HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Retired » Retired Forums » 2016 Postmortem (Forum) » Hillary WILL NOT Lobby Ag... » Reply #172

Response to Persondem (Reply #158)

Wed Nov 11, 2015, 02:48 PM

172. I don't want a way for artificial persons to make an end run around democatic governments

and cry to an unelected panel of corporate shysters when they don't realize expected profits (a benefit it could reasonably have expected to accrue to it . . . is being nullified or impaired as a result of the application of a measure of another Party that is not inconsistent with this Agreement). That is the gist of Chapter 28.

The other matters can be addressed without this horsepucky. What would Adam Smith say about a corporation suing for "expected" profits? There must be an earthquake in the vicinity of his resting place.

A corporation is not a human being. It has a charter from the state, not a birth certificate. It has what rights we give them. It is not entitled to human rights.

If a corporation wants a profit, it has every right to manufacture a safe product and put it on the market at a reasonable price in competition with other similar manufactured goods made in the market or even some that are as radically different as a solar panel is to a barrel of oil that accomplish the same thing.

By a safe product, I mean one that that doesn't harm the end user if used as directed, either as an individual or as a member of society or the biosphere. Yes, that means the state has the right to ban the use of tobacco products or even petroleum products, and that the poisoners at Philip Morris or the polluters at ExxonMobil should not be able to have a a private system of justice at its disposal in order to seek a more favorable judgment than one it might get in a real court.

I also don't think it proper for politicians who are guilty of taking [strike]bribes[/strike] generous campaign contributions from corporate officers and high ranking corporate employees, even acting in the fictitious name of the corporation itself, to pass judgment on a radical document that upsets the world's political and legal order by granting artificial persons the right to realize expected profits, something that no reasonable person would expect to find in a state of nature. The majority of our congressmen, who punitively represent us, are bought and paid for by the very legal entities who stand to benefit from a document which they negotiated among themselves. If that sounds corrupt, there's a good reason for it.

Yes, I am calling for mass civil disobedience in response to the passage of the TPP and its sinister sister trade deals, TTIP and TISA. I think that would be the just and proper response. Moreover, I call for civil disobedience worldwide and maintain that very few will benefit from these deals and most of us will just be fucked over.

Having said that, there is a little matter I need some help me with. I have read parts of the TPP and perused over others, so I may have missed something that you seem to think is there. So persuade me that I'm all wet. Here's your assignment:


Please tell us how Dred Scott could have brought his complaint before an ISDS panel. Could he have gotten a better judgment there than he got from the Supreme Court in 1857. If Mr. Scott could not have appealed to the ISDS, what provision in the TPP could Mr. Scott have used to argue that he should be set free, how a result in his favor might have been arrived at and how this decision would be enforced under the TPP.

Thank you in advance.

Reply to this post

Back to OP Alert abuse Link to post in-thread

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 221 replies Author Time Post
Segami Nov 2015 OP
TM99 Nov 2015 #1
Segami Nov 2015 #6
erronis Nov 2015 #44
INdemo Nov 2015 #67
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #169
TM99 Nov 2015 #173
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #194
TM99 Nov 2015 #197
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #198
kacekwl Nov 2015 #52
acuity24 Nov 2015 #159
InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2015 #163
roguevalley Nov 2015 #77
imthevicar Nov 2015 #135
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #168
TM99 Nov 2015 #171
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #196
TM99 Nov 2015 #199
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #200
TM99 Nov 2015 #201
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #202
Jester Messiah Nov 2015 #204
lewebley3 Nov 2015 #205
Jester Messiah Nov 2015 #206
Cassiopeia Nov 2015 #2
tecelote Nov 2015 #19
Fast Walker 52 Nov 2015 #41
Cassiopeia Nov 2015 #92
99th_Monkey Nov 2015 #121
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #136
Plucketeer Nov 2015 #83
pangaia Nov 2015 #3
erronis Nov 2015 #46
stillwaiting Nov 2015 #4
UglyGreed Nov 2015 #5
virtualobserver Nov 2015 #7
R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2015 #59
Kelvin Mace Nov 2015 #8
Buzz cook Nov 2015 #9
ruffburr Nov 2015 #10
Aerows Nov 2015 #11
restorefreedom Nov 2015 #13
restorefreedom Nov 2015 #12
Autumn Nov 2015 #14
Paka Nov 2015 #97
AzDar Nov 2015 #15
Segami Nov 2015 #16
AzDar Nov 2015 #18
840high Nov 2015 #68
roguevalley Nov 2015 #78
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #137
tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #89
Paka Nov 2015 #105
MrMickeysMom Nov 2015 #17
Art_from_Ark Nov 2015 #147
SoapBox Nov 2015 #20
tecelote Nov 2015 #21
bahrbearian Nov 2015 #23
Ed Suspicious Nov 2015 #38
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #126
hopemountain Nov 2015 #133
willvotesdem Nov 2015 #156
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #164
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #166
blackspade Nov 2015 #175
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #182
blackspade Nov 2015 #184
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #185
blackspade Nov 2015 #187
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #192
blackspade Nov 2015 #193
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #195
blackspade Nov 2015 #210
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #213
blackspade Nov 2015 #215
LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #179
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #183
LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #211
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #214
LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #216
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #218
LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #219
ConservativeDemocrat Nov 2015 #220
hopemountain Nov 2015 #186
AlbertCat Nov 2015 #58
R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2015 #64
R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2015 #63
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #117
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #142
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #165
William769 Nov 2015 #217
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #221
wilsonbooks Nov 2015 #39
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #113
SheilaT Nov 2015 #22
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #116
a2liberal Nov 2015 #144
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #162
George II Nov 2015 #24
Bryce Butler Nov 2015 #27
LiberalArkie Nov 2015 #28
guillaumeb Nov 2015 #30
roguevalley Nov 2015 #81
George II Nov 2015 #99
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #143
polly7 Nov 2015 #150
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #153
polly7 Nov 2015 #154
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #155
PowerToThePeople Nov 2015 #25
SammyWinstonJack Nov 2015 #26
yallerdawg Nov 2015 #29
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #31
SusanCalvin Nov 2015 #42
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #74
Android3.14 Nov 2015 #32
KansDem Nov 2015 #33
dorkzilla Nov 2015 #62
hughee99 Nov 2015 #76
lame54 Nov 2015 #34
tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #93
coyote Nov 2015 #127
lame54 Nov 2015 #160
coyote Nov 2015 #188
mmonk Nov 2015 #35
Persondem Nov 2015 #36
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #40
SusanCalvin Nov 2015 #43
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #49
SusanCalvin Nov 2015 #54
DhhD Nov 2015 #181
Persondem Nov 2015 #47
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #51
Persondem Nov 2015 #56
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #69
Persondem Nov 2015 #91
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #98
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #103
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #109
Persondem Nov 2015 #120
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #124
Persondem Nov 2015 #158
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply I don't want a way for artificial persons to make an end run around democatic governments
Jack Rabbit Nov 2015 #172
rhett o rick Nov 2015 #118
Persondem Nov 2015 #119
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #145
Persondem Nov 2015 #157
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #37
darkangel218 Nov 2015 #45
Major Hogwash Nov 2015 #132
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #139
think Nov 2015 #48
SusanCalvin Nov 2015 #55
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #140
silenttigersong Nov 2015 #50
d_legendary1 Nov 2015 #53
davidpdx Nov 2015 #134
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #141
davidpdx Nov 2015 #146
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #167
GeorgeGist Nov 2015 #189
R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2015 #57
whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #60
R. Daneel Olivaw Nov 2015 #70
whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #82
GoneFishin Nov 2015 #106
Art_from_Ark Nov 2015 #151
sadoldgirl Nov 2015 #61
Name removed Nov 2015 #65
AzDar Nov 2015 #72
ColesCountyDem Nov 2015 #75
tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #96
Paka Nov 2015 #110
INdemo Nov 2015 #66
Historic NY Nov 2015 #71
jeff47 Nov 2015 #112
GeorgeGist Nov 2015 #190
stupidicus Nov 2015 #73
SmittynMo Nov 2015 #79
Truprogressive85 Nov 2015 #80
Phlem Nov 2015 #84
Puglover Nov 2015 #88
Phlem Nov 2015 #104
Puglover Nov 2015 #85
YOHABLO Nov 2015 #86
floriduck Nov 2015 #87
PatrickforO Nov 2015 #90
Populist_Prole Nov 2015 #125
kelliekat44 Nov 2015 #94
floriduck Nov 2015 #95
kelliekat44 Nov 2015 #100
Dawgs Nov 2015 #212
cantbeserious Nov 2015 #101
WillyT Nov 2015 #102
azmom Nov 2015 #107
senz Nov 2015 #108
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #148
Faryn Balyncd Nov 2015 #111
JEB Nov 2015 #114
whereisjustice Nov 2015 #115
philly_bob Nov 2015 #122
jfern Nov 2015 #123
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #149
JDPriestly Nov 2015 #128
Major Hogwash Nov 2015 #131
Unknown Beatle Nov 2015 #129
BeanMusical Nov 2015 #152
Betty Karlson Nov 2015 #130
Fairgo Nov 2015 #138
monicaangela Nov 2015 #161
retrowire Nov 2015 #170
blackspade Nov 2015 #174
I hate liars Nov 2015 #176
bvar22 Nov 2015 #177
Faux pas Nov 2015 #178
jkbRN Nov 2015 #180
Freddie Stubbs Nov 2015 #191
Jester Messiah Nov 2015 #203
Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2015 #207
sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #208
EndElectoral Nov 2015 #209
Please login to view edit histories.