Reply #56: First off, you are wrong about... [View All]

[Gordon25]

...my perspective based on my number of posts. I followed the issue here for almost three months before I ever registered to join the discussion, using the time to do my own research, come to my own conclusions, and start working locally to effect whatever remedies were possible. I am the lead author of the Pima County Democratic Party Report on Voting Integrity, here:
http://www.pimademocrats.org/votingreport/votingintegrity.htm
I figured on an issue this important I should wait to join the discussion until I knew what I was talking about and had something of value to contribute. So don't make a mistake of dismissing what I have to say based on the fact that I have only 101 posts.

Second, you ignored the essence of my question which was: quit using generalities and give me some specifics. Who have I trashed? Who has Bev trashed? Who has Eloriel or Paranoid Pat or DemActivist or Hedda Foil? Specifics and links if you please or quit making wild general and unspecific allegations.

Third, regarding your complaint: "By the way, it's pretty transparently cynical how all three of you misinterpreted my post below in exactly the same way. It's obvious from my post that when I said "I believe the scientists" it didn't mean I believed them just because they were scientists. I listed the reasons I believed them, and it clearly wasn't just blind deference to authority." Let's look at the reasons you listed that you believed in them.

"I believe the scientists based on the fact that I haven't seen any scientist accuse anyone of any crime, let alone charge anyone of treason. Also I haven't seen any scientist trash their opposition, or make any appeal to patriotism.
My confidence in the scientists was reinforced by my one interaction with David Dill, here on DU, where he came to respond to the thread suggestively titled "Who owns David Dill's website?"

1. "I trust the scientists based on the fact that I haven't seen any scientist accuse anyone of any crime, let alone charge anyone of treason."

That must mean either you go into it believing there hasn't been any crime and the proof for your belief is that no scientist has accused anybody of a crime. Or you believe there hasn' t been any crime because no scientist has said there was. Am I missing something? In general, don't scientists as a group avoid making accusations of wrong doing, leaving that activity to law enforcement and victims of crime? Please explain how any number of scientists not charging anyone with treason is a rationale for "believing" them?

2. "Also, I haven't seen any scientist trash their opposition, or make any appeal to patriotism."

First, please provide the specifics I asked for earlier. Who got trashed and by whom? Otherwise your argument is a generality which means nothing. Second, please explain your comment about patriotism in the context of our discussion. I don't remember seeing any or making any such appeals. And somehow I just don't understand how any scientist not making an appeal to patriotism is grounds for believing that scientist about anything other than that they haven't made any appeal to patriotism.

3. "My confidence in the scientists was reinforced by my one interaction with David Dill, here on DU, where he came to respond to the thread suggestively titled "Who owns David Dill's website?" You then quote some of the email exchange, none of which seems to have anything to do with whether or not the Diebold emails constitute the beginnings of proof of an intent to defraud, which is a crime.

Note also that you begin this paragraph "My confidence in the scientists was reinforced..." which means, I guess, that you base your belief in scientists on the two earlier reasons you gave. This being the case, I suppose I should just repeat what I said below: a true believer is a true believer and a dyed in the wool skeptic is just a true believer who believes there is nothing worth believing in. IMHO, of course. And thanks for giving me a reason to kick this back onto the front page.

Gordon25