 #192

No. Civil rights activist since 60s. Gay rights advocate since 70s. HooptieWagon Sep 2015 #62

Wel someone has to write the spin and cover for Hillary's water carrying for the billionaires. Todays_Illusion Sep 2015 #67

Yikes Deny and Shred Sep 2015 #70

Funny I'm not seeing him say it there either JackInGreen Sep 2015 #72

You SHOULDN'T base your politics on color, OR gender. Bonobo Sep 2015 #78

Post removed Post removed Sep 2015 #79

I would have worded it differently... ljm2002 Sep 2015 #81

Great explanation Armstead Sep 2015 #115

I'm voting for Bernie Sanders n/t whatchamacallit Sep 2015 #83

Clinton or Sanders....I miss Senator Elizabeth Warren for POTUS 2016. Stellar Sep 2015 #85

She'd be attacked and distorted as much as Sanders has been if she ran Armstead Sep 2015 #103

Ugh!....That is what elections are all about these days. Stellar Sep 2015 #117

This part of your OP makes sense - TBF Sep 2015 #96

Trying to stir the racist stuff...again? SoapBox Sep 2015 #97

Trying to make this a wedge-issue, to divide Democrats is wrong-headed. 99th_Monkey Sep 2015 #98

Billionaire class not economic justice smilingwen Sep 2015 #101

Except he said no such thing ibegurpard Sep 2015 #102

Equality of opportunity regardless of race is your gotcha? Ed Suspicious Sep 2015 #105

It’s all they got, Ed. dorkzilla Sep 2015 #137

He's right. pinebox Sep 2015 #107

I don't think he ever said that tularetom Sep 2015 #114

Completely and enthusiastically unrecommended. Enthusiast Sep 2015 #118

Perhaps it would be more helpful if you just explained exactly what you think the platform should be Live and Learn Sep 2015 #124

No I don't remember that statement from Bernie. DrBulldog Sep 2015 #126

No I don't. Please cite a quote where he says what you are claiming he said and suggesting we Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #129

Bernie's platform on economic justice is the best we've had from any Democratic candidate in PatrickforO Sep 2015 #130

Some people invoke black people to exhort them to be stronger, smarter. Some just to use them. jtuck004 Sep 2015 #135

Some people think minorities artislife Sep 2015 #144

Most of the supporters that are worth a crap for any candidate will make this election about jtuck004 Sep 2015 #168

The history of the DLC from the Council on Foreign Relation ---------------------- turbinetree Sep 2015 #136

Here is a quote from Hillary that I remember clearly and I will quote her exactly as well as the Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #138

If the Republicans nominate Tim Scott, should black men vote for him over Hillary Clinton? Jim Lane Sep 2015 #139

Why do conservatives lie to support their positions? frylock Sep 2015 #140

K & R SunSeeker Sep 2015 #141

Bernie Sanders has never even implied that AgingAmerican Sep 2015 #143

This is an excellent... AlbertCat Sep 2015 #145

I'm willing to accept that the BLM movement had a positive impact in Baitball Blogger Sep 2015 #149

Another hot thread with 150 replies, only 18 recs. Ed Suspicious Sep 2015 #151

We have been working on racial justice for a long time, and ignoring economic justice. JDPriestly Sep 2015 #152

I don't see "social justice must wait for economic justice" cyberswede Sep 2015 #153

why do they always pull this? they make a claim and then everyone points out their own sources MisterP Sep 2015 #156

I find it hard to get past HRC's remark to BLM a few weeks ago about going to talk ALBliberal Sep 2015 #154

What a load. Unrec. Phlem Sep 2015 #159

You would prefer he say something racist instead of something inclusive? MindfulOne Sep 2015 #162

I'll sign that right along witth you. William769 Sep 2015 #167

K&R. I remember. I posted that same interview, and was flemed for it lunamagica Sep 2015 #169

Could you quote the part of the interview that actually backs up your headline? jeff47 Sep 2015 #170

Sen. Bernie Sanders On How Democrats Lost White Voters MADem Sep 2015 #174

The headline claims that social justice must be secondary. The quote doesn't say that. jeff47 Sep 2015 #175

Sanders doesn't address social justice at all and his words say that color doesn't matter. MADem Sep 2015 #181

And if the headline was "Sanders didn't address social justice" I wouldn't be asking. jeff47 Sep 2015 #182

The headline whinges about WHITE VOTES. The optics are poor. MADem Sep 2015 #184

And optics are the only important thing. jeff47 Sep 2015 #191

You didn't bother to read the link I helpfully provided, I see. MADem Sep 2015 #199

If you want to call her something other than what she goes by jeff47 Sep 2015 #200

But she DOES "go by" that--and she answers to it, too. MADem Sep 2015 #201

That was the headline and article writer Armstead Sep 2015 #177

The complaint had to do with the OP characterization. Was it, or was it not, KINDER than the NPR MADem Sep 2015 #179

Haha, what bullshit... MellowDem Sep 2015 #176

It's impressive how people respond to your bait. GeorgeGist Sep 2015 #183

I can't believe that anyone would think economic equality wouldn't benefit polly7 Sep 2015 #187

It's complete bullshit. Phlem Sep 2015 #188

It IS bullshit ........... and it's unbelievably transparent and stupid. nt. polly7 Sep 2015 #190

If you have to twist his words to make a point, you don't have a point. AtomicKitten Sep 2015 #189

Why not focus on both? Jamaal510 Sep 2015 #202

Interesting and thought-provoking post, Jamaal. And alot of other AAs have said very similar things Number23 Sep 2015 #207

Why don't you stay in your own foul playpen? hifiguy Sep 2015 #205

Results of Jury Service LiberalElite Sep 2015 #206

Posting Sanders own words and evolution on the matter isn't trolling. Blacks on DU has said what uponit7771 Sep 2015 #211

Do not believe the lies! senz Sep 2015 #214